Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: canuguzzi on February 20, 2016, 11:56:39 AM
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As in totally blind? I have a friend who might like to ride but at some point might want to take their wife along as a passenger.
I'd lean to a trike ala Can-Am for stability but I really have no experience in this matter so some actual experiences would be helpful. If you've done it, does it work for a motorcycle or is a three wheeler a better way to go?
Its a serious question.
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No experience with this situation but if it were me, I'd start out slow to get them acclimated to the leaning over sensation and maybe develop some kind of hand signals (tap on the knee) for left turn, right turn, slowing down, etc. Should prove an interesting experience for the new passenger.
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I'd be more concerned how much riding experience your friend has before taking a passenger and also how up for it his wife is.
A backrest might be an idea but her blindness should be almost irrelevant.
I'd skip on the trike as she'd be thrown around more on something that does not lean.
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My Father was legally blind. I used to take him riding on the back of my Goldwing, and also took him on a quad I had off road on some pretty gnarly desert trails. Dad loved it, I would describe the surroundings to him. Man...that was many years ago, as my dad died in 1984. at 64 years of age. He became 100% blind at 38 years of age, due to an eye infection they could not treat due to lack of medicines in Cuba.His blindness was no problem at all, as far as riding was concerned, but my dad was a very resilient person. He taught high school spanish being blind until 1981 when he retired.
Rick.
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Thanks for that. He would be a new rider but I figure a good year's worth of riding experience before taking the passenger. My main concern was a pathway to even going down that road so to speak. In other words, if it was something that just doesn't work from any standpoint, abandon the idea.
The plan would be something like a starter bike, MSF training, ride ride ride, larger bike, ride ride ride and then with family member on back who is sighted, more riding and then, two up with non-sighted spouse, helmet communications all tried and tested beforehand etc.
It wasn't my idea but I thought someone here might have experienced it before. Asked and received. At least now there is some direction to explore.
Thanks.
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Does mentally impaired count?
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Walter, you asked: "Does mentally impaired count?"
Count for what?
The dear woman is blind (maybe visually impaired was the wrong description), her other faculties are sharp. She has no sight, not even shadows.
The concern would be vertigo if that is a valid concern. I once made the mistake of trying to help her cross a street, touched her arm instead of just offering mine. I didn't know. I knew immediately after. Just not sure of what else might come up and since he does not yet ride, experiences here are valuable.
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Two words, side car. That way they get their own supply of bugs and don't have to depend on leftovers.
You can ride them at night and they don't care.
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Does this person want to ride regardless of the passenger, or is taking this lady riding the premise for getting the bike? If it is the second part of my question, I might suggest someone experienced, already with a motorcycle, take her for a ride and find out if she even likes it and does not have any trouble. Then go from there. I'm just thinking it would be sad for someone to go to a lot of trouble only to have it not work out.
In either case, now would be a good time to get signed up for an MSF course for the upcoming season. They tend to fill up quickly.
John Henry
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Been pulled over a few times and found to be impaired. :boozing:
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No experience with this situation but if it were me, I'd start out slow to get them acclimated to the leaning over sensation and maybe develop some kind of hand signals (tap on the knee) for left turn, right turn, slowing down, etc. Should prove an interesting experience for the new passenger.
For a blind passenger, there is no sense of lean, at least once the bike is underway and the rider making proper coordinated turns. Just as sighted persons flying on aircraft at night rarely ever notice aircraft making banked turns. The inner ear senses unbalance and there is none on coordinated turns. Sighted m/c passengers see the lean over on during turns and think they must correct their seating position.
People in sidecars and similar where centrifugal forces cause them to lean out, learn to prepare for sharp turns in advance of the turn, a situation denied a blind passenger.
Ciao,
DC
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Proper "leaning" can be learned, most of the blind pillions I've had the honor of carrying had ridden bicycle before and were familiar with the mechanics of leaning in turns. BTW, a lot of us underestimate the ability of blind folks to do stuff they "can't"... I had a completely blind friend that could ride a motorcycle, working the clutch and balancing and all. This is especially true of folks with low vision, I met a young blind guy once who'd found a loophole in Wisconsin's licensing law and rode a hopped up moped all over the state!
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When I went to New Zealand in 2012 a young blind lad (about 19) asked if I would take him for a ride. His parents said that if I said yes he wouldn't stop pestering me until I took him. We finally went for a ride. He yelped and hooted the whole way especially through the twisties. After a short while I could tell he was comfortable and rode at my regular pace. He turned out to be one of the best passengers I ever had.
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On the few occasions I have ridden as a pillion I made a concerted effort not to lean and to keep my spine in perfect alignment with the rear tyre.
From my limited experience of carrying a pillion the worst is carrying an experienced biker because its very difficult for them not to lean.
There are only two ways to be a pillion I understand as correct. 1) Stay in line with the bike. 2) hold close to the rider and let them move you.
To my loss, I never been on a bike with some one I wanted to get real close to so I cant speak of 2) only 1)
A blind person could be a good pillion because they are less likely to move around anticipating anything ahead. (ie be a bad pilion) They may enjoy riding pillion on something like a Califonia that has a nice slow thumpy beat to it and a supportive pillion seat.
I imagine riding pillion blind on a can-am trike could be quite terrifying. 3 wheels all following a different track makes pot holes hard to avoid. high cornering forces with no way of anticipating and leaning into them, no handlebars to grip onto. huge power, ....
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The owner of the MGNOC Frank Wedge's wife is legally blind and they ride together all the time. You might call him and see what he says. ph. 785-340-8740
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Thanks for that, I will pass that along ^^^
From discussions, riding would be a together thing for them with not a lot of interest going single up.
I asked about having her ride on a bike to see if there is interest and what came back was along the lines of not wanting to ride with anyone else. That part I can understand because in my experience, some partners will like to ride with you but not with someone else. Maybe I'm not explaining it right but you know how you might like to do something with another person and enjoy it but do it with someone else and not even care? That might be what it is. I probably still am not explaining that right.
It will take about a year of learning to ride and riding before he'd go 2 up and if things didn't work out, the bike could get sold, its only money and with a good used bike, the loss wouldn't be such a big thing.
Of course it could always happen that he really likes it even solo but that gets too in between of husband and wife. I'd rather just help selecting a bike, help arrange the MSF training and so on and let them give it a try.
I was worried that someone who could not see would have a difficult time riding on the back of a bike and good folks here answered that.
Who knows, they might end up with a MG, a starter bike, then maybe a V7 and then onto something better suited for trips (they go all summer).
Again, thanks for all the help, it made this so much easier.
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My Mom lost her sight before she passed, but we took a few short rides anyway and she loved it. Our main issue was getting her to avoid the hot pipes and make sure she kept her feet on the passenger pegs until we were ready to get off the bike. She had ridden pillion with my Dad about sixty years previously, so had some experience. Someone new to the idea shd practice getting on and off a few times, be shown where the spokes turn and where the pipes burn.
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Walter, you asked: "Does mentally impaired count?"
Count for what?
The dear woman is blind (maybe visually impaired was the wrong description), her other faculties are sharp. She has no sight, not even shadows.
The concern would be vertigo if that is a valid concern. I once made the mistake of trying to help her cross a street, touched her arm instead of just offering mine. I didn't know. I knew immediately after. Just not sure of what else might come up and since he does not yet ride, experiences here are valuable.
My comment may have been a little irreverent but as you said blind is blind, to me visually impared means does not see very well. I was making a joke or a pun based on does not see well vs someone not having all their faculties. Which can can describe some previous passengers and even myself.
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A passenger doesn't need to see.
You never know how a passenger might react. If they sit still and don't fight the balance and lean of the bike, they do well. If they lean against you and move around they're a hazard. You just never know until they get some seat time with ya.
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Does mentally impaired count?
You rotten person. I was going to post "only blind drunk females", but you kinda beat me to it!
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Frank Wedges wife visually impaired. If I remember correctly she would ride with Frank and the towed her guide dog in a trailer.
Dave
Galveston
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Given that the lady has no visual sensory input, she will be unaware of any leaning of the bike given that the gravitational and centrifugal forces are in balance so the resultant effect is straight into the seat. If you held a pendulum in front of your face in a corner on the bike it will point straight at the tank, (not surprisingly). Your fortunate passenger will not have any sensation in that regard, given that I've no doubt you can ride very smoothly when required your lady passengers experience will be nothing but pleasant.
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As in totally blind? I have a friend who might like to ride but at some point might want to take their wife along as a passenger.
I'd lean to a trike ala Can-Am for stability but I really have no experience in this matter so some actual experiences would be helpful. If you've done it, does it work for a motorcycle or is a three wheeler a better way to go?
Its a serious question.
Sorry can't help, in fact I had to read this 15 times and then the rest of your posts to figure out what you were asking.
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As the father of blind/legally blind daughter with over 75K on HER behind I can with absolute certainty say that blind passengers most absolutely FEEL the lean, probably before a sighted person can. I've taken many of her blind friends on rides and as stated before they are probably the best passengers given the time/instruction. I think the most important thing is familiarizing said impaired person with the machine parts {what to avoid when hot};mounting/unmounting; braking forces; turning; acceleration at slow speeds and then working up from there. Hope this helps.
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Ok , you are a person who knows first hand so I won't embarrass myself or insult you by giving advice or half baked opinions. My only point was and still is that, the human body can not sense velocities, only accelerations, so your passenger will feel as you say the tipping in as the bike goes from straight to lean but once established in a corner there is no overall sensation. Any way, who the hell cares, this is not a p*****g contest to see who can remember the most high school physics, (that includes me), if there is sufficient trust and respect for your passengers feelings and they believe in you enough to take them on a nice steady ride, then good on you and pick a lovely day for your ride. All the best for you , your passenger just might remind you of why you got on one in the first place, never mind all the diatribe of 4v vs 8v etc........