Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: cappisj1 on November 23, 2023, 05:44:46 PM
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Should I be using anti-seize, dielectric grease or normal grease on my spark plug threads. I don’t want them to get stuck in there with all that heat.
Thanks,
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“A few tiny dabs of antisneeze..and best not to run plugs in and out in a hot cylinder..”
Said my machinist after fixing the stripped spark plug hole
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Actually...none. Lubricant can give a false sense of actual tightening torque and lead to stripping.
SR
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Don't use anti-seize compound on the spark plug threads for your 0-200 Continental engine said my A&P friend.
(https://i.ibb.co/bR8yrCn/2612big-84670.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bR8yrCn)
Use the proper product designed for the application.
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P.S. -- per NGK factory:
NGK spark plugs feature trivalent plating. This silver or chrome-colored finish on the threads is designed to provide corrosion resistance against moisture and chemicals. The coating also acts as a release agent during spark plug removal. NGK spark plugs are installed at the factory dry, without lubrication or anti-seize.
Anti-seize can act as a lubricant, altering torque values up to 20 percent, increasing the risk of spark plug thread breakage and/or metal shell stretch. Thread breakage can sometimes involve removing the cylinder head for repair. Metal shell stretch changes the heat rating of the spark plug and can result in serious engine damage caused by pre-ignition. Do not use anti-seize or lubricant on NGK spark plugs. It is completely unnecessary and can be detrimental.
SR
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Great information.
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My car, a 2000 Mazda, specifically tells you that you MUST use anti-seize on the treads. The plug would 'lock' in my Honda 600 if I did not anti-seize it.
I also use a dab of dielectric in the cap to help waterproof them. A habit I got into on my dirt bikes to help keep them going in the rain and mud.
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Be careful using the silver/aluminum type anti-seize. This stuff can act as an insulator, and the spark plugs need a good ground. There is a copper type anti-seize which I believe provides electrical continuity.
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Yeah, but ... we're talking Moto Guzzi here.
Going back to the beginning of the thread: "...best not to run plugs in and out of a hot cylinder." Guess what: if you want to get plugs out of something like a 5.4-liter Ford, the best way is to do it hot. Otherwise, there's a good chance they're going to break.
So again...we're not talkin' Mazda, Ford, Continental Aero, or?
SR
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Thanks for that! Further evidence of my dinosaur status..
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Be careful using the silver/aluminum type anti-seize. This stuff can act as an insulator, and the spark plugs need a good ground. There is a copper type anti-seize which I believe provides electrical continuity.
The power to your house likely passes through a lot of aluminum to get there. The current for that spark likely passes through carbon resistance at some point. It will have no problem passing through aluminum to the aluminum head. Plus you can be certain that there is still metal to metal contact in there.
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Yeah, but ... we're talking Moto Guzzi here.
The OP did not mention that.
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Yes, you can use a little anti-seize and I would recommend using on aluminum cylinder heads.
One issue with different metals is electrolysis and welding the dissimilar metals together. Anti-seize helps prevent this. Moto Guzzi lists a lot of torque specs as wet specs, that said if you can’t replace an easy to access spark plug without stripping, cross threading and ripping the threads out maybe you shouldn’t be replacing spark plugs.
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I use a little anti seize on mine and have for the past 20 years or so with no ill effects
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Using anti-seize in the plugs in the aircraft shop was a must. Especially with aluminum heads.
kk
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I like the permatex copper anti sieze for this application. It has powdered copper in it, and comes in a little brush top container, that makes it easy to brush on the plug threads. Plugs always come out easy, and smoothy.
Rick.
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As an alternative, I have used 2stroke oil on occasion, mostly in corrosive ( marine) environment also using it for storage top end lube, gets on the threads anyway, but just a drop or two .
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I use a 50/50 mixture of Locktite 272, molybdenum disulfide powder and dielectric grease that contains 73.8% copper oxide to conduct electricity while simultaneously stopping conduction of electricity. Stick, slip, flow and no :thumb:
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This almost as good as an oil thread. :boozing:
No lube.
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I use permatex aluminum anti seize on the BMW, Guzzi, Porsche plugs. Permatex copper anti seize on brake bolts, etc. I sleep well and don’t agonize about it. 👍🥃👍
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It is, it also strikes me as funny that those who hate threads like this feel the need to post on threads like this which in turn adds to the thread in question.
I actually was looking for information, times change, things come and go, looking at threads from 5 years ago might not be the latest and greatest.
The other things in threads like these is when someone tries, key word tries, to be funny and cute and completely fails.
I love humor in a forum but the post has to at least make some sense. Take for instance 50-50 mix using three items.
Hopefully that was done on purpose as part of the humor attempt, at least I hope so. The alternative reason is scary not funny. Finally, saying the one thing in common on different engines (another thread) would be incorrect, there are many. Maybe they meant one OF the things in common. It completely ruins the humor attempt, key word attempt.
Respectfully
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This thread has something for everyone on the subject. No matter where you come down on the topic, there is someone who claims you're doing it right. Sure there is also someone claiming you're doing it wrong, but we humans have become pretty accustomed to only listening to "our" tribe, so it fits right in.
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This thread has something for everyone on the subject. No matter where you come down on the topic, there is someone who claims you're doing it right. Sure there is also someone claiming you're doing it wrong, but we humans have become pretty accustomed to only listening to "our" tribe, so it fits right in.
I kind of get what you’re saying. I rarely look to the left at the posters name so not familiar with the different “tribes”. Keep in mind a new member has no idea which tribe to join.
For no other reason but to try and do the right thing for my bike I will ask about oil. It’s not to watch the ceiling come crashing down just for information. I’m satisfied about what to use now but it was the long way around the barn.
I’m not sure this thread has something for everyone. A new member who wants to know if they should or shouldn’t use anti-seize will most likely still be confused and look elsewhere.
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NGK with the rolled threads do not require Anything. If I find rust on the threads of the plug, I will will use a copper based antisieze, and very sparingly.
Dielectric should only be used on the rubber boot, never on the threads.
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This thread has something for everyone on the subject. No matter where you come down on the topic, there is someone who claims you're doing it right. Sure there is also someone claiming you're doing it wrong, but we humans have become pretty accustomed to only listening to "our" tribe, so it fits right in.
Tribe? This is a Guzzi tribe.
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Heat range issues is another reason to not use anti-sleaze . Local tech/ racer told me that a long time ago.. He now runs Suzuki warranty's for the east coast.. His advice has always been spot-on..I stopped doing that a long time ago. 5.4 liter Ford I would probably do it. That's the least of your problems.. :evil:
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Spark plugs vary widely in every possible way. So the only sure bets are what does a particular application require. I make sure if the plug has a crushable gasket that it crushes on the first install to get a good seal. If the plug is a tapered style I make sure I just torque it properly or not more than the fractional turn on the box. That is where the heat range is made functional, not through the threads. I have found Dielectric grease to very good for most applications on a spark plug tower. But it can cause issues with poor release on some coil on plug or rubber boot extensions. I find many times a plug torqued correctly will still loosen over time, so checking them once in a while is a good practice. With many new types of electrodes coming into play there will be more questions than answers. I have been trying some of them out and time will tell if they really are better.
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I bet a lot of people in the old days who had Mercury outboards wish they had used something. Spark plugs for these motors had only a 3/8" reach. I have picked up quite a few with Helicoils already installed.
kk
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What's the difference between antisneeze and antisleaze . . . Asking for a friend . . . :evil: :violent1:
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What's the difference between antisneeze and antisleaze . . . Asking for a friend . . . :evil: :violent1:
One keeps things from binding the other keeps Enik away. Anti-Sleestak :thumb:
(https://i.ibb.co/wMP9ZJs/enik-the-friendly-sleestak-posters-1.webp) (https://ibb.co/wMP9ZJs)
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What's the difference between antisneeze and antisleaze . . . Asking for a friend . . . :evil: :violent1:
Just the color. If it looks the same, it is the same, we learn that in helicopter aviation .
If it looks good, it is good as well. Don’t overthink these things is what I say…
Edit. I was a migrant helicopter worker awhile back. A German MBB BO 105 mostly, EMS so there was some humor. The first thing on the “Ball of Flames” checklist is for the pilot in command to calmly state: “ oh shit, oh dear” which alerts everyone of the imminent doom associated with helicopter aviation . Once when I was wiping down the engine cowling on Old Sparky, a flight nurse made a derogatory observation. I don’t remember what she said but I said: “ I gotta get my prints off it, case it goes down somewhere “. She was impressed . But I digress..
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Follow the manufacturer's recommendations for your specific plugs. If they are plated and the manufacturer says not to use anti-seize, then don't use anti-seize. If they say to use anti-seize, use it and follow any recommended adjustment to the torque spec (often 20% less).