Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Testarossa on June 26, 2015, 10:56:00 PM
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Peter Jones writing in the August issue:
"There's too much to admire about Moto Guzzi motorcycles to not want them to succeed, but they're just a bit too strange for the masses. So, since we want them to survive, I thing that you should buy one, while you might think that I should buy one. Neither of us will. Moto Guzzis are great bikes, but they're bikes that only Moto Guzzi owners would own, and somehow we all know what I mean by that, even though I can't explain it.
But then there's Moto Morini . . . "
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Peter Jones writing in the August issue:
"There's too much to admire about Moto Guzzi motorcycles to not want them to succeed, but they're just a bit too strange for the masses. So, since we want them to survive, I thing that you should buy one, while you might think that I should buy one. Neither of us will. Moto Guzzis are great bikes, but they're bikes that only Moto Guzzi owners would own, and somehow we all know what I mean by that, even though I can't explain it.
But then there's Moto Morini . . . "
You're a few hours late on this............... :wink:
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Dear Peter Jones,
I did buy one, so now it is your turn. Go buy one and I'll buy a copy of Cycle World. That seems only fair.
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Boy is there truth in that statement. That's pretty funny. :shocked:
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Sorry, I don't get what is supposed to be so "strange" about Moto Guzzis. They have two wheels, a handlebar, a V twin engine, a seat. No para- tele- whatever suspension. Throttle on the right grip. Except for the Griso, their styling is traditional. They cost about the same as most motorcycles. They're just rare, is all.
I really like my Guzzi, but maybe I'm missing something.
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Too many sheep, not enough black sheep! :boozing:
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Sorry, I don't get what is supposed to be so "strange" about Moto Guzzis. They have two wheels, a handlebar, a V twin engine, a seat. No para- tele- whatever suspension. Throttle on the right grip. Except for the Griso, their styling is traditional. They cost about the same as most motorcycles. They're just rare, is all.
I really like my Guzzi, but maybe I'm missing something.
What's strange about Guzzi is Guzzi, not the bikes. They do things a little differently shall we say. There's Luigi on the line of course and the corporate shananagans that has kept them at a distance to the general public for quite awhile.
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I guess writers have to write about something :blank: :blank: :blank:
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I guess writers have to write about something :blank: :blank: :blank:
This guy is a new writer for CW and I'm not really impressed by his articles so far...........I'd give him a D for this 1.
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Magazines are struggling to stay in business. Many have cut staff and mainly use freelance stuff so the quality is...well, you get what fits the pages. Some rags are just recycling old articles so I guess we should be happy that CW has not started doing that too. My SIL worked for a high end publishing company for 25+ years. He got caught in the third round of layoffs about two years ago. Now they call him in on a contract basis to do their web stuff...less pay, no benefits. It seems like a downhill spiral.
Peter Y.
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I'm kinda strange. I am on hold for a time. Hoping that a Goose decides to fly my way. Then I can aid the factory in staying upright.
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Read the whole article and it's an endorsement of Italian bikes with character. I can't explain my behavior in regard to old maintenance-intensive (mostly Italian) motorcycles, so in a sense the article is about me (and probably most of us on this board).
For purely emotional reasons I have bought, rebuilt and maintained an Aermacchi/Harley 350SS, a Laverda 750SF, my T, and the '70 Triumph. AT least two of these bikes were right-foot shifters (I honestly can't recall which side the Laverda used), and I got rid of the two Japanese bikes for being too, um, vanilla. A Morini would fit my style nicely. When I acquired the T, it appealed to me aesthetically and because it handled so well, but also because the layout promised easy owner maintenance. Of course I wasn't thinking about clutch replacement but fortunately I got at least 50,000 miles on the original clutch.
Ducati is the only Italian brand that really made it into the U.S. mainstream and I'd welcome an explanation about how that happened, and why it didn't happen for Guzzi.
I'd ask the same question about BMW. In the late '60s Guzzis were no odder than Beemer boxers of the same era, yet BMW gradually achieved traction in the market while Guzzi just plodded along in second gear. Why and how did that occur?
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Read the whole article and it's an endorsement of Italian bikes with character. I can't explain my behavior in regard to old maintenance-intensive (mostly Italian) motorcycles, so in a sense the article is about me (and probably most of us on this board).
For purely emotional reasons I have bought, rebuilt and maintained an Aermacchi/Harley 350SS, a Laverda 750SF, my T, and the '70 Triumph. AT least two of these bikes were right-foot shifters (I honestly can't recall which side the Laverda used), and I got rid of the two Japanese bikes for being too, um, vanilla. A Morini would fit my style nicely. When I acquired the T, it appealed to me aesthetically and because it handled so well, but also because the layout promised easy owner maintenance. Of course I wasn't thinking about clutch replacement but fortunately I got at least 50,000 miles on the original clutch.
Ducati is the only Italian brand that really made it into the U.S. mainstream and I'd welcome an explanation about how that happened, and why it didn't happen for Guzzi.
I'd ask the same question about BMW. In the late '60s Guzzis were no odder than Beemer boxers of the same era, yet BMW gradually achieved traction in the market while Guzzi just plodded along in second gear. Why and how did that occur?
Ducati got traction here by making the 851 and the start of the Superbike class of road racing and then World Superbike racing in `88. Then the awesome 916 series didn't hurt. Moto Guzzi pulled out of road racing in the 50s.
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Race Sunday sell Monday.
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Well, I just got CW this afternoon and read the entire article. The key point he made (IMHO) was one should stay away from Guzzi. At the top of the list to stay away from would be Moto Guzzi. There did not seem to be any rational for that other than the fact that Guzzi uses a V that is placed differently from most other bikes. I guess being different is the kiss of death. It strikes me odd that there are other brands that have tried various engine configurations...pa rallel twin, single, V4, V2, horizontal single, and even rotary...but that's OK. Maybe it was just a slow month for ideas and the magazine deadline came up all of a sudden.
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We all know what the drawback to Guzzi's is and the cycle rags are kind when they review them, but they all ding the hard-mounted translverse engine and MG still hasn't gotten the message.
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The article contains a spectacular typo: it claims we ride with our engines sideways-mouthed. Flounder engines, I suppose.
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The cool part is Piaggio sees Guzzi as something different for themselves and for this we are all grateful. If it had the same engine layout as some of the others would Piaggio want them? Harley has done ok with their "old school" designs so I think Guzzi being unique is what makes Guzzi what it is today. Who cares what the rags say, Guzzi will be around longer than they probably will so who gets the last laugh? :huh:
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The cool part is Piaggio sees Guzzi as something different for themselves and for this we are all grateful. If it had the same engine layout as some of the others would Piaggio want them? Harley has done ok with their "old school" designs so I think Guzzi being unique is what makes Guzzi what it is today. Who cares what the rags say, Guzzi will be around longer than they probably will so who gets the last laugh? :huh:
For starters, I don't think Peter Jones represents anyone but himself on this. I'm surprised CW has given this guy a forum to share his thoughts 'cause so far all his thoughts I've read I think are not worth sharing. He's certainly no Peter Egan or Kevin Cameron.
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And it seems to me that continuing the old classic is what Guzzi has always done. Anyone here not want a version - any version - of the Falcone?
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Some people just don't dare to be different, and that's fine. Personally I have always been drawn to things out of the ordinary and found the uniqueness of the Moto guzzi's to be there best attribute. I think until you have actually owned a goose you will never understand it's true value. All bikes are fun to ride, but I have found the guzzi's the most fun to own, to work on ,and to ride by far. The like minded people you meet along the way only enhance the whole experience and you feel as though you have joined a supportive family instead of a bad ass cult. Ive got nothing against loud pipes and doo rags, to each there own. I just prefer the character to be in the bike not on it. :shocked:
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(snipped)
Ive got nothing against loud pipes and doo rags, to each there own.
(snipped)
Me too. Except for ape hangers.
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I don't know, ape hangers ain't so bad. We rode by a big gaggle of dudes on ape hanger bikes going to Guffy, Co. the other day, couldn't help but laugh a little in my Shoei. :grin: Do they get bugs in thier armpits?
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Quote from Guzzistajohn:
I don't know, ape hangers ain't so bad. We rode by a big gaggle of dudes on ape hanger bikes going to Guffy, Co. the other day, couldn't help but laugh a little in my Shoei. :grin: Do they get bugs in thier armpits?
Be fun to watch them get behind a bee hauling truck.
GliderJohn
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Quote from Guzzistajohn:
Be fun to watch them get behind a bee hauling truck.
GliderJohn
Be fun to watch them have to suddenly stop...........ther eby causing the apehanger to break off at it's mount...........and see them fly forward still hanging onto said apehanger.......... ..with official non DOT 1/2 helmet on. :popcorn:
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Different folks, different spokes ....... :boxing:
Simian hangers on a Roto Guzzi. :shocked:
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/guzzi%20chopper_zpspk31easv.jpg)
Hipster on a Rolling Stone. :cool:
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/hipster%20on%20v7_zpsgjqfoht0.jpg)
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Yep, some like it rough.
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One of their editorial writers, Peter Jones had this to say in the CW August '15 issue. I won't bother with the link: I'll just type it here:
"There are different levels of questionable choices when it comes to motorcycles. I'd have to put Moto Guzzi at the upper level of that scale, being a brand that normal people might want to own but not quite. Moto Guzzi has been trying to get into motorcycling's USA kingdom of acceptability for nearly 100 years now, never getting farther than camping outside the castle walls, like a weird tribe of migrant serfs. Guzzi's sideways-mounted shaft drive V-twin is so peculiar that Honda once copied it.
There's too much to admire about Moto Guzzi motorcycles to not want them to succeed, but they're just a bit too strange for the masses. So, since we want them to survive, I think that you should buy one, while you might think that I should buy one. Neither of us will. Moto Guzzis are great bikes, but they're bikes that only Moto Guzzi owners would own and somehow we all know what I mean by that, even though I can't explain it."
The bolded lines are mine. Oh well, there it is. Looks like his observations continue to keep us as outsiders, WAY outside the realms of "normalcy." Not a bad thing.
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Who ever said we were normal? :wink:
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Why be normal?
Not for those with the herd mentality.
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Yep. Forgot to mention the title of the article was "Weirdos and Wallflowers of Two Wheels."
Oh well. I didn't get many dances at my high school Friday night dance events either. But the few I did get were really great! :laugh:
It's the quality, not the quantity...
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I think I really like that review. It's not a bike you ride if you don't want people to come up to you and ask you questions. I enjoy going past people on the sidewalk (them, not me) and seeing that quick turn of the head as they think " What am I looking at ? "
" weird tribe of migrant serfs "
Can we get some WTMS patches made up ?
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merged
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Opinions are like axesholes - everyone has one. Including the author of the article. I think he's trying to say you won't be able to identify with others in the comfort of a big group. Or something.
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My V11 Sport is the only bike I have ridden that gets a thumbs up from both the Ducati and the Harley crowd. I guess both recognize their superior when they see one.....
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I tried being normal once, worst two minutes of my life. Just yesterday I was in a Harley shop and was approached by the owner. She asked me if I've changed if she could put me on a Harley. My reply was 'Judy you know I have nothing against Harley's and rather like them but I just don't want to ride what everyone else is so I couldn't afford one. If I bought one it would look like others. Then I'd have to put thousands into it to look different. Then it wouldn't be fast enough even though I'm seventy so I'd have to put thousands into the engine and still I'd only be faster than another Harley. Nope just can't afford one'.
Today I got a copy of Motor Cyclist and they had a small write up on the Eldorado and Audace and it was rather complimentary. Myself I like the Audace but would be happier on the Eldorado. I'm not going back to work so I won't be getting one but I'm happy on my Aluminum.
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I get lots of compliments about my Cal Special. One guy thought is was the most powerfully sounding bike he'd ever heard. I've even got positive remarks about its looks even if it does need paint.
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For what it's worth...
When I'm on my Ducati, I get thumbs up from guys in Porsches.
When I'm on my Guzzi, I get thumbs up from guys on motorcycles.
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"weird tribe of migrant serfs" - thats got a ring to it!! :grin: There was a great quote about being in the club of Guzzi ownership from a US journalist...it involved chickens........
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Serfs don't migrate. They are bound to the land.
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Serfs don't migrate. They are bound to the land.
I guess writers aren't required to use a Thesaurus or Dictionary in this day and age...
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I like being a little different, I like being the only Moto Guzzi to show up somewhere. Nothing wrong with that. I love the bike and the ride it gives. I love the looks of wonder on people's faces. Second night out and a cop pulls up beside me and asks what kind of bike it is, I love that! Had MG taken the motor and turned it like the HD twin, I wouldn't be riding it now. Don't want to look like that.
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Oops, sorry Rocker Fifty Nine. I never saw Testarossa's orig. thread. Need to stay on top and visit WG more often!
The Bob
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I think I really like that review. It's not a bike you ride if you don't want people to come up to you and ask you questions. I enjoy going past people on the sidewalk (them, not me) and seeing that quick turn of the head as they think " What am I looking at ? "
" weird tribe of migrant serfs "
Can we get some WTMS patches made up ?
Funny how MG just came out with 'Clan' apparel........now all we need are the patches to go with it. Anybody out there know an embroidery outfit that will do them?
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Motorcycle Consumer News goes out of there way to anchor the 'real' end of the journalism spectrum. They know how to analyze a brand or a bike without succumbing to their bias -- and then when it comes down to their personal preferences they use sidebars and don't pretend their opinions are universal.
Here's my sidebar: what the Peter Jones article represents is a writer projecting his own oddball eccentricities onto a brand -- and using absolutely nothing concrete to suggest the opinions have merit.
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I guess writers aren't required to use a Thesaurus or Dictionary in this day and age...
Or a brain..
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I'd ask the same question about BMW. In the late '60s Guzzis were no odder than Beemer boxers of the same era, yet BMW gradually achieved traction in the market while Guzzi just plodded along in second gear. Why and how did that occur?
BMW upgraded the R60/69 into the R75/90 series and then the K Bikes and added in the Oilheads then singles and twins. Diversity. They also had the R&D and $$, I suppose, from the car division and an ultimate goal of a performance brand. I don't think Guzzi had the direction and certainly not the resources to progress, not to mention the changes in management (ownership) over the years.
Re. the Peter Jones article, I'm just happy to see somebody saying something about the brand and in general, the article seemed to portray the brand in an attractive (not for everyone) way. While I may not agree with his views all the time, I do enjoy his writings.
ps, I also own a Ducati 860GT which he derided in the article. His opinion, mine..........the first gen Multistrada is the ugliest Ducati ever made, the GT second. :wink:
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Ducati 860GT
My first Duck. Great bike, really.
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My first Duck. Great bike, really.
Yep , the BMW of Ducaties :evil: :grin:
Dusty
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Yep , the BMW of Ducaties :evil: :grin:
Dusty
Except it handled, was (relatively) fast, come to think of it.. pretty darn fast for the day..and had character.. <shrug> :evil:
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Reckon the Dealer in BR, Louisiana is going to let MG go. They did not send a tech to school for the new bikes so will not get any. Said, when they sell a MG, they never see it again, as most owners work on them instead of bringing them in for service. They don't make that much on selling them, so they will let them go.
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I'm new to Guzzi ownership, so don't have experience with earlier models (but always found them appealing). There was always one word, though, that you seemed to find in every review of a Guzzi, and you all know what it was: "quirky". That wasn't necessarily a pejorative, but there it was.
I now have about a month with my new Cali 1400 Custom, and (except for the dipstick) "quirky" is not a word that springs to mind with this motorcycle at all. It is a thoroughly refined, modern motorcycle in every respect. This is not to diminish the character of older Guzzis at all; just my observation that Guzzi may -- in one sense -- have moved the bar.
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Last week I was at the 2015 Norton National Rally near Asheville, NC. There were over 450 registered attendees so this was a really big deal. Remember that the newest Norton was made in 1975 (OK, there were a few attempts to bring the brand back to life but that's another story). The interesting part is that I saw at least 4 MG Califorinas (EV's), 5 or 6 Griso's, two newer V7s, and a Stelvio. This leads me to believe that people who appreciate motorcycles recognize Guzzi as a desirable machine and one that they can live with. Quirky might be in the eye of the beholder. If you are used to a steady diet of inline 4 engines with chain drive then anything else is quirky. Heck, by that standard the HD brand is quirky...rubber band drive, for example. Oh well, I guess I'll have to pitch my tent outside the castle walls and wonder if their view is as nice as mine.
Peter Y.
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I now have about a month with my new Cali 1400 Custom, and (except for the dipstick) "quirky" is not a word that springs to mind with this motorcycle at all. It is a thoroughly refined, modern motorcycle in every respect. This is not to diminish the character of older Guzzis at all; just my observation that Guzzi may -- in one sense -- have moved the bar.
Indeed, the California 1400 is my first Moto Guzzi, and to me it just seems like a really nice, well-made, technologically advanced motorcycle. You want "quirky" in 2015? Go ride a Ural, not a Guzzi.
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Last week I was at the 2015 Norton National Rally near Asheville, NC. There were over 450 registered attendees so this was a really big deal. Remember that the newest Norton was made in 1975 (OK, there were a few attempts to bring the brand back to life but that's another story). The interesting part is that I saw at least 4 MG Califorinas (EV's), 5 or 6 Griso's, two newer V7s, and a Stelvio. This leads me to believe that people who appreciate motorcycles recognize Guzzi as a desirable machine and one that they can live with. Quirky might be in the eye of the beholder. If you are used to a steady diet of inline 4 engines with chain drive then anything else is quirky. Heck, by that standard the HD brand is quirky...rubber band drive, for example. Oh well, I guess I'll have to pitch my tent outside the castle walls and wonder if their view is as nice as mine.
Peter Y.
Vintage bike guys like Moto Guzzis.
Or, Moto Guzzi riders like vintage bikes.
There is a similar phenomenon at NTNOA Lake O the Pines in Texas each October. Quite a few Guzzi faithful show up for the weekend of Norton love.
I think it says a lot for the average Guzzi owner: "Motorcycle Enthusiast".
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Guzzi owner: "Motorcycle Enthusiast".
Bingo. I love Guzzi but I love all motorcycles. Hell I think the Honda pc800 is a rad bike and it looks boring and ugly as sin but if it were in my garage I'd ride it. I'd ride it a lot.
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Peter Jones writing in the August issue:
"There's too much to admire about Moto Guzzi motorcycles to not want them to succeed, but they're just a bit too strange for the masses. So, since we want them to survive, I thing that you should buy one, while you might think that I should buy one. Neither of us will. Moto Guzzis are great bikes, but they're bikes that only Moto Guzzi owners would own, and somehow we all know what I mean by that, even though I can't explain it.
But then there's Moto Morini . . . "
Mr. Jones seems to be on the receiving end of much vitriol here; yet, I can't see that he's saying anything that is inconsistent with admiration nor truth.
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Any more of a cult, it would require chickens
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(http://lghttp.24139.nexcesscdn.net/80AD9C/magento/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/600x/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/r/u/rubber_chicken_dog_toy_-_front_view.jpg)
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Boy is there truth in that statement. That's pretty funny. :shocked:
I identified with that diatribe a lot more than I expected I would. Great article if you don't take yourself too seriously.
Steve
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MCN in the US does quite a bit of bias BS. Perhaps, not as much as the rags that take adds, but they are no way as unbiased as they like to claim.
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I take it this is a print-only thing? I can't find a link. And if something isn't on the internet, does it really exist? :laugh:
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Dear Mr. Jones,
Are you insinuating that serfs migrate? And what've you got against Moto Morini?
I am offended.
Please cancel my subscription at your earliest convenience.
Thank You
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I take it this is a print-only thing? I can't find a link. And if something isn't on the internet, does it really exist? :laugh:
It's in a very recent print issue, so it will be online in a month or two.
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I read a quote once on this site about Guzzis which basically said if you ride one for 10 minutes you'll hate it but ride it for 10 hours and you'll love it . I'm one of those lucky few !
These guys are missing the boat . It's their loss and I really like this little exclusive club we have here . Hope it's around for a longtime to come .
Steve
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OK , why is it that we all celebrate how different our MGs are , and how we are such rugged individualist free thinkers we are , and yet when a journalist states the same thing , well hell , he is an idiot and should be shunned :huh: I don't get it .
Dusty
"I'm an in-duh-vidual, and if you don't agree with me you're wrong!" :tongue:
(Actually a member of Dogbert's New Ruling Class)
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I'm an individual, but its lonely out here. Its a pain to fight conventionality and nobody notices that you're doin your own thing. I think I'll get a Chinese scooter.
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To quote Hunter S Thompson.
“Yesterday's weirdness is tomorrow's reason why.”
or, another one.
“Too weird to live, too rare to die!”
Which I like better.
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and here is the full quote.
“There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die.”
― Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas
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OK , why is it that we all celebrate how different our MGs are , and how we are such rugged individualist free thinkers we are , and yet when a journalist states the same thing , well hell , he is an idiot and should be shunned :huh: I don't get it .
Dusty
LOL. Exactly. It's that whole, "My family is nuts!" "Wait, what'd you say about my mamma? Get my gun!"
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All I know is I love my '12 Stelio NTX for the motorcycle it is, how it makes me feel when I ride it and look at it in the garage at night. Not because some one else said its a great bike or a terrible bike. So when I read comments (like Peter Jones) that somebody makes after taking a test ride or no ride at all, my only response is that as far as I am concerned, he can go piss up a rope.
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Once again , what did Mr Jones say that was wrong or bad ? He stated that he likes MGs .
Dusty
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and the most famous from the Good Doctor:
"when the going gets weird, the Weird turn pro!"
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"Football season is over"
Dusty
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"Football season is over"
Dusty
his last quote
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OK , why is it that we all celebrate how different our MGs are , and how we are such rugged individualist free thinkers we are , and yet when a journalist states the same thing , well hell , he is an idiot and should be shunned :huh: I don't get it .
Dusty
(http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb127/Davebbell/groucho.jpg)
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Where are the graphic artists out there I want a weird clan of migrant serf tee shirt!
Dave
Galveston
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Where are the graphic artists out there I want a weird clan of migrant serf tee shirt!
Dave
Galveston
Turns out peasant migrants , or migrants serfs , were quite common in Russia , so we are gonna need those shirts printed in Cyrillic :laugh:
Dusty
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What I find interesting is that on two occasions, I had stopped at other brand dealerships to check on what they would charge to change a tire. When the sales manager in one case & dealership owner in another, found out it was a Moto Guzzi, they launched into a put down of the marque. I just smiled and replied.... where are all your customers, in fact where are your salesmen? A quick look revealed that they were all out in the parking lot looking over my California 1400 Cruiser. Emerging, & much to the chagrin of the would be put down artists, I was bombarded with questions & complements. Too weird for American tastes indeed...