Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: mentalfloss on October 15, 2015, 10:48:53 AM
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My more bang for your buck thread got me to thinking what used motorcycles sell for a surprisingly high amount.
I have always wanted a GB500 Honda thumper clubman replica. They did not sell very well when new (I should have bought a leftover model when dealers where giving them away! DOH!).
I see the are higher than a cats back now!
Pretty common to see them for over $5,000!
Another bike I used to own was a FT 500 ascott Honda. I was selling hondas in the 80's when I bought one for 500 bucks from the dealer I worked for...brand new leftover. Heck we sold them retail for $999.00.
Now they seem to get over that all worn out. They are a cool bike though. A lot of fun.
I used to know Harleys pretty well back in the day 1980's but really lost interest in them when every poser in the world has to have one but they seem to bring an awful lot used now ?!?!?!
Bmw GS's are another contender (R1200 GS &GSA)
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That's why they call them "cult bikes" - there's no rhyme or reason for it, just some sort of mass hysteria.
Couldn't give away a GB500 in 1990 - now you need about $7500 to even play, for a nice one.
It's not just rarity - there are probably 50 times as many Suzuki GT-750s as there are BSA Beagles in the country, but .....
Who knows? And you can't predict it - if you could, everyone would have been selecting the $900 "Hemi" option for their Mopar in 1970 ....
Lannis
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With the money you saved on not buying the 500gb and a little more time you could have bought a similar Ducati 1000GT
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Airhead GS Beemers , especially the PD models seem to command a premium , and anything late 60s Tri/BSA also .
Dusty
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PS, I think YAMAHA might be onto something selling SR400s for sky high prices in the firs places?
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The ridiculous part of this subject is people who have "X-brand" motorcycle that was built somewhere between the 60's-80's and they advertise it for absolutely stupid prices with the unrealistic hope that some fool will actually pay their crazy price.
As Dusty posted above, Airhead GS Beemers fall into this category. I have owned several BMW R100RT's in the 80's and really like the bikes. I know the good and the bad re. these bikes and I can tear one down to the crank & put it back together. A couple of months ago, I found an 84-RT in the NE where the owner wanted around $8k for the bike. He had a phone number in the ad so I called and asked why he was asking so much. He said that he had invested that much in the bike over the 10 years that he had owned the bike. I politely pointed out that what he put in it has very little (if anything) with what the bike is worth to someone who is looking to purchase a 30+ year old motorcycle. He told me that apparently the bike just wasn't for me because I couldn't appreciate how "special" it was.............. and I agreed. I'm not saying that someone won't be stupid enough to pay $8k for the bike BUT I highly doubt that someone who knows anything about these bikes will pay much more than $5k for it if it's in REALLY GREAT condition. Unless he changes his opinion re. the real value of his piece of gold, this bike will probably never be sold and will be sitting in his garage when he dies.
After inquiring about more than a half dozen bikes over a period of several months, I finally gave up trying to find a nice one at a reasonable price and bought a much newer (used) Beemer. Too many people have been watching these "reality shows" (that are fake) where cars & motorcycles are supposedly sold at stupid prices and now they're looking for their pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
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Triumph Hurricane. A friend of mine was a Triumph dealer when they came out and he couldn't give them away. Now they are bringing stupid money.
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:Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu
I think there's a lot of self deception involved.
You can think back how much you wanted an RG500 when you could no afford one. Years later you got the money. Will you find a good one? Of course not.
500GB Well it was nice but there was the much cheaper 500 the bike was based on. Odd thing with the bike you choose it was supposed to be a retro brit bike without hassle. Probably easier to get parts an run an old brit bike now or buy a new retro brit bike.
I once wanted a Guzzi v50, I once wanted a Gilera Saturno, I figured just buying an early V7 Classic was so much less hassle.
I also wanted a Bimota BB1 and then saw the much cheaper SRZ660. Now what modern bike will cure me of my desire for these last two
Oddities ?
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In the last 5-10 years, Kawasaki triples have taken a big jump in price. A rider H2 can easily go for 5-10k, and a properly restored '69 H1sometimes goes over 20k. They were originally made to be cheap and fast, so it's funny to watch "correct" restorations get cheap yellow chromated zinc on the fasteners and the CDI housings, non-stainless spokes, and all the other low-end parts put back to exact original condition. Did a previous owner upgrade to stainless Allen head bolts on the clutch and alternator covers? Not original! Throw them away and use zinc plated JIS screws! The crankshaft may not get rebuilt with new seals, but as long as the bike looks perfect...
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Jim , that same "factory" correct thing happens in the Brit bike world also . Years back I owned a modded 1970 TR6R Triumph , stock green with gold and black highlights , even the stock appearing Burgess mufflers , although the were from a much earlier era and a bit more free flowing . The only outward changes were alloy wheels , an oil cooler, a slightly different seat , and Allen head fasteners on the engine/transmission . Took it to a vintage meet , and 2 out of 3 attendees made comments like " how could anyone ruin a Triumph motorcycle like that" :rolleyes:
Dusty
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Couldn't give away a GB500 in 1990 - now you need about $7500 to even play, for a nice one.
Lannis
Or not
https://cf.searchtempest.com/go-1.1.html#http%3A//harrisburg.craigslist.org/mcy/5215138803.html
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Or not
https://cf.searchtempest.com/go-1.1.html#http%3A//harrisburg.craigslist.org/mcy/5215138803.html
Yeah , but that one is dinged up :evil:
Dusty
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If I'm selling I'm happy about high value. If buying I complain I can't buy a bike for $500 anymore.
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Jim , that same "factory" correct thing happens in the Brit bike world also .
Yes, I know it's pervasive. As far as I'm concerned, there should be one perfect example of every motorcycle ever built, kept in a museum, and the rest of them should be built and/or modified to suit their owners. :grin:
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Yes, I know it's pervasive. As far as I'm concerned, there should be one perfect example of every motorcycle ever built, kept in a museum, and the rest of them should be built and/or modified to suit their owners. :grin:
And for the small percentage of owners who it suits to have the one in the factory. I'm sure there's a name for that. *#*@& paradox?
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Jim , that same "factory" correct thing happens in the Brit bike world also . Years back I owned a modded 1970 TR6R Triumph , stock green with gold and black highlights , even the stock appearing Burgess mufflers , although the were from a much earlier era and a bit more free flowing . The only outward changes were alloy wheels , an oil cooler, a slightly different seat , and Allen head fasteners on the engine/transmission . Took it to a vintage meet , and 2 out of 3 attendees made comments like " how could anyone ruin a Triumph motorcycle like that" :rolleyes:
Dusty
Well, thankfully, not so much (yet) in the Norton corner of the motorcycle universe. As I commented in another thread, Norton asking prices have climbed into the "stupid" category in the last few years & more sellers are actually getting the asking prices (or higher) in the past couple of years. However, at least in the DE-MAR-VA area, the "factory correct" virus is still rare. Bikes with either period-correct or even modern (non-factory) functional/safety upgrades are still widely appreciated & fawned over at Norton gatherings. Non-factory paint jobs (horrors!!!), some of them quite garish, regularly receive positive comments, too. Barrett-Jackson, Pebble Beach & their ilk can have the "factory correct down to the assemblers' chalk marks on the frame" on vehicles that never get driven/ridden more than 20' (from the garage to the trailer & from the trailer to the field display); when/if the Norton or MG world gets that way it will be time for me to sell mine & cash in on the people with more cash than sense that drive this phenomenon.
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Or not
https://cf.searchtempest.com/go-1.1.html#http%3A//harrisburg.craigslist.org/mcy/5215138803.html
That is a pretty good price on that GB500!
It will go up in the next 5 years.Maybe 50% to 100%
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The R80 G-S first year is another one that has gone wacko in the price dept but may go up even more. I saw one on AADVrider (Blue) that was very reasonable for todays market. I think it is still for sale.
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.......and what really gets my goat is those that call themselves a "Purist"...bunch of pretentious ***** s. What's wrong with modifications to your own taste or requirements?, and by the same token there is nothing wrong with keeping it standard if that is what YOU want.....
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Well, thankfully, not so much (yet) in the Norton corner of the motorcycle universe. As I commented in another thread, Norton asking prices have climbed into the "stupid" category in the last few years & more sellers are actually getting the asking prices (or higher) in the past couple of years.
My one was ALMOST in the "stupid money" category when I bought it, but I wanted a nice stock one with a known history and the Norton-typical problems fixed and I got it, it's been a really good bike and worth the money ...
(http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i130/LannisSelz/100_0975_zpsy0gzkmc8.jpg) (http://s71.photobucket.com/user/LannisSelz/media/100_0975_zpsy0gzkmc8.jpg.html)
My riding plans have me and Fay riding it about 5,000 miles a year to various events, so if I keep it in shape, it should hold its value at least ....
I've added a few bolt-ons to make long trips easier to live with (windshield, AirHawks, luggage rack) and I've got an old set of Craven panniers to fix up and use on it ...
Lannis
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My third motorcycle was a brand new cb400F 4 cyl honda.....man what a sweet motor! I do not quite remember what it cost new but looked at several a couple of years ago to scratch that nostalgia itch and was pushed back by what they were getting for them and low and behold they have gone up by about 30% 40% just in the last couple of years since then....
A nice one is north of $5,000 $6,000 now.
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.......and what really gets my goat is those that call themselves a "Purist"...bunch of pretentious ***** s. What's wrong with modifications to your own taste or requirements?, and by the same token there is nothing wrong with keeping it standard if that is what YOU want.....
Nothing at all wrong with doing whatever you want to a bike to make it "yours".
However, many of the folks who modify bikes get really pissed when they find out that the big money that they've put into their bikes to "modify" it to their taste actually DROPS the value of a bike relative to a "stock" one, and that they can't sell it for anything near the amount that a stock bike would bring.
IF they blame that inability to sell their bike on the "Purists" who just don't understand the value of what they've done, then it's the modified-bike guy who's screwed up, not the "Purist".
On the other hand, nobody likes an obnoxious anorak rivet-counter who makes a point to make a bunch of unsolicited comments about someone's custom bike. If the owner's not asking money for it, or hasn't posted it on a board like this saying "Hey, look at this neat bike", nobody has any call to tell him what's "wrong" with it ....
Lannis
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The first 3 or 4 years of the gold wing (naked) has really gone up in the last 5 years. From what I have seen they have about tripled in value in that time. Probably will go way up from where we are too.
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Sold my VERY hard used but good shape Laverda 750 SFC for around 2 grand in the early eighties (1981 ?), memory starting to go! Hell, GOOGLE the model and prepare to gag!! They didn't even sell for much when new, if they could even be sold, usually as leftovers!
Peter
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Sold my VERY hard used but good shape Laverda 750 SFC for around 2 grand in the early eighties (1981 ?), memory starting to go! Hell, GOOGLE the model and prepare to gag!! They didn't even sell for much when new, if they could even be sold, usually as leftovers!
Peter
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My friend in Lawrence has a Laverda and he bought it right but thought he paid way to much for it... quite a few years ago.
He and I both think they are really getting a premium for the now. I think they might still have some room for higher prices in the next 5 years.
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My riding plans have me and Fay riding it about 5,000 miles a year to various events, so if I keep it in shape, it should hold its value at least ....
I've added a few bolt-ons to make long trips easier to live with (windshield, AirHawks, luggage rack) and I've got an old set of Craven panniers to fix up and use on it ...
Lannis
Looks nice! I'm envious that you can get your other half to ride on it with you. My wife will only ride maybe once or twice a year, for an hour or less at a time. I even bought a nice king/queen seat a few years ago so she'd be more comfortable on the back, but that didn't change her mind. I got the seat from the son of a retired Norton dealer in England; it had been sitting on a shelf for years. Apparently not a "factory correct" option, but whatever company made it did a good job of making it appear to be a factory option item. I kept it on the bike for a year or so, but eventually switched back to the stock seat so I could slide my own butt around more since I wasn't going to have a passenger anyway.
5,000 miles a year, huh. Hmmmm, I know a guy who might have a comfortable king/queen seat that might make your better half's butt happy.... :grin:
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It has mostly to do with rarity. GS Suzukis don't bring money because there are so many out there, as they were great stuff (save for the crap wiring). Big Kaws bring way more because even tho they were pretty much the same thing, they were not as long lived and most are junk. I can't remember the last time I saw an early Ninja on the street. I bought a V65C Moto Guzzi new for 2400, they still get that in great condition, they only imported a few hundred. Supply and demand is most of it, tho some bikes are more desirable because of nostalgic fervor, like the big Kaw triple or the Honda CBX. I would not be afraid to take my GS850 to California, and I could replace it in a week for maybe 1200 or less. How many 1981 bikes would you get on and try that, realistically? I would ride my 1984 Guzzi Cal II the same, but not an earlier Guzzi with chromed bores. Guess which one is worth the most by far? Most Cal II's ever made are still at it, and are daily rider stuff.
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Nothing at all wrong with doing whatever you want to a bike to make it "yours".
However, many of the folks who modify bikes get really pissed when they find out that the big money that they've put into their bikes to "modify" it to their taste actually DROPS the value of a bike relative to a "stock" one, and that they can't sell it for anything near the amount that a stock bike would bring.
IF they blame that inability to sell their bike on the "Purists" who just don't understand the value of what they've done, then it's the modified-bike guy who's screwed up, not the "Purist".
On the other hand, nobody likes an obnoxious anorak rivet-counter who makes a point to make a bunch of unsolicited comments about someone's custom bike. If the owner's not asking money for it, or hasn't posted it on a board like this saying "Hey, look at this neat bike", nobody has any call to tell him what's "wrong" with it ....
Lannis
Absolutely agree with you regarding those that think their add ons must increase the value of the bike , from what I have seen most bikes are more valued when sold back in stock trim-Harleys might be an exception to the rule however. Have been to many potential purchases where the seller thinks the anodised footpegs and such like are the main selling points and must command a premium price-I just politely ask if they can change them back with the originals . My comment regarding "Purists" is that they seem to be a certain type who want to project an aura of superiority-loved the remark about a frame having a chalk mark still on it-priceless !
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Looks nice! I'm envious that you can get your other half to ride on it with you. My wife will only ride maybe once or twice a year, for an hour or less at a time. I even bought a nice king/queen seat a few years ago so she'd be more comfortable on the back, but that didn't change her mind. I got the seat from the son of a retired Norton dealer in England; it had been sitting on a shelf for years. Apparently not a "factory correct" option, but whatever company made it did a good job of making it appear to be a factory option item. I kept it on the bike for a year or so, but eventually switched back to the stock seat so I could slide my own butt around more since I wasn't going to have a passenger anyway.
5,000 miles a year, huh. Hmmmm, I know a guy who might have a comfortable king/queen seat that might make your better half's butt happy.... :grin:
We did a 1200-mile weekend this past spring (Friday - Sunday) and the stock seat with the Airhawk did well for us - it's pretty wide and supportive, not perfect, but fine for the riding we do - I don't want to go the full Russell Day-Long route for this bike ....
Yep, Fay's a great rider. I've hinted gently that I would be fully behind any effort to re-establish her MC license (last active in 1979) but she insists not ....
Lannis
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I bought a red Ducati Sport Classic new (the most desirable monoposto version). There were several available, including a Paul Smart version, with no line or bidding war...
I sold it about a year before they started getting popular and going up in value. But I've had way more fun on the bikes I got afterwards. Sometimes if I mention it, someone will say "Bet you wish you still had that." Nope. If I still had it I would sell it immediately for WAY more than it's worth. BTW - current market value is WAY more than it's worth (as a motorcycle).
I look at prices of used Harleys (in general) and I just don't get it. Perhaps because the bikes themselves don't speak to me - but when you compare to equally (or more) capable Japanese cruisers, I just don't understand the premium for used Harleys.
PS - this is fun contrast to the "bang for buck" thread. Good idea.
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I look at prices of used Harleys (in general) and I just don't get it. Perhaps because the bikes themselves don't speak to me - but when you compare to equally (or more) capable Japanese cruisers, I just don't understand the premium for used Harleys.
PS - this is fun contrast to the "bang for buck" thread. Good idea.
The upside is that the premium pays off when you come to sell..
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My old '78 CX500 cost me a few hundred bucks back in '91.
A couple of years later I picked up a second one for parts for under a hundred from a service centre .
Got to know that thing inside & out during those recession/poverty years.
Thought I might scrounge around and get one as a cheap project............ :huh:!
I KNOW there not worth the asking prices.
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I have always wanted a GB500 Honda thumper clubman replica. They did not sell very well when new (I should have bought a leftover model when dealers where giving them away! DOH!).
I see the are higher than a cats back now!
Pretty common to see them for over $5,000!
I used to know Harleys pretty well back in the day 1980's but really lost interest in them when every poser in the world has to have one but they seem to bring an awful lot used now ?!?!?!
Bought a GB400 brand new. $2600 new from memory. Had to sell it with 28,000kms on the clock. Seen them now wanting over 6 grand (NZ) now. Loved the bike, and the 400 motor was less prone to top end failure than the 500.
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I look at prices of used Harleys (in general) and I just don't get it. Perhaps because the bikes themselves don't speak to me - but when you compare to equally (or more) capable Japanese cruisers, I just don't understand the premium for used Harleys.
I have to wonder how much of it is because the name "Harley-Davidson" sounds cool. Would they command a premium if the guys happened to have the names Snodgrass and Pinkney? "I just bought a Snodgrass-Pinkney "Road King".
What do you think?
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I have to wonder how much of it is because the name "Harley-Davidson" sounds cool. Would they command a premium if the guys happened to have the names Snodgrass and Pinkney? "I just bought a Snodgrass-Pinkney "Road King".
What do you think?
Or , as it really should have been , Davidson Harley . Of course , the first time seeing the name Kawasaki as a boy of about 10 , my adolescent brain read KawaLski , as in a Polish motorbike . Ahh , what could have been . Or , as my really cute GF in HS that had an ever so slight speech problem , KaMasaki :grin: Good grief she was SO cute :laugh:
Dusty
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I have to wonder how much of it is because the name "Harley-Davidson" sounds cool. Would they command a premium if the guys happened to have the names Snodgrass and Pinkney? "I just bought a Snodgrass-Pinkney "Road King".
What do you think?
The local chain of nursing homes is called "Runk and Pratt" and they don't have a problem.
Neither does the local funeral home "Bruce and Stiff".
Or the local engineering firm "Hurt and Proffit". I'm not making these up ....
"Harley Davidson" might have sounded stupid if they weren't a 112 year old American Icon. And "Wanker and Grindeylow" might have sounded cool if they were the original company ....
Lannis
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The first 3 or 4 years of the gold wing (naked) has really gone up in the last 5 years. From what I have seen they have about tripled in value in that time. Probably will go way up from where we are too.
Really? A friend has a cosmetically excellent yellow '76 that needs a water pump and carbs cleaned. He can't get any interest, even at $1500.
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"Harley Davidson" might have sounded stupid if they weren't a 112 year old American Icon. And "Wanker and Grindeylow" might have sounded cool if they were the original company ....
I understand your point, but I don't think it holds for tough-guy wannabees. Indian, Henderson... maybe it could be argued that they sound cool enough. Armstrong-Wolf probably.
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so is the GB500 a better collectable than an SR500?
I always thought that Yamaha nailed in so far as looking like a Manx.
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so is the GB500 a better collectable than an SR500?
I always thought that Yamaha nailed in so far as looking like a Manx.
The Honda was a bit more performance oriented .
Dusty
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Really? A friend has a cosmetically excellent yellow '76 that needs a water pump and carbs cleaned. He can't get any interest, even at $1500.
Even 1st generation Goldwings in very nice shape don't attract big $$, They are great bikes, reliable, parts are readily available but the collector market has just passed them by. A good friend has his original 76, a 77m 78... and so on, nice bikes but highly collectable, not.
On the other hand from the same vintage a 76 Yamaha XT500 (one year with the unique exhaust), a RD350, a RD350LC, and even the YR5 are getting silly money. But the real big bucks seem to be in the Kawasaki camp with the early triples and the original Z1 models at the summit.
One would think the Honda CBX would be worth more than the Kawasaki but the 6 cylinder technical marvel from Honda is on where close to the value of a nice Z1.
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Really? A friend has a cosmetically excellent yellow '76 that needs a water pump and carbs cleaned. He can't get any interest, even at $1500.
Charlie - I'd be interested if it was a little cosmetically challenged & the carbs & water pump were "excellent." Seems to me that one of the few criticisms of the early Goldwings was that the carbs were a bear to access & work on. I know nothing about how hard the water pump is to get at. I do know that parts availability for Goldwings in 1984 was horrendous, even for a new bike! I can't imagine that it would be better 31 years later. I could get parts for my 9 y.o. (at that time) Norton (company had been out of business for essentially 9 years at that time) more easily & quickly than I could get them for my 6 mo. old Golddwing.
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I have a 77 Wing that was GIVEN to me a few weeks ago. While it was a rat bike, it's taking shape pretty well for no real money yet. Rear brake pads are the only item I've spent gold on, and vinegar to clean out the tank. Everything else has come out of the garage so far. It runs great. I'll get a picture up. I think it would have to be clean and fairly original to carry any value. If the 1st 3-4 years are climbing in value, it's because guys like me can actually work on them and not break the bank doing it. It didn't take Honda but a few years to make them complicated and very expensive to repair. Price an electric fuel pump sometime.
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I understand your point, but I don't think it holds for tough-guy wannabees. Indian, Henderson... maybe it could be argued that they sound cool enough. Armstrong-Wolf probably.
But it's not the combination of letters that makes something sound "cool" or "silly", it's the associations to which those words apply.
Look at what's happened to the words over the years that we've used to refer to those with mental or developmental disabilities.
People have always tried to come up with, and use, objective, non-perjorative words to use in that context.
We started with "Idiot" and "Cretin" for certain levels of disability. But then people started using them as insults and ...
... we went with "Feeble-Minded". That was supposed to be gentle and descriptive, until stupid people started using THAT as an insult and a perjorative. (What is today Central Virginia Training School used to be "Colony for the Feeble-Minded").
... so we went with "Retarded". Again, started as an objective, caring, descriptive term until people started calling other people "Tards" and "REE-tards" and that made it ugly.
... and now we're into "Special", and you watch, that one's going to go the same way.
So it's the use that makes the word "good" or "bad", not the other way around. I'm telling you that if the two fellows who developed the American motorcycle had been named "Pugsley" and "Hufflewump", people would proudly be wearing the "Pugsley and Hufflewump" logo today, and nobody would think it was the least bit silly; quite the opposite, in fact ......
Lannis
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Charlie - I'd be interested if it was a little cosmetically challenged & the carbs & water pump were "excellent." Seems to me that one of the few criticisms of the early Goldwings was that the carbs were a bear to access & work on. I know nothing about how hard the water pump is to get at. I do know that parts availability for Goldwings in 1984 was horrendous, even for a new bike! I can't imagine that it would be better 31 years later. I could get parts for my 9 y.o. (at that time) Norton (company had been out of business for essentially 9 years at that time) more easily & quickly than I could get them for my 6 mo. old Golddwing.
Friend of mine who's not into motorcycles but wants to be, called me the other night and said he had a line on a '76 GL1000 that looked to be in good condition, everything there and stock, with Windjammer and Bates gear, but "needs the carbs cleaned" to run, for $400.
He doesn't know anything about bikes and doesn't work on them himself, so I warned him off of it, but I'm sure there are deals like that everywhere these days .... Although depending on what's wrong, "Free" might be too expensive ....
Lannis
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I'm telling you that if the two fellows who developed the American motorcycle had been named "Pugsley" and "Hufflewump", people would proudly be wearing the "Pugsley and Hufflewump" logo today, and nobody would think it was the least bit silly; quite the opposite, in fact ......
I'll go as far as Pugsley-Wolf. :laugh:
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I'll go as far as Pugsley-Wolf. :laugh:
Allis-Chalmers ? Or what if Louis Chevrolet had not been a famous race car driver , would we have bought the Durant ?
Dusty
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Here is my free Wing, a 77. It doesn't look like much but it's straight and mechanically sorted pretty well. Sounds very good, no carb work, no leaks anywhere. That's a Guzzi rear fender & headlight, a Virago tail light, aftermarket mufflers stuck on there from a Guzzi project we didn't use. If it hadn't been a good runner with only cosmetic issues, I would not have bothered. It will be decent for the spring, and my son has already laid claim to it. He thinks they're cool.
(http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL683/2961393/5987839/411747851.jpg)
(http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL683/2961393/5987839/411747850.jpg)
Here's a shot stripped down straight from the car wash
(http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL683/2961393/5987839/411607825.jpg)
And it wasn't worth anything to the PO, who was afraid of a money pit. I don't think much collectible.
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Allis-Chalmers ?
That's a cool sounding name for sure. Cool like Massey-Ferguson and Bucyrus-Erie. Not Cockshutt.
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That's a cool sounding name for sure. Cool like Massey-Ferguson and Bucyrus-Erie. Not Cockshutt.
Could be why Cockshutt tractors were marketed in the states as CO-OP :laugh:
See the USA in your .... Durant :huh: If I was going to start a MC company it would be called ...
The Acme Peerless
Dusty
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Allis-Chalmers ? Or what if Louis Chevrolet had not been a famous race car driver , would we have bought the Durant ?
Dusty
We sure bought a lot of "Buicks", which sounds like someone vomiting. And "Locomobiles" back in the day.
And the Subaru Justy. What was up with that? Or the Honda "Benly"? Do the Japanese not know that these names mean nothing in English?
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If I was going to start a MC company it would be called ...
The Acme Peerless
Dusty
Too late! Since about 1955, the only thing that people would associate that with would be Wile E. Coyote waving goodbye to the camera as he went over the cliff ....
Lannis
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Too late! Since about 1955, the only thing that people would associate that with would be Wile E. Coyote waving goodbye to the camera as he went over the cliff ....
Lannis
Yeah , but think of the name recognition :laugh: Seriously , doubt if anyone much under 45 would associate Acme with
Wile E .
Dusty
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There are a ton of bikes out there that go for way too much money for what they are .
One that was mentioned was the Ducati Sport Classics .. I remember when dealers couldn't sell them for cost .. Now they want as much for one as a new Duc.
CB750s are another . Great bikes . There were plenty of them at one time but then they got popular with the hipsters . I used to own a caffed one and sold it for chump change . Lester mags , Full system, race carbs , etc. If I held onto it I probably could of gotten 6-7k for it .
I'll get flogged for saying this but a first generation 850 Lemans. It's my dream bike too. But are they really worth 15-20k$?
Triumph T120 and T140s were fetching big money for a while but have stabilized . Lots of the European stuff fetches too much money but people pay it .
New Bonnevilles go for too much too. I remember when I wrecked my 2006 with 30k on the clock.. I got what I paid for it . I thought that was absurd but I certainly didn't complain when I got the check...
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Yeah , but think of the name recognition :laugh: Seriously , doubt if anyone much under 45 would associate Acme with
Wile E .
Dusty
Under 45? Just young punks, they don't count ..... :thewife:
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" I'll get flogged for saying this but a first generation 850 Lemans. It's my dream bike too. But are they really worth 15-20k$? "
You won't get flogged by me, but I've never seen one personally sell anywhere near that. Are people really asking that?
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I don't think anyone has mentioned Cushman , or the 1969 sandcast CB750 Honda . The Honda will bring stupid money , and who in their right mind would want a Cushman :evil: Several years ago we witnessed a supposedly factory built Whizzer sell for something like $6K at a Mid America auctionin Dallas .
Dusty
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Those old Cushmans show up at antique steam engine shows and such, but I never see one getting ridden. Parts are stupidly high. My nephew has one.
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" I'll get flogged for saying this but a first generation 850 Lemans. It's my dream bike too. But are they really worth 15-20k$? "
You won't get flogged by me, but I've never seen one personally sell anywhere near that. Are people really asking that?
Yes . Are they getting that? I don't know. I just saw a 850T dressed like a LeMans going to 10k. MarkIV LeMans' in good shape will get more . Maybe it's just my area. I'm in SoCal....
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Do the Japanese not know that these names mean nothing in English?
I'm sure they do. They often name things based on how pleasant the name sounds to them, rather then what meaning it has. When I was in Japan, I saw a sports drink called "Pocari Sweat", a disco called "Finger Pop 101", and three cigarette brands called Caster, Cabin, and Mild Seven.
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" I'll get flogged for saying this but a first generation 850 Lemans. It's my dream bike too. But are they really worth 15-20k$? "
You won't get flogged by me, but I've never seen one personally sell anywhere near that. Are people really asking that?
The was one in the MGNOC Classifieds a while back, belonged to the widow of a friend. It sold for $15k and needed work.
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(http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g192/Toystoretom/20140510_131153.jpg)
"What makes that so expensive?"
"The price....."
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Really? A friend has a cosmetically excellent yellow '76 that needs a water pump and carbs cleaned. He can't get any interest, even at $1500.
I passed on a 76 naked wing in 2010 for $600.00 needed tires and service and carbs needed work but it ran. The guy who bought it put tires on it fix carbs from a randakk kit rode it 30 k miles and sold it this summer for $2,000. They are still cheap I think....but have up side still.
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Old bikes going for a lot of money is one thing but...
I lost all interest in owning another 60's ~ 70's muscle car when I watched a 1969 Mustang Mach I sells for over $100K at Barrett Jackson a couple years back in Scottsdale, followed by silly money for Chrysler and Chev products getting that and more.
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I've actually drank Pocari Sweat. It also had a strange TV commercial involving a young man pushing the can into the ground.
It tasted pretty bad. But Calpis was quite tasty.
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My third motorcycle was a brand new cb400F 4 cyl honda.....man what a sweet motor! I do not quite remember what it cost new but looked at several a couple of years ago to scratch that nostalgia itch and was pushed back by what they were getting for them and low and behold they have gone up by about 30% 40% just in the last couple of years since then....
A nice one is north of $5,000 $6,000 now.
You can still find a nice one for $3,000-4,000 if you watch closely, and are willing to travel to get it.
I got a nice one for $2,500 in Sept. 2012, when they were typically fetching $4,000.
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OK, here is my list:
Vintage bikes:
Any Ducati bevel-twin except for the fugly 860GT bring stupid money. Nice condition, original 750SS or 900SS bevels are in the $25-50k range. 750GT are in the $15-$25k range (sometimes higher), and the 750 Sport somewhere in between
Ducati bevel singles, esp. Diana/Mark 3, and Desmos are also bringing stupid money, easily 2-3X what the went for only 4-5 years ago. Heck, beater scramblers bring several thousand on ebay (unless those are all shill-bid auctions).
CB750 Sandcast, and to a lesser extent CB750 1969 though about 1975 all bring pretty good money if in nice shape.
Not-so-vintage bikes (yes, some of these were already mentioned), many bringing the same or more money than when they were new:
Ducati Sport Classics
Kawasaki W650
Honda GB500
Honda CB-1
Kawasaki Eddie Lawson Replica KZ1000R
Just about any two stroke sport bike:
Yamaha RZ350
Yamaha RZ500
Suzuki RG500
Honda NS400R, NSR250
Aprilia RS250
Airhead GS's
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....I look at prices of used Harleys (in general) and I just don't get it. Perhaps because the bikes themselves don't speak to me - but when you compare to equally (or more) capable Japanese cruisers, I just don't understand the premium for used Harleys.
The prices you see for used Harleys generally represents magical thinking on the part of the owner. Many have drank the Harley Kool-Aid and think their bike will never drop in value. Those days are long gone. How do I know? I've sold a used Harley. There are bikes that are achieving cult status (XR1200 for example - but typically bought by enthusiast and not rank and file Harley people). Part of the problem is Harley dealers will run year end specials on new bikes priced below the used ones on their lots so they can get the manufacturer incentive to move new bikes.
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Those old Cushmans show up at antique steam engine shows and such, but I never see one getting ridden. Parts are stupidly high. My nephew has one.
I have two friends that rode there stock Cushmans to Sturgis and back (with gear) from Mpls a couple of years ago. So they can do it. They both say they wont do it again though.
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My short list, based on personal interest:
BMWS:
- R90/S - good ones are getting crazy expensive
- R75/5 - Toaster Tanks, any year - have gone up substantially in the last 3 years
Hondas
- Any unmolested CB 4 cylinder 1969-1977, especially CB400fs
- CBX
Yamahas
- Unmolested XS650s through 1977. Still a deal but a lot more expensive than they were 3 years ago
- Any good 2 stroke street bike
Moto Guzzis
- Good Eldorados - may still be a bargain but not cheap like they were 3-5 years ago.
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My short list, based on personal interest:
BMWS:
- R90/S - good ones are getting crazy expensive
- R75/5 - Toaster Tanks, any year - have gone up substantially in the last 3 years
You might as well add any /2 airhead to that list. Like the Toasters, they've gone up substantially in recent years.
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Harley XR1200, XR1200X.
Oh, and a prediction, in 5-10 years, the 2013-2014 Honda CB1100.
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Honda mini bikes:
CT-70 aka "Trail 70", esp. the CT-70H with it's 4 speed transmission with manual clutch (standard model had a 3 speed w/o automatic clutch)
Z-50, aka "Mini Trail"
The earliest years of both command a premium. Like new restorations and originals fetch $4-5k. They are popular among people who grew up in the 70's riding one, or wishing they had one.
They are quite possibly the smallest street legal (yes, they came with lights and turn signals, and could be titled and registered for the road).
(http://www.cyclechaos.com/images/5/52/Trail_70_Ad.jpg)
(http://www.tias.com/stores/adsbydee/origpics/14652a.jpg)
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I bought a red Ducati Sport Classic new (the most desirable monoposto version). There were several available, including a Paul Smart version, with no line or bidding war...
I sold it about a year before they started getting popular and going up in value. But I've had way more fun on the bikes I got afterwards. Sometimes if I mention it, someone will say "Bet you wish you still had that." Nope. If I still had it I would sell it immediately for WAY more than it's worth. BTW - current market value is WAY more than it's worth (as a motorcycle).
I recall that a local dealer recently sold a used Paul Smart for an enormous sum... to a guy in Russia. There is money and demand in all corners of the globe, hence the high prices.
And I wonder if anyone actually pays those high prices for used Harleys on Craigslist, or if they are simply asking a lot.
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The prices you see for used Harleys generally represents magical thinking on the part of the owner. Many have drank the Harley Kool-Aid and think their bike will never drop in value. Those days are long gone. How do I know? I've sold a used Harley. There are bikes that are achieving cult status (XR1200 for example - but typically bought by enthusiast and not rank and file Harley people). Part of the problem is Harley dealers will run year end specials on new bikes priced below the used ones on their lots so they can get the manufacturer incentive to move new bikes.
It's true. I just sold a 2003 Dyna on CL. KBB retail $7440 KBB trade in $5430
I finally got interest in it at $4500 and sold it for $4300. I was happy to be done with it.
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I recall that a local dealer recently sold a used Paul Smart for an enormous sum... to a guy in Russia. There is money and demand in all corners of the globe, hence the high prices.
And I wonder if anyone actually pays those high prices for used Harleys on Craigslist, or if they are simply asking a lot.
Nephew the Harley salesman tells me that a lot of "pre-owned" HDs (that term still cracks me up) get traded in on new HDs . The dealer only pays trade in value on nice ones , usually about 60% of what individuals are asking for them . Seems to me , if used Harleys could be sold for the prices they are advertised for , most would be sold instead of traded in .
It's true. I just sold a 2003 Dyna on CL. KBB retail $7440 KBB trade in $5430
I finally got interest in it at $4500 and sold it for $4300. I was happy to be done with it.
So about 60% ?
Dusty
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I think 35 years out is when a bike or car starts appreciating.
If you're 15 to 20 years old, you lust for the unobtainable hot wheels. Around age 50 you have both the time and money to treat yourself to a long-delayed graduation present.
I'd guess my 1970 Triumph bottomed out in value around 1980-90. For investment purposes, it might make sense to buy a stock hi-performance machine 10 to 15 years old, keep it in good shape and plan to sell it 15 or 20 years later. This works only if you have a lot of free storage space.
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Seth , folks in the biz refer to the 17 year cycle . A bike or car we wanted at 17 ...
Dusty
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I think 35 years out is when a bike or car starts appreciating.
If you're 15 to 20 years old, you lust for the unobtainable hot wheels. Around age 50 you have both the time and money to treat yourself to a long-delayed graduation present.
I'd guess my 1970 Triumph bottomed out in value around 1980-90. For investment purposes, it might make sense to buy a stock hi-performance machine 10 to 15 years old, keep it in good shape and plan to sell it 15 or 20 years later. This works only if you have a lot of free storage space.
1981, I wanted a 650 Triumph with a Joe Hunt magneto. Went to the (former) Triumph dealer, who was now working out of a small shed with a couple semi-trailer bodies out back for storage. Guy told me "I'll make up you a good-running, complete late-60's Bonneville. Won't be matching numbers but engine will have a title. $400. How many you want?"
Just bought one, and it was exactly what he said. Rode it for a year or two, sold the magneto to a drag racer, parted out the bike, and bought a new Electra-Glide .....
Lannis
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Nephew the Harley salesman tells me that a lot of "pre-owned" HDs (that term still cracks me up) get traded in on new HDs . The dealer only pays trade in value on nice ones , usually about 60% of what individuals are asking for them . Seems to me , if used Harleys could be sold for the prices they are advertised for , most would be sold instead of traded in .
So about 60% ?
Dusty
Yep, right on. Mine did have 64k on the clock.