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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: JeffOlson on February 12, 2015, 11:20:26 AM
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If you have both, which do you prefer?
Also, on a bike with shaft drive, what advantages are there to a center stand? (I suppose it facilitates the rare removal of the rear wheel, but what about the front wheel?)
Just curious. For some reason, my Ducati ST2 owner's manual recommends using the center stand over the side stand. However, it seems that the bike is more likely to fall over if placed on the center stand than if placed on the side stand. Further, in my experience, a side stand is much easier to deploy than a center stand.
I have a new Norge on its way, and I have read that the center stand drags easily and is also prone to coming loose. I am wondering if I should just remove it and avoid those problems from the start...
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I like both for different reasons.
I USUALLY store the bike on the sidestand (because the lean fits well with the other bikes all in a row).
Of course, for long term storage it is nice to lift more weight off both wheels using the centerstand.
I also prefer to fuel up on the centerstand to get every last drop (especially when touring). And I like to load up on the centerstand.
I use the centerstand to remove the front or rear wheel (simply place a block of wood under it for more height).
I also like to use the centerstand for checking oil or some maintenance operations.
But most of the time I just park it on the sidestand.
PS - I can't STAND that our Duc doesn't have/can't have a centerstand... that makes NO SENSE on a chain drive bike!
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Center stand. I rarely use the side stand unless conditions do not permit.
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With my current storage location, I am completely incapable of putting my Breva 1100 up on the centerstand. It also gets in the way of me putting my foot down in a comfortable manner as I can on the left side. I have thought about removing it for all these reasons. The only thing stopping me is having the ability to change the tires since there really aren't any aftermarket stands for the bike
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I always use the side stand.
I do use the center stand for rear tire changes, which are every 4 months or so. Plus oil changes and for other maintenance.
One bike I have doesn't have a center stand, so it is a pain to do some maintenance.
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The side stand for just parking it but the center stand for longer term or if I am working on the bike.... pretty much what Kevin said. If I had to have one or the other, it would be the center stand.
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And for a completely different kind of input, I tore my Achilles tendon in half using a centre stand, 7 years ago. 750 VStrom, gravel road in N Ont, raining. Decided my chain needed some lube. Bike on a slight downward slant. Foot slipped off the peg on the centre stand, slammed into the road with most of my 180 lbs behind it, snap. 30 km ride to the hospital, surgery, 8 weeks in a cast during one of the nicest autumns in years. So, by all means, use a centre stand (I still do), but exercise caution. I painted my peg yellow as one of those 'caution, slippery when wet' kinda signs :D
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I always use the side stand.
I do use the center stand for rear tire changes, which are every 4 months or so. Plus oil changes and for other maintenance.
One bike I have doesn't have a center stand, so it is a pain to do some maintenance.
Yep, me too. And I'll put an aftermarket centerstand on a bike that doesn't have one.
Lannis
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As a Norge owner of a 2011 8V I would want a center stand on any bike I owned. I will admit that it is a bit of an effort to get the Norge on the stand, especially compared to my T-3 which is quite a bit less effort. Concerning dragging the center stand, you have to be leaning pretty good. The boots I ride with will generally contact the road with the outer edge of the sole before the stand contacts. In fact I have never touched the stand.
GliderJohn
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Since owning a BMW I've gotten spoiled and I use the centerstand 99% of the time. Bikes I've purchased since, all now have centerstands. Some aftermarket, some homebuilt if the factory doesn't make one. Sidestands are useful for the short term parking jobs. YMMV ~; Homemade/adapted for my V11 Sport.
Paul B :BEER:
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LM2, hate that self retracting sidestand so much I removed it.
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Since owning a BMW I've gotten spoiled and I use the centerstand 99% of the time. Bikes I've purchased since, all now have centerstands. Some aftermarket, some homebuilt if the factory doesn't make one. Sidestands are useful for the short term parking jobs. YMMV ~; Homemade/adapted for my V11 Sport.
Paul B :BEER:
Beemer pilots seem to use the centerstand more than owners of other marques, IMO. When I got my first BMW years ago I got into it as well. Something in the culture :)
Since then I've gotten back to using the side/center stand as does Wayne -- even with my BMW. Jim B at Rosefarm once told me that BMW literature referred to the center stand as the "service stand." Good enough for me.
Best,
Carlo
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I use the side stand exclusively since my V7 Stone doesn't have a center stand. If it did, I would use it for fuel fill-ups but probably not much else on the road. For oil changes, valve adjustments, etc., I have a front wheel chock and a scissors jack which, together, keep the bike upright and stable in the garage. The chock and jack together cost a lot less than a center stand, and I don't have to carry the extra weight around.
My previous bike, a generation or two ago, was a Honda CB-77 (305 cc), which came with both a side stand and a center stand. I didn't use the center stand very much except for servicing.
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I think a center stand is a must have for reasons already posted. When I put mine on the Jakal right after I bought it, I cutoff about 2" of the stem so it wouldn't be so hideous or in the way.
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Back in the 90s I worked with a guy who did a real nice job of prettying up his airhead GS before we took a group trip down the Blue Ridge.
Powdercoated frame and valve covers to match in a gleaming white. Installed new suspension bits etc.
Thing is, he was a little short.
And he used the centerstand a lot.
And once it was on the stand he had to climb up into the saddle (where he looked like a little kid on a $0.10 pony ride in front of the supermarket swinging his feet that no longer touched the ground).
So to get it off the stand he'd stand up on the pegs and kinda rock back and forth until it rolled forward off the stand from the motion, where the suspension would compress enough for him to just get a foot on the ground.
Of course, the ground wasn't always level.
And he returned home with scuffs on one (or both, I forget) of those pretty valve covers.
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With that new Norge, what do you plan to do if you get a flat rear tire while on the road? With a centerstand it's pretty simple to take off the caliper and then the rear wheel so you can fix the flat. Without a centerstand.....I guess you could just lay that pretty new bike over on its side and do the same, but I wouldn't. You can keep the stand from dragging by just increasing the rear preload a bit. Easy-peasy.
Peter Y.
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Quote from pyoungbl:
With that new Norge, what do you plan to do if you get a flat rear tire while on the road? With a centerstand it's pretty simple to take off the caliper and then the rear wheel so you can fix the flat. Without a centerstand.....I guess you could just lay that pretty new bike over on its side and do the same, but I wouldn't. You can keep the stand from dragging by just increasing the rear preload a bit.
Most likely one could plug the tire so no need to take it off.
GliderJohn
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With that new Norge, what do you plan to do if you get a flat rear tire while on the road? With a centerstand it's pretty simple to take off the caliper and then the rear wheel so you can fix the flat. Without a centerstand.....I guess you could just lay that pretty new bike over on its side and do the same, but I wouldn't.
::) Didn't you know that there is some magic powder that you put in the tire and eliminate the risk of ever having a flat tire?
It also brightens your teeth I'll bet.
:beat_horse
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I'm amazed that anyone would trust an Italian side stand. When I had my Ducati Darmah long ago, it had both. Center stand was remarkably well-designed for easy operation (they made up for that later with the one on the Pantahs) and the side stand was short so it left the bike at an unstable angle. It also locked in place as I recall, was not deployable on the bike, and if you rode off without first retracting in you'd get tossed at the first left-hander.
Spring-loaded Guzzi side stands, at least on my old ones, leave the bike at an unstable angle and can't be deployed while on the bike. Which has to be vertical or even a little past (invitation to disaster there) in order to get the stand down or back up. At that point it's easier to use the center stand. Which is also more stable.
cr
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I use the center stands on my T140 and my BMW R80 almost always
otherwise the T140 leans too much and the BMW side stand is a stupid design; it retracts by itself and is hard to get at
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Crazy not to have a centerstand on a chain drive bike.
With shaft, I prefer not to have a centerstand. 2 incidents have colored my views on this: #1 I used to scrape my RT's centerstand - very annoying; #2 One hot day long ago I lifted my ST2 onto its centerstand which over the course of a workday SANK into the blacktop. It had the 'suicide' stand which was it's own problem. Best for shaft - side stand without auto retract and use the metal plate solution for sidestand/tarmac sink issue. With the Sport1100, I had a beautiful shop stand which I used when doing maintenance.
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If I had to have just one it would be the center stand. I really wish my V7 had one...at some point I may install the option. My garage set up would be a lot easier to manage if all of them could be up straight.
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Jeff,
Ducati side stands are bolted to the cast aluminum engine case and they recommend not putting any excess weight on them - such as sitting on the bike while it's on the side stand. It doesn't take much to crack the case and then you might as well total the bike given what it will cost to replace the case. I paid through the nose for a used center stand for my 2006 Multistrada but it's worth every penny.
John
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I was camping with my bike. My bike was one foot away from my tent. Dipsh!t put it on the center stand. During the night it fell over. I won the 50/50 raffle as it fell away rather than on top of me. Never use a center stand on soft ground! Lesson learned.
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Jeff,
Ducati side stands are bolted to the cast aluminum engine case and they recommend not putting any excess weight on them - such as sitting on the bike while it's on the side stand. It doesn't take much to crack the case and then you might as well total the bike given what it will cost to replace the case. I paid through the nose for a used center stand for my 2006 Multistrada but it's worth every penny.
John
The cases can be welded. DAMHIK. ~;
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The original side stand on the mk 3 lemans was a miracle of italian engineering, a miracle they didnt hang the designer.
So around 25 years ago I moved it and redesigned it so it actually worked.
Also modified the centre stand after it cracked.
So I use both.
At rallys with dirt I use the side stand with a alloy plate under it or a crused beer can.
Centre stand for storage.
Havent heard that sickening "crunch" as your bike hits the ground behind you as you leave it on the sidestand in 25 years.
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1) If you have both, which do you prefer?
2) I have read that the center stand drags easily and is also prone to coming loose.
3) I am wondering if I should just remove it and avoid those problems from the start...
1) I use whichever is appropriate.
2) That was reported with the 2007 Norges, which had soft rear springs. I do not recall much talk on the matter over the past few years, as the bikes have been improved.
3) That would be real inconvenient in the event of a rear flat. I have had a couple of rear flats on bikes without centerstands, and it makes the repair job tougher. In fact, my V11 LeMans sidestand was so long the bike would not stand with a flat rear tire, the bike would fall to the right...
Keep the center stand.
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I'm amazed that anyone would trust an Italian side stand. When I had my Ducati Darmah long ago, it had both. Center stand was remarkably well-designed for easy operation (they made up for that later with the one on the Pantahs) and the side stand was short so it left the bike at an unstable angle. It also locked in place as I recall, was not deployable on the bike, and if you rode off without first retracting in you'd get tossed at the first left-hander.
Spring-loaded Guzzi side stands, at least on my old ones, leave the bike at an unstable angle and can't be deployed while on the bike. Which has to be vertical or even a little past (invitation to disaster there) in order to get the stand down or back up. At that point it's easier to use the center stand. Which is also more stable.
cr
Well, the newer V7 Guzzis come here with a specific USA-approved side stand that is quite stable. Thank the Gummint for that. And they can be deployed easily while the bike is vertical or leaning a bit either way. Also, the "idiot-proof" interlock system prevents roaring off with the side stand down, saving you some embarrassment. Thank the Gummint again. The only drawback is the USA side stand makes the center stand inconvenient to use, although they're not completely incompatible, if you insist on adding a center stand.
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And for a completely different kind of input, I tore my Achilles tendon in half using a centre stand, 7 years ago. 750 VStrom, gravel road in N Ont, raining. Decided my chain needed some lube. Bike on a slight downward slant. Foot slipped off the peg on the centre stand, slammed into the road with most of my 180 lbs behind it, snap. 30 km ride to the hospital, surgery, 8 weeks in a cast during one of the nicest autumns in years. So, by all means, use a centre stand (I still do), but exercise caution. I painted my peg yellow as one of those 'caution, slippery when wet' kinda signs :D
That is a freak accident. Reminds me of a few broken feet/ankles I saw working in the hospital. People with panic stop and hit the breaks as hard as they could. Upon impact the forces of pressing on the brake and hitting whatever it was there were hitting was enough to break a few bones.
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I like both for different reasons.
I USUALLY store the bike on the sidestand (because the lean fits well with the other bikes all in a row).
Of course, for long term storage it is nice to lift more weight off both wheels using the centerstand.
I also prefer to fuel up on the centerstand to get every last drop (especially when touring). And I like to load up on the centerstand.
I use the centerstand to remove the front or rear wheel (simply place a block of wood under it for more height).
I also like to use the centerstand for checking oil or some maintenance operations.
But most of the time I just park it on the sidestand.
PS - I can't STAND that our Duc doesn't have/can't have a centerstand... that makes NO SENSE on a chain drive bike!
:+1
I'm exactly the same.
I can understand having no centerstand on my Ducati Superlight, but I think a Monster would have one.
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Always nice to have the option. No center stand on my Jackal, always wished for one, every tire change and oil service (checking & changing), and quite handy when checking & adjusting valves. And, as mentioned above, loading a bike heavy on a center stand is easier, better load balance. I wouldn't chuck it before trying the bike out for a few thousand miles.
Lee
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Pretty hard to beat the fubarguzzi method- lean on a tree.
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Pretty hard to beat the fubarguzzi method- lean on a tree.
Not sure I'd want to test my Norge doing that...those bars are pretty, but flexible....no where near as strong as a good 'ol tubular bars, and everything else is plastic :wife:
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Sidestand. Carport and garage sealed concrete. Good luck getting the centerstand to grip enough to get it deployed. I guess I could weld some sharpened pins on the bottom of the feet, but only use the centerstand now when I'm working on the bike.
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Pretty hard to beat the fubarguzzi method- lean on a tree.
I had a BSA Lightning I named ILEAN for that reason.
The advantage of a center stand nobody has mentioned is that you can put the bike on the stand and then use the stand as a lazy susan to spin the bike around its own center. Otherwise, I think all the pro's and con's are valid. I have both center and side stands on all my bikes. There is a time and place . . .
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I use the sidestand unless I service the MC.
Been thinking of removing the sentrestand because the left side "push arm" that goes round the exhoust pipe is to low.
Scraping on left turns.
(California EV) :BEER:
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I use the sidestand for short term parking, but for overnight I always use the center stands on my bikes. Exception is the Sport1100i, and I lost the aftermarket centerstand when the Staintune was installed. The new exhaust crossover pipe wasn't compatible with the stand.
My garage floor was painted by a PO, and after 25 years is still too slick to get the bikes off the centerstands easy. They just push to the other end of the garage on the stands. So I keep a few carpet sample squares on the floor. Just park the bike on sidestand, take my foot to push the carpet square under the centerstand, and put it up. That holds the stand to the floor, so a push and it comes right off.
I have a fear of having a tire go flat in the garage (again) and the bike falling over from straightening up on the sidestand.
The Sport1100i has a paddock stand that lifts the swingarm, and I use it when parking at home. On the road that isn't an option.
YMMV
-Dale
'97 Sport 1100i
'78 Ducati Darmah
'75 Norton Commando Roadster
'03 1800 Gold Wing
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I use the side stand for parking and the center stand for maintenance.
The center stand is also handy for triggering traffic lights with inductive loops.
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I use the sidestand for short term parking, but for overnight I always use the center stands on my bikes. Exception is the Sport1100i, and I lost the aftermarket centerstand when the Staintune was installed. The new exhaust crossover pipe wasn't compatible with the stand.
My garage floor was painted by a PO, and after 25 years is still too slick to get the bikes off the centerstands easy. They just push to the other end of the garage on the stands. So I keep a few carpet sample squares on the floor. Just park the bike on sidestand, take my foot to push the carpet square under the centerstand, and put it up. That holds the stand to the floor, so a push and it comes right off.
I have a fear of having a tire go flat in the garage (again) and the bike falling over from straightening up on the sidestand.
The Sport1100i has a paddock stand that lifts the swingarm, and I use it when parking at home. On the road that isn't an option.
YMMV
-Dale
'97 Sport 1100i
'78 Ducati Darmah
Good trick with the carpet, Knaus.
'75 Norton Commando Roadster
'03 1800 Gold Wing
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Loved the center stand on the old /5 beemers.
Take front wheel off, bike is weighted to the back.
or, take back wheel off, bike weight shifts forward.
Nice.
Also love watching the 'ol Triumph walk backwards when rev'ed on it's center stand!
The 1100sporti side stand has broken the hearts of many an owner, I'd wager..
Harley has that sweet side stand that prevents the bike from rolling forward ;-T
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Another vote for both. Which one I use depends on what I am doing, where I am at, and how long I will be there.
I do carry a plate to use with the sidestand on soft ground.
Caveat: my side stand is not stock. I cut off the leg and welded on the bottom portion of the Harley stand. Then bent the original mounting plate to a good angle, then welded on a reinforcing plate. Now it leans nicely, has a tab right under my foot to deploy it, and the single return spring means I don't have to fight to keep it down. Next mod is a larger aluminum foot section attached to it (to keep it from sliding).
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I had a BSA Lightning I named ILEAN for that reason.
The BSAs are all eventually somebody's "LEAN". That furnace-brazed sidestand lug only has about a 40 year life, which means that none of mine have working sidestands until I strip them down and figure out a way to re-braze them without knocking the engine mounts out of line .....
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Harley has that sweet side stand that prevents the bike from rolling forward ;-T
Which will also pop up on its own once the weight is of the bike, if you forget it and it touches down.
It's actually a rare (for Harley) rather elegantly simple mechanical design.
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The cases can be welded. DAMHIK. ~;
Hah! Proof that you're living a good life! ;D
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And for a completely different kind of input, I tore my Achilles tendon in half using a centre stand, 7 years ago. 750 VStrom, gravel road in N Ont, raining. Decided my chain needed some lube. Bike on a slight downward slant. Foot slipped off the peg on the centre stand, slammed into the road with most of my 180 lbs behind it, snap. 30 km ride to the hospital, surgery, 8 weeks in a cast during one of the nicest autumns in years. So, by all means, use a centre stand (I still do), but exercise caution. I painted my peg yellow as one of those 'caution, slippery when wet' kinda signs :D
Sturgeon, were you on a statin when it happened (the tendon tear, that is)?
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The kick down lever on the center stand on my Rocket 3 used to touch down far too easily when cornering to the left (that is, before everything else did) so I chopped the lever off. Left just enough of a stub to be able to engage it with my toe.
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This is starting to be un interesting :D
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I have never bought a bike because of center stand or not.
With the Guzzi California side stand, I only use the center sand for maintenance. Right now I nee new springs for my sagging center stand.
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:+=copcar
This is starting to be un interesting :D
Yea, even the "I lean over so far while cornering I scrape the centerstand" stories...
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:+=copcar
Yea, even the "I lean over so far while cornering I scrape the centerstand" stories...
;D Well you didn't have to lean R3s very far to do it, but its a suggestion for those whose main complaint is scraping them.
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I keep my centerstand in the garage as a mainenance lift only. I use the bolts as push pins and "install" it temporarily for maintenance.
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Once KevM writes an essay on a subject it becomes a moot point. ;D
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I've heard that the 2nd gen Norges are delivered to the dealers as the first gen ones were regarding the fasteners of both the side stand and the center stand: be sure to locktite the fasteners of both. Otherwise you risk losing fasteners or even the stands while riding.
I don't know if this is true of the second gen Norges (I have a 2009), but when on the side stand, my bike leans over so far that if I'm not careful about where I park it I have difficulty getting it off the stand, especially when the luggage is fully loaded. (I really should fix this!)
It's a lot easier to check tire air pressure and to clean the rims when the bike is on the center stand.
Jon
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Thanks for all the comments! Very helpful.
Re. the Ducati side stand, now I understand why its use is not recommended...