Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: jackson on March 23, 2015, 05:25:27 PM
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Well..........I've read about it happening to others but today was my day to join the club of buggered quick connects for the fuel line coming out of the gas tank. I've had the tank off of my recently acquired, 2010 V7 Classic several times and each time, the quick connect system was really difficult to remove. I used to have a 2007 Breva 750 and although it could be a little stubborn (sometimes, but not all the time), they would release after a few attempts without having to pull too hard. The red connector did not break (like I've seen in pictures with others) but there is a very small (super small would be a better description) nick in the round-raised part of the red tube. So, now the connector just slides off easily because it won't grab that round raised part of the plastic tube.
*Edit: The more I look at the red pipe, I'm wondering if the tiny nick in the nipple is the problem. The nick is so small that the problem may simply be with the female connector. Though my searches on this problem, the size of the connector is 5/16" so will any 5/16" female quick connect fit on the red tube?
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This site might have what you want
www.beemerboneyard. com
Look for a CPC chrome plated brass fuel line quick disconnect. Check that the hose size is correct for your model.
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If you need a new elbow, you can order it as an independent part (from an Aprilia Pegaso). It's not available in North America as the Pegaso wasn't sold here, so you have to order it from Europe. Not cheap, at GBP 25.00, but a heck of a lot cheaper than ordering the whole assembly for the Guzzi.
You can find it at gutsibits.com. Search for "Plastic Spigot" or part number FUA30000. Given the cost of shipping, I ordered two, and now have a spare.
Note that this model is white, not red, but seems a direct replacement.
Hope this helps.
Shaun
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Here is a direct link to the CPC website. If you can buy them direct, you'll probably save 50%.
http://www.colder.com/Tabid/72/MaterialID/2/cID/1/sID/15/tID/1/Products.aspx (http://www.colder.com/Tabid/72/MaterialID/2/cID/1/sID/15/tID/1/Products.aspx)
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Does anyone know if any of the 5/16" Dorman female fuel connectors will fit the red tube/nipple or do I need the specific Guzzi female connector Part #883265?
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Both my Stone Touring models have been fitted with the Beemer Boneyard quick connect and I'm very pleased with them. I cut off the OEM plastic fitting and fitted the BB connector to that. The, I clamped and safety-wired a short length of 5/16" (8mm) hose to the original red nipple and the forward end of the BB connector is fitted into that. Several years now and not a problem. It's a delight to use, compared to the horrid OEM POS.
Ralph
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Sorry that happened
I still don't get how ppl have such issues with these fittings?
It's really no different than a quick connect on a compressed air line??
(http://catalog.dunhamrubber.com/ImgMedium/FD43%20Series%20Industrial%20Interchange%20Air%20Quick%20Disconnect.jpg)
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I still don't get how ppl have such issues with these fittings?
It's really no different than a quick connect on a compressed air line??
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I have disconnected and connected thousands of the compressed air line fittings you speak of and to compare them to the POS fuel line disconnect that came on MY Norge would be just plain ludicrous, yours may be different. Beemerboneyard had the solution that should have come on MY Norge to begin with. They also had the proper fuel line clamps and I was fortunate enough to know what tool to use and borrow to properly install them on my fuel lines. Taking my tank off for routine maintenance like inner spark plugs or changing the air filter will be a piece of cake now. I would have gladly paid more for MY Norge for it to have come properly set up from the factory without those aggravating POS cheap bargain brand connectors, maybe yours came with something different. The ones that came with mine could have cost me valuable downtime in a short riding season to save how much....? Sorry but you hit a nerve.
Stay safe, John
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I have a breva 1100 it's the same tank, lines, & connector
I've had my tank off 4 times, and besides the first time around.. No issues :shrug
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Must be they ran out of the good ones.✌️
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Both my Stone Touring models have been fitted with the Beemer Boneyard quick connect and I'm very pleased with them. I cut off the OEM plastic fitting and fitted the BB connector to that. The, I clamped and safety-wired a short length of 5/16" (8mm) hose to the original red nipple and the forward end of the BB connector is fitted into that. Several years now and not a problem. It's a delight to use, compared to the horrid OEM POS.
I have disconnected and connected thousands of the compressed air line fittings you speak of and to compare them to the POS fuel line disconnect that came on MY Norge would be just plain ludicrous, yours may be different. Beemerboneyard had the solution that should have come on MY Norge to begin with. They also had the proper fuel line clamps and I was fortunate enough to know what tool to use and borrow to properly install them on my fuel lines. Taking my tank off for routine maintenance like inner spark plugs or changing the air filter will be a piece of cake now. I would have gladly paid more for MY Norge for it to have come properly set up from the factory without those aggravating POS cheap bargain brand connectors, maybe yours came with something different. The ones that came with mine could have cost me valuable downtime in a short riding season to save how much....? Sorry but you hit a nerve.
Stay safe, John
Ralph
Well, it looks like I should order the connectors from Beemer Boneyard. Is this the correct connector that they sell? http://www.beemerboneyard.com/cpcqkdiscon1.html
What is the tool that you're talking about in your post? I am an old carburetor guy and have only a limited experience with fuel injection lines. Since my red nipple is intact, I will connect it like krglorioso did on his bikes.
Thanks much for this information.
Jack
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It is a pain to release you either get the hang of it and have no further problems or continually struggle. I found the use of a very small flat bladed scewdriver to prise the locking teeth from the rear of the fitting to be the best method. Of course if the elbow locking rings are damaged all bets are off.
I can recommend Gutsibits here in the U.K. for replacement parts as mentioned earlier.
If it is any comfort the connectors Triumph use are just as bad.
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I was able to remove the quick connecter from my Breva most of the time with no drama but the connector on this particular bike has been a struggle every time since I bought it several months ago. The connectors are just junk and should have never been used by MG. I always unplug the electrical connector and then start the bike to relieve pressure in the line but undoing this connector has been the equivalent of wrestling with a bear.
As soon as someone confirms that the connectors that I need to order from Beemer Boneyard http://www.beemerboneyard.com/cpcqkdiscon1.html are the correct ones, I'm going to order them and use the method that krglorioso and Adk.IBO used with these connectors. Since my red nipple is intact, I'll attach directly to the nipple using the forward end of the BB connector.
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My experience over 3 bikes.
2007 750 Breva, connector was slightly hard, took several attempts being coaxed with a micro flat screw driver but was able to get it done.
2008 1200 Sport wa a pain in the arse to get loose. Would fight it for 1/2 an hour and require my sons help for a third hand. Would eventually get it off but much cursing was involved, and when it finally came off, feeling of great relief fell over my body!
2013 Stelvio. I tried to get it apart on several occasions, spending up to an hour and many beers to calm down, never had success. If I hadn't lost the bike to a deer strike, it would have been changed out to a real connector!
Note, this is just one of many reasons I did not replace the Stelvio with another one and have gone to a different brand for my big touring bike. Loved so much of that bike but just too many little issues to deal with before I could trust it and the over cooling in winter was the big last straw issue.
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We're having some great riding weather at the present time so I bought some 5/16" fuel injection hose and connected one side to the red nipple and the other to the RH barb. Put the proper FI clamps on each side and fired it up. Works fine (at least, for now). I ordered the quick connects from Beemer Boneyard and when they arrive, I'll just cut a section out of the hose that I just installed and insert the new connectors.
Thanks to everyone for your opinions and assistance.
Jack
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Look for a CPC chrome plated brass fuel line quick disconnect. Check that the hose size is correct for your model.
Could anyone tell me what size fuel line an 06 B1100 or Norge has ? I could just take the tank off and measure, but then I have to fool with the *#!^ing quick connect.
I think this is on my list when my next service comes due.....
kjf
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Hey Jackson, the tool that I used for installing the clamps on fuel injection fuel line is a Snap-on YA3080. Google the part# YA3080 and you will find it quickly. If you need fuel line be SURE to purchase ONLY fuel line rated for fuel injection systems as gas leaking all over a hot motor has potential to be very bad! I stress this because the first clerk I spoke to at Advance Auto cut a piece that was not rated for fuel injection and luckily I picked up on the fact that she was unsure of what I was talking about. beemerboneyard code #'s are: cpcqkdiscon1 for the disconnect and BB13311460928 for the fuel line hose clamps.
Stay safe, John
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Hey Jackson, the tool that I used for installing the clamps on fuel injection fuel line is a Snap-on YA3080. Google the part# YA3080 and you will find it quickly. If you need fuel line be SURE to purchase ONLY fuel line rated for fuel injection systems as gas leaking all over a hot motor has potential to be very bad! I stress this because the first clerk I spoke to at Advance Auto cut a piece that was not rated for fuel injection and luckily I picked up on the fact that she was unsure of what I was talking about. beemerboneyard code #'s are: cpcqkdiscon1 for the disconnect and BB13311460928 for the fuel line hose clamps.
Stay safe, John
John, I bought fuel injection hose this morning and it was rated for 100 psi so I'm good to go. I already had some proper FI hose clamps. I lubed the fuel line before attaching it to the old barb at the "T" and it was fairly easy to get on; then I put a FI clamp around it. Same with the red nipple connection. Not sure why I would need the special tool since the clamps that I have are screw on type but made specifically for FI hose of this specific size. I installed a pair of "better than factory" connectors on a BMW R1150 RT in 2002 and used these same clamps with no problems. This way, I can ride my Guzzi until the connectors arrive (Friday). Then, all I have to do is cut out a section of the hose that's already installed and splice in the new connectors.
Thanks for your help.
Jack
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If you used the type of clamps I used you would need the tool. Otherwise, you're on your own I'm afraid. What you're doing may very well be fine. Sure wish I could say riding weather was here but it's not. Way to much sand, and salt still, not to mention -10 degrees farenheidt this am when I got up. I did speak to a friend who saw a pair of robins already (don't know what they could possibly eat yet) so it's coming soon.
Stay safe, John
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I'm doing the same conversion on my '13 V7. When I finally got the darn QD to disconnect I saw that the red barb is really not a barb at all, it's straight. For that reason I'm going to re-install the QD, put some 5/16" fuel injection line on the QD barb, with an Oetiker clamp, then the metal QD (barbed on both ends), more 5/16" hose, and clamp onto the lower QD end. I'm just concerned that, over time, my hose would work its way free of that barbless elbow up at the tank housing.
Peter Y.
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I'm doing the same conversion on my '13 V7. When I finally got the darn QD to disconnect I saw that the red barb is really not a barb at all, it's straight. For that reason I'm going to re-install the QD, put some 5/16" fuel injection line on the QD barb, with an Oetiker clamp, then the metal QD (barbed on both ends), more 5/16" hose, and clamp onto the lower QD end. I'm just concerned that, over time, my hose would work its way free of that barbless elbow up at the tank housing.
Peter Y.
I just rode my V7 for 70 miles under a variety of conditions and nothing moved. At this time, I just have 5/16" fuel injection hose from the red nipple to the barb on the other end. Both are clamped with a fuel injection hose clamp (screw type). I'll be installing the quick connects when they arrive later this week and will just remove a section of this hose like Ralph, aka "krglorioso" did on two of his Guzzis.
Although the red nipple is not a barb, I would think that there wouldn't be any movement of the hose if it's clamped tightly (whether you use an Oetiker clamp or the type that I've used). krglorioso said that he also installed safety wire between the clamp on the red nipple and somewhere else (he didn't specify where). He said that one has been on for several years with no problems. I sent him a PM and asked where he installed the safety wire but haven't heard back from him yet. It would be an extra step to ensure "peace of mind" but I don't really see any reason for it to come off of the red nipple.
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I love Sophia, my 2007 Griso, and I don't think I would trade her for anything less than a newer Griso (sorry, sweetheart). Having said that, I have never been able to disconnect the fuel tank. First off it wasn't obvious to me which way the disconnect was supposed to move, since it would't move either toward or away from the tank. Which way is correct?
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I love Sophia, my 2007 Griso, and I don't think I would trade her for anything less than a newer Griso (sorry, sweetheart). Having said that, I have never been able to disconnect the fuel tank. First off it wasn't obvious to me which way the disconnect was supposed to move, since it would't move either toward or away from the tank. Which way is correct?
The first thing you should do is (1) disconnect the multi-pin electrical connector that runs from the tank. That will stop the pump from running when you then, (2) press the starter button and let the engine turn-over (it won't start) so you can relieve any pressure in the line.
Some remove easily after doing this and others don't. Here's a YouTube video where someone is removing the connector: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SYAS5xsUlo
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http://www.bonanza.com/listings/Quick-Connect-Disconnect-Fuel-Line-Adaptor-1-4-or-5-16/238549415?st_id=29673245
I bought this one, $13 shipped. Although still plastic, it's built smart. The thing is, mine didn't even break, but the few times I've had the tank off, I nearly have. I cringe just thinking about removing the tank and that's not right. ;)
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http://www.bonanza.com/listings/Quick-Connect-Disconnect-Fuel-Line-Adaptor-1-4-or-5-16/238549415?st_id=29673245
I bought this one, $13 shipped. Although still plastic, it's built smart. The thing is, mine didn't even break, but the few times I've had the tank off, I nearly have. I cringe just thinking about removing the tank and that's not right. ;)
I assume that you attached the side that's connected to the red nipple with fuel injection fuel line and a clamp? If so, how long has it been on the nipple and has there been any slippage off of the red nipple?
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Oh, and make sure you have the correct allen wrench in your tool kit to take the tank off. It's not in the supplied tool kit. I discovered this when my QD popped off about a mile from home. No way to take the tank off and re-connect the QD. Luckily my wife has a sense of humor and could hook up the trailer.
Peter Y.
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Jackson: Sorry, but your PM never received. I sent one to you just now.
For others, I fitted the safety wire upstream of the shoulder on the red plastic elbow. The shoulder keeps the safety wire from moving. The other end of the safety wire is wrapped around the EFI hose just downstream of the (proper) EFI hose clamp. Wired like this, the hose is going nowhere. Well, at least neither one has, so far. The BB fitting is a joy to use. I no longer cringe at removing the tank. Easy as pie!
Ralph
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Thanks Jackson. Why doesn't the shop manual say this? All it says is "Remove the fuel tank by the disconnect" or some such laconic verbiage.
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Jackson: Sorry, but your PM never received. I sent one to you just now.
For others, I fitted the safety wire upstream of the shoulder on the red plastic elbow. The shoulder keeps the safety wire from moving. The other end of the safety wire is wrapped around the EFI hose just downstream of the (proper) EFI hose clamp. Wired like this, the hose is going nowhere. Well, at least neither one has, so far. The BB fitting is a joy to use. I no longer cringe at removing the tank. Easy as pie!
Ralph
Thanks! I'll do it as an extra precaution when I install the new connectors.
Jack
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Just another vote to confirm tha tthe factory fitting is a cheap POS. I replaced it on my Griso as well as the 1200S. I didn't have the beemerboneyard fitting- just went to the local Autozone and their standard FI fittings were better than stock. Only like $12. I didn't spend hours trying to coax the old ones off- I just lopped them off when it seemed like i was wasting too much time on a fitting i was going to toss anyway.
BTW- I know about running the pump to relieve pressure- still didn't work.
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I've not installed it yet. The next time the tank must be removed, I'll make the swap. Yes, using FI hose and clamps. I see no reason it should work its way off, once installed.
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I've not installed it yet. The next time the tank must be removed, I'll make the swap. Yes, using FI hose and clamps. I see no reason it should work its way off, once installed.
I took the advice that krglorioso gave and used safety wire as an extra measure of precaution to ensure that the clamped fuel line on the red nipple could not slip over a period of time. He's done this on two Guzzis and one has been on for around three years with zero slippage or leaks so it obviously works well. Only takes a few minutes to add the safety wire while the tank is already off and it gives me "peace of mind" to have it on there. My connectors arrive tomorrow so all I have to do to complete the project is screw them into the line that I've already installed, clamp them and snap the connectors together.
If I bought another Guzzi that had this crummy connector on it, I would immediately replace it with this setup. It's worth the time & cost of materials to replace the inferior, factory connectors.
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I'll mention my fix for the problem, which is that given where it lives, you can't grasp the fitting properly to get it off. So I cut my fuel line in a more accessible place and installed marine grade fuel line quick disconnects. They work like air hose couplings except both sides self-seal for dripless operation -- no pressure relief needed. If you've got an old outboard motor tank and hose kicking around you already have the parts.
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PS: I used a 10" length of 8mm EFI hose running from the red elbow to the EXTERNAL fuel filter (all metal Mahle KL-145, I believe) and this places the filter in the space under the upper frame rails, where I wrapped it with a short piece of pipe insulation so it's not banging around on any neighboring pipe or frame rail. I shortened the OEM fuel hose by about 10" and connected the outlet end of the filter there. Usual safety wire. I can easily raise the tank and slip off the quick connector with one hand, patting myself on the back vigorously with the other!
Ralph.
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Solving one problem, I created another - luckily this doesn't always happen! Had to work on replacing the distintegrated switch for my fog lights on the Norge (was getting intermittent performance on/off of the lights) and decided that taking the tank off to check the wiring and relays was a good idea. Good news, fog lights are working again and no crimping found, relay working well, and some re-routing of the wiring is done. Check!
Bad news - I have now joined the fuel disconnect "Broken Red Elbow" club of esteemed colleagues above! Thanks to this post, replacement parts from Gutsibits are on the way (ordered 2 just be on the safe side plus the pump gasket). At least I was able to confirm in the process that I had already had the solid fuel filter installed and not the old plastic bloated one, and all else looks good.
Now I need get some padding to replace the foam under the tank, is that even a Guzzi part # or have folks just fabbed up some of their own padding with 3M adhesive and foam rubber?
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If you haven't got it yet, pad #GU05102930
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What parts did you order, Paul, and from where?
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What parts did you order, Paul, and from where?
Hi Chris...I ordered the red elbow which sits at the bottom of the pump on the outside of the tank, it's snugged in to pump and then held in place by a worm/grub hex screw, and the pump gasket, both from Gutsibits.
Here's the linky:
http://gutsibits.co.uk/pr/TheShop/index.php?f=e&Shnew=1&Model=2&ModelName=Breva%201100,%201200%20Sport,%20Norge,%20Griso,%20Stelvio&Cat=FUA&CatName=Fuel%20and%20Carburettors&spPage=3#topbar
Page 1 of this shows the rubber pump gasket - check that your fuel pump model is part number 05107230 on the fuel pump flange, if so, this gasket is for you.
Page 3 shows the Elbow...Gutsibits sells it in white, yours should be red if it had never been replaced before.
Helluva a deal...pay 26 GBP for the elbow, or shell out 500 GBP for the pump, not sure what the pump costs stateside. Cheap insurance...I bought 2 of them!
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It's in a Samples bag but that's the Aprilia part#
](https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4079/34940752953_56c1a96d0d_z.jpg)
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The CPC metal connectors are far better than the fragile plastic type but one thing to be aware of with them is the type of 'O' ring. As standard they supply them with a Nitrile 'O' ring which is not fuel resistant.
I fitted them to my Ducati 916 tank and they were fine for a year or so but the Nitrile rings swell in fuel and so those on the hose fitting split or leak - not a big problem as Viton 'O' rings are easily available, cheap and easy to change (in fact it's wise to change them regularly as it's easy to 'pinch' them, then they leak).
But the 'O' ring inside the tank fitting was also nitrile and when this swelled it cut off the fuel supply, leaving me stranded at the road side.
When I got the bike home it took me a while to figure out what was wrong as disconnecting/reconnecting the fittings made it work again (at least for a mile when it broke down again and I ended up nearly having a cardiac 'incident' pushing it home).
But to change the internal 'O' ring on the female fitting requires removal of the fitting from the tank which is a bit of a game due to the access and tapered threads on the fitting meaning they are tight.
Moral of the story is make sure the fittings (particularly the female) have Viton 'O' rings - CPC part number has the suffix 'V' if they are viton. or, if they don't have them in stock with Viton (they didn't when I contacted them) then order some Viton 'O' rings and change them before use. If in any doubt then change them anyway as swapping the 'O' ring in the tank fitting is a PITA if the fitting is in the tank.
The above info relates to a Ducati and so may not be relevant to Guzzi and I don't know if Guzzi use the same part? as there are NPT or BSP threads? but for info the NPT thread as used by Ducati has the following CPC part no.
CPC - LCD10004V = Metal female with viton seal
The hose fitting is;
CPC - LCD23006V = Metal male with viton seal
If they only have the same part without the 'V' at the end then assume the 'O' ring is not Viton and get some ath the same time as the fitting, in fact get some spares as the ones on the hose attachments will need changing at some point anyway.
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I use the green one of these
(http://preview.ibb.co/jPP0Ua/ASTA_A_1102504_3.jpg) (http://ibb.co/i7EOhv)
Allows you to squeeze, pull and wiggle in a tight space all at the same time :wink:
Go here http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CAR-FUEL-LINE-DISCONNECTION-SET-PLIERS-3-PIECE-PIPE-REMOVAL-PETROL-DIESEL-/222451245872?epid=1795061011&hash=item33cb20a330:g:yjAAAOSwPCVYBJnM about 7 quid on fleabay
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Mate, I feel like I've just been kissed on the arse by a golden fairy!
While I've never broken one they can be aright bastard! That looks like just the ticket! Excellent find. Thank you!
Pete
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Awwww Pete - I didn't know you cared :embarrassed: :embarrassed:
Glad I could help
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Excellent tips there gents...thank you. Will get that handy tool and look for the proper O-rings. Good stuff!
Esoterica Guzzica at its best!
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Hi-
Just making sure, this would be the correct disconnect for a '07 Breva 1100?
http://www.beemerboneyard.com/cpcqkdiscon1.html
Thanks, Brian
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I, like many others, was going crazy trying to remove the quick disconnect (oxy moron!) fuel coupling on my 2008 CalVin. The thing literally brought me to my knees, and I was deathly afraid of breaking the plastic piece of crap.
I apologize, I don't have the link,,, but I think it was the owner of a Breva? who had posted 2 different videos on Youtube, on how to remove the MG fuel line disconnect, that solved the mystery for me,,, patience is a virtue,,, once I figured it out,, it was a simple one hand removal,,, I've probably put the hex on it for future removals, bwth,,,lol.
From the video, and what worked for me,, was grabbing the outer female part of the coupling between my thumb and middle fingers,,,push the coupling forward, and while maintaining forward pressure,,, putting tips of my thumb and index finger, using them as slight wedges pushing backwards as I wiggled it slightly back and forth.
Once I mastered this simple one handed technique,,, what had previously, frustrated me for hrs, became a 5 second damage free removal, I didn't have to relieve pressure in the line or jump through any hoops.
After seeing how simple and well the right technique worked,,, I would be extremely hesitant about using any tpe of tool around those fragile , brittle plastic bits.
As always, ymmv fwiw,,,
Good luck
Kelly
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I use the green one of these
(http://preview.ibb.co/jPP0Ua/ASTA_A_1102504_3.jpg) (http://ibb.co/i7EOhv)
Allows you to squeeze, pull and wiggle in a tight space all at the same time :wink:
Go here http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CAR-FUEL-LINE-DISCONNECTION-SET-PLIERS-3-PIECE-PIPE-REMOVAL-PETROL-DIESEL-/222451245872?epid=1795061011&hash=item33cb20a330:g:yjAAAOSwPCVYBJnM about 7 quid on fleabay
US buyers may want to check Amazon - the sellers there are also in the UK, but some offer less expensive and faster shipping to the US. As always, with any foreign source the reviews become very important!
I'm puzzled that no one seems to offer these things in the US - we're saddled with the klutzy designs instead!
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I bought a set of those pliers style tools. Didn't work for me except to use them as a way to grip the QD fitting.
What has worked so far is to lift back of tank, disconnect the fuel pump electrical connector, start the bike and let it run out to relieve the fuel pressure and the QD comes off with a bit of a wiggle. HD tells you to do this same thing for their QD connector.
Seems to work??
Tom
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I'm hoping that these little tools will make handling this contraption a little easier...almost like you need a 3rd pair of hands at the moment to squeeze in the gray tabs and then wiggle that bugger off the red nipple....will see once the replacement item comes in.
Thanks for all the inputs here guys.