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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Huzo on December 05, 2016, 06:00:54 PM
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I've wondered what is it that sometimes makes my right hand go numb starting from the outside of the palm and can progress to most of my hand when riding ? Removing it from the 'bar will restore the feeling almost immediately but it can be troublesome. If I grab my left hand with my right, it feels like it's not my hand I'm grabbing. I don't know if it's circulatory or not but maybe someone does. I asked about it once and all I got was some oblique response like, "you should be happy, every man's dream" whatever that means ??? The Norge doesn't do it as much nor did my Triumph Sprint ST, but my GSXR 1100 Suzuki was a shocker.
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What do you expect when you ask a question like that? "Uhh, maybe swap hands?" :grin:
Seriously, it's pretty common for an inline 4 to be "buzzy." You might try gel grips and or gel palms in your gloves. It's one of the reasons I don't like 4s.
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I've wondered what is it that sometimes makes my right hand go numb starting from the outside of the palm and can progress to most of my hand when riding ? Removing it from the 'bar will restore the feeling almost immediately but it can be troublesome. If I grab my left hand with my right, it feels like it's not my hand I'm grabbing. I don't know if it's circulatory or not but maybe someone does. I asked about it once and all I got was some oblique response like, "you should be happy, every man's dream" whatever that means ??? The Norge doesn't do it as much nor did my Triumph Sprint ST, but my GSXR 1100 Suzuki was a shocker.
Numbness like that is more likely nerve related than circulatory, but tele-medicine from amateurs is worth every penny you pay for it. Check with a physician that does industrial injury work, or a good physiotherapist. Chances are if you can describe it well, they can give you techniques to avoid or reduce the problem.
A lot of these problems have to do with things like weight on the wrist (based on your posture), a bad angle for the bar that positions your wrist oddly, or gripping the bar too tightly. As an experienced rider, I wouldn't think you would miss these signs, but I thought I'd mention them so everyone reading could add to them.
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More buzz vibration can come through the "loose parts" of the throttle side of the bar vs. the "fixed parts" of the left side. This has affected my right hand on every bike I've ridden. Never a problem at my left hand.
Original Grip Buddies grip wraps help. I also use a Kyriakyn Universal Throttle Boss, and a Go Cruise Throttle Control from Aerostich. And along with these, I've installed Vibranator bar end weights on my FJR. The combo of these work pretty well. I've also noticed some insulated cold weather gloves transmit more vibes than my Aerostich Ropers. I would think the glove insulation would snuff out vibes, but this is not the case with all gloves.
Good luck.
Steve.
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Grip Puppies.
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Carpal tunnel syndrome.
http://www.healio.com/orthopedics/journals/ortho/2012-5-35-5/%7B629ba187-2e6d-4635-a737-09ed454174f3%7D/prevalence-of-carpal-tunnel-syndrome-in-motorcyclists
Science, it works.....
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Sounds like a form of vibration induced neuropathy . I have the same problem . The right gloves can help , although probably not with what Chuckie is suggesting :shocked: :laugh:
Dusty
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I purposely sit on my left hand until it goes numb, but if I go any further Dusty will bitch slap me. So I won't.
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that is my complaint with the V7 at 70 mph. It is better during temps 60 or less.
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I'm with IT Sec- it is nerve related. You can try changing handlebar positions but mostly it's bad nerves due to having too much fun when you were a young whelp. Might try acupuncture, it has worked for me.
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I tend to grasp the right grip tighter than the left even though I have throttle assist. When my right hand starts to numb up I just relax my grip and all is well. Maybe some form of throttle assist for you?
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Corn oil, works wonders. :laugh:
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You can try changing handlebar positions but mostly it's bad nerves due to having too much fun when you were a young whelp.
Yes that's always possible I guess but I've never really had any injuries as such even when younger.
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Corn oil, works wonders. :laugh:
Does that give some relief to the joints or tendons ?
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Median nerve (carpal tunnel) issues effect the thumb, index finger, middle finger, and thumb-side of the ring finger. It manifests as tingling and numbness at those digits and generally progresses to weakness and muscle wasting of the thenar (thumb-side) eminence (the big pad of palm at the base of the thumb.) I've operated on plenty of carpal tunnels and I don't recall a single person who said that his symptoms only occurred, or occurred chiefly, while riding...and I live in Wisconsin, so there are plenty of riders.
What you're describing doesn't sound carpal tunnel-like or at least not carpal tunnel alone.
Try this: go out to your garage and put on a radio program you like or maybe a CD or something. Now sit on your bike and grab the handlebars, and sit like that for a good 30 minutes. If you have tingling issues you've ruled-out the vibrations as a source and, indeed, since you're not cranking your wrist, you've ruled-out the carpal tunnel too. And now we're looking at positional neuropathies that can generally be cleared up by a good physical therapist and/or some positional modifications/stretching exercises, etc.
If it doesn't happen, then it's likely more of a vibrational issue and it's likely polyneural since your symptoms don't correspond to a particular nerve. I assume you're right side dominant? In any case, a great place to start with nerve issues (the parasthesias are thought to be secondary to perineural inflammation) is with scheduled anti-inflammatories like 3 Advil every 6 hours for a week, ice, and inactivity/brace use.
If you do end up with a brace, come up with a good story, like you strained it pulling deaf kids out of a burning bus or something. My motorcycle makes my hand numb isn't going to impress the ladies :)
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I've had stuff before to give relief to a sore shoulder and stuff for hay fever relief and lots of other things, but what do you ask for when it's your hand that's problematic ?
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Median nerve (carpal tunnel) issues effect the thumb, index finger, middle finger, and thumb-side of the ring finger. It manifests as tingling and numbness at those digits and generally progresses to weakness and muscle wasting of the thenar (thumb-side) eminence (the big pad of palm at the base of the thumb.) I've operated on plenty of carpal tunnels and I don't recall a single person who said that his symptoms only occurred, or occurred chiefly, while riding...and I live in Wisconsin, so there are plenty of riders.
What you're describing doesn't sound carpal tunnel-like or at least not carpal tunnel alone.
Try this: go out to your garage and put on a radio program you like or maybe a CD or something. Now sit on your bike and grab the handlebars, and sit like that for a good 30 minutes. If you have tingling issues you've ruled-out the vibrations as a source and, indeed, since you're not cranking your wrist, you've ruled-out the carpal tunnel too. And now we're looking at positional neuropathies that can generally be cleared up by a good physical therapist and/or some positional modifications/stretching exercises, etc.
If it doesn't happen, then it's likely more of a vibrational issue and it's likely polyneural since your symptoms don't correspond to a particular nerve. I assume you're right side dominant? In any case, a great place to start with nerve issues (the parasthesias are thought to be secondary to perineural inflammation) is with scheduled anti-inflammatories like 3 Advil every 6 hours for a week, ice, and inactivity/brace use.
If you do end up with a brace, come up with a good story, like you strained it pulling deaf kids out of a burning bus or something. My motorcycle makes my hand numb isn't going to impress the ladies :)
That sounds like a good analytical approach to zeroing in on some answers. I'll look down that track. BTW wouldn't the ladies just think you were a caring sort of guy if you gave them the "bus story", why would they not be impressed ? I would be.
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I purposely sit on my left hand until it goes numb, but if I go any further Dusty will bitch slap me. So I won't.
Sorry Cam , I hit modify instead of quote :rolleyes: If I am reading this correctly , keeping your left hand out of service keeps down on ugly posts :laugh:
Dusty
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From Simon and Garfunkle:
I been Norman Mailered, Maxwell Taylored
I been John O'Hara'd, McNamara'd
I been Rolling Stoned and Beatled 'til I'm blind
I been Ayn Randed, nearly branded
Communist, cause I'm left-handed
That's the hand I use...well, never mind
Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA
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This has happened to me on my Norge and CX. Both remedied by different bars, more relaxed position.
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I got that bad on a long cold ride on my
LeMans
After 3 days and still partial numbness I went to doctor
Diagnosis was pinching of ulnar nerve with no real treatment except surgery. It slowly dissipated over about 3 weeks.
Now I use throttle lock and be mindful of it and have avoided a full on bout since
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Yeah, I get this too while riding the SP. I will probably try some gel grips and make sure everything is tight before spring. How much would a failed steering damper effect this?
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Move the throttle to the left side so that you can let go and flex the fingers while riding.
Or spring for an expensive cruise control device.
I'm lucky, it's my left hand that does that. I just let go the bar and flex the fingers until it goes away.
If the right hand does it I let go on the down hills when the throttle is not needed.
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Start an exercise routine that strengthens your core muscles...you should be using those to support your seated position so the force is taken off your hands and wrists...
Also, on long rides, exercise your fingers, wrists, and thumbs periodically to restore circulation and relieve cramping...
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I got that bad on a long cold ride on my
LeMans
After 3 days and still partial numbness I went to doctor
Diagnosis was pinching of ulnar nerve with no real treatment except surgery. It slowly dissipated over about 3 weeks.
Now I use throttle lock and be mindful of it and have avoided a full on bout since
Yes, the numbness starting at the outside (pinky-side) of the palm is ulnar nerve territory. I'm not 100% sure but I think that an ulnar nerve stretching exercise is to make an "a-ok" sign (thumb to index finger and other three fingers straight up) and then to rotate your elbow up over your head and then to look through the a-ok. Remember as kids it was a funny face thing I'm sure you did in pictures. And yes, I'm doing it now and it's not as easy as it was when I was a kid and that's the stretch alright.
Anyhow, google it for a picture and try some stretches for a couple of minutes a few times a day. That may do some good, can't hurt anyway.
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Anecdotally, the same thing happens with bicycling. Shaking my hand brings the feeling back again. I stopped wearing cycling gloves as an experiment and the problem essentially disappeared. I always felt it was a circulation issue, but I almost failed biology in high school. There isn't much buzzing on a bicycle, so I would eliminate that. On the other hand, my first symptom of spinal stenosis was tingling, then numbness, in my foot. The docs had to do actual diagnostic medical tests to rule out circulation stuff (without running it by the folks here on the forum), then they started looking at nerve stuff.
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Yep, mine is positional aggravated by the vibrations. Not sure if it is shoulder or elbow since both were abused a lot playing baseball. I always use a throttle lock on my bikes and that solves the issue since I can move my hand around. The only problem times is continuous twisties where I can't use the lock.
FWIW, I get the same issue when my arm is in a particular position, whether on the bike, driving a car or sitting on the couch.
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Or spring for an expensive cruise control device.
not expensive and it WORKS!
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Buell/i-69dtg2Q/0/M/IMG_1977-M.jpg) (https://fotoguzzi.smugmug.com/Buell/i-69dtg2Q/A)
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Try heat. Helps me.
(http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic004/Oxford%20hot%20grips_5_zpsna9qqxv8.jpg)
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First let me say “look out here comes some free advice” :grin:
My wife had the same sort of problem and we tried every add on solution imaginable, got to the point where she would not ride her bikes. Then she went to the doctor and was diagnosed with carpal tunnel , lots of stuff in between, had surgery. Her wrists have not bothered her since but I did have to buy her a third bike. So go see a doctor.
Another thought is we use some sort of throttle lock, helper, either cramp busters or Throttlemeister on any bike we take on trips of any length.
Bob
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You can try changing handlebar positions but mostly it's bad nerves due to having too much fun when you were a young whelp.
Do you think it would be the cumulative effect of minor injuries ?
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I had the right hand numbness problem on my previous bike, a Suzuki 600 Bandit. I tried numerous changes to the bike such as handlebars, bar end weights, grips, seating position, gearing, etc. but nothing but getting rid of the bike fixed the problem.
I occasionally get a bit of numbness or tingling when riding my 90 degree v-twins but it isn't bad and a couple of quick shakes of the hand takes care of it.
I did find that some gloves were somewhat better than others. I now wear gloves that are a little on the loose side and have fingers/thumbs that are cut as long enough so that my finger tips don't touch the end of the gloves when my hand is curled into the gripping position.
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Same thing, strange most say right hand.
Mine starts the numb/tingling thing.
First stop or hill I put it straight down, usually fixes it.
Also have a Omni- cruise which is great and not made in china.
Harry
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Maybe unrelated but both my hands are gnarled and arthritic. I drop things all the time, and have trouble using the right amount of "squeeze" to do delicate work. Being a steel mill laborer, millwright, and an aircraft mechanic for 45 years did not help. The only way I can ride any length of time at all is to get a bike that allows me to sit up straight, with my arms out fairly straight, slight forward torso bend. That way I can twist the throttle to a desired setting, and then hold it in place without too much of a grip. It puts the arms in a good place to push the bars. I have found this to be much easier than Guzzi Cali style wheel barrow bars, or lower sporting bars. I put the bike in nuetral at stop lights, and use foot brake to avoid drift. Every little bit helps.
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Surprising no-one's said, sounds same as me, whitefinger or Raynaud's, common as muck, vibration and cold both agitate it
trying a powder, dissolved in water, will post when I remember what it is, has shown promise
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raynaud_syndrome
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I think wrbix and elevenminusoneblade have nailed it. I strongly suspect carpal tunnel.
I have carpal tunnel triggered by a previous autoimmune response to an injury. I have since developed another which is causing Reynauds amongst other things. What you are describing does not sound like Reynauds. My carpal tunnel really only gives me grief when I am reading a book or at night. When the numbness fills your entire hand you will most likely find that the little finger and the strip down the outer edge of the palm remain untouched.
I have been given nerve gliding exercises which really help. There are a heap of them online. My problem is caused by degradation of the nerve surface rather than compression caused by inflammation of the tunnel.
The riding position of the Breva is very easy on the wrist, so in general I have no real problem on the bike. If I do feel it coming on I use engine braking coming in to a corner and wave my hand/wrist vigorously. Usually eases off by the time I am ready to wick it. I have though started to investigate throttle locks for longer trips as it is the right hand of course that is the problem.
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Surprising no-one's said, sounds same as me, whitefinger or Raynaud's, common as muck, vibration and cold both agitate it
trying a powder, dissolved in water, will post when I remember what it is, has shown promise
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raynaud_syndrome
Raynaud's is in the differential - but really requires a noticeable color change in affected fingers (some say three phase required) to make that diagnosis. OP didn't describe that (yet).
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Whether cycling or motorcycling, I have had similar issues. The answer for me was achieving a better fit with my riding gloves. Any constriction of my hand causes numbness, so a good fit, soft leather, and a "pre-bent" glove design go a long way toward relief. Right hands are particularly vulnerable, due to throttle duties...
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I've had hand numbness for years. Had the test, reaction in the nerves was 60% delayed. Had the Carpel Tunnel Relief surgery......hand is GREAT!
Big problem is when you sleep many curl their wrists inward, like how a cat sleeps. This is bad on the "tunnel". At CVS drug stores they sell a wrist support by Futuro #482571 for $30.00 that's padded and prevents you from "curling" your wrist at night.
They work! While waiting my surgery I was wearing on both hands nightly and had zero pain riding 5 hours to a rally and 5 hours back.... My right hand needed the surgery so I still did it. After the surgery on the right hand I quit wearing them and the left hand would still go numb on the bike if I had not been wearing it. I now wear them both nightly, just because.
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Huzo....A Crampbuster is a great device to keep your wrist from getting into that tension spot, it uses your palm to keep the throttle in position rather than the fingers and you can ride all day with no tension in the right hand, but always good to stretch it forward and back as often as possible.
Since it's so easily adjustable, and can rotate around easily on the grips, you can adjust it infinitesimally to either city driving or highway cruising. Just practice a bit so you don't gun it accidentally at slow speeds, using the palm of the hand rather than the wrist/fingers allows for more gentle throttle control.
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I've had hand numbness for years. Had the test, reaction in the nerves was 60% delayed. Had the Carpel Tunnel Relief surgery......hand is GREAT!
Big problem is when you sleep many curl their wrists inward, like how a cat sleeps. This is bad on the "tunnel". At CVS drug stores they sell a wrist support by Futuro #482571 for $30.00 that's padded and prevents you from "curling" your wrist at night.
They work! While waiting my surgery I was wearing on both hands nightly and had zero pain riding 5 hours to a rally and 5 hours back.... My right hand needed the surgery so I still did it. After the surgery on the right hand I quit wearing them and the left hand would still go numb on the bike if I had not been wearing it. I now wear them both nightly, just because.
Yep....known generically in the business as a "cock up splint". Careful where y'all go with that.
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Ok, what started out as a partial play on words to generate a humorous response has actually given me some very useful tactics to minimise the problem. To be honest, it's not as bad on the Norge as previous sport bikes but can creep in still from time to time. Thanks all for offering good advice learned from long experience and congrats to those who have found some "hand relief". (Someone had to say it, and I guess I'm the only one childish enough !). Some got close I think.
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Big problem is when you sleep many curl their wrists inward, like how a cat sleeps. This is bad on the "tunnel". At CVS drug stores they sell a wrist support by Futuro #482571 for $30.00 that's padded and prevents you from "curling" your wrist at night.
They work!
A big :1: :thumb: on that one John. I use one for my right hand only, the left is not too bad at this stage. Mine is a different brand; has a rigid lightweight shaped piece of reinforcing in it which stops the hand curling. Now sleeping much better which helps in itself.
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not expensive and it WORKS!
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Buell/i-69dtg2Q/0/M/IMG_1977-M.jpg) (https://fotoguzzi.smugmug.com/Buell/i-69dtg2Q/A)
Works great! I have two :bike-037: :bike-037: :thumb:
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This might sound a bit simplistic but bear with me...do you wear a wristwatch on that arm? If I wear a watch the constriction will cause my left hand to go numb just as you describe. I think the pressure of the watchband combined with the glove is just enough to cause the problem. No watch, no problem!
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This might sound a bit simplistic but bear with me...do you wear a wristwatch on that arm? If I wear a watch the constriction will cause my left hand to go numb just as you describe. I think the pressure of the watchband combined with the glove is just enough to cause the problem. No watch, no problem!
Nothing's off the table Doggie when it comes to possible causes. Can be a bonus if your hand's still numb when you stop for a wee !!!
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See post #14 first.
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In my case I always wear my watch on my left wrist, right hand is affected worse.