Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: rodekyll on June 24, 2015, 11:00:34 PM
-
The trike lives. The big ?'s like does it work with no transmission, did we ballpark the final drive ratio workably, do the suspension, brakes, steering, wheel alignment stuff work, does the fluid drive like the radiator, and does the charging system work have all been answered. So far I'm 15/love overall and batting touchdowns at every wicket.
I'm still suffering the details -- wheel alignment is the tricky one, but I'm at the point that it tracks neutrally on the straights and doesn't need to be manhandled on the corners. The drive-shaft-powered alternator belt was screeching, but that turned out to be a simple tension adjustment. The brakes need to be bled better. But otherwise -- until I get it up to highway speeds anyway -- it feels solid and substantial.
With the resting battery voltage at 12.2, the 115amp alternator puts out 12.8v @ 6mph (first twich of the meter) and 14.4 @~17mph.
I got in on the road Sunday. Monday I got the tags renewed, and today I got the insurance up-to-date. The plate reads 3VL TWN.
And it still has no bodywork, tank(s) or fairing installed. The headlight works and I installed a tractor taillight above the license plate. It's getting fuel from a blitz can cargo strapped to the rear frame (intake and return hoses stuck into the filler hole). The mufflers are sitting on the bottom deck of the differential carrier. The dashboard is a piece of cardboard with switches sticking through holes and gauges GOOPed in place. I'm wiring them up as needed for testing. Final dash will not be cardboard -- flaps too much in the wind. There are a lot of bundled, rolled up wires here and there waiting for the box to be installed.
The fuse box sits where the gas tank would be, and there is no faux tank covering it right now. All the wiring is exposed. People are telling me that it's very startling to see a bike with no fuel tank scooting down the road.
I got it up to 40mph (in a 35 zone) on my way to the parts house. Felt good, although a little buzzy in the solid mounted floorboards. I stopped in for a couple of circlips and left 90 minutes later after the crowd unblocked the trike and let me leave. People were circling the block to get a look at it. One guy said he saw it from the highway and u-turned to take a picture.
Same thing happened at the body shop. I wanted a quick word with Ron, the owner, about the paint schedule, and was there till far after closing because people kept pulling in to get a better look. When I got home two cars had followed me to find out more about it.
Overall I'm pleased with both the initial results of my effort and the reaction from observers. The most often said phrase is "I never saw anything like it!" Alrighty then. That's what I was going for.
-
Stay tuned for the next enthralling episode :grin: :thumb:
I am :grin:
-
Rode,
Got to see a picture.
Alaska in background.
A true naked trike?
-
So far I'm 15/love overall and batting touchdowns at every wicket.
:bow:
Now there's a dandy mixed metaphor! Couldn't you squeeze soccer in there too?
Nick
-
Cool! Speaking of cool, I recall you increased cooling capacity for the converter? If I remember your overall mechanical reduction is less and the weight is up, so the converter will be picking up a bigger heat load.
How's trail on the forks?
And where's the pictures?
-
:bow:
Now there's a dandy mixed metaphor! Couldn't you squeeze soccer in there too?
Nick
RK wasn't intentionally mixing metaphors , it was late , he is in Alaska , and well ... :grin:
David , those folks are correct, never anything like it , maybe you consider clear bodywork :bow:
Dusty
-
Cool! Speaking of cool, I recall you increased cooling capacity for the converter? If I remember your overall mechanical reduction is less and the weight is up, so the converter will be picking up a bigger heat load.
How's trail on the forks?
And where's the pictures?
Yes, the cooler is thicker and has about 4x the surface area and a 1 liter capacity.
The forks are still stock and have not been lowered. 18" front wheel.
I'll try to get some pics. It looks a bit undone right now.
:bow:
Now there's a dandy mixed metaphor! Couldn't you squeeze soccer in there too?
Nick
It wasn't a soccer reference?
-
Here's a few pics . . . You asked for an Alaska background. Anyone familiar with the album by "Bookin'T is an MG" and the music video from the song "Tonti is Tight" will recognize the background as Sitka High School's back parking lot.
(http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd10/rodekyll1/trike/rolling%20chassis%201%20long-dumb_zpszn8dmokf.jpg) (http://s226.photobucket.com/user/rodekyll1/media/trike/rolling%20chassis%201%20long-dumb_zpszn8dmokf.jpg.html)
(http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd10/rodekyll1/trike/rolling%20chassis%202-dumb_zpskr1rqmgb.jpg) (http://s226.photobucket.com/user/rodekyll1/media/trike/rolling%20chassis%202-dumb_zpskr1rqmgb.jpg.html)
Note the skookum dashboard concept and the innovative use of cargo strapping on the fuel tank. That's not just good design, that's hold-my-beer good design. :thumb:
(http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd10/rodekyll1/trike/rolling%20chassis%203-dumb_zpshhjbjtye.jpg) (http://s226.photobucket.com/user/rodekyll1/media/trike/rolling%20chassis%203-dumb_zpshhjbjtye.jpg.html)
(http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd10/rodekyll1/trike/rolling%20chassis%204-dumb_zpsos16uixv.jpg) (http://s226.photobucket.com/user/rodekyll1/media/trike/rolling%20chassis%204-dumb_zpsos16uixv.jpg.html)
-
I like it!!
-
:thumb: :thumb:
-
David , I'm thinking a little lighted whirlygig mounted in place of the original alternator , or maybe a propeller for extra thrust :grin:
Dusty
-
Red Green!
I love it!
-
Lordy! Needs a nice front fender, and maybe a PTO for the front of the shaft, like goes on the Ford 8N. I like the seat, and bars tho.
-
That's not just good design, that's hold-my-beer good design. :thumb:
:laugh: :laugh:
-
This will show my ignorance; but on your drive shaft, why didn't you tilt the rear axel so the second universal joint could be in line and not at the same angle as the first universal joint as it comes out on the engine side? I probably missed it, who's rear axel did you use?
I would have used spoked rims.... :D and a Russell Day Long seat..... :D
Got an ETA on build completion?
-
Nice job so far RK, Dusty beat me to it but I second the idea of a spiral painted spinner on that crank snout! Whoooo Doggies! Hope you got a patent on that dash :evil:
Paul :boozing: :boozing:
-
that looks BAD ASS!
-
It Lives :grin: :grin:
-
This will show my ignorance; but on your drive shaft, why didn't you tilt the rear axel so the second universal joint could be in line and not at the same angle as the first universal joint as it comes out on the engine side? I probably missed it, who's rear axel did you use?
I would have used spoked rims.... :D and a Russell Day Long seat..... :D
Got an ETA on build completion?
The differential is a Ford 7.5" IRS. The axles I had made.
The differential is tilted as far as it will go in the frame it lives in. I'm using CV joints on the drive shaft so relative angles are not as important as absolute angles and plunge relief. Since the drive shaft doesn't move up and down like an axle, plunge is not an issue here.
ETA is possibly for the 4th of july "shine-n-show". I'm on a break from the body shop right now where I'm cleaning and etching the aluminum body parts. They get a coat of epoxy primer in the morning, and then some mud here and there to hide some of my learning experiences. Topcoat could go on over the weekend if I can hold the painter's attention that long. I'll need a day to clean up the chassis and remove the mufflers, gas can, etc and then a week to install the box and plumb in the wiring and stuff. So it's doable by the 4th . . .
Also got the borrow of wheel alignment stuff from the local foreign car shop. One of the mechanics there was in one of the crowds looking at the rolling chassis yesterday and told me the shop was looking forward to lending me whatever I need.
I was thinking about hanging some mouse balls on the crank snout, kinda like the cow balls on the back of a pickup truck, only from Microsoft.
-
:popcorn: Sooooo Am I going to get to see it in person this summer?
You've built jigs as you go? Harley trike are obscenely expensive.
-
No, no jigs. This is a one-off. If I do it again (hah!) I'd be making so many changes the jigs wouldn't help.
I don't know if I'll get it off the rock this season or not. I'm not going to rush it -- I want it as right as it can be.
Looks like I'm next in line for primer on account of the epoxy booth is full of my stuff and he can't get any cars into production until it's out.
I know how obscene trike prices are. This one is right up there with them, cost-wise. I could have easily bought a used GW trike for what I've spent on this. But what fun would that be, and I'd have to settle for a Goldwing.
-
I hate to ask, as I've enjoyed this entire saga thus far... but what monstrous color(s) combo are you going to do for this one RK? :popcorn:
-
No, no jigs. This is a one-off. If I do it again (hah!) I'd be making so many changes the jigs wouldn't help.
I don't know if I'll get it off the rock this season or not. I'm not going to rush it -- I want it as right as it can be.
Looks like I'm next in line for primer on account of the epoxy booth is full of my stuff and he can't get any cars into production until it's out.
I know how obscene trike prices are. This one is right up there with them, cost-wise. I could have easily bought a used GW trike for what I've spent on this. But what fun would that be, and I'd have to settle for a Goldwing.
So you are saying that basically you hung a torque converter in the air and built a trike around it :laugh:
Dusty
-
Pretty much.
-
I hate to ask, as I've enjoyed this entire saga thus far... but what monstrous color(s) combo are you going to do for this one RK? :popcorn:
You must be remembering the purple one. :laugh:
This one will be close to the green of a 1948 Ford F1 pickup -- darker than british racing green, no metallic, and something short of full gloss. Trim will be black, also not a high gloss. There might be some white pinstriping, although I fear that would look too Teutonic.
-
Impressive engineering, looking great!
-
Looking good! Are you satisfied with the final drive ratio? I recall you had been concerned about that.
John Henry
-
The final drive ratio feels close -- low enough to start a roll uphill, and tall enough to not be wound out at 40mph. I have not yet connected the tach so I have no real numbers.
I can't get it up to speed for comparisons until I get the rear wheels aligned, and the weather isn't cooperating. I'll report in with the figures when I get some.
-
Is this a locking diff? Will you have issues if one wheel looses traction? I like it so far. The body work blends nicely with the fenders. :thumb:
-
Thanks for the nice words about the body style. I have to confess that it's a ripoff of an existing design -- Wonder Woman's airplane.
No, it is not a locking diff. This is the Ford 7.5" differential as found in Mustangs and Merkurs. It has only the traditional ring, pinion, and spider gears of a textbook punkin. When I was looking into the pros/cons of different kinds of diffs I discovered a locking or posi diff will override the ability of the front wheel to describe a turn with it's desire to continue straight.
A lot of trikes have a 'single-traction' differential. That is, only one wheel (and always that wheel) drives -- more like a hack than a car. IIRC, my servicar was like that -- it liked a tight circle in one direction but not the other.
-
:thumb: :thumb:
-
We're into production on the paint. Got the basecoat on today and pulled the trike into the bay to prep it for installation. Since we're tying up a bay and the paint booth, this will be fast-tracked through. I might be up with the box on (less fenders) come Monday.
We took ourselves to the brewery and impeded further progress for the night. I don't generally do that, but with two milestones passed in a week, I felt it was an occasion for :boozing:
-
Got the paint on the aluminum parts. I took pics, but in the paint booth the lighting isn't true. The color doesn't look right on film. You'll have to wait till I roll it outside for pics.
I'm tinkering with the wheel alignment now. I didn't do too badly on the camber -- less than -1/2 on one wheel and right on -1/2 on the other. Toe in is about neutral, but I'm not convinced they're pointed down the center line of the frame. So I'm trying to figure a way to index the centerline. I'm back at the house to get my laser level. I think I can cast a line with that.
Tomorrow we set the box on the chassis and bolt it down. Fenders and tank (steel parts) are still in prep.
-
:thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
:popcorn:
-
I must have missed it but I could not find how you solved the oil tank/cavitation problem. If understand the new board, we now have to search on Google to look up old posts.
-
I'll boil the three weeks of grief and fear down to one sentence: Bad pump body o-ring.
-
Great. I guess when you hear hoofbeats you won't be looking for zebras. :laugh:
-
So I'm trying to figure a way to index the centerline.
I can see that the end of the crank is available. How about hanging a plum bob to the ground from there and then one from each of your rear most outboard hard points and triangulate from there.
Adam
-
I was able to shoot my laser level down the centerline and mark it on tape. Then triangulation was easy. Once I could tell which wheel was pointed where it was easy to tweak the adjusting cams to 0,0,0. I think that's a good place to start.
Still having problems with the parking brake. This is essential since there's no mechanical connection between the engine and the road -- can't use the transmission as a brake.
Today Ron hasn't shown up yet (party at this house last night) so I'm installing stuff like the mirrors and trailer hitch. I'm home right now for more parts and a can of gunk to delouse the rear chassis before setting the box on it.
Oh -- and the crank snout gets covered in the traditional way.
-
Ron didn't show. I guess we'll put the box on tomorrow. I got some more details done on the trike and took a ride on the bike. Then I did deli dinner at Herring cove, way out the end of the road. A salmon swam by, completely undressed, and embarrassingly fat to run around like that. So I did it a favor and dressed it. Tomorrow I'll teach it how to smoke.
-
Ron didn't show. I guess we'll put the box on tomorrow. I got some more details done on the trike and took a ride on the bike. Then I did deli dinner at Herring cove, way out the end of the road. A salmon swam by, completely undressed, and embarrassingly fat to run around like that. So I did it a favor and dressed it. Tomorrow I'll teach it how to smoke.
:1:
Now I'm getting envious.
-
Fish goes on racks in about half an hour. Dries and sets till about noon tomorrow and then we put the smoke to it for a day or so.
The box is on the chassis and mounted securely. I got stopped on the next step -- mufflers -- because I cut a pipe too short. Progress continues tomorrow.
Ron says now that he sees it nearing completion the pressure is on for him to get the fenders and tank done. So he may get on them before the weekend.
-
King salmon is a pink fish (unless white). We use the secret family recipe including salt and brown sugar to brine them to the color of freshly peeled black cherries in sunlight. Then we put them on racks to drip and dry until the surface takes a dry tack. During this time the color dulls.
Once at the proper tack we run cold alder smoke on them for 20 - 30 hours, depending on what we're after. Around about 20 hours the color starts to pop and it starts looking like it was painted (badly) with a candy color. Then we're after the proper dryness for whatever effect we want.
If you want to try some, be at Deep Forest this year. I'm not going to be there but I'm sending a side of fish.
-
It needs thrust-rockets.
-
It needs thrust-rockets.
A couple of these borrowed from a C130 should do the trick :thumb:
(http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/6048/c130jatorocketsb.jpg)
(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTHwGxgn_vSH_TmHY5TQZLJxBhsfT3gr6Vs6OVYgjV1EoLGsnzG)
-
Looking good. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
Can't wait to see the piccies of it with it's clothes on.
-
Exhaust is hung end-to-end, floorboards and steering brakes are installed, hatches are bolted down and the cargo box deck is in place.
Tomorrow the forward decking goes down, the radiator gets installed and I start putting finish bits on the panels. I took some pics, but they'd be spoilers right now. I'll wait for the final assembly (or nearly so) to post more pics.
Ron says yes, we should have it completed by the 4th.
-
Why would you run those style of rear wheels? Considering the rear and front for that matter are now going to deal with lateral loads whay would you run motorcycle wheels on the rear?
Ciao
-
Why doesn't a hack run car tires?
-
Some hacks do run car tires. It's a matter of getting the proper wheels laced. As for alignment you'll probably want a slight bit of toe in on the rear for stability. If you notice some "darting" about under braking you need more toe in. I suspect 0.060 to 0.100 total toe at the rear.
-
Thanks for the toe hint. I set it as close to neutral in all directions as I could It should be easy to turn them in from there.
I tried to find thin auto tires and rims. It just wasn't happening for me. They don't fit the theme. Fat tires on a trike look silly in my opinion, so they were out of the question. I am using 6-ply, fairly flat aspect 4.00/19 TT Duro tires on the rear. A real bear to mount. I looked at the 'real' hack tires and couldn't find much wider than 3.50 in a 19 and I couldn't find 6-ply sidewalls.
-
You might try a square profile sidecar tire on the front. I've found that a round profile lacks the authority to turn a three wheeler and the front just slides leading me on unfortunate paths especially on decreaseing radius corners.
-
Do you know of any tubeless square profile tires? All these rims are tubeless. It seems a shame to run tubes in them.
-
Unfortunately I don't , I don't remember what kind of tire I use but I'll go and look,I am on my way up to the vet's hospital soon, just an appointment .whatever it is I've had good luck with them.
-
*yawn*
I'm just getting up (2:30P local time). After yesterday with the morning spent on real work, the afternoon on the trike, the evening catching more kings and all day/night tending the smokehouse I ran out of steam about 5:AM. Luckily my neighbor has fish in the box too, so he took over smokehouse duty for me.
Just getting the thin pieces out of the smoke. It's darn yummy stuff. The thicker/larger pieces could be in another 6-12 hours.
-
The fish makes me hungry! I run Metzler K blocks on the front and on the car. They are tube type so I do run a tube. I've been eyeing antique car tire websights but haven't tried one yet but I did find a 17 for the rear so that's next. The handling improvement with the square profile as a steering tire is worth it for me to run a tube but I'm hoping to find a tubeless at Coker tire or somewhere when I need one.
-
Coker was a brand I researched extensively when I was at this point of design -- we'd had a discussion on the wheels and all here when I was doing it. Coker has some good replica stuff and I was considering knock-off hubs and brit wheels on the rear. The thinnest they had was about 5" in the diameters I was looking at. That was still a little wide for the look I wanted, and the rim choices were limited -- didn't think I could get a wheel diameter and final drive ratio that worked together.
I also wanted the three wheels to match, and I was getting frustrated trying to work a brit rim into a guzzi hub. When it was all said and done I went with 19" BMW/7 lesters on the rear and made adapter plates to side mount them to the Ford hubs. I used a Guzzi 18" Lester on the front. I wanted to go BMW up front so I could carry a mounted spare that fit any corner. The axle diameter was too small. I couldn't get a compatible bearing to go from the small axle/taper bearing to the large axle/ball bearing.
-
:popcorn:
Looking forward to an update :grin:
-
It's been busy around the hovel d'rodekyll this week. The salmon are running the beach out at the end of the road, and I've been running out the end of the road to run the salmon running the beach. There's a window of a couple of weeks to lay in what I can, and the time spent catching only qualifies me to spend more time putting it up. So the trike progress has been slow.
Got the rear deck lid set up with an electric door popper connected to a couple of Jackal seat releases for push-button opening. The radiator fan thermoswitch components are wired up and the basic dashboard layout is done. Still waiting on Ron to paint the fenders and other remaining parts.
In another topic I bought a valeo knockoff starter. It didn't work out-of-the-box (DOA). The seller didn't offer an exchange, but didn't bat an eye at a return, either. A genuine valeo is now on the way. Once installed I'll be driving it around the immediate area of the shop for various tests. I don't want to take it out much without the fenders though.
Parking brake is still an issue. It engages, but if left overnight it won't release; I have to crack a bleeder to cycle it. It's driving me nuts. With no way to use the transmission as a brake on account of there's no transmission, a parking brake is a requirement.
-
David posted "The salmon are running the beach out at the end of the road, and I've been running out the end of the road to run the salmon running the beach".
(http://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q692/2jabam3/DSC_0336_zpsc9eb7600.jpg) (http://s1354.photobucket.com/user/2jabam3/media/DSC_0336_zpsc9eb7600.jpg.html)
(http://i1354.photobucket.com/albums/q692/2jabam3/DSC_0383_zpsb2ea63a3.jpg) (http://s1354.photobucket.com/user/2jabam3/media/DSC_0383_zpsb2ea63a3.jpg.html)
:boozing:
Matt
-
I'm fishing on the other side of the cove this week, Matt. I brought a 20' ladder to get down the cliff. I reset it five times to reach the beach. Got five kings on the beach and kept the best ones (released the rest) in a driving rainstorm. It was iffy getting it all back up the cliff. Took two trips, even though I left the head and bones for the eagles. (note to self -- bring another kitchen garbage bag. They don't fit in one.)