Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Dr. Enzo Toma on October 22, 2024, 03:01:05 PM
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EICMA EICMA 2024 Milan Motorcycle Show is approaching, Nov 7-10
https://www.eicma.it/en/
Anyone going?
There are rumors of an updated Euro5+ V7.
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If they don’t present a unique small block model entirely different from the V7/V9 or V85, I’ll be fairly pessimistic about the small block’s future. There’s been plenty enough time for R&D to create something different beyond new color ways and “street versions” of a mild ADV.
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EICMA EICMA 2024 Milan Motorcycle Show is approaching, Nov 7-10
https://www.eicma.it/en/
Anyone going?
There are rumors of an updated Euro5+ V7.
Yes, there's a rumor (and a photo) of a new V7 with USD forks and dual discs.
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Stolen from the rumor's source:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw/AP1GczOxqAVHyRZ0M8Vgko7m3wGv1VW-PMmdni0BnMKCZ5tVEj7RCz2x4i_VYstLIegMXweZFbIrV8v5GoQdRI7vnsoDx9dDO2rgiszviXQr3Ag9XJhI-LiJ5PaOtzOXZ_roISh4MnNSCLPScI50Nj8mFDuzNA=w720-h482-s-no-gm?authuser=0)
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Stolen from the rumor's source:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw/AP1GczOxqAVHyRZ0M8Vgko7m3wGv1VW-PMmdni0BnMKCZ5tVEj7RCz2x4i_VYstLIegMXweZFbIrV8v5GoQdRI7vnsoDx9dDO2rgiszviXQr3Ag9XJhI-LiJ5PaOtzOXZ_roISh4MnNSCLPScI50Nj8mFDuzNA=w720-h482-s-no-gm?authuser=0)
OK - That is one good looking Guzzi!!! :thumb: :bow: :boozing: :cool:
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The forks look…noodle’y to me, and I wonder why the front needs two rotors. Granted, I can’t remember how the 850 felt when I rode one, but at least with the Mk III, it doesn’t feel necessary. And if it isn’t necessary, why bother adding the weight and bits?
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The forks look…noodle’s to me, and I wonder why the front needs two rotors. Granted, I can’t remember how the 850 felt when I rode one, but at least with the Mk III, it doesn’t feel necessary. And if it isn’t necessary, why bother adding the weight and bits?
* Balanced look
* Longer life
* Less fade if seriously pushed
* Weight has slowly increased since the MkI
* Power has been increasing since the MkI
Follow me for more tips
PS Jenn's M696 weighs only 400# and has dual Brembos and USD forks and feels brilliant. Why not a V7?
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I wonder if the Chang Jiang 750 Defender will be there-------------------
https://www.rideapart.com/news/687891/changjiang-v750-defender-sidecar-design/
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Stolen from the rumor's source:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw/AP1GczOxqAVHyRZ0M8Vgko7m3wGv1VW-PMmdni0BnMKCZ5tVEj7RCz2x4i_VYstLIegMXweZFbIrV8v5GoQdRI7vnsoDx9dDO2rgiszviXQr3Ag9XJhI-LiJ5PaOtzOXZ_roISh4MnNSCLPScI50Nj8mFDuzNA=w720-h482-s-no-gm?authuser=0)
Give me a V100 which looks like that, and I'm in heaven...
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I wonder why the front needs two rotors. Granted, I can’t remember how the 850 felt when I rode one, but at least with the Mk III, it doesn’t feel necessary. And if it isn’t necessary, why bother adding the weight and bits?
Twin disks increases braking power, decreases effort at the lever, and increases feel for the rider. Allows two-finger braking in most conditions. The single disk outfit on the V7s has been perfectly adequate, but going to dual disks will improve the riding experience.
Same for the USD fork. It will be an improvement over the bargain bin conventional fork fitted to these since 2009.
It's about time some of the V7s have these two items.
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Hamlin has a fantastic mod for the V7 single disk that does everything you just described without the added weight. Must be experienced to be believed.
He really is a master at that stuff.
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Hamlin has a fantastic mod for the V7 single disk that does everything you just described without the added weight. Must be experienced to be believed.
He really is a master at that stuff.
Ooh, where can I find details on this?
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Ooh, where can I find details on this?
Hamlin Cycles…..dot…..com
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Hamlin Cycles…..dot…..com
Couldn't find any details on their site. Is there a link to it?
What's the upgrade consist of, is it the Brembo RCS radial master upgrade or something else?
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Jim doesn't bother with too much web stuff. His huge customer base already knows.
Call him, use my name, and ask for the V7 brake mod.
Ask around. Everybody in the east knows how great Hamlin Cycles is.
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One can only fervently hope that such expertise will find a path to flow into the next generation of masters of their craft. Bravo, Jim!
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2025 Monza.
https://youtu.be/oZ7OKWHSddo?si=facq_P5nE2z5MfPP
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2025 Monza.
https://youtu.be/oZ7OKWHSddo?si=facq_P5nE2z5MfPP
Too bad that’s another example of a “probably” fake reveal video that simply shows an Oberdan Bezzi concept.
But I’d love to see that come to life. Reviving the Monza name would be great for a modern small block.
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Put the V85 motor in it and you would have a bike worthy of its name and predecessors.
Pete
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2025 Monza.
https://youtu.be/oZ7OKWHSddo?si=facq_P5nE2z5MfPP
That bike should sell !! Maybe to us old guys, but you can get a GSXR with twice the power
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Crappy photoshop...all this speculative stuff gets really boring.
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Crappy photoshop...all this speculative stuff gets really boring.
It could be, but I don't think it is. The only parts that would need to be are the front end. The wheel is well done if that's the case. And isn't the side cover badge different but very believable?
Maybe I'm easy to convince because it so matches my desires.
Also the group admin who posted it doesn't usually tolerate such. Hell he deleted a post with one recently.
*Shrugs* guess we'll know soon enough.
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I meant the video Kev.
The photographs initially posted are very credible for me and I think would be a very good upgrade.
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I suspect, if they really made this model, it will sell like "hot cakes", and especially in "red"
:bow: :thumb: :cool: :boozing: I guess we will know after the EICMA show, yes? :wink:
(https://i.ibb.co/zn2y0S5/Screenshot-2024-10-24-at-5-22-22-AM.png) (https://ibb.co/zn2y0S5)
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I suspect, if they really made this model, it will sell like "hot cakes", and especially in "red"
:bow: :thumb: :cool: :boozing: I guess we will know after the EICMA show, yes? :wink:
(https://i.ibb.co/zn2y0S5/Screenshot-2024-10-24-at-5-22-22-AM.png) (https://ibb.co/zn2y0S5)
Let me make a prediction. Won't happen. :smiley: I'm still waiting for the Ippogriffo..
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There are a number of videos on Utube with "new" models coming from MG. I watched one and only one just a load of BS. There is even one with a new California. Yeah right even AI couldn't come up with something that any of us would want, I didn't watch it just saw the thumbnail.
kk
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The "green" V7 is lovely looking and unlike some people who have a Mk 2 or 3, or even 1 V7, I have a 2004 Breva and I anticipate it would be quite an upgrade for me personally. . Fit a small screen, centrestand and HB racks and panniers and that me done for the next 15 years. And unlike a lot of people, I AM actively looking to replace my old Guzzi with a new Guzzi sooner rather than later.
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I know they can't because vespa exists within the same corporation, but I want to see a modern Galletto
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Things may be quiet at Moto Guzzi, but Moto Morini is promising something:
Moto Morini is ready to usher in a new era at the 110th edition of EICMA, the most important international exhibition dedicated to two-wheel vehicles. It is here, at EICMA, that the motorcycle manufacturer will reveal, in a world premiere, four new models set to enhance its lineup from 2025 onwards, marking a strategic expansion and further solidifying its presence in the global market.
Moto Morini has chosen EICMA, the world’s leading event, as the ideal stage to showcase these new entries, aiming to reach a diverse audience with a range that will be highly varied in both style and engine capacity. As with all Moto Morini models, the new ones will be characterized by meticulous craftsmanship and exceptional design, tailored to meet the expectations of the most demanding riders.
This edition of EICMA is a landmark for Moto Morini, representing a key moment in our journey of growth and transformation,” declares Alberto Monni, General Manager of Moto Morini ‘In addition to expanding our footprint in new market segments, this year we will also have the opportunity to celebrate the anniversary of a model that has made the history of the Moto Morini brand.
"Our commitment is clear: to combine tradition and innovation, focusing on motorbikes that deliver high performance, reliability, and an exceptional riding experience. The models currently in our range along with those we will introduce at EICMA, embody the evolution of our heritage and the brand’s look towards the future. We invite you to discover the new products at our booth.
Moto Morini thus reaffirms its mission to remain a key player in the motorcycle market, staying deeply rooted in its rich past while embracing the challenges of the future. The new range is designed to meet the needs of an international audience increasingly aware of quality, design and innovation.
The appointment is set at EICMA, Fiera Milano – Rho, from 5th to 10th November 2024, at Hall 24, Stand C54, where Moto Morini eagerly awaits enthusiasts, partners, and the media to celebrate a new milestone in its remarkable history."
SR
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If they don’t present a different small block model entirely different from the V7/V9 or V85, I’ll be fairly pessimistic about the small block’s future. There’s been plenty enough time for R&D to create something different beyond new color ways and “street versions” of a mild ADV.
As both a V7 owner and a (now discontinued) Harley Sportster 1200 owner... How much longer can Moto Guzzi avoid making the V7 liquid cooled and still meet emissions requirements?
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As both a V7 owner and a (now discontinued) Harley Sportster 1200 owner... How much longer can Moto Guzzi avoid making the V7 liquid cooled and still meet emissions requirements?
As a former Harley owner you might get that it's largely a balance between the priorities of performance and emissions.
I mean Harley still sells mostly air-cooled bikes.
And BMW went the other direction stepping back a little from water cooled bikes releasing new lines of air cooled boxers.
So it really depends on market pressures and regulatory pressures but fans of air-cooled motors shouldn't give up hope quite yet.
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As both a V7 owner and a (now discontinued) Harley Sportster 1200 owner... How much longer can Moto Guzzi avoid making the V7 liquid cooled and still meet emissions requirements?
Yep, always a concern, but the same can be applied to any other air-cooled bike currently out there. Some are just better designed to take on the tightening restrictions (and internally, such is the case comparing the small blocks to the recently extinct big blocks). As for Harley, their engineers—at least in their racing departments, perhaps also the consumer-street end, too—seem to be more short-sighted and willing to work more with bandaid fixes.
I’m sure Piaggio has a good idea just how long the small block’s remaining theoretical shelf life is. Someone just needs to ask them nicely :cheesy:
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Good question, I think a lot of us wonder the same thing.
kk
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Impatiently waiting for the V100 California.
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M/C media started predicting the coming soon demise of air cooled motors back in the mid 90s, it's 30 years later and they're still with us. However, the end is likely not to many years off.
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Well the 2025 V85 passes Euro5+ so I suspect its good until more stringent standards are passed.
Pete
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I read an article about Euro 5+ that basically said the criteria was the same, except that now they catalyst has to be tested in a long term way for durability and efficiency, instead of just testing the pollutants coming from a brand new bike one time. Now they have a 35k km testing cycle for degradation of the catalyst.
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Good question, I think a lot of us wonder the same thing.
kk
Thanks all. I was wondering if there was any gossip or rumours out there on when Moto Guzzi / Piaggio might be forced to change, but, no news is good news.
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I wonder if the Chang Jiang 750 Defender will be there-------------------
https://www.rideapart.com/news/687891/changjiang-v750-defender-sidecar-design/
Chang Jiang made about 1,000,000 sidecar units for the Chinese Army.
They were based on a Ural only they just had splash lube, a POS
When I was in Beijing I visited an American who was refurbishing these machines upgrading the motors with BMW Boxer engines.
I hired one for the day to Visit the great wall,
I called a company Bejing Sideways and next morning a driver and Guide picked me up at the hotel
SO it looks like they are now knocking off a Guzzi, I wonder what shortcuts they are taking there?
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For starters I think the chinese engine is a 750.I'd expect it to only be compliant with less stringent emissions too.
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For starters I think the chinese engine is a 750.I'd expect it to only be compliant with less stringent emissions too.
I wouldn't expect the emissions to rule out an export to the USA, as the USA is a place older models tend to "go to die" after strict tailpipe emissions restrict their sale in other parts of the world. The USA is more lenient on those, but in some ways can be more strict on noise emissions.
RevZilla had an article on this a while ago:
https://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/is-the-united-states-where-old-motorcycles-go-to-die
Some recent examples are Honda shipping the Navi to the USA after it was discontinued due to not meeting tailpipe emissions requirements in India, and the USA market Honda Transalp XL750 making less peak power and being limited to a lower RPM than elsewhere in the world so that it would comply with USA noise emission requirements.
I read an article about Euro 5+ that basically said the criteria was the same, except that now they catalyst has to be tested in a long term way for durability and efficiency, instead of just testing the pollutants coming from a brand new bike one time. Now they have a 35k km testing cycle for degradation of the catalyst.
Of the few "Euro5+" 2025 model year updates I've seen to existing Euro5 bikes on the market, so far most of them have noted changes to the exhaust, specifically the catalyst, and the tune.
I reached out to Hamlin Cycles, the upgraded front brake setup they offer is indeed the higher spec Brembo master cylinder and front brake caliper. Not really Guzzi pricing on the parts as you can buy them much cheaper elsewhere, but it would be a good option for someone on the East coast also looking to have a shop install it for them.
The Moto Morini mention had my attention until I looked them up... Chinese bikes wearing an Italian brand. Not my cup of tea. If I wanted to buy something with a CFMoto engine it would likely be a KTM for the established brand support and local dealerships.
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I read an article about Euro 5+ that basically said the criteria was the same, except that now they catalyst has to be tested in a long term way for durability and efficiency, instead of just testing the pollutants coming from a brand new bike one time. Now they have a 35k km testing cycle for degradation of the catalyst.
The new V85's (E5+) also have a 3rd Lamda sensor after the cat, thus able to check the condition & performance of the cat with those.
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The 2025 V7 Sport rumor is confirmed by the same bike spotted on the venue floor.
Photo from "Moto Guzzi Daily" on Facebook, not mine.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/4937603529687444/posts/8704365479677878/
(https://i.ibb.co/bX08ZBf/465658985-10233673921820706-2218380962571523396-n.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bX08ZBf)
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The 2025 V7 Sport rumor is confirmed by the same bike spotted on the venue floor.
Photo from "Moto Guzzi Daily" on Facebook, not mine.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/4937603529687444/posts/8704365479677878/
(https://i.ibb.co/bX08ZBf/465658985-10233673921820706-2218380962571523396-n.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bX08ZBf)
Oooooooooo I think that badge says V7 SPORT.
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Gold rims as standard, hopefully they will have red available in the premier model.
(https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/465670180_28386807820917995_1457744070287711144_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=bd9a62&_nc_ohc=kpcPWVKjXzoQ7kNvgFjEK2M&_nc_zt=23&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&_nc_gid=Ae5Sv0J8Uwphtv9Q_vhF4Kq&oh=00_AYCclrLCx8ukrHSq-HfmGHefV48RssBdpvsgMpUP86OjFA&oe=672EEAD7)
Edit:
(https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/465568593_10233772473324376_2412026217485783667_n.jpg?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=bd9a62&_nc_ohc=8rLMtty3dVkQ7kNvgH9mUvE&_nc_zt=23&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&_nc_gid=AhboW0nF6S26zgNCAgpJtuj&oh=00_AYCz52Gbi4-BkOk7IF9ssLEiSsgTbCEhV9kAn9x4Ge6b9Q&oe=672EF732)
Familiar paint work:
(https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/465753838_1292574531933859_8843904808955405464_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=aa7b47&_nc_ohc=rDARsVp0uyIQ7kNvgH7KQvy&_nc_zt=23&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&_nc_gid=AEby4eO0rOCXicNEZ92LQct&oh=00_AYAmrNPC6hUVseUJcIxco6u94cLKP2p38-8FirMhiOobCQ&oe=672ED940)
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Oooooooooo I think that badge says V7 SPORT.
Looks like V7GRT?????
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Looks like V7GRT?????
Look closer. Maybe one of these links will help:
https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipMBu5qXHZIdMNrouRpUSe5fnPryQva7rDv3AEqQfHBpePgPrLSroxkosTaPBbYExA/photo/AF1QipOq_XyYgdwa1rtMGUv2ZlFCnA8hU_N4-NnqrEN-?key=cTk3cUIwR1N2NW5EZU9NN3pFak5UX04teWtZQzV3
https://photos.app.goo.gl/1x8mDte7v4jPvzBM8
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Gold rims as standard, hopefully they will have red available in the premier model.
(https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/465670180_28386807820917995_1457744070287711144_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=bd9a62&_nc_ohc=kpcPWVKjXzoQ7kNvgFjEK2M&_nc_zt=23&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&_nc_gid=Ae5Sv0J8Uwphtv9Q_vhF4Kq&oh=00_AYCclrLCx8ukrHSq-HfmGHefV48RssBdpvsgMpUP86OjFA&oe=672EEAD7)
Edit:
(https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/465568593_10233772473324376_2412026217485783667_n.jpg?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=bd9a62&_nc_ohc=8rLMtty3dVkQ7kNvgH9mUvE&_nc_zt=23&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&_nc_gid=AhboW0nF6S26zgNCAgpJtuj&oh=00_AYCz52Gbi4-BkOk7IF9ssLEiSsgTbCEhV9kAn9x4Ge6b9Q&oe=672EF732)
Familiar paint work:
(https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/465753838_1292574531933859_8843904808955405464_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=aa7b47&_nc_ohc=rDARsVp0uyIQ7kNvgH7KQvy&_nc_zt=23&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&_nc_gid=AEby4eO0rOCXicNEZ92LQct&oh=00_AYAmrNPC6hUVseUJcIxco6u94cLKP2p38-8FirMhiOobCQ&oe=672ED940)
On the V100 Mandello - In addition to the different rims and changes to the color scheme, the windscreen has been changed. Looks like a notch has been made along the bottom, maybe for a different actuator mechanism ?
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Pretty much what I expected from the V7 Sport - will be very interested to see the specs of the motor when that is released. Like everything about it from what I can see apart from the pleated seat! It will be interesting to test ride in sequence - my 2004 Breva750 ->Standard V7 Stone - > V7 Sport.
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“Looks like a notch has been made along the bottom, maybe for a different actuator mechanism ?“
From what I read, it is probably related to the optional radar system.
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Adaptive cruise control wouldn't break my heart. It works really well on my wife's Jeep. It will detect traffic slowdown before I can. That's what it looks like to me, radar head.
kk
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More...looks like somebody snuck in on setup day.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGBNuGetH68
SR
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I find it odd that they’re selling a “V7 Sport” with a standard handlebar.
Personally disappointed with what Guzzi has to show. I don’t demand a large stable of bikes out of this small production brand, but I do feel they’ve regressed in the past 10 years. No scrambler. No cafe. Just a heavy standard with an ugly digital dash, a sport tourer and adventure bike using the liquid-cooled motor that appear much closer in design and performance than perhaps they ought to be, an air-cooled “cruiser” that’s pretty much a V7 with balloon tires, a goofy tank, and still sells poorly. Seems to me like they have 2.5 good motors to develop more platforms off of. Where’s that California? Anything new with the V9? Stornello? V85X?
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I find it odd that they’re selling a “V7 Sport” with a standard handlebar.
Personally disappointed with what Guzzi has to show. I don’t demand a large stable of bikes out of this small production brand, but I do feel they’ve regressed in the past 10 years. No scrambler. No cafe. Just a heavy standard with an ugly digital dash, a sport tourer and adventure bike using the liquid-cooled motor that appear much closer in design and performance than perhaps they ought to be, an air-cooled “cruiser” that’s pretty much a V7 with balloon tires, a goofy tank, and still sells poorly.
Heh?!?
I dunno. I don't get the Scrambler thing anyway and I don't think they sold well.
And a cafe? Isn't that the V7 Sport with a fairing or a different seat?
And what is selling poorly?
Wait, do we even KNOW what the full line-up is? Aren't we just seeing snippets of what they are showing at the EICMA here?
Did I miss an official announcement?
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Heh?!?
I dunno. I don't get the Scrambler thing anyway and I don't think they sold well.
And yet the major brands still pump them out—Royal Enfield, Triumph, Honda, BMW and more have scramblers in their lineup. Aside from the Stornello, Guzzi simply offered kits, and barely any for the V7III range (scrambler exhausts for a V7 III are hard to come by, hence why I bought a salvage V7 III with one attached).
And a cafe? Isn't that the V7 Sport with a fairing or a different seat?
I didn’t live in the initial period of production but to me, a factory cafe at least needs clip-ons or sporty bars, which is why I’m puzzled over the Sport moniker. Isn’t it the first V7 sport/racer/cafe not using clip-ons?
And what is selling poorly?
I was referring to the V9.
Wait, do we even KNOW what the full line-up is? Aren't we just seeing snippets of what they are showing at the EICMA here?
Did I miss an official announcement?
Wouldn’t we have seen the bigger reveals via pics by now?
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some V7 info
(https://i.ibb.co/0BRhtC5/mga.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0BRhtC5)
(https://i.ibb.co/4wq6Yjf/mgb.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4wq6Yjf)
(https://i.ibb.co/hgKgF1P/mgc.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hgKgF1P)
(https://i.ibb.co/RhXy1R1/mgd.jpg) (https://ibb.co/RhXy1R1)
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some V100 info
(https://i.ibb.co/wpKYqqZ/v100a.jpg) (https://ibb.co/wpKYqqZ)
(https://i.ibb.co/r348Z1W/v100b.jpg) (https://ibb.co/r348Z1W)
(https://i.ibb.co/0ZJdGyS/v100c.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0ZJdGyS)
(https://i.ibb.co/LtSF50M/v100d.jpg) (https://ibb.co/LtSF50M)
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Stelvio Tributo
(https://i.ibb.co/dbqCcmH/stelvio1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dbqCcmH)
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(A) And yet the major brands still pump them out—Royal Enfield, Triumph, Honda, BMW and more have scramblers in their lineup. Aside from the Stornello, Guzzi simply offered kits, and barely any for the V7III range (scrambler exhausts for a V7 III are hard to come by, hence why I bought a salvage V7 III with one attached).
(B) I didn’t live in the initial period of production but to me, a factory cafe at least needs clip-ons or sporty bars, which is why I’m puzzled over the Sport moniker. Isn’t it the first V7 sport/racer/cafe not using clip-ons?
(C) I was referring to the V9.
(D) Wouldn’t we have seen the bigger reveals via pics by now?
(A) - BMW dropped it. Yeah Duc and Triumph still have em. I could care less what Honda has. But like I say to my kids. "Just because other kids are doing it isn't justification enough for you to". I don't see that the V7 SCRAMBLERS WERE POPULAR, I think they lagged in sales. That's what I was saying.
(B) - I don't think that just because something is called a Sport or V7 Sport it needs to be a clone of the original. Yes I believe the original had clip ons, but ugh, man, I'm glad this doesn't personally. I wonder how the Racer sold vs the Special and Stone - that could be the reason right there. I'd rather have to change bars than say FRONT END and BRAKES. But that's just me.
(C) - oh, yeah, but I guess I missed your point. So you're bitching that they offered IT (a V9) in the first place instead of something else? Again, I suspect they know what is and what is not selling. So they tried something different. I don't hold that against them.
(D) - No Since I posted that I have just FINALLY seen ANY official announcement. The show is the debut for some new product and then they can add models or take away models when they want right? Maybe this is all that will be new but still, small brand, small changes.
EDIT - HUZAH - they updated the whole V7 line to the 52 mm throttle body and ride by wire!!!! That IS a big change. That's awesome!
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I've mentioned it here a few times. The V9 was made in response to requests from the UK dealers and importer. Possibly one of our friends over there can chime in.
As for scrambler, or this, or that. Companies mentioned make and sell WAY more than Guzzi. Ya can't be all thinks to all people unless you're Honda or similar.
Look at all the great deals available on leftovers from Guzzi. Heck, one can still get a new Black/White special V85 brand new-and they made what-1500 or so limited editions?
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hoping they would have shown the baby Guzzi leaked in some spy photos.
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some V100 info
(https://i.ibb.co/wpKYqqZ/v100a.jpg) (https://ibb.co/wpKYqqZ)
(https://i.ibb.co/r348Z1W/v100b.jpg) (https://ibb.co/r348Z1W)
(https://i.ibb.co/0ZJdGyS/v100c.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0ZJdGyS)
(https://i.ibb.co/LtSF50M/v100d.jpg) (https://ibb.co/LtSF50M)
The V100 "Wind Tunnel" version is interesting, looks like it has everything the "S" version has except the PFF rider assistance stuff.... cool graphics too
https://www.cycleworld.com/bikes/moto-guzzi-v100-mandello-range-first-look/
https://www.1000ps.at/motorrad-bilder-detail-moto-guzzi-v100-mandello-wind-tunnel-2025-23775
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Let me make a prediction. Won't happen. :smiley: I'm still waiting for the Ippogriffo..
You may make that prediction Chuck, but that’s EXACTLY what some established luminaries said about the V85..
One bloke had the guts to admit he was wrong here on these pages.
Do we need to pull up the old thread ?
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What buyers want is an 850 version of the new liquid motor in a suitably V7 sized chassis, proper Ohlins inspired front end (or the actual thing), twin discs, a wholesale reduction in the electronic gimmickery that has you taking the thing back to the dealer, no stupid “aggressive” straight line/slash cut styling and that utterly chunder inducing cocked up tail piece that is just garbage.
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Buyers don't all want the same thing. I likely wouldn't have bought a liquid-cooled V7. It being air-cooled was a major selling point over a Kawasaki Z900RS for me. Doesn't mean I don't like the liquid-cooled V100 though, as it's a much different type of bike and the liquid-cooling suits it better IMO.
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Buyers don't all want the same thing. I likely wouldn't have bought a liquid-cooled V7. It being air-cooled was a major selling point over a Kawasaki Z900RS for me. Doesn't mean I don't like the liquid-cooled V100 though, as it's a much different type of bike and the liquid-cooling suits it better IMO.
I’ll concede that not all buyers want the same thing, but even if 3% of the motorcycle buying public wanted a liquid cooled 850 cc Guzzi, that would still translate out to 100’s of thousands of orders.
Also there have been a hell of a lot of people turn away from a V85 to get something else because of easily remedied things like excessive seat heights or too heavy (V100), (new Stelvio) et al…
The best R&D people are the buying public….Listen to them…!
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I think the v85 has sold far better than Huzo seems to want to give credit to.
Huzo said, "I’ll concede that not all buyers want the same thing, but even if 3% of the motorcycle buying public wanted a liquid cooled 850 cc Guzzi, that would still translate out to 100’s of thousands of orders."
What??? I guess, even though it makes very little sense to say so, you are using all motorcycle sales world wide for this? But even using your numbers, there is NO WAY Guzzi is going to get orders for "100s of thousands" for an 850 liquid cooled twin! Seriously, think about what your saying!
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I think the v85 has sold far better than Huzo seems to want to give credit to.
Huzo said, "I’ll concede that not all buyers want the same thing, but even if 3% of the motorcycle buying public wanted a liquid cooled 850 cc Guzzi, that would still translate out to 100’s of thousands of orders."
What??? I guess, even though it makes very little sense to say so, you are using all motorcycle sales world wide for this? But even using your numbers, there is NO WAY Guzzi is going to get orders for "100s of thousands" for an 850 liquid cooled twin! Seriously, think about what your saying!
For starters mate it’s “you’re” not “your”, but we‘ll get back to that.
I know how well the V85 sold and I did my bit there. I do not think that MG could cope with one tenth of that demand but what I contend is this…
For every new bike you see on the road that someone has paid hard earned money for, there are a LOT of bikes the buyer chose not to get and we’ll never know why they went elsewhere, but my point was and still is that over a massive target audience, you only have to capture a trifling percentage increase in hits, and that is a massive increase in orders.
Strangely, it’s a lot like elections….. :wink:
Oh and BTW.
I’ll think about what I’m saying if you think about what you’re typing, the only bit of your post that wasn’t riddled with grammatical errors was between the quotation marks.
I’ve survived on this forum because I DO think about what I’m saying, it can be a slippery slope BC.
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I’ll concede that not all buyers want the same thing, but even if 3% of the motorcycle buying public wanted a liquid cooled 850 cc Guzzi, that would still translate out to 100’s of thousands of orders.
Congratulations, you've qualified as the owner of the most ridiculous hyperbole ever thrust upon WG members.
For this completely made up statistic coupled with a pure fantasy that is contradicted by the entire production history of the brand, you'll receive a lifetime supply of "WTF"!
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Congratulations, you've qualified as the owner of the most ridiculous hyperbole ever thrust upon WG members.
For this completely made up statistic coupled with a pure fantasy that is contradicted by the entire production history of the brand, you'll receive a lifetime supply of "WTF"!
I considered all that filler material. The primary purpose of Huzo’s comment was clearly to protect the English language in written form ;)
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Congratulations, you've qualified as the owner of the most ridiculous hyperbole ever thrust upon WG members.
For this completely made up statistic coupled with a pure fantasy that is contradicted by the entire production history of the brand, you'll receive a lifetime supply of "WTF"!
Yeah I always back off a bit when you weigh in Kev. Sure the numbers can be hacked back into reality to protect the innocent and I’ll wear that.
Can you give some consideration to my point though, I guess if I have to be held to realistic margins, my point is that the buying public is so large, that a relatively small advance percentage wise in sales, will add up to a large increase in potential orders. It can be in the positive or a couple of poor decisions can send you under.
As for the production history of the brand, there was a time when they were pretty much on the skids but a redirecting of course has boosted sales and profits.
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An air cooled motorcycle with decent performance, cruise control, and options under $10k. I would think this is going to be a bigger hit with people than previous iterations of the V7. Not a drastic design change but still looks way cool and seems a smart design evolution.
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Yeah I always back off a bit when you weigh in Kev. Sure the numbers can be hacked back into reality to protect the innocent and I’ll wear that.
Can you give some consideration to my point though, I guess if I have to be held to realistic margins, my point is that the buying public is so large, that a relatively small advance percentage wise in sales, will add up to a large increase in potential orders. It can be in the positive or a couple of poor decisions can send you under.
As for the production history of the brand, there was a time when they were pretty much on the skids but a redirecting of course has boosted sales and profits.
Of course Guzzis numbers are such a miniscule part of the industry that a single percent could mean a lot.
What I don't necessarily buy is that your proposal would guarantee such a percentage.
I mean are the V100's flying off the shelf?
Water-cooling is a non-starter to me personally. I don't NEED the performance, so I don't WANT the complexity.
I'm certainly not alone since even BMW has taken steps backwards away from it.
I think if it weren't for emissions regulations trying to wag the dog the MARKET wouldn't be pushing it even as much as it does.
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Going after a person for their poor grammar, is about the lowest hanging fruit a guy can grab. If we were speaking instead of writing would you call me out for poor use of the language? You wouldn't need to, as my spoken word is far stronger than my admittedly weak hold on the written side.
I don't usually go here, but I will today. I have dealt with dyslexia my whole life, I was teased at great length from first grade up, always the first or second out on a spelling bee, poor grades, remedial english class, the list goes on longer than I care to revisit. Spell check has been a huge help, but I clearly don't have a great handle on how to use that either, and that's on me. Anyway, I still disagree with you, Huzo, on the subject at hand. And I understand from your post that I don't have the kind of respect that you show to others. Respect is earned, as the saying goes, perhaps at some point I'll get there.
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For starters mate it’s “you’re” not “your”, but we‘ll get back to that.
I know how well the V85 sold and I did my bit there. I do not think that MG could cope with one tenth of that demand but what I contend is this…
For every new bike you see on the road that someone has paid hard earned money for, there are a LOT of bikes the buyer chose not to get and we’ll never know why they went elsewhere, but my point was and still is that over a massive target audience, you only have to capture a trifling percentage increase in hits, and that is a massive increase in orders.
Strangely, it’s a lot like elections….. :wink:
Oh and BTW.
I’ll think about what I’m saying if you think about what you’re typing, the only bit of your post that wasn’t riddled with grammatical errors was between the quotation marks.
I’ve survived on this forum because I DO think about what I’m saying, it can be a slippery slope BC.
You're missing a couple of commas, since we've reduced ourselves to being pedantic grammar Nazis.
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I think an 850 w/c half faired Breva 750 replacement would "do well" but of course what do I mean by that? Just because I would like to ride such a thing doesn't mean lots of people agree with me. After all, I like bagpipe music from the 1600s.......
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Respect is earned, as the saying goes, perhaps at some point I'll get there.
You've had my respect for many years.
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Who else would like to see a single using one barrel of the 850 oriented like the old Guzzi single with a balance shaft and chain or belt drive??
Not that it would do me any good as my eyes no longer support riding!!!
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Who else would like to see a single using one barrel of the 850 oriented like the old Guzzi single with a balance shaft and chain or belt drive??
Not that it would do me any good as my eyes no longer support riding!!!
I would certainly like to ogle that as a concept bike, but I don't think it would do well on the market. Ducati allegedly kicked around the idea of dropping a cylinder from their Scrambler for a lower displacement version, but ended up going with a smaller bore and stroke on the L-twin as a Ducati Scrambler Sixty2. Even with the reduced price, it did not sell well. On the other end of the spectrum there is also the Ducati Scrambler 1100 which has not sold well. The 800 seems to have been the sweet spot for price, power, and weight.
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Who else would like to see a single using one barrel of the 850 oriented like the old Guzzi single with a balance shaft and chain or belt drive??
Not that it would do me any good as my eyes no longer support riding!!!
Not so much a single as a 650cc version (reduced stroke?) of the V85 or V7 released for the Australian market so that our learner riders could start out on a Guzzi. Heck, they even built such a machine in the '90s called the NTX650 with a US 8 gallon (30 litre) tank.
It would introduce new riders to the characteristics of an air-cooled, 90 degree V-twin and might even build some brand loyalty.
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Who else would like to see a single using one barrel of the 850 oriented like the old Guzzi single with a balance shaft and chain or belt drive??
Not that it would do me any good as my eyes no longer support riding!!!
(https://i.ibb.co/8NXQV4K/IMG-1363.jpg) (https://ibb.co/8NXQV4K)
marine corps scholarship foundation (https://nonprofitlight.com/va/alexandria/marine-corps-scholarship-foundation-inc)
Don't have the backstory.
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Not so much a single as a 650cc version (reduced stroke?) of the V85 or V7 released for the Australian market so that our learner riders could start out on a Guzzi. Heck, they even built such a machine in the '90s called the NTX650 with a US 8 gallon (30 litre) tank.
It would introduce new riders to the characteristics of an air-cooled, 90 degree V-twin and might even build some brand loyalty.
That's something I'd love to see. Tiered licensing in Europe would also support a smaller displacement bike. That said I suspect Piaggio has other brands to fill the lower displacement market like the Aprilia 457 and that Guzzi will remain their 'luxury' brand.
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Something I noticed in some of the EICMA photos is that the heated handgrips icon is on for one of the V7 models. I wonder if this means the OEM accessory heated grips will finally be released for the V7 850.
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Something I noticed in some of the EICMA photos is that the heated handgrips icon is on for one of the V7 models. I wonder if this means the OEM accessory heated grips will finally be released for the V7 850.
Yes, I think so:
(https://i.ibb.co/zVWc2FJ/mgd.jpg) (https://ibb.co/zVWc2FJ)
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Hamlin has a fantastic mod for the V7 single disk that does everything you just described without the added weight. Must be experienced to be believed.
He really is a master at that stuff.
What is the modification ?
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What is the modification ?
From Jim @ Hamlin Cycles when I inquired with that very question:
"We replace the caliper and the master cylinder with higher spec Brembo items. The parts cost @$1000, plus a couple hours of installation. The results are dramatic!"
I didn't pursue beyond that, but I suspect it may be the Brembo 4-pad caliper paired with a Brembo RCS master cylinder that you can find documentation of others swapping onto the V7. GTM also sell those parts as braking upgrades for the V7.
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Seriously, think about what your saying!
Like that will ever happen! :grin:
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What buyers want is an 850 version of the new liquid motor in a suitably V7 sized chassis, proper Ohlins inspired front end (or the actual thing), twin discs, a wholesale reduction in the electronic gimmickery that has you taking the thing back to the dealer, no stupid “aggressive” straight line/slash cut styling and that utterly chunder inducing cocked up tail piece that is just garbage.
I just want a bigger f***ing frame so I can take my girlfriend for a ride without the two of us (who only weigh a combined 305 lbs, but aren't short) feeling like a couple of circus bears on a gawdamn miniature tricycle.
The woman who has sat on the back seat of a 650cc BMW for multiple 2,000 km road trips with me hates being on the back of the V7, and between you and me, I hate her on the back of the V7 too.
As she isn't able to get a license, we do a lot of riding together, and with multiple motorcycles and even a Vespa in the garage, we'll always take literallyanythingbu tthev7 as our ride of choice.
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Buyers don't all want the same thing. I likely wouldn't have bought a liquid-cooled V7. It being air-cooled was a major selling point over a Kawasaki Z900RS for me. Doesn't mean I don't like the liquid-cooled V100 though, as it's a much different type of bike and the liquid-cooling suits it better IMO.
If you don't dislike in-line fours, get the Z900RS. It's so, sooooo good.
I owned a Z900RS while I was making my "Best Mid-Size Retro Motorcycle Series" on YouTube comparing the V7 I vs the Bonneville SE, vs the Royal Enfield Interceptor 650.
A few people thought it was weird that I put "Mid-Size" in the title, and that I put a low maximum budget on the bikes in the contest. The reason for both was because I owned the Z900RS at the time, and I needed to keep that bike OUT of the contest, because it would absolutely wipe the floor with any of those three motorcycles, in any category. It would've been an absolutely one-sided contest.
Ok, maybe the V7 would've won for character, but besides that, Z900RS, top grades across the board.
It was even better than the other motorcycles at two up riding. Even through some aggressive twisties and technical riding, the Z900RS carried my girlfriend on the back so well, that I probably felt her the least on that motorcycle versus any of the others.
My only knock against the Z900RS, which is ultimately why I sold it, was that I just can't stand inline 4s for long. I'm probably some kind of autistic, but the hum of in-line four motorcycles, and vacuum cleaners, I can't stand it.
If you like in-line fours, you will absolutely love the Z900RS. If you can find a used SE with the upgraded shocks, even better, but even the base model is everything a motorcycle should be. It's really a fantastic machine. I absolutely loved it but I couldn't stand the sound of the motor for long because I'm built weird.
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I hate 2-up riding period.
But when I do it nothing compares to a bike designed for it, like my old Road Kings.
We do use our V7's for 2-up once in a while, with our kids as passengers. That's it.
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I just want a bigger f***ing frame so I can take my girlfriend for a ride without the two of us (who only weigh a combined 305 lbs, but aren't short) feeling like a couple of circus bears on a gawdamn miniature tricycle.
The frame’s not the issue—it’s the tank, or more accurately, what the tank does to the seating position. Before Guzzi came out with the V7 Classic, that tank was never on a small block. All other small block bikes had tanks that ended near where the frame’s top tube terminates and/or didn’t bump-stop the rider so far back. This allowed the seat to often sit farther forward. And if anyone has ever ridden a V7 and wondered why they reach forward a little more than they do on other standards, I think it’s primarily that reason. The V7 is the only standard that I’ve owned or ridden which I found myself seeking a solution to that forward reach—makes longer distance riding a bit uncomfortable.
Here’s an animation comparing the ergonomics of a V50 II and a V7 Stone Ten, overlaid on top of one another using wheelbase as reference (click the thumbnail to view the animation):
(https://i.ibb.co/Gf6nJZN/IMG-6581.gif) (https://ibb.co/Gf6nJZN)
Slap on an older tank and seat from a V50 or V65–or at least throw on a tank that doesn’t block your crotch like a Volkswagen attempting to drive through the Berlin Wall, and I bet you’d have the seating room that you and others seek.
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The correct answer is, V85! Perfect for two up, and solo.
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Not sure I’m following this accurately, but the SB frame is absolutely smaller in most every aspect when compared to any BB to to frame.
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I put bar extenders on our v7 to get a comfortable riding position.
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The frame’s not the issue—it’s the tank, or more accurately, what the tank does to the seating position. Before Guzzi came out with the V7 Classic, that tank was never on a small block. All other small block bikes had tanks that ended near where the frame’s top tube terminates and/or didn’t bump-stop the rider so far back. This allowed the seat to often sit farther forward. And if anyone has ever ridden a V7 and wondered why they reach forward a little more than they do on other standards, I think it’s primarily that reason. The V7 is the only standard that I’ve owned or ridden which I found myself seeking a solution to that forward reach—makes longer distance riding a bit uncomfortable.
Here’s an animation comparing the ergonomics of a V50 II and a V7 Stone Ten, overlaid on top of one another using wheelbase as reference (click the thumbnail to view the animation):
(https://i.ibb.co/Gf6nJZN/IMG-6581.gif) (https://ibb.co/Gf6nJZN)
Slap on an older tank and seat from a V50 or V65–or at least throw on a tank that doesn’t block your crotch like a Volkswagen attempting to drive through the Berlin Wall, and I bet you’d have the seating room that you and others seek.
Tomato tomahto. It's cramped! lol
That's a cool diagram though :)
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I wonder if the Chang Jiang 750 Defender will be there-------------------
https://www.rideapart.com/news/687891/changjiang-v750-defender-sidecar-design/
If that's not a Guzzi Ripoff nothing is
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I’ll concede that not all buyers want the same thing, but even if 3% of the motorcycle buying public wanted a liquid cooled 850 cc Guzzi, that would still translate out to 100’s of thousands of orders.
Also there have been a hell of a lot of people turn away from a V85 to get something else because of easily remedied things like excessive seat heights or too heavy (V100), (new Stelvio) et al…
The best R&D people are the buying public….Listen to them…!
Yeah, opinions vary......... Does Guzzi listen to its fanbase? or look to go wider into the market? Tough call, and has to be a bit of both. The V85 has made tons of converts to the brand, and the V7 audience is growing as time passes, especially for those who long for a more authentic MC experience.
The new V100 twins are also making headway, at least people are talking about them and considering.
V100 Mandello/Stelvio are heavy? THey are around 530 +/-. That's just about perfect for a purported Sport Touring bike (Mandello). I dont see it as one, the fairing is too small, rear seat is too much like a sport bike, and luggage too wonky in looks and attachment, but that is just me. The Stelvio is well, fugly, and uses the same luggage, but decent racks and ADV cases may work better.
IMHO, a WC 750/850 V7/9 styled bike will be a fail unless they keep faux fins and incorporate the radiator the way Triumph does.
Me? I want them to run with AIR cooled as long as the Euro Environazi's will allow. I'd also like to see a 1200cc 130HP successor to the Norge, and am hoping the upcoming California will have a larger displacement motor. I still believe if they could have stuck with the 1400 series bikes, they would be very popular.
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hoping the upcoming California will have a larger displacement motor. I still believe if they could have stuck with the 1400 series bikes, they would be very popular.
I feel like I'm the perfect target customer for a Cali. And the 1400 was nearly a complete fail in every way for me.
* I don't need the performance valve adjustments add on this type of bike
* It was too long (longer than a Road King) with too much wheelbase (3" more than an RK), and felt too wide too.
* It had wonky bags and windshield that were quick detach like the Harleys
* It had maintenance that required removal of things like the bags and the rear wheel.
And it just didn't offer any benefits for these things.
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Bulldog understandably suggested a 130 hp version of the Norge and I’ve no doubt it would be a success for them if they did, although I have not lamented the relatively modest performance of mine at any time.
If it was aimed at 130 hp it would need to be a 4 VPC unit one would think and then how would the cooling around the valve area be satisfactorily achieved ? That seems to suggest liquid cooling again and so you are back to radiators and all they bring with them.
I’d ask, other than trying to compete, why is 130 hp seen as a necessary feature ? The case could be made I guess, that in Europe and some other places where 200+ km/h speeds are quite legal, you could use such performance, but here in Australia, your licence would be gone in a week.
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Bulldog understandably suggested a 130 hp version of the Norge and I’ve no doubt it would be a success for them if they did, although I have not lamented the relatively modest performance of mine at any time.
If it was aimed at 130 hp it would need to be a 4 VPC unit one would think and then how would the cooling around the valve area be satisfactorily achieved ? That seems to suggest liquid cooling again and so you are back to radiators and all they bring with them.
I’d ask, other than trying to compete, why is 130 hp seen as a necessary feature ? The case could be made I guess, that in Europe and some other places where 200+ km/h speeds are quite legal, you could use such performance, but here in Australia, your licence would be gone in a week.
I'm just saying to be taken seriously in the modern ST world, it will need at least that much. Me? I'm sticking with the 105 HP'd Beetlemap and Cat bypassed with Mistral Exhaust 2012 Norge............
(https://i.ibb.co/6vggP3Q/maxresdefault.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6vggP3Q)
**Not my bike, don't have good pics of it yet.
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I had a 1400 Audace. Due to the wheelbase, rake and trail and the weight I had to sell it. I just wasn't confident on it anymore, dropped it three times and almost three more times. I went to a 1200 Triumph, MG didn't make anything that would fit my needs. When the Mandello came out I came back, I still had a V7 though. I am just a few months short of 80 and can handle the V100 just fine. I figure another year or two, maybe more. However a V100 California would have been my choice if the frame and engine etc were similar. I am not buying anymore new bikes, but as they say never say never. I will probably be riding off into the sunset on my V7, maybe a Vespa as a final ride.
kk
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Here’s hoping when they do come out with their next muscled highway muncher, it doesn’t look like it’s in the midst of engaging warp speed with that lady taffy stretched middle section.
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Yeah, I understand the concept that to be taken seriously you do need to be able to play in that league.
As a penis extension 130+ hp is nice, but I didn’t notice the lack of ponies in the 100,000 km I did in Europe plus the 100,000+ that I did in Oz on this.
(https://i.ibb.co/GpjG25S/IMG-4547.png) (https://ibb.co/GpjG25S)
A lot of guys use the “distance munching” statistics to somehow legitimise their presence in the touring scene, then go chasing cheaper tyres because they burned them on the back of their mega monster.
Most of the time I was taken fairly seriously…