Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: motogman on September 10, 2016, 08:01:28 PM
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I posted a few weeks ago asking about ultrasonice cleaners. Several good suggestions were given and I bought a 3L unit off of Amazon.
Wow. Why did I not do this sooner.
The 3L unit is just large enough to submerg a disassemble Delorto carb body, a brembo F08 caliper body and a Brembo master cylinder with the lever removed.
The results are phenomenal. See pics below as an example. 20 minutes in a 1/3 solution of simple green & water.
For $100 it is well worth it. Now I am dunking everything now... I will try my toes next. :grin:
(http://thumb.ibb.co/eHG1iv/Clean_1.jpg) (http://ibb.co/eHG1iv)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/hS5u3v/Clean_2.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hS5u3v)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/bJFGGF/Clean_3.jpg) (http://ibb.co/bJFGGF)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/jmYQAa/Clean_4.jpg) (http://ibb.co/jmYQAa)
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May your toes come out looking that shiney too.
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I've worked with ultrasonics of many types (horns, welders, cleaner baths, etc). I saw instances of items destroyed where items made of disparate materials were run too long in a bath ultrasonic. The most dramatic were some particle sizing sieves that were brass hoops with soldered-in stainless steel mesh screens. The combination of materials reacting differently to the vibrations had them completely come apart (and rather quickly).... Anyway, I thought I'd mention it so that if you're unaware of this potential, it might save some grief. Certain carb floats come to mind, for instance. They're like magic for many chores, though.
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Interesting. I never had sand sieves die in an ultrasonic. But probably never ran them more than an hour though. Were they Gilsons?
-AJ
I've worked with ultrasonics of many types (horns, welders, cleaner baths, etc). I saw instances of items destroyed where items made of disparate materials were run too long in a bath ultrasonic. The most dramatic were some particle sizing sieves that were brass hoops with soldered-in stainless steel mesh screens. The combination of materials reacting differently to the vibrations had them completely come apart (and rather quickly).... Anyway, I thought I'd mention it so that if you're unaware of this potential, it might save some grief. Certain carb floats come to mind, for instance. They're like magic for many chores, though.
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CRAIGCLU - thanks for that info...
I did not feel comfortable cleaning the floats from the carbs in the US cleaner so I did those by hand. Maybe my 6th sense warning me of a problem... they also float by the way. :grin:
The master cylinder was frozen in the applied position and I could not push the pistion back with reasonable force applied. I figured, what the hell, considering the condition I might as well try the U/S cleaner on it. After 20 minutes it had released but was still very stuck & stcky. Another 20 minutes and some brake fluid and it is moving smoothly.
Not knowing exactly what was fouling it (cruded up brake fluid or rust or ???) I am a bit uncomfortable that the seals will be OK and the M/C operational - partciular considering how critical the MC is to safety - so it may get rebuilt anyway.
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I made a COB one out of a plastic peanut butter jar and a palm sander...not really ultasonic but it works. I also use a little lemon juice in the mix. Someday I'll buy a real one....
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Great things those ultrasonic cleaners are! I have been lucky perhaps but so far have not wrecked anything off a Guzzi. I throw wire harnesses, switches, even distributors in, really cleans them up nice. Sounds like a master cylinder rebuild kit is needed.
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I made a COB one out of a plastic peanut butter jar and a palm sander...not really ultasonic but it works. I also use a little lemon juice in the mix. Someday I'll buy a real one....
Sounds like the one from Ichiban Moto: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1DtY2VwSyY
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I have had a commercial grade ultrasonic cleaner for years now but rarely use it anymore. I end up using my solvent tank most of the time and find it just as effective. Just takes longer. Ultrasonic cleaners will etch metal and can do damage if the part is left in too long. Just keep checking every ten minutes or so to make sure its not getting damaged.
Pete
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I have had a commercial grade ultrasonic cleaner for years now but rarely use it anymore. I end up using my solvent tank most of the time and find it just as effective. Just takes longer. Ultrasonic cleaners will etch metal and can do damage if the part is left in too long. Just keep checking every ten minutes or so to make sure its not getting damaged.
Pete
Pete,
Not to completely hijack this thread, but what solvent do you use in your solvent tank? (I've got one of those.)
Moto
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Sounds like the one from Ichiban Moto: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1DtY2VwSyY
Yup, thats it.....
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I have had a commercial grade ultrasonic cleaner for years now but rarely use it anymore. I end up using my solvent tank most of the time and find it just as effective. Just takes longer. Ultrasonic cleaners will etch metal and can do damage if the part is left in too long. Just keep checking every ten minutes or so to make sure its not getting damaged.
Pete
The US cleaner has its place. It looks like the OP would get a better result with a different solvent. For carbs I just use solvent and they get really, really clean.
This one was varnished like a piece of furniture when it went in.
Hunter
(http://i1355.photobucket.com/albums/q708/2hhjones/IMG_20160911_111025_zpsksl10b9q.jpg)
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Moto, I get the solvent cleaner at Tractor Supply. They also have a water based one but I guess I am old school.
Pete
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I use either a degreaser or Simple Geen HD (the purple stuff). Never use the green stuff on aluminum.
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I use either a degreaser or Simple Geen HD (the purple stuff). Never use the green stuff on aluminum.
Why not the green on Al?
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Moto, I get the solvent cleaner at Tractor Supply. They also have a water based one but I guess I am old school.
Pete
Thanks!
Moto
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Why not the green on Al?
http://simplegreen.com/faqs/
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The little bit of attack on aluminum that simple green can produce gives really fantastic results. Just rinse thoroughly.
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I use Purple Power degreaser in mine, it works great.
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I picked up a large Harbor Freight model. Anyone have a review before I take it out of the box or take it back?
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I have had a commercial grade ultrasonic cleaner for years now but rarely use it anymore. I end up using my solvent tank most of the time and find it just as effective. Just takes longer. Ultrasonic cleaners will etch metal and can do damage if the part is left in too long. Just keep checking every ten minutes or so to make sure its not getting damaged.
Pete
I used a crockpot and simple green. Let the parts "stew" over night and, Wallah!
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Regular Simple Green will darken aluminum...at least it does in my machine..
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I picked up a large Harbor Freight model. Anyone have a review before I take it out of the box or take it back?
This one? http://www.harborfreight.com/25-liter-ultrasonic-cleaner-95563.html
I have one and it does a great job, but is a bit limited on size of course. Some carb bodies will stick up out of the solution, so must be turned to clean completely. I'll put the small bits in that one and the bodies in my larger 5 liter one.
Otherwise, it works well. Maximum time you can set it for is 480 seconds, heat works well. Relatively quiet.
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This one? http://www.harborfreight.com/25-liter-ultrasonic-cleaner-95563.html
I have one and it does a great job, but is a bit limited on size of course. Some carb bodies will stick up out of the solution, so must be turned to clean completely. I'll put the small bits in that one and the bodies in my larger 5 liter one.
Otherwise, it works well. Maximum time you can set it for is 480 seconds, heat works well. Relatively quiet.
That's the one I have. I will run it through 5-10 cycles with heat although it may not need that much. So far it seems to work fine.
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not a US cleaner - but I went from this:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-5drOz1mseJA/Tnf762ZrZ4I/AAAAAAAAFSo/DFTyopd7QwE/s640/carb4.jpg)
to this:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-pzJocAi8f4k/TnqecaCmsuI/AAAAAAAAFbk/HllikXRg_2c/s640/053.JPG)
using a homemade soda blaster that cost $5 and using baking soda that I grabbed from fridge.
I have since bought a harbor freight blaster with a soda attachment and a 50lb bag of blasting soda. wont clean the inside of the carb or caliper, but worked great on the outsides.
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Why not the green on Al?
Yeah....I have had very good luck with the standard "green" on aluminum. This is just spray on and wipe off (not in ultrasonic). Many times I haven't even rinsed it off well, just wiped it off. I have not noticed any discolorations or funny reactions with it on aluminum. Maybe I better be more careful.
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Regular aluminum foil is used for testing the quality of the units cavitation effect.
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic002/codysontest_zpsrgzedqqc.jpg)
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic002/GS3test_zpsq7ci9fgf.jpg)
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As someone who works with ultrasonics and much higher frequency megasonics, I would say it's important to understand what they really do and that is to enhance chemical reactivity; in some cases by several orders of magnitude. While it's true that cavitation events can blow holes in tin foil, they have little effect on metal parts that are more substantial. What can do damage is the chemical reaction between the liquid and the part when enhanced by ultrasonics.
What that really means is that you need to understand what it is that your cleaning and the solution you're using. You may be able to soak a carb overnight using x solution but you may get the same result in 10 or 15 minutes in an ultrasonic and if the solution has the ability to attack the metal, you could well damage it.
What this means is that you want a chemical that will attack whatever it is that you want to remove but not react with the metal that your part is made from. If you do that, the ultrasonic won't damage it assuming that it's not super thin or delicate. That is why I would tend to recommend solutions made for carb cleaning over a general chemical like simple green or something along those lines and make sure it's compatible with aluminum or whatever material your carb is made from.
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As someone who works with ultrasonics and much higher frequency megasonics, I would say it's important to understand what they really do and that is to enhance chemical reactivity; in some cases by several orders of magnitude. While it's true that cavitation events can blow holes in tin foil, they have little effect on metal parts that are more substantial. What can do damage is the chemical reaction between the liquid and the part when enhanced by ultrasonics.
What that really means is that you need to understand what it is that your cleaning and the solution you're using. You may be able to soak a carb overnight using x solution but you may get the same result in 10 or 15 minutes in an ultrasonic and if the solution has the ability to attack the metal, you could well damage it.
What this means is that you want a chemical that will attack whatever it is that you want to remove but not react with the metal that your part is made from. If you do that, the ultrasonic won't damage it assuming that it's not super thin or delicate. That is why I would tend to recommend solutions made for carb cleaning over a general chemical like simple green or something along those lines and make sure it's compatible with aluminum or whatever material your carb is made from.
Great info. Thanks!