Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: flip on December 05, 2015, 01:20:43 AM
-
For you Guzzi owners that might not care for the more traditional look of the new Guzzi's, what do you do when it's time for another bike? Let's say you like the looks of the Lemans, Sport series, Grisos or even the Breva based bikes, do you give up on getting a new bike and buy one of those or do you move on from Moto Guzzi and switch to another brand? If you're a sport or sport-touring kind of guy, it doesn't look like Moto Guzzi will have any new bikes for you.
I'm looking at my first retirement in a couple of years. I had thought that a new bike would not be out of the question then but it doesn't look like Moto Guzzi will be making anything then that I would want.
This is not meant as an insult to you guys that love the V7's, new V9's or 1400's. I'm actually happy for you. They just don't do it for me and I'm guessing a few more oddballs among this eccentric collection of fine folks. :grin:
-
The cool thing about a Guzzi is if you hate the new Guzzis you can always get an older Guzzi.. :thumb:
-
In the past, I'd say switch to BMW, but they are getting way too technical for me. I have considered joining the MOA again and maybe getting a nice used R or K bike @10 years old or so, though. Another route might be Triumph. I like a lot of their offerings. As much as I am a Euro junkie, Honda is always at the back of my mind. Their quality and reasonable prices do have me interested. Good luck.
-
THE *LOOK* ISN'T 'TRADITIONAL', IT IS OBSOLETE AND ANTIQUATED! IT PANDERS TO IDIOTS AND FOOLS WHO ONLY REFFERENCE THEIR LIVES BY THE MISTAKES AND FAILURES OF THEIR PARENT'S GENERATIONS!
The world and technology move on. It saddens me that so many people are so resentful of that they have turned the second oldest motorcycle company in the world into a shallow joke.
Pete
-
I know that this kind of avoids the discussion about the direction GUZZI are headed, but hey, another perspective here.
I see where you are coming from, but for me, also coming up to retirement, I prefer to look backwards rather than at new models.
That's simply because a) there are some great iconic bikes from my early years that I can't wait to get hold of, I don't quite get the 'must have the latest' mindset where it gets superseded almost immediately b) they cost about the same as new bike money, c) they won't go down in price unless you trash them, and d) I love taking care of them, especially as I'll have more time.
As long as I have a good reliable daily rider, I'm not too interested in a brand new model...I've never liked paying the tax on a new bike, I've always tended to pre registered or under a year old.
At the moment I have a T3 and a LM2 complimenting my 2010 BMW. I'm a happy bunny right now.
Good luck with your search for that ideal machine
-
THE *LOOK* ISN'T 'TRADITIONAL', IT IS OBSOLETE AND ANTIQUATED! IT PANDERS TO IDIOTS AND FOOLS WHO ONLY REFFERENCE THEIR LIVES BY THE MISTAKES AND FAILURES OF THEIR PARENT'S GENERATIONS!
Pete, you know I love ya. So you'll understand when ii say
F YOU TOO
-
Scratch up enough $$ for a Magni other than that just a case of finding a bike thats not a sewing machine and has a local shop that actually knows their product thats the hard bit. There are some awesome motors out there the 11 degree tettastrada motor is a brilliant road bike motor by all accounts and the latest installment of the KTM superduke is interesting. Although it might be time to take serious some of the electric bikes arriving on the market.
-
I'm on board with all the new electronics, tires etc. but not transformers styling cues.
-
THE *LOOK* ISN'T 'TRADITIONAL', IT IS OBSOLETE AND ANTIQUATED! IT PANDERS TO IDIOTS AND FOOLS WHO ONLY REFFERENCE THEIR LIVES BY THE MISTAKES AND FAILURES OF THEIR PARENT'S GENERATIONS!
The world and technology move on. It saddens me that so many people are so resentful of that they have turned the second oldest motorcycle company in the world into a shallow joke.
Pete
Yea, that's it Pete. It's the "LOOKS" that are keeping Guzzi down, not the fact that you are neck deep in self destructing 1200 8V motors. Not to mention you're one of only a few dealers on the planet that can fix 'em. It MUST be the looks.
-
Yea, that's it Pete. It's the "LOOKS" that are keeping Guzzi down, not the fact that you are neck deep in self destructing 1200 8V motors. Not to mention you're one of only a few dealers on the planet that can fix 'em. It MUST be the looks.
I think the only one keeping Guzzi down is Piaggio at least in the U.S. as their dealer network for Vespa and Aprilia is just as bad. But I don't have a problem keeping it as the traditional brand of the group. They can use Aprilia brand for the latest and greatest.
It all comes down to investing in their dealers which obviously they don't seem to value.
-
Besides the fact that I don't like the looks of many new bikes, they just don't work as well for my intended purpose.
I doubt many of the transformer designers think their bikes are beautiful.
I like Guzzis-older ones, mostly-because they aren't hard to keep up so an older bike is a viable alternative-at least they have been.
-
Before I make another stupid comment, a couple of questions. How many Dealers of other non Continental brands also carry Guzzi? How many Guzzi Dealers stand alone in brand offerings. It has been my experience that the bikes from HD and Asia get the lion's share of exposure either in print or press for good or bad. How many Son's of Anarchy Wannabes buy Italian? I do not see Angels on Beemers. Thankfully, the lower and stretch a$$hats go for the Asian brands. (There is one bozo riding a l&s s1000. An abomination) Until we change their hearts and minds... Good luck with that.
-
After I get into my new house next year, I will start looking for my bikes. A loop frame type, a Tonti cafe, and my touring mile eater. The mile eater will probably will be a Harley ElectraGlide. The Guzzi 1400 fuel tanks are too small to be considered. The Norge is not as comfortable for my wife as the Harley is. Dealer support and parts supply are why I am liking the Harley.
-
Pete, I really wish you'd stop holding back and let us know how you really feel. Otherwise, all of that bile is going to build up and turn you the color of your Griso, think Aussie Incredible Hulk... :tongue:
If you would be so kind, could you please enlighten this admittedly foolish idiot on what new bikes--by any marque--are keeping up with technology's forward march and don't look like plastic insects?
-
After many years of Guzzis I now ride a Triumph Scrambler. Not a great bike, but it fits me just right (bad back) and it's a great 60 mph back road machine, which is the majority of my riding. It's also an enjoyable platform for a vast array of aftermarket trinkets, it's enjoyable to me to "make it my own". The new Triumph Classics look great, and Triumph already has a nice diversity with bikes like the Daytona and the Tiger, all seemingly great bikes per everything I can see and read (only rode a Tiger briefly).
I get what Pete is saying, but to my thinking it's "give your base what it wants"... and clearly given the V7 success, retro is a big part of that. And that gets to my "what should Guzzi do".... and I think the successful path is the one Triumph took. Perfect the retro cool V7 and maybe offer a 900 version, develop a beautiful, modern hi-tech sport bike (like a Daytona or Ducati) that compete with others in the minds of YOUNG riders, and perfect the "adventure" platform that they already have, so continue to refine and perfect the Stelvio. From a styling perspective, the Stelvio is tops in it's class in my mind. And to that end, maybe Guzzi needs to consider another engine configuration for some of these bikes.... it didn't kill BMW to offer 4 cylinder bikes.
I hope to own another Guzzi or two someday, I hope the mother ship can get their act together as an organization. To my thinking that means from a business and engineering perspective as well as a marketing/styling perspective.
-
Guzzi, a niche brand that as much as we complain about Piaggio would be dead by now if they were independent. The only analogy I can think of is in the bicycle world. It use to be cyclists longed for a Cinelli, Masi, Colnago, De Rosa, all beautifully hand crafted Italian lugged steel frames. Down tube Campy Super Record 6 speed, you can see where I'm heading. Now the above brands that still are in business make 99% of their frames out of Carbon in Taiwan or China, 11 Speed Shimano, tubeless carbon wheels, and now disc brakes. The world moves on. Yes some retro guys will show up on their steel studs, but not many. We are lucky to have the brand left at all producing bikes in that quaint Alpine lakeside factory. I'm puzzled by their line up, but heck glad they are still in business. I would guess most Yanks looking for a cruiser alternative are going to think Indian, not Goose!
-
I understand fully what Pete is getting at. I am conflicted to a point on technology and grateful for the simplicity and robust nature of my Norge. That said advancements and features are very slow in coming. For one thing I want cruise control and some of the features found on the Caponard. Not too much to ask.
As far as the FU PETE dialog. Come on now! Get a grip. Is any of this personal?
-
The cool thing about a Guzzi is if you hate the new Guzzis you can always get an older Guzzi.. :thumb:
...or two... or three... for less than the cost of a new one.
I've only bought two motorcycles new - a 1986 Yamaha Radian and a 2006 Ducati Sport 1000. For me, it's rare that a new motorcycle is different enough to catch my interest.
With all the great deals on older, reliable bikes, I just have a hard time paying so much money for a new motorcycle. And I don't finance or pay comprehensive insurance on vehicles. I was thinking about putting some hard bags on one of my V11s, but ended up buying a 1992 BMW K75s with better bags for about the cost of putting bags on a V11.
That being said, I cannot stop looking at the new Honda Africa Twin, but I am still comparing/contrasting to the Stelvio.
I think the answer to the core question of this thread is that you don't need to fall in love with a brand - you can fall in love with some specific models. If you have the opportunity to own more than one motorcycle, you can appreciate all the things that each bike does better than the others.
-
THE *LOOK* ISN'T 'TRADITIONAL', IT IS OBSOLETE AND ANTIQUATED! IT PANDERS TO IDIOTS AND FOOLS WHO ONLY REFFERENCE THEIR LIVES BY THE MISTAKES AND FAILURES OF THEIR PARENT'S GENERATIONS!
The world and technology move on. It saddens me that so many people are so resentful of that they have turned the second oldest motorcycle company in the world into a shallow joke.
Pete
Can you clarify that a bit more? 😀
-
All the modern gadgetesque bikes are great in my book as long as there is factory support for the dealers when a problem shows up. Problem seems to be a lacking in that department with the newer guzzis(Piaggio) and the buyer is just left hanging with his mad money tied up in a piece of inanimate crap. Well Screw that, my next modernish bike might just turn out to be a boring semi well supported bike like a V-strom.
-
Personally, I love the look of the V7 II, the California 1400 Touring, the Eldorado, and the Norge. Even the V9 is growing on me. They all have style, shaft drive, adequate power, and ABS. All but the Norge even have traction control. Some even have ride modes.
With my Norge, at least, I do not wish for more power. If I had a V7 II or V9, I might wish for more power.
I placed a deposit on the new Triumph Thurston R when they were first announced, but I began having second thoughts when I saw the new V9. Of course, I have gone neither direction and instead have bought another Norge! (I wonder if I can get my deposit back? :wink:)
-
Moto Guzzi
Est 1921
Going out of business since 1922
You guys are killing me :laugh:
Dusty
-
The glaring open slot in the Guzzi lineup is a sporty bike. The Griso is a little too much of an acquired taste for some people. I think the next bike from the factory will be a resurrection of the Le Mans name. It maybe nothing but a naked Norge, restyled Griso or possibly an all new platform that their "Skunkworks" have been working on for the last year. They have captured a whole new rider with the small block series and it would be a sin to lose them to another marque.
Or maybe this is just a pipe dream on my part and the next bike will be a reworked Nevada.
-
I do laugh at the idea that a bike has to look like a child's fantasy soldier to have modern technology. Most of these retro bikes have used advanced electronics to give the simple motorcycling experience that I like. Doesn't have to look like a modern outhouse.
-
Actually I like the styling from Guzzi. Especially when compared to the new origami and Dali inspired bikes from Europe and Japan. My big gripe, is the new riding position is going cruiser from what I know about the 1400 and what I've read for the V9.
Bring back the standard and sport pegs and boards.
I'd also like to see a performance 1400 LeMans.
Whatever they sell, make sure service is reasonable and available.
-
...a resurrection of the Le Mans name.
That is a serious brand-asset for Moto Guzzi. It would seem that Piaggio would recognize that. It could also be made consistent with a retro-theme, if that's where MG is headed.
I'd have to seriously consider a Diesel Stelvio if one were to become available.
-
Maybe I am dreaming, but I imagine V9 cafe racer (with better suspension) would not be too hard to do.
-
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic047/bikers%20dont%20cry_zpshcrouurg.jpg)
Just kidding. We are all tough guys here. sniff.
or ...
you could just ride something else!
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic047/crow-riding-1-phoo-chan_zpsvnaqnkug.jpg)
:wink:
-
The glaring open slot in the Guzzi lineup is a sporty bike. The Griso is a little too much of an acquired taste for some people. I think the next bike from the factory will be a resurrection of the Le Mans name. It maybe nothing but a naked Norge, restyled Griso or possibly an all new platform that their "Skunkworks" have been working on for the last year. They have captured a whole new rider with the small block series and it would be a sin to lose them to another marque.
Or maybe this is just a pipe dream on my part and the next bike will be a reworked Nevada.
Right my friend! You guys worry to much about the supposed change of direction at Guzzi. Guzzi has gone after what is hot, only makes sense. However, to assume that they will not come out with a new standard or semi sport is naive. They only have so many resources at one time, I highly suspect as R59 has alluded to that next years ECMIA show in Italy will have something to address the perceived hole in the line up. Don't toss out the baby with the bath water!
-
Here is my solution: build a new house with a 3 car garage and ten foot side and rear bump garage bump out that can hold probably five bikes with ease. I am going to keep the V7R as long as I can get Houston maintenance (thanks and waves to Mike at MPH). What to do? It is very unlikely I will ever buy another Moto Guzzi. What may happen is a third bike. I am eyeing the new Thruxton, or more like a mid-range light touring bike like the BMW F800GT (used).
I still love the look, performance and style of my V7R. It is a joy to ride. As I age (gracefully?) into my mid-sixties it could be the "sport bike for old men--as coined by Todd Haven" will continue to be my favorite machine. Riding geometry is key to me, comfort on butt, back and hands. Light weight is also key so forget big cruisers with masses of metal and feet forward. I sat on a Indian Scout: nope, no way.
The STRX Triumph triple is an amazing machine. It is supremely capable and flexible with the upright riding geometry. Add some side tail bags, a larger tank bag, and a front screen (readily found aftermarket) and the hot rod could be a reasonable light touring bike. Its only downfall is low gas mileage, although that is acceptable if I refrain from hooligan mode and keep RPM below 6000.
The Houston oil crash has resulted in mass quantities of quality used motorcycles at the dealers and from individuals. Next summer I may start looking around for a third bike.
-
Well boys and girls............. cant help but add my T/C.
First thing is of all the machines I have owned and ridden over the years the simple machines to a degree are the ones I seem to enjoy the most.
Second thing.......... Not sure why anyone would be willing to sacrifice those wonderful cables attached to throttle bodies in exchange for ride by wire.... ride em back to back and get back to this forum. :popcorn:
Cruise........ Hmmm not sure what that's about. If they wanna take the spirit out of riding these machines just continue down the road that Ducati took years ago ( a sad numbing experience )......... Rumor has it there working on a self guided motorcycle so you don't necessarily need vision or even be there for that matter.there you go.
How's that for an opinion?
Ciao. :thumb:
-
Now that the 8v motors are properly sorted, I'd been wondering about trading in my beloved Breva 1100 for something newer. The Stelvio 8v seemed a possibility, but suddenly the only Stelvio advertised for UK is the NTX which is more than I could stretch to and has features I don't want. The Eldorado looks lovely, but it's too bulky for me, and too much money, especially for a bike that might need over a grand spent on new headers. That left the Griso which I've always had a soft spot for - but apparently that's about to be dropped. The V7s are just a bit too cramped and under-powered for me, the V9 Roamer also feels too cramped, and the V9 Bobber styling isn't my thing. If I could face having chain drive again, I might go for a V-Strom, and if I could face the absurd prices and reliability niggles a Harley Dyna might be in the frame. I even considered a Crosstourer, but there seem to be a worrying number of UJ failures by 40k miles. At present, the only new bike that draws me is the Indian Scout; it's too soon to know about reliability, but it seems like a thoroughly modern take on an old theme - it's styling somehow reminds me of the LE Velocette I first rode. In the meantime, every mile on the Breva brings a smile to my face.
-
THE *LOOK* ISN'T 'TRADITIONAL', IT IS OBSOLETE AND ANTIQUATED!
No, it's traditional.
Speaking of "look", obsolete and antiquated is something none, or very few, still use. But the "traditional" look is, on the contrary, very popular today.
Speaking of the "technology" that "move on", the functionality of a bike and the level of technology used isn't defined by the form of an headlight or of a tank.
-
THE *LOOK* ISN'T 'TRADITIONAL', IT IS OBSOLETE AND ANTIQUATED! IT PANDERS TO IDIOTS AND FOOLS WHO ONLY REFFERENCE THEIR LIVES BY THE MISTAKES AND FAILURES OF THEIR PARENT'S GENERATIONS!
The world and technology move on. It saddens me that so many people are so resentful of that they have turned the second oldest motorcycle company in the world into a shallow joke.
Pete
Pete, your surely have a way with words! :thumb:
-
Don't like the new ones? Just get 2 or 3 old ones for what you would pay for that new bike. The 1400 Cali? cost is about 8 Jackals
-
or ...
you could just ride something else!
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic047/crow-riding-1-phoo-chan_zpsvnaqnkug.jpg)
:wink:
Uh...that was pretty much the point of the original post. It was directed to those Guzzi owners that really aren't attracted to V-twin bikes with twin shocks and 40-45 horse power or to cruiser style bikes.
-
The glaring open slot in the Guzzi lineup is a sporty bike. The Griso is a little too much of an acquired taste for some people. I think the next bike from the factory will be a resurrection of the Le Mans name. It maybe nothing but a naked Norge, restyled Griso or possibly an all new platform that their "Skunkworks" have been working on for the last year. They have captured a whole new rider with the small block series and it would be a sin to lose them to another marque.
Or maybe this is just a pipe dream on my part and the next bike will be a reworked Nevada.
If Moto Guzzi drops the Griso and Norge, all they will have are gaps.
How do you gain market share even if your products aren't cutting edge?
Quality. Make the bikes reek with quality and people will buy them. Make a Moto Guzzi the most reliable bike out of the crate. Make it so when you buy a Moto Guzzi, everything fits the way it is supposed to fit. How hard can that be? Fix the wiring, it isn't that they don't have enough wire, they just don't know what to do with it.
Moto Guzzis are known for what? It is not reliability it is being quirky. Being quirky is the marketing strategy?
Make the bikes the best in the business, then business will get better. No more kludge fixes years later, do it right do it right all the time and people will buy them.
-
THE *LOOK* ISN'T 'TRADITIONAL', IT IS OBSOLETE AND ANTIQUATED! IT PANDERS TO IDIOTS AND FOOLS WHO ONLY REFFERENCE THEIR LIVES BY THE MISTAKES AND FAILURES OF THEIR PARENT'S GENERATIONS!
Pete
For those of you that never have the pleasure of conversing with Pete. This a huge guffaw moment with loads of discussion. Somewhere there is a beer involved.
I'd don't think that Piaggio will do the sport bike thing. Power cruiser. Yes. That seems to be case with the 1400 Cali different Volvo Sports wagon.
-
If Moto Guzzi drops the Griso and Norge, all they will have are gaps.
How do you gain market share even if your products aren't cutting edge?
Quality. Make the bikes reek with quality and people will buy them. Make a Moto Guzzi the most reliable bike out of the crate. Make it so when you buy a Moto Guzzi, everything fits the way it is supposed to fit. How hard can that be? Fix the wiring, it isn't that they don't have enough wire, they just don't know what to do with it.
Moto Guzzis are known for what? It is not reliability it is being quirky. Being quirky is the marketing strategy?
Make the bikes the best in the business, then business will get better. No more kludge fixes years later, do it right do it right all the time and people will buy them.
100% correct.
That thinking went out of the window in mandello (and probably most places) in about 1975...
now where are the keys for my ambo... funny how it never lets me down, 45 years since it was built.
-
THE *LOOK* ISN'T 'TRADITIONAL', IT IS OBSOLETE AND ANTIQUATED! IT PANDERS TO IDIOTS AND FOOLS WHO ONLY REFFERENCE THEIR LIVES BY THE MISTAKES AND FAILURES OF THEIR PARENT'S GENERATIONS!
The world and technology move on. It saddens me that so many people are so resentful of that they have turned the second oldest motorcycle company in the world into a shallow joke.
Pete
<3 <3 <3
-
100% correct.
That thinking went out of the window in mandello (and probably most places) in about 1975...
now where are the keys for my ambo... funny how it never lets me down, 45 years since it was built.
:thumb:
Yeah, your Ambo. never let's you down but it's marginal in every way except looks compared to newer Guzzis.
I've had it with all the new gizmos 'new' bikes are coming with now too and have no interest in any of them both for that reason and their looks, whether it be Guzzis or any other brand. I'll just keep my current 'old' bikes running or just ride my scooters. :boozing: Rigs I can do most the maintenance on myself. :thumb:
-
...or two... or three... for less than the cost of a new one.
I've only bought two motorcycles new - a 1986 Yamaha Radian and a 2006 Ducati Sport 1000. For me, it's rare that a new motorcycle is different enough to catch my interest.
With all the great deals on older, reliable bikes, I just have a hard time paying so much money for a new motorcycle. And I don't finance or pay comprehensive insurance on vehicles. I was thinking about putting some hard bags on one of my V11s, but ended up buying a 1992 BMW K75s with better bags for about the cost of putting bags on a V11.
That being said, I cannot stop looking at the new Honda Africa Twin, but I am still comparing/contrasting to the Stelvio.
I think the answer to the core question of this thread is that you don't need to fall in love with a brand - you can fall in love with some specific models. If you have the opportunity to own more than one motorcycle, you can appreciate all the things that each bike does better than the others.
I like how you think.. :thumb:
-
And it keeps coming back to this 'Ostrich with its head in the sand' argument about how complex the new bikes are. They aren't! They are very simple, they just require a couple of different tools to keep them going well!
And Kev, I'll say it again. I have no problem with the smallblock powerplant but it really doesn't need to be in a crappy, obsolete, chassis. I don't care if it looks like 1970's hipster wet-dream or an insect on steroids, I just want suspension and brakes that work with a degree of subtlety and a frame that isn't a hacked about horror from a different age.
I like the *Old* bikes for heavens sakes but if you want an old bike then why not just buy one rather than gleefully trying to paint a once highly inovative company into a stagnant backwater?
I'm really hoping we get something exciting next year but I'm not holding my breath.
Pete
-
And it keeps coming back to this 'Ostrich with its head in the sand' argument about how complex the new bikes are. They aren't! They are very simple, they just require a couple of different tools to keep them going well!
And Kev, I'll say it again. I have no problem with the smallblock powerplant but it really doesn't need to be in a crappy, obsolete, chassis. I don't care if it looks like 1970's hipster wet-dream or an insect on steroids, I just want suspension and brakes that work with a degree of subtlety and a frame that isn't a hacked about horror from a different age.
I like the *Old* bikes for heavens sakes but if you want an old bike then why not just buy one rather than gleefully trying to paint a once highly inovative company into a stagnant backwater?
I'm really hoping we get something exciting next year but I'm not holding my breath.
Pete
Sorry Pete, but I'm not going to go down the throttle by wire road any time soon. A throttle cable is all I need and my `04 750 Breva is sophisticated enough.
-
The RBW system works fine, I don't know why the Cali 1400 shakes so much at idle? That really ticks me off. I have a feeling it may be deliberate which reaches a whole new level of stupid!
Pete
-
I absolutely love ride by wire. Probably outlast any throttle cable.
-
Yeah, your Ambo. never let's you down but it's marginal in every way except looks compared to newer Guzzis.
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
-
Here's another answer: buy a Triumph Street Triple. Just back from a ride. Damn I love this bike!! It is refined, easy to ride, handles like a greyhound chasing a bunny, sounds wonderful, and can be either a terrifying demon, or smooth cruiser. Brakes are fantastic. Reliable. Relatively good looking if you happen to be a Klingon. Lot of bang for the buck!! And it even has a fuel gauge, ABS and gear indicator.
-
And it keeps coming back to this 'Ostrich with its head in the sand' argument about how complex the new bikes are. They aren't! They are very simple, they just require a couple of different tools to keep them going well!
And Kev, I'll say it again. I have no problem with the smallblock powerplant but it really doesn't need to be in a crappy, obsolete, chassis. I don't care if it looks like 1970's hipster wet-dream or an insect on steroids, I just want suspension and brakes that work with a degree of subtlety and a frame that isn't a hacked about horror from a different age.
I like the *Old* bikes for heavens sakes but if you want an old bike then why not just buy one rather than gleefully trying to paint a once highly inovative company into a stagnant backwater?
I'm really hoping we get something exciting next year but I'm not holding my breath.
Pete
I wouldn't mind dual discs, and I guess USD forks would be ok if they didn't effect price too badly. But the V7 does everything I need it too without a monoshock or SSSA.
As for an actual vintage bike, no thanks. I want a NEW bike with turn key reliability as well as more flavor/style than a Honda.
-
I absolutely love ride by wire. Probably outlast any throttle cable.
Yeah, well, when it quits you're SOL. If you have a replacement cable you can be back on the road.
-
Here's another answer: buy a Triumph Street Triple.
Gutless non existant mid range 600 supersport motors, pass on all of them and the local triumph dealer I'm not prepared to give them any of my money.
-
Yeah, well, when it quits you're SOL. If you have a replacement cable you can be back on the road.
I'm sorry, but this is the same old tired argument we hear all the time. The type that has people removing reliable electronic ignitions for points.
Thing is that the vast majority of these modern components so far outlast their predecessors you will likely need that vintage replacement and may never need the modern equivalent to be repaired.
Not that it can't happen, but HELL, I'm not going to stock every possible replacement for every vehicle I own anyway.
-
Eh if they don't make what you want then why not buy another brand? If you are a fan of Moto Guzzi will you come back if they produce something that would fulfill your needs 4-5 years down the road or would you have washed your hands of the brand entirely?
-
Yeah, well, when it quits you're SOL. If you have a replacement cable you can be back on the road.
Using that argument you could say if you carry a demand sensor with you you can be back on the road in an identical or shorter period of time. The argument is like a colander!
Pete
-
Using that argument you could say if you carry a demand sensor with you you can be back on the road in an identical or shorter period of time. The argument is like a colander!
Pete
Guzzis are 1 of the few brands I've had clutch or throttle cables break on and that's why I carry replacements for when it happens. :tongue:
-
I'm sorry, but this is the same old tired argument we hear all the time. The type that has people removing reliable electronic ignitions for points.
Thing is that the vast majority of these modern components so far outlast their predecessors you will likely need that vintage replacement and may never need the modern equivalent to be repaired.
Not that it can't happen, but HELL, I'm not going to stock every possible replacement for every vehicle I own anyway.
:thumb: :1:
-
For you Guzzi owners that might not care for the more traditional look of the new Guzzi's, what do you do when it's time for another bike? Let's say you like the looks of the Lemans, Sport series, Grisos or even the Breva based bikes, do you give up on getting a new bike and buy one of those or do you move on from Moto Guzzi and switch to another brand? If you're a sport or sport-touring kind of guy, it doesn't look like Moto Guzzi will have any new bikes for you.
<snip> but it doesn't look like Moto Guzzi will be making anything then that I would want.
<snip>
I'm actually looking at bikes now:
Another GRiSO (stories of slow parts deliveries do not inspire confidence in Piaggio support of a discontinued model)
Ducati Monster 1200s or 821
Aprilia Tuono 1100 (but would still have to deal with Piaggio. :undecided: )
BMW R NineT
-
THE *LOOK* ISN'T 'TRADITIONAL', IT IS OBSOLETE AND ANTIQUATED! IT PANDERS TO IDIOTS AND FOOLS WHO ONLY REFFERENCE THEIR LIVES BY THE MISTAKES AND FAILURES OF THEIR PARENT'S GENERATIONS!
The world and technology move on. It saddens me that so many people are so resentful of that they have turned the second oldest motorcycle company in the world into a shallow joke.
Pete
The most popular brand in North America got to that envious position by sticking with traditional design and considered to many what accounts for obsolete technology. The Motor Company may well pander to fools and idiots but from a business model you sure can't knock them. Perhaps the folks behind Guzzi have looked at what works for the Motor Company and are taking their lead. Go fast and high end technology appeals to many but the Japanese have had a stranglehold on that sector for decades. I think Guzzi may just be returning to the origin of their success in the late 60's and early 70's.
Or maybe they just think they know what hipsters will buy and are heading in that direction.
I may buy a new to me Guzzi this spring and get a Cali II or even take a giant leap towards modernity and get a spine frame bike. :wink:
-
Well none of doing that is going to help the Guzzi factory right now. I see your newest 2 bikes are not Guzzis. Not saying there's anything wrong with that. :smiley:
-
Using that argument you could say if you carry a demand sensor with you you can be back on the road in an identical or shorter period of time. The argument is like a colander!
Pete
Let them think that way. It's their money, it's their life and there are plenty of old bikes for them to fart with. I love EFI (carbs are proving to be a royal PITA for me), ABS may have saved me two shoulder surgeries, now if they can just do something to replace cams and tappets we'll be in hog heaven. :D
-
I have a 2004 B750 and always thought it was a pity that Guzzi didn't eveolve that model a bit further. The bike I would envisage would have the engine of these new V9s juiced up a little now the Heron heads are gone, a monoshock, maybe even USD forks maybe not and twin front disks. Would also come in a Mini Norge version. I quite like the styleing of the V7 Stone, but then again like the styling of my 2004 Breva!!!
-
I may buy a new to me Guzzi this spring and get a Cali II or even take a giant leap towards modernity and get a spine frame bike. :wink:
The California II is a great old bike, mine handles better than my V11 Sport (or at least it gives me more confidence), a couple of years back I took a training course on a simulated race track and found I was able to catch crotch rockets in the corners although they could out accelerate me. The instructor was shocked how well I was able to do on the old girl, several times he commented that I was almost dragging the rear crash bars.
-
I like the *Old* bikes for heavens sakes but if you want an old bike then why not just buy one rather than gleefully trying to paint a once highly inovative company into a stagnant backwater?
Again with the "if you like old bikes, then why you just not buy on" argument?
Those that buy a "classic" bike (and there are many, cause, as said, the style is very popular today) don't want an old bike. They don't want to spend their life in the garage servicing it, and have in exchange crappy brakes and suspensions. They want a bike built with modern tecnology and reliability with a simple, user friendly, look. What they don't mind is having the fastest of the bunch, cause they realized that, in any case, 90% or the riders are not capable to use much more than a fraction of the possible performances of a modern bike.
Is the Street Triple a great bike? Obviously it is, but the bike that Triumph sell the most is the Bonneville, and the new Bonneville line is admittedly their biggest design effort so far. Shun Miyazawa, Product Manager of Yamaha Motor Europe, presenting the XSR700 said that they expect that the market of the "classic looking" bikes will double in the next four years. Their answer to the demand can't be: "If you like old bikes, then go buy an XS650, we produce the MT09 nowadays".
-
Again with the "if you like old bikes, then why you just not buy on" argument?
Those that buy a "classic" bike (and there are many, cause, as said, the style is very popular today) don't want an old bike. They don't want to spend their life in the garage servicing it, and have in exchange crappy brakes and suspensions. They want a bike built with modern tecnology and reliability with a simple, user friendly, look. What they don't mind is having the fastest of the bunch, cause they realized that, in any case, 90% or the riders are not capable to use much more than a fraction of the possible performances of a modern bike.
Is the Street Triple a great bike? Obviously it is, but the bike that Triumph sell the most is the Bonneville, and the new Bonneville line is admittedly their biggest design effort so far. Shun Miyazawa, Product Manager of Yamaha Motor Europe, presenting the XSR700 said that they expect that the market of the "classic looking" bikes will double in the next four years. Their answer to the demand can't be: "If you like old bikes, then go buy an XS650, we produce the MT09 nowadays".
Sorry! Hoist on your own pettard! The whole argument I'm making is that *The Customer* shouldn't have to deal with that shit!
If though, they decide that *That Shit* is what the motorcycling community, bollocks! Any community! Is *All About*? It speaks volumes for the society I which we live. (See last night's rant! I won't resile from it!).
Pete
-
Sorry! Hoist on your own pettard! The whole argument I'm making is that *The Customer* shouldn't have to deal with that shit!
And they don't have to. Nor a V7, or a Bonneville, or a CB1100 requires the kind of manteinance work that a real '70s bike requires, and they surely have way better brakes.
-
Wayne, I've had cables go, generally a long way from home, and on Italian bikes that had a parts supply in our great nation that required innovation on my part. I'll take my chances with RBW. But more than that, it just works better.
On the original question-before I bought the Scout, I considered a Griso, a Cali 1400 and (what I really liked) a V7. I excluded the Griso and Cali on fairly logical ground based on size and intent-but I really liked the V7.
But the fueling was crap. Brand new bike, and it surged and such, throughout the ride. Possibly related, the driveline was making sounds I didn't like. Unacceptable for a new FI bike.
-
Again with the "if you like old bikes, then why you just not buy on" argument?
Those that buy a "classic" bike (and there are many, cause, as said, the style is very popular today) don't want an old bike. They don't want to spend their life in the garage servicing it, and have in exchange crappy brakes and suspensions. They want a bike built with modern tecnology and reliability with a simple, user friendly, look. What they don't mind is having the fastest of the bunch, cause they realized that, in any case, 90% or the riders are not capable to use much more than a fraction of the possible performances of a modern bike.
Is the Street Triple a great bike? Obviously it is, but the bike that Triumph sell the most is the Bonneville, and the new Bonneville line is admittedly their biggest design effort so far. Shun Miyazawa, Product Manager of Yamaha Motor Europe, presenting the XSR700 said that they expect that the market of the "classic looking" bikes will double in the next four years. Their answer to the demand can't be: "If you like old bikes, then go buy an XS650, we produce the MT09 nowadays".
Sums up my feeling, best looking bike in my garage is the 75 Trident. The problem is every time I fix one thing something else breaks, fix the carbs, and no spark, then the front caliper pisses all over the garage floor. I tired of working on it and would probably sell it in a heartbeat if I could get every thing ixed at the same time. I wish they put a triple motor in a thruxton chassis, I love the look and would probably jump on a triumph if I ver buy a new bike.
-
Again with the "if you like old bikes, then why you just not buy on" argument?
Those that buy a "classic" bike (and there are many, cause, as said, the style is very popular today) don't want an old bike. They don't want to spend their life in the garage servicing it, and have in exchange crappy brakes and suspensions. They want a bike built with modern tecnology and reliability with a simple, user friendly, look. What they don't mind is having the fastest of the bunch, cause they realized that, in any case, 90% or the riders are not capable to use much more than a fraction of the possible performances of a modern bike.
Is the Street Triple a great bike? Obviously it is, but the bike that Triumph sell the most is the Bonneville, and the new Bonneville line is admittedly their biggest design effort so far. Shun Miyazawa, Product Manager of Yamaha Motor Europe, presenting the XSR700 said that they expect that the market of the "classic looking" bikes will double in the next four years. Their answer to the demand can't be: "If you like old bikes, then go buy an XS650, we produce the MT09 nowadays".
My feelings exactly. I want a new bike with vintage good looks. I do not like the origami transformer look of most "modern" motorcycles. I prefer the classic organic lines of the past. That being said, I have come to the realization that I don't want the maintenance and poor performance of a genuine vintage bike. I've come to the realization that 1990s is as vintage as I want to ride on a regular basis.
There is no reason a vintage/retro-styled bike can't have modern suspension/brakes/handling. Until the unveiling of the new Thruxton R, the Norton Commando 961 Cafe Racer held top spot for me, for this type of bike. I do hope that Guzzi ups the game on the V7/9 Racer for 2017, giving it suspension and brakes to equal the Thruxton R.
The 2014 V7 Special that I bought in August fills its niche pretty well. I'm not happy with the suspensions, but the look and feel are perfect. And it's new/reliable.
-
Not all 70s bikes were work. My 78 GS1000 was a fantastic bike! Aside from having to have the stator fixed, the bike was very little maintenance, handled as good as I could ride, and was very powerful. 2vpc, inline air cooled 4, with accurate fuel gage and great ergonomics, it really was a hell of a good bike.
I was bored last night and decided to check out web sites of the big 4 Japanese brands, good god things have gotten weird! Take a look at what Honda has to offer, they appear to be lost in the wind? :huh: All of them have mostly stuff that seems ugly, and unsure of what it wants to be. Aside from a smattering of 700/800s and a 1200ish bikes, their was very, very little I would want to buy.
I want to see Guzzi come out with a more sporting bike too, and I suspect they will, but I super happy they aren't trying to follow the Asians down the path to the insect wars.
-
Wayne, I've had cables go, generally a long way from home, and on Italian bikes that had a parts supply in our great nation that required innovation on my part. I'll take my chances with RBW. But more than that, it just works better.
On the original question-before I bought the Scout, I considered a Griso, a Cali 1400 and (what I really liked) a V7. I excluded the Griso and Cali on fairly logical ground based on size and intent-but I really liked the V7.
But the fueling was crap. Brand new bike, and it surged and such, throughout the ride. Possibly related, the driveline was making sounds I didn't like. Unacceptable for a new FI bike.
Aaron, my 750 Breva was the 1st Guzzi to have the EFI closed loop system and it has none of the issues the V7 you rode has. If it did I wouldn't still have it. It's throttle is impeccable from day 1 to 48Kmiles later. I put lighter/louder mufflers on it and the ECU adjusted by itself to them. :cool: When I 1st got the Breva it felt like a Swiss watch it's so precise. The only complaint I have of it is it's gas tank of 4.7 gal. is really only good for 4.0 gal between fillups, so I carry an extra 1 gal. on trips.
-
I've already been through this with my allegiance to Plymouth, a one time spin off company that made 2 iconic muscle cars: The GTX/RoadRunner and the 'Cuda. Different series like the super bird, AAR cuda, colors from panther pink to go mango, motors like the 340 6pack, 440 six pack, and of course the classic 426 hemi. They ended up folding, Chrysler pushing dodges, but after all these years it's nice to see some 'devil may care' attitude with the hellcat
-
Aaron, my 750 Breva was the 1st Guzzi to have the EFI closed loop system and it has none of the issues the V7 you rode has. If it did I wouldn't still have it. It's throttle is impeccable from day 1 to 48Kmiles later. I put lighter/louder mufflers on it and the ECU adjusted by itself to them. :cool: When I 1st got the Breva it felt like a Swiss watch it's so precise. The only complaint I have of it is it's gas tank of 4.7 gal. is really only good for 4.0 gal between fillups, so I carry an extra 1 gal. on trips.
I wouldn't go blaming the RBW for the differences. For starters the 1TB V7 meets more strict emissions standards than the B7.
But more likely there was just something wrong with the one that Aaron rode and/or it was the early mapping cold start/low speed hunt we've seen. Either way the fueling has been great on my V7 Stone.
-
The glaring open slot in the Guzzi lineup is a sporty bike. The Griso is a little too much of an acquired taste for some people. I think the next bike from the factory will be a resurrection of the Le Mans name. ...
Another glaringly open slot for Guzzi is the cheep commuter. A small single or twin such as one that a high school student might use. That area is the bread and butter of a motorcycle manufacturer.
-
Another glaringly open slot for Guzzi is the cheep commuter. A small single or twin such as one that a high school student might use. That area is the bread and butter of a motorcycle manufacturer.
Is it? Maybe in some parts of the world, but not the US.
-
Is it? Maybe in some parts of the world, but not the US.
Dunno about that Kev. Honda and others did very well with such machines there. Manufacturers who got into trouble and /or were taken off the board had almost invariably ignored that market.
-
Guzzi, a niche brand that as much as we complain about Piaggio would be dead by now if they were independent. The only analogy I can think of is in the bicycle world. It use to be cyclists longed for a Cinelli, Masi, Colnago, De Rosa, all beautifully hand crafted Italian lugged steel frames. Down tube Campy Super Record 6 speed, you can see where I'm heading.
What I remember from the 80's is Gitane and Campagnolo.
-
Dunno about that Kev. Honda and others did very well with such machines there. Manufacturers who got into trouble and /or were taken off the board had almost invariably ignored that market.
DID being the operative word.
And again, I'm talking US sales vs. world.
-
Although looking at the original question their styling direction is not so much of an issue, its their engineering direction thats making me look elsewhere, KTM 1290 Superduke GT has my interest at the moment.
-
Man, all I'm saying is Guzzi MUST be doing something right as per design because I haven't seen so many old coots get their suspenders and knickers in a knot since Geritol threatened to leave the market. :grin:
No offense to anyone and really, what's the point in lamenting a thread title, but this whole stream here seems based on a completely bogus assumption that Guzzi will not fill the line back out and will keep on making nothing but V9s and 1400s. They won't. But they can't revamp their whole damn line in one year and let's face it, the Stelvio and Norge are great bikes (I enjoyed the '11 Stelvio I had for a bit) but are/were seriously losing propositions. If you don't believe me and your heart is set on getting a wing tipped flying machine, go look on your nearest dealer floor and you'll find many of these poor pound puppies begging you take them home. :thumb:
-
I would imagine Guzzi are restrained by head office. They can't get too sporty because of Aprillia, they can't go commuter because of Piaggio scooters so they are stuck in a classic/retro straight jacket.
I despair at the plastic insect look the Japanese seem to favour but there are plenty out there selling alternatives to keep most people with money to spend fed and watered.
-
What I don't get about the V9 is the foot-forward pegs and trying to appeal to the cruiser crowd. I mean is there a big market for small displacement cruisers? Do they really expect to get a significant share of that market?
I can understand the strategy of making Guzzi a legacy/retro brand but I think they would do better sticking at what made the old Guzzi's so popular. Good all around performance, great touring platforms, reliability, etc.
I think the new electronics are a good move, but I think they should also focus on having quality suspension bits and a tank that allows for a reliable 200 mile range.
-
What I don't get about the V9 is the foot-forward pegs and trying to appeal to the cruiser crowd. I mean is there a big market for small displacement cruisers? Do they really expect to get a significant share of that market?
I can understand the strategy of making Guzzi a legacy/retro brand but I think they would do better sticking at what made the old Guzzi's so popular. Good all around performance, great touring platforms, reliability, etc.
I think the new electronics are a good move, but I think they should also focus on having quality suspension bits and a tank that allows for a reliable 200 mile range.
Mark, what you & I think will show up in the sales volume(or lack) of this new model. But I thought the new B11 would be a big hit in the US and it wasn't so what do I know?
-
What I don't get about the V9 is the foot-forward pegs and trying to appeal to the cruiser crowd. I mean is there a big market for small displacement cruisers? Do they really expect to get a significant share of that market?
I can understand the strategy of making Guzzi a legacy/retro brand but I think they would do better sticking at what made the old Guzzi's so popular. Good all around performance, great touring platforms, reliability, etc.
From someone who keeps a pretty good eye on the "Cruiser" market, those AREN'T FOOT-FORWARD pegs (anymore than the V7 is really, at least as far as said market is concerned, they're certainly no more than a Tonti Cali).
And I think one of the largest growth segments in the market right now is for < 1000cc bikes, cruisers or "Bobbers" included.
-
Mark, I understand that there is a relatively good sized market for just such machines. The v9, not a foot forward cruiser, but compared to a typical standard, the pegs are slightly more forward, I'd call it mid mount.
HD, and Triumph, both sell a lot of retro-ish Sportys and Bonnies, to guys under 35, not to mention the Star Bolt. I suspect that this is the market demo the V9 is pointed at, not that it won't appeal to many older riders too.
The "old Guzzi" as you call it, never was popular! If Guzzi sold 1000 units in the states on any given year, it was considered a BIG year. Certainly Piaggio is trying to figure out how to grow sales in the US. They have a plan, I don't know exactly what it is, none of us do, but hopefully it will be better than the plans Guzzi used over the past 30 years!
-
What I don't get about the V9 is the foot-forward pegs and trying to appeal to the cruiser crowd.
I'm not seeing the "feet forward" pegs. Placement is real similar to a Nevada. Slightly forward of a standard V7.
Looks like a "standard" motorcycle, to me.
(https://www.via-moto.co.uk/Media/ViaMoto/_Profiles/84748f86/68fe42a4/Moto-Guzzi-V7-Audace-004.jpg?v=635827531643745716)
-
Man, all I'm saying is Guzzi MUST be doing something right as per design because I haven't seen so many old coots get their suspenders and knickers in a knot since Geritol threatened to leave the market. :grin:
Kind of a specialty for some geezers :evil:
Dusty
-
Agreed with Rocker.
-
What do you do?
Point out the direction things are going.....
http://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/2015/november/mrs-kawasaki-vulcan-special/
Well if you can start with such a hideous cruiser as Kawa... Vulcan and get this there's hope for V9 range yet.
-
Next year will see new bits that will improve the looks and performance .... I hope.
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic047/missing-the-target_zpsdz5qyzbu.jpg)
-
I see a potential market for super sized gas tanks...... :boozing:
-
I wouldn't go blaming the RBW for the differences. For starters the 1TB V7 meets more strict emissions standards than the B7.
But more likely there was just something wrong with the one that Aaron rode and/or it was the early mapping cold start/low speed hunt we've seen. Either way the fueling has been great on my V7 Stone.
Likewise for my 2013 V7 Racer and 2014 V7 Special.
Although, it may not have always been right on the Special, as my left muffler is discolored right by the heat shield like another member posted a little while back. I runs great though. I'll still be getting that checked out while it is still under warranty.
-
Dunno about that Kev. Honda and others did very well with such machines there. Manufacturers who got into trouble and /or were taken off the board had almost invariably ignored that market.
DID -- that is the operative word here. Lots of high school students don't even bother getting a drivers license, much less a motorcycle license. The current high school generation are all about social media and looking at their cell phones. They can't wait for the self driving car so they don't have to be bothered with the "chore" of driving.
-
Lots of high school students don't even bother getting a drivers license, much less a motorcycle license. The current high school generation are all about social media and looking at their cell phones. They can't wait for the self driving car so they don't have to be bothered with the "chore" of driving.
I feel like a dinosaur.
I got my learners' permit at 14. Got a hardship license at 15. I was driving my own Chevrolet pickup at that age and loved the independence it provided. I got my first motorcycle at 16. A 1983 CB650SC Nighthawk.
The parking lot at my high school was full. You had to have a permit to have a spot. There were usually several motorcycles in the student parking lot. Oldest/Coolest being a jocky-shift Pan Head. Newest being my 650 Honda. There were no kids who put off getting licensed.
The license was freedom.
That was all in the 1980s. Not too awful long ago...
-
That was all in the 1980s. Not too awful long ago...
That's a generation or two ago... :shocked:
-
Similar story. Got my licence at 16, and my M/C endorsement about the same time. But in IL, still the case, you could only operate a sub 150cc bike on the road until you were 18. I got a 1970 Honda CL125, that I road to high school, and about ever where else I could. It ran well, but would only hit about 50mph, but that didn't stop me. There were 3 other dudes that road to school, all older. One had a 350 Yamaha, that was pretty cool, it seemed to me he got a lot of Trim. Another guy road something, that I don't recall much about, but the SR Scott, got a new Yamaha Seca 650!!! And man, did I think he, and his bike were cool! There was no question in my mind, he got a lot of female attention. Days gone by...
-
I feel like a dinosaur.
I got my learners' permit at 14. Got a hardship license at 15. I was driving my own Chevrolet pickup at that age and loved the independence it provided. I got my first motorcycle at 16. A 1983 CB650SC Nighthawk.
The parking lot at my high school was full. You had to have a permit to have a spot. There were usually several motorcycles in the student parking lot. Oldest/Coolest being a jocky-shift Pan Head. Newest being my 650 Honda. There were no kids who put off getting licensed.
The license was freedom.
That was all in the 1980s. Not too awful long ago...
Same for me and my high school but 1971.
-
As this thread has drifted onto the younger generation and lack of enthusiasm for riding/driving. Mountain bikes are as popular as ever an when you look at the new Bultacos which are a mountain bike / trails bike cross - these bikes have serious potential for both the young an those of us brought up with bmx/skake board/mountain bikes who's legs an knees aren't what they used to be. 150 mile an hour on a sports bike might be fast. 40 mph off road down hill on on full suspension mountain bike is in a complete other dimension. Add a battery pack to whip you back up that hill in a couple of minutes. I don't believe there aren't a lot of kids who want that.
-
......
The parking lot at my high school was full. You had to have a permit to have a spot. There were usually several motorcycles in the student parking lot. Oldest/Coolest being a jocky-shift Pan Head. Newest being my 650 Honda. There were no kids who put off getting licensed.
The license was freedom.
That was all in the 1980s. Not too awful long ago...
I'm within a few years of being the same age as Rocker. This echos my experience, minus getting a motorcycle at age 16. My parents would never hear of that. But, the only kid I knew that didn't get their driver's license at age 16 was my brother, who wanted it, but, was denied by my parents due to poor grades. He never did "earn" it with grades, and was 18 until he got it. I'm only 10 months younger than he is. My driver's license was HIS ticket to freedom, as I didn't mind driving him around, as it was an excuse to drive.
That's a generation or two ago... :shocked:
Thanks for that little does of reality, Kev. :undecided:
-
.... 150 mile an hour on a sports bike might be fast. 40 mph off road down hill on on full suspension mountain bike is in a complete other dimension.
Mountain biking was my passion before getting into motorcycles late in life (and before I eff'd up my back). Yes, 40 MPH down a rocky single track is an absolute thrill -- especially when a large buck cross the trail you are screaming down :shocked:. Maybe if we didn't ride with the "if you're not crashing, you're not trying" attitude, my back wouldn't be messed up :undecided:.
Add a battery pack to whip you back up that hill in a couple of minutes. I don't believe there aren't a lot of kids who want that.
Hmmm, maybe that could be the gateway into motorcycling for the "younger generation."
First, a motor on a downhill mountain bike, and then something like the KTM Freeride E http://www.ktmfreeride-e.com/en (http://www.ktmfreeride-e.com/en).
I think it looks like a lot of fun, and wouldn't mind trying one.