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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: ohiorider on August 06, 2021, 07:52:48 AM
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Front end on my 2016 Bonneville T120 still has light up and down pogos. To date:
- used Bonnie (1600 miles) had front tire wobbles on day one in 2020, New Pilot Activ tire and wheel truing cured problem.
- dropped a set of Progressive springs in (down and dirty,) just pulled OEM springs and replaced with new springs and spacers. No problems.
- Pogo'ing started with installation of new Pilot Activ f&r tires in May 2021. Both tires spin balanced.
- Took front wheel to another shop for a 2nd spin balancing. Was not out of balance. No need to change weights.
- Replaced Pilot Activ with another new Pilot Activ. Problem remains.
- Pulled Progressive springs and spacers and went back to stock. Still slight pogo. Correct oil levels and spacer lengths.
Mechanic at multi brand shop tugged and pulled on fork legs with bike on center stand, felt for any play in steering head bearings and found none. Asked me to bounce bike up and down as he felt various parts of the fork legs trying to feel any clunking indicating bad bushings. Felt nothing.
At wits end.
Bob
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Bob, can you be a little more descriptive as to what “pogoing” is and what’s the effect it is having on the bike?
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Bob, can you be a little more descriptive as to what “pogoing” is and what’s the effect it is have on the bike?
Dan, what I'm trying to describe is a slight up and down motion in the front end of the bike, noticeable on very smooth road surface. On a slightly bumpy road, it mixes in with the normal suspension movement. Up and down motion, not side to side wobble.
Bob
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Dan, what I'm trying to describe is a slight up and down motion in the front end of the bike, noticeable on very smooth road surface. On a slightly bumpy road, it mixes in with the normal suspension movement. Up and down motion, not side to side wobble.
Bob
Have you checked with the dealer to see if anyone else is having similar experiences?
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Couple of things come to mind. Did the tire possibly get mounted backwards, see arrow on sidewall. With the bike on the center stand, front wheel off the ground, spin the wheel with a straight edge almost against the tread at various places to check for out of round. Should be no more than 1mm. My $.02
Paul B :boozing:
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Wheel bearing?
Really reaching here, but maybe a disc not mounted parallel to the wheel rim?
Might not cause pulsing while braking, but maybe on a REALLY smooth surface......
That should be a relatively easy check if you have access to a dial indicator.
Those minor little niggles on a magic carpet ride on new pavement
can drive you right round the bend if you let 'em......
-Stretch
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Excellent tire. I've not had problems and tend to get decent wear. Has long been my favorite. Hope you figure out the issue but I don't think it's the tires. Good luck.
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This doesn't help you. But you asked about issues.
I had just put one on the front of my EVT. It had been fine on most grooved roads, until.... Out here the pavement I think was laid and then the grooves cut. You ride on a wideish surface. On one freeway, it's like the pavement was laid and then the grooves were added with a fine rake or saw blade. Looks like points more than flat.
The tire didn't like that grooving. It felt like I was on ice or a flat tire. I had to slow down in the curves for fear it may slide out. I've been on that freeway before with the EVT but ME880 without issues. Even the Bridgestone S11 was fine on my Loops.
I think it's due to the angle of the grooves next to the center groove on this tire. The S11 has something like it, but they are basically parallel with the center.
Good luck with your issue!
Tom
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I had a Cal 3 that did that (drove me nuts, too), and replacing the tire helped. Another thing I did that also helped was to move the fork tubes up/down (can't remember which) in the 3-trees.
Rich A
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Something else to look at, Motorcycle tires usually - all? - have a thin line embossed around near the beads to indicate rim seating. That line should be the same distance from the rim edge all the way around on both sides.
Okay I'm up to $.04 now
Paul B :boozing:
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We had a major issue with a set mounted on a buddies BMW K100RS 1985. We mounted and static balanced twice then took the wheels to a shop and they spun balanced and still had the same balance issue. We then took the bike to the BMW shop and they dismounted and remounted the tires and balanced them and the same balance issue was still there. These were the pilot active tires. The tires were warranted buy Michelin and money refunded
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Other that how difficult they are to mount & get them to seat properly...they have been great tires on my 2 bikes.
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Probably my favorite tire for the V7. I’ve burned up many of them, never an issue.
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Bob, forgot to mention. If you haven't done so you might try posting at Triumph Rat.net in the Triumph Twins Talk section. A lot of Bonnie knowledge over there.
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Thanks, everyone for your observations and suggestions. Some I've done already, but some I'll try. Riding buddy Tom and I pulled the forks (again!), removed the Progressive springs and spacers, and reinstalled the OEM springs, just to eliminate them from the equation. Set fork oil level per Trumph spec. Marginal improvement, probably because the stock springs are stiffer.
We did make an observation that may be meaningless when installing the front wheel. Service manual specifies axle torque of 65ft/lb. We had spun the wheel before final torqueing, calipers still off, and the wheel spun freely. At 65ft/lb., the wheel hit a tight spot every revolution, for probably 45 degrees of rotation. Then it would rotate freely until it came to that spot again. To test, we reduced torque to 50, and wheel rotated freely thru entire 360 degrees. Took up to 55 ft/lb rotated full 360 with no tight spot. Left at 55 for the moment, and tightened pinch bolt.
Bearing issue or normal behavior?
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Thanks, everyone for your observations and suggestions. Some I've done already, but some I'll try. Riding buddy Tom and I pulled the forks (again!), removed the Progressive springs and spacers, and reinstalled the OEM springs, just to eliminate them from the equation. Set fork oil level per Trumph spec. Marginal improvement, probably because the stock springs are stiffer.
We did make an observation that may be meaningless when installing the front wheel. Service manual specifies axle torque of 65ft/lb. We had spun the wheel before final torqueing, calipers still off, and the wheel spun freely. At 65ft/lb., the wheel hit a tight spot every revolution, for probably 45 degrees of rotation. Then it would rotate freely until it came to that spot again. To test, we reduced torque to 50, and wheel rotated freely thru entire 360 degrees. Took up to 55 ft/lb rotated full 360 with no tight spot. Left at 55 for the moment, and tightened pinch bolt.
Bearing issue or normal behavior?
Sounds like the wheel spacer is bent from overtightening.
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As I've written previously, I had the exact same issues after replacing 2015 OEM V7 tires with Pilot Activ. THREE front tires (Activ) and the issue was still there. changed to Conti RA3's and it went away immediately. Chase anything, change anything, whatever. I did. It was the tires.
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As I've written previously, I had the exact same issues after replacing 2015 OEM V7 tires with Pilot Activ. THREE front tires (Activ) and the issue was still there. changed to Conti RA3's and it went away immediately. Chase anything, change anything, whatever. I did. It was the tires.
K of Fleece
A buddy of mine just order a set of Conti RA3s for his 2016 Bonneville T120. We concluded that both Fr and Rr are radials. For some reason, Triumph uses a radial on one end, and a bias belted on the other. I don't think they'll be an issue with the Conti's on the Bonneville.
Thanks for reaffirming your results with the Michelins.
Bob
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Sounds like the wheel spacer is bent from overtightening.
The spacers 'look' ok, but is is possible I overtightened them at some time in the past, so perhaps a set of spacers and wheel bearings are in order.
Bob
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Buy the good Japanese bearings-not cheap Chinese Allballs.
I put radials on all 5 of my Bonnies-one 790 and 4 865's.
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We did make an observation that may be meaningless when installing the front wheel. Service manual specifies axle torque of 65ft/lb. We had spun the wheel before final torqueing, calipers still off, and the wheel spun freely. At 65ft/lb., the wheel hit a tight spot every revolution, for probably 45 degrees of rotation. Then it would rotate freely until it came to that spot again. To test, we reduced torque to 50, and wheel rotated freely thru entire 360 degrees. Took up to 55 ft/lb rotated full 360 with no tight spot. Left at 55 for the moment, and tightened pinch bolt.
Bearing issue or normal behavior?
JMHO: If at 55 Ft/lb you do not have the issue on the road. But at 65 Ft/lb you do. You could have a bad bearing. It could be notched or the like.
Good luck,
Tom