Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: toaster404 on May 09, 2017, 07:00:06 AM
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My wife (no makeup lumberjill cargo pants 5-9 early 30s) currently rides a Versys 650. She keeps looking at pictures (this is so much better than a Victoria's Secret make up cucumber on eyes version) of things like the Royal Enfield and other small classics. Now she's excited about the Honda Rebel 500. I have some concern that I'll find her with a delightful project that will require me to tow a tool trailer behind me to support her motorcycle trips. So I'm thinking of working towards a fun local trip bike. Local trips from here include the Dragon, Cherohala Skyway, and a good deal of 60 mph 4 lane. She's also taken with the scrambler look.
On my end of things, I've never ridden anything like my Guzzi and suspect she'd like something with that cool kind of feel.
On the position, she's an ADV to standard position person.
Any ideas? I don't know the older Guzzi line and when I think of matching her to the bikes I know, I end up in the 1970s (probably dates me). Something with decent torque, probably 40 HP more or less, 400 lbs or less, fairly reasonable CG, classic lines and handling. Looks retro. Relatively cheap. That I can work on. A single carb bike with rocker arm valve adjustments would be great.
I would LOVE some suggestions, lest I find a project, an Enfield, or (heaven forbid) an expensive Bonneville sitting by the other bikes for me to take care of!!!
Thanks much
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I'm going to go out on a limb here but a newer V7?
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How about a V65?
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Some of the criteria are gonna be hard to meet . Single carburetor means a single cylinder or a Brit twin model with a branched manifold . 400 lbs and simple to maintain eliminates a whole bunch of other classic bikes .
Seems like a newer V7 or a /5 BMW might be the logical choices . A nice '69-'73 /5 beemer can be had for $3K , a slightly used V7 for a bit more .
Dusty
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http://rycamotors.com/RYCA-cs2-standard-&-scrambler-kit.html
(http://rycamotors.com/images/cs2page/gallery/ryca-scrambler-kit-01.jpg)
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I'm going to go out on a limb here but a newer V7?
Agreed...On the Guzzi side, Modern V7 or Stornello, or 500cc Monza or equivalent, V65 also, but find a clean one that has been sorted, ridden, and maintained! :cool: :1: :thumb:
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what bike do you ride? basically you describe a V7 or a enfield,
if you've got a powerfull bike the difference between the enfield and your bike can get annoying.
recent bikes require hardly any maintenance, so adding one to the fleet shouldnt be a problem , regardless of choice.
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Show her the RE Himalayan & have her test ride. Cheap enough. Not a lot of history out there yet, but so far impressed. Fits my niece who is a little shorter & who also likes the classic-looking bikes, the ones that don't look like insects. Get her to test ride anything she fancies - she'll fall for something appropriate.
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V-7.Ticks all the boxes. Done. See, that was easy. On a more realistic note, sounds like you have a fun challenge to help your wife find the right bike that she would be happy with. Good times,my friend.
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Honda CX, not single carb but checks the other boxes. Search the cx500 forum for information, it includes the larger 650 CX, 500 and 650GL models. Japanese Moto Guzzi in some ways.
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One bike that might do it is a 500 Triumph. The 500 single carb Triumph is a lot cheaper than the 650. Once set up it can be quite reliable and for classic looks, it is hard to beat. Here is a picture of my 500 Triumph. It is under 300 pounds but it is heavily modified. It started out as a 1973 Adventurer.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/jwu5mQ/DSCF1757.jpg) (http://ibb.co/jwu5mQ)
Another consideration is the Honda GB500. These tend to be expensive but they do come up at reasonable prices every once and a while. They are classic in their own right, but they also have the looks of an old AJS.
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I'm confused as to the purpose of the bike.
Is she looking for a project to wrench on or turn into something else, or is she like my wife and just WANTS SOMETHING THAT LOOKS A CERTAIN WAY but would prefer it to be turn key?
I.E. are you looking at old bikes for the price or for the look? Cause if it's the latter you can get the LOOK without the hassle (and that seems to appeal to many of the women riders I know).
A few come to mind immediately:
Street Twin
Triumph Bobber
V7
Scrambler
I'm just not sold on the RE's being uh, modernly reliable enough yet.
And if she's already used to the power and capability of a Versys 650, I dunno that she'd be happy with something like an RE.
But again that depends on her reasoning and wants.
EDIT - OOOOOHHHH, how about W650.... I might just know of one that is mechanically sound but a little cosmetically challenged....
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(https://i2.wp.com/www.bike-urious.com/wp-content/uploads/MZ-Silver-Star-Classic-Right-Side.jpg?zoom=1.25&fit=881%2C629)
http://www.bike-urious.com/1994-mz-silver-star-classic/
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I sent her the Himalayan. That looks perfect, except for the obvious compromise on power.
W650 with cosmetic issues are OK. I can do all the mechanicals and all the cosmestics ONCE. While I have the skills to fabricate things and do major work, at my age I am not really interested in more than cleanup, paint, replace hoses & wear parts, and get the systems adjusted properly. The W650 would make sense. Looks right, not too much bike, EZ working machine.
I would prefer a less expensive more or less modern bike. We're going to go have her ride a V-7. And a Bonneville. Will look for other things. An excellent Nevada showed up cheap, but I can't see her really adapting to that position well.
On the other hand, her first solo commute to work today, and she made it. Figuring out some adjustments. Maybe she'll adapt. Might be the Versys high CG and the I-am-autistic-and-weird styling. Matches her, but don't tell her that!
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If it's to be a modern, cheap bike with cafe styling for 60mph roads, I would buy (and may yet buy) an SSR Buccaneer 250i, designed by Italjet in Italy, and built in China. It's $3599. I've examined and test ridden one. 17 horsepower is the equivalent of having 17 horses at your disposal! At about 300 pounds, that's only 18 pounds for each horse to haul around. The top speed is 75 mph, if there is no wind and no hill to climb.
(http://www.ssrmotorsports.com/store/street/buccaneer/cafe/ca.jpg)
Here it is, second from the top, carefully reproduced (by me) at the same scale as two other bikes you might be considering:
(http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p135/motocomo/SSR%20vs%20Guzzi%20vs%20SYM.png)
It doesn't have a carburetor. Fuel injected, electronic ignition. The motor is a clone of the Yamaha 250 Virago, so you could get one of those with a carburetor and build her up a hot rod ( :wink:) if you want to twirl wrenches. (The gas tank has been found to be about 3.5 gallons and the price has gone up by $100 since I made that comparison graphic.)
Moto
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:1: to Kev's comments above -- all the bikes he listed are good choices. I'd likely skip the Genuine G400C. While the motor is a copy of the 400cc Honda single from the XR400, it is still a Chinese-made product. For the price of a G400C, you can buy a used V7. While the G400C will have a resale value of half what you paid in short order, a pre-owned V7 will more-or-less hold it's value, as would a W650, or pre-owned Triumph. The benefit being, aside from having a much higher-quality bike, if she changes her mind later, you can get your money back out of it.
Moto Guzzi are currently offering $2,000 off the V7II Special, and $1,500 off the V7II Stone.
Recently, I saw a lightly used (< 5,000 miles) V7 Stone on CL for $4,700.
I enjoy my vintage bikes, but, have a 2014 V7 Special that is turn key, and my preferred rider for putting any miles on than my vintage bikes -- partly to keep miles off the vintage bikes, and partly because I have better shocks on it than I do any of my vintage bikes.
It has the good looks and "feel" of a vintage bike with the benefits of modern engine management and good brakes.
Finally, the best advice I can offer is to make sure that SHE picks the bike, and that you don't pick it for her. You can make suggestions, but, the final choice has to be hers for her to truly be happy (even then, there are no guarantees :grin:).
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Agreed...On the Guzzi side, Modern V7 or Stornello
:1: A modern V7 of some kind doesn't meet the OP's specs exactly but would seem to fit the bill. I was thinking Stornello.
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:1: A modern V7 of some kind doesn't meet the OP's specs exactly but would seem to fit the bill. I was thinking Stornello.
Oh yeah, forgot, she likes the Scrambler look.
Well, then add to the list both the Triumph and Ducati Scramblers too.
Skip the Royal Enfield. They require as much fettling as a tru vintage bike.
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Finally, the best advice I can offer is to make sure that SHE picks the bike, and that you don't pick it for her. You can make suggestions, but, the final choice has to be hers for her to truly be happy (even then, there are no guarantees :grin:).
Mic drop please!
Absofreakinglutely
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She's pretty much immune to my influences at this point, regardless. Her first bike I just went and got her (VStar 250) because it was clear that she was clueless. But the piles of motorcycle magazines and her search for her next bike demonstrate she has a mind of her own. My role is to make sure the thing is safe and set for riding, and she's learning how to do a full check over. In spite of her uncertainty (stated) on corners, she seems to have developed her skills well enough that there are negligible chicken strips on her Versys tires.
I do have to get her on a V-7. Seems an obvious choice, but she balked before. We went to look at one and I rode home on a California. Won't do that again! I have to get her on an RE so she understands why she doesn't want the 500. This new Himalayan looks great, if it ever gets here!
thanks all
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Maybe 2017 SR400 Yamaha. ?
Brand new $5k.
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I'm still hearing shades of you trying to get her to look at something. I've BTDT, it just doesn't matter. In my experience, either the girl wants it or doesn't and I think most of em make their mind up in minutes just looking at a photo.
Now I'll admit I have occasionally seen one change their minds in person. Back when Jenn was looking for her second bike (more than a decade ago) she sat on an R1200C (that she'd previously liked in photos) and HATED it, so as fate would have it the next stop she sat on a Sportster (that she'd previously been ambivalent about in photos) and LOVED IT. Wound up with two of them over the next 6 years or so.
BUT, somewhere along the way she saw a Ducati, wanted a Ducati, and never got the thought of a Ducati out of her head and THAT WAS IT. The Sporty was doomed, which is fine.
I did TRY to get her to look at a V7 the day we BOUGHT a Ducati... she looked, and then turned and made a deal on the Ducati. :grin: :laugh: :grin:
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I don't get it, what's wrong with the Kaw?
None of the bikes listed represents an upgrade.
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I'd hold off on the Himalayan for now (and I want one really bad myself)
From ADVRider.com:
"http://bikeadvice.in/re-himalayan-serious-engine-issues-other-severe-problems-reported/
https://www.motorbeam.com/2017/03/b...ld-himalayan-quality-issues-are-way-too-many/
https://www.rushlane.com/royal-enfield-himalayan-quality-reliability-12237993.html
http://riderzone.in/royal-enfield-himalayan-price-positives-negatives-adventure-motorcycle/
And lastly and most importantly, go through this 55 page ownership thread. Point out ONE bike which hasnt had a bulk of its parts swapped.
http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/motorcycle-ownership-experiences/34161-royal-enfield-himalayan.html"
How 'bout the new BMW 310?
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Depends on the definition of upgrade. Or even if such a thing is desired or needed.
V7 sounds spot on to me.
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Ducati Monster? available in many displacements & models both old & new so suit all budgets - good handling & strong V-twin torque or maybe a Ducati Scrambler if you want new?
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Just another data point...
A friend of mine, (he is a little guy about 5'4" 115 lbs. - maybe), in Phoenix rode a SYM 150cc Wolf for a time. It was a great little bike, and nice looking as well. However, he could not take it on the freeway because it to was too "anemic" (aka under powered) at highway speeds of 70-75 mph.
So he it and bought a new Yamaha R3 (300cc). He is MUCH happier now with the overall performance and 150cc more motor. :1: :cool: :thumb:
(http://thumb.ibb.co/d3DbAk/Screen_Shot_2017_05_09_at_1_25_42_PM.png) (http://ibb.co/d3DbAk)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/iRR7GQ/Screen_Shot_2017_05_09_at_1_26_05_PM.png) (http://ibb.co/iRR7GQ)
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Maybe 2017 SR400 Yamaha. ?
Brand new $5k.
Kick start only. Not that women can't kick start a bike, but, she may not want to.
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Kick start only. Not that women can't kick start a bike, but, she may not want to.
After owning a string of kick start only bikes from 1968 until about 1990 , I can highly recommend electric starters :rolleyes:
Dusty
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On horsepower alone the V7 is streets ahead of all those other weird looking bikes.
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Kick-start ONLY or not...I think these SR400's are sweet little bikes...Would love to have one in the stable! :thumb: :1: :cool: Also it's predecessor, the SR500 or the SRX600!! :wink:
(http://thumb.ibb.co/idurRQ/Screen_Shot_2017_05_09_at_5_44_49_PM.png) (http://ibb.co/idurRQ)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/fRxBRQ/Screen_Shot_2017_05_09_at_5_44_57_PM.png) (http://ibb.co/fRxBRQ)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/d2R5mQ/Screen_Shot_2017_05_09_at_5_45_16_PM.png) (http://ibb.co/d2R5mQ)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/bDs0Lk/Screen_Shot_2017_05_09_at_5_45_23_PM.png) (http://ibb.co/bDs0Lk)
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Wow. Reading this stuff makes me glad I got an older RE Bullet 500 with the non unit case. It has actually been quite reliable for me the past two years. Front drum brake is awful, but that is my only complaint. It has a top comfortable cruising speed of 50 mph. At 55 and above the handlebar vibes get worse & worse. So I cruise it on back roads and stay off hiways. Ridden like that, it is comfortable and light handling and a lot of fun. Perfect bike for the BRP!
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Got a date with a V-7, maybe this weekend, and a line on a Bonneville she can take on a substantial ride and get if she likes. So things are coming together.
On the other hand, she commuted solo on the Versys today and did OK.
I'm not going to fight with this one, whatever she wants we'll figure out!
Great suggestions above and I'm passing them on to her.
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On the other hand, she commuted solo on the Versys today and did OK.
I'm not going to fight with this one, whatever she wants we'll figure out!
Great suggestions above and I'm passing them on to her.
So are we to take it this is a replacement for the Versus?
Is it because there's something she doesn't like about it, looks, height?
Just curious.
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On horsepower alone the V7 is streets ahead of all those other weird looking bikes.
We are definitely not in Kansas anymore! Not sure anybody has ever said that before and if they did it probably wasn't true.
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Well them V7s Paul, they can throw ya right off the back if you ain't experienced. And never use the front brake you'll go over the bars. Of course if you have to lay er down..... :grin:
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This is maybe way off base but I was also wondering what was wrong with the Versys. I remember liking them when they came out but I had forgotten what they looked like so I just googled Versys and found that they have a new one in 300cc. To me that looks like a fun bike especially for the Dragon. Hardly a classic though!
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Got a date with a V-7, maybe this weekend, and a line on a Bonneville she can take on a substantial ride and get if she likes. So things are coming together.
On the other hand, she commuted solo on the Versys today and did OK.
I'm not going to fight with this one, whatever she wants we'll figure out!
Great suggestions above and I'm passing them on to her.
The Versus is just a great motorcycle that few bikes in that range can compare.
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The Versus is just a great motorcycle that few bikes in that range can compare.
Unless of course it's as simple as "she doesn't like it" which then it doesn't matter as IT can't compare to the bikes in "that" range.
That's where I'd be personally.
I've put some miles on a Versys, it was adequate in a lot of ways, inspiring in none. But that's a taste thing.
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Great news Ken. I am still awaiting your preference regarding the test rides of the Harley, Indian and Cal 14 of 4 years ago. I am glad you have a definitive non preference for the Versus. Quite helpful to many here no doubt.
The Versus is a faster, better handling motorcycle let down by utter reliability.
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How about the KTM 390, it's supposed to be a great riding bike and $4999 new. :thumb:
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Great news Ken. I am still awaiting your preference regarding the test rides of the Harley, Indian and Cal 14 of 4 years ago. I am glad you have a definitive non preference for the Versus. Quite helpful to many here no doubt.
The Versus is a faster, better handling motorcycle let down by utter reliability.
I think you completely missed the point.
The Versys (did both our autocorrects do that spelling? lol) may be all that to you or someone who plain likes it. To anyone else it might as well be a Keurig and none of that matters.
She already HAS a Versys (or access to one) and for whatever personal reason she is looking for something else, which suggests she's not happy with it, i.e she has her own non preference.
And I know you were being sarcastic, but I'll still probably take the RK over a Cali 1400, Indian, or especially now, a Vic. Though now I have to ride the new M8.
Meanwhile I still think the next bike to join the fleet will be the new CX Roadster.
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I think you completely missed the point.
The Versys (did both our autocorrects do that spelling? lol) may be all that to you or someone who plain likes it. To anyone else it might as well be a Keurig and none of that matters.
She already HAS a Versys (or access to one) and for whatever personal reason she is looking for something else, which suggests she's not happy with it, i.e she has her own non preference.
And I know you were being sarcastic, but I'll still probably take the RK over a Cali 1400, Indian, or especially now, a Vic. Though now I have to ride the new M8.
Meanwhile I still think the next bike to join the fleet will be the new CX Roadster.
totally got your point and I think you got mine. And appreciate the spell help.
Glad you decided on the RK after 4 years of consideration. :evil:
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Glad you decided on the RK after 4 years of consideration. :evil:
Ha ha, but I'll still probably buy a Sporty, lol.
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Weird how different perception can be , having ridden a couple of Sportsters over the last few years I can discern zero similarities to my Jackal , like none , zip, nada . OK , maybe in acceleration , but literally nothing else .
Dusty
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Weird how different perception can be , having ridden a couple of Sportsters over the last few years I can discern zero similarities to my Jackal , like none , zip, nada . OK , maybe in acceleration , but literally nothing else .
Dusty
Size, weight, power-to-weight ratio are all more similar than dissimilar. They differ largely by fractions or singles digits.
The Jackal was A HAIR longer, made a tad less HP and torque, weighed a few pounds less, felt like it turned a little quicker, had a little more vibration.
But all sooooo much more similar than so many other bikes from Bonnie's to Oilheads, from Bricks to Ducs, from BT Harleys to Vic's or Neo-Indians to obviously most everything from JAPanInc.
But I'm measuring with a yardstick and not a micrometer.
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Calling BS on that one Kev. I don't think the Jackal makes less HP than a Sportster: The Guzzi revs another 2k rpms.
So far as vibrations, you must be talking about a rubber mount Sporty, otherwise way off base.
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If she gets something else I'll dump my VStrom and keep the Versys. The Versys is amazing. Much better suspension than the stock suspension on the VStrom. And I have decided I really don't need a litre ADV bike - smaller would be better. I can flog that Versys pretty nice, too!
Been talking to her and am thinking that I might be able to fix her general issues. Suspect she's hanging onto the bars tight. My demo of doing twisties 2 up on the big Guzzi with thumb and finger on each grip apparently had an influence.
Will see what she does. She looks so good for the most part!
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After owning a string of kick start only bikes from 1968 until about 1990 , I can highly recommend electric starters :rolleyes:
Dusty
As luck would have it, anyone with issues kick starting THIS bike,
Yamaha will throw in a box of tampons...
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Calling BS on that one Kev. I don't think the Jackal makes less HP than a Sportster: The Guzzi revs another 2k rpms.
I keep a spreadsheet on various bikes, here are some facts/figures I've compiled, largely but not all from MCN (M Consumer News), but also from Motorcyclist, Motorcycle.com, CW, and some individual dyno sheets etc., many dimensional specs from OEM:
97 Cali - 540 dry / 553 wet, 93.7" length, 61.4" wheelbase, 59 rwhp / 58 ft. lbs. torque
00 Jackal - 542 dry / 572 wet, 92.7" length, 61.4" wheelbase, 62 rwhp / 60 ft. lbs. torque
10 Cal Vin - 580 dry / 616 wet, 93.7" length, 61.4" wheelbase, 68 rwhp / 58 ft. lbs. torque
11 Black Eagle - 553 dry / 589 wet, 93.7" length, 61.4" wheelbase, 68 rwhp / 58 ft. lbs. torque
04 1200R - 565 dry / 585 wet, 90.1" length, 60.0" wheelbase, 58 rwhp / 69 ft. lbs. torque (carb)
07 XL50 - 558 dry / 578 wet, 89.1 length, 60.0" wheelbase, 64 rwhp / 73 ft. lbs. torque (EFI)
09 XR1200 - 526 dry / 580 wet, 85.4 length, 59.8" wheelbase, 79 rwhp / 68 ft. lbs. torque
16 1200CX - 549 dry / 568 wet, 86.0 length, 59.3" wheelbase, 69 rwhp / 74 ft. lbs. torque
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g115/sgozdzi/Dynos/sportin_2007.jpg)
Of course you probably are more aware than most on this board how Harley purposely chokes the motors and how much a Stage I can do for them (much more in my observation than most other brands who don't seem to purposely handicap them). As such it's not uncommon to see a simple Stage I rubbermount dyno in the mid-to-high 60's or low 70's hp.
I suspect a Stage I on a new CX will easily make high 70s, and might touch low 80s at the rear wheel.
So far as vibrations, you must be talking about a rubber mount Sporty, otherwise way off base.
That's all that they've sold for 13+ years now (since 2004) so yeah, of course I am.
I wrote sporty's off in the 90s, swore I'd never own another, but a demo of a 2004 1200R changed all that, and now I'm planning the purchase of #4 (#5 if you count the solidmount I had in 93-95).
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I never personally owned a Sportster, but have ridden several...vintage and modern...and I always liked the no frills look. :1: This "Forty-Eight" model is way cool. :thumb: :cool: If I had the room and extra lettuce, I would have no issues owning and riding one. :wink: :smiley: I also always like the Jackal and the Stone model Guzzi's as well...same thing...no frills...stripped down...pure motorcycle! :thumb: :cool:
(http://thumb.ibb.co/mcUy6Q/Screen_Shot_2017_05_11_at_7_02_06_AM.png) (http://ibb.co/mcUy6Q)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/hfuLLk/Screen_Shot_2017_05_11_at_7_02_21_AM.png) (http://ibb.co/hfuLLk)
free image hosting for websites (http://imgbb.com/)
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yeah Kev, you can hot rod a harley and make it pull pretty hard. Certainly you can spend a ton of money and get power where a Sporty can run like a 15 year old Jackal or even faster.
So when you spend all that money to throw all those mods and make Guzzi power+, does the engine shake like a jack hammer? Much easier to have a stock bike that smoothly revs another 2000 rpm which is my preference.
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yeah Kev, you can hot rod a harley and make it pull pretty hard. Certainly you can spend a ton of money and get power where a Sporty can run like a 15 year old Jackal or even faster.
So when you spend all that money to throw all those mods and make Guzzi power+, does the engine shake like a jack hammer? Much easier to have a stock bike that smoothly revs another 2000 rpm which is my preference.
Except that I quoted you STOCK numbers in that comparison. So again my 07 Sporty STOCK ran just fine/just as fast as my 00 Jackal. And a new CX would be a bit quicker.
And no, I don't bother going full Stage I as I don't like loud exhausts. I ran very lightly modified exhausts on my 07 for 10 years and just recently went back to stock. It runs great, no jack hammer and MUCH SMOOTHER THAN MY JACKAL (or BREVA 1100) EVER WAS.
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As luck would have it, anyone with issues kick starting THIS bike,
Yamaha will throw in a box of tampons...
Your knees aren't shot :laugh:
Dusty
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Good point ! :boozing: :grin:
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Except that I quoted you STOCK numbers in that comparison. So again my 07 Sporty STOCK ran just fine/just as fast as my 00 Jackal. And a new CX would be a bit quicker.
And no, I don't bother going full Stage I as I don't like loud exhausts. I ran very lightly modified exhausts on my 07 for 10 years and just recently went back to stock. It runs great, no jack hammer and MUCH SMOOTHER THAN MY JACKAL (or BREVA 1100) EVER WAS.
the dyno chart had a St 1 kit with screamin bald eagles. Really, the sporty goes to 5500 rpm and the Guzzi will run 7k with another k over rev. I won't pick nits withya, since I am confused with all your numbers and charts. And we're comparing a Cali, not a sport Guzzi which seems crazy when you're showing bald eagles .... but ride whatcya want.
I am sure your original statement is true in some circumstances. Still if we're comparing 15 year old sportsters to jackals (which was on my mind)....which is oranges to oranges, BUT, I am sure you can show me a 15 year old vance and hines pro-stocker-buel-sportster-eagle-stroker-blower and still win the argument. Win at all costs or don't try. I should know better.
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Something like a 2012 V7 Racer might just be the ticket and come to think of it I know where there might be one for sale.
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the dyno chart had a St 1 kit with screamin bald eagles. Really, the sporty goes to 5500 rpm and the Guzzi will run 7k with another k over rev. I won't pick nits withya, since I am confused with all your numbers and charts. And we're comparing a Cali, not a sport Guzzi which seems crazy when you're showing bald eagles .... but ride whatcya want.
I am sure your original statement is true in some circumstances. Still if we're comparing 15 year old sportsters to jackals (which was on my mind)....which is oranges to oranges, BUT, I am sure you can show me a 15 year old vance and hines pro-stocker-buel-sportster-eagle-stroker-blower and still win the argument. Win at all costs or don't try. I should know better.
Not for nothing my friend but the chart ALSO SHOWED BONE STOCK NUMBERS which is what I quoted, and listed in the comparison, in BOLD so it wouldn't confuse you and it clearly showed the 07, bone stock bike, made more HP (a tad) than a Jackal of almost identical size and weight.
Which was really the only point.
You called BS, so I backed up my statements with figures.
Cue mic drop. [emoji56]
I don't know why Jackal rpm range confuses you so, the Sporty makes more torque too, by a margin and at an rpm that makes up for the difference I guess.
Of course we're comparing Calis and not other models, the whole conversation started when I said how similar my Cali was to my Sporty. [emoji28]
I don't know where this win at all costs or other stuff started. Maybe you called BS on my statement understanding it which moves the goal posts in my mind.
Maybe I was unclear in my post. For me the Sportster changed completely in 2004 making it a completely different (improved) bike from what it was that. So I'd compare an 00 Jackal (I that I owned) to an 04 later (like I own). And I'd probably choose an 07+ to get EFI. So that's what I meant when I stated "Sportster".
That would explain this 15 year old distraction. I mean I wasn't calling for some ultimate year by year analysis of the merits of a Sportster vs a Cali. I just noted a similarity in two bikes I owned.
But if you want I'll be happy to go and compare some solidmounts to the Jackal. Though I'm not sure that would be oranges and oranges.
The solidmount would be lighter by up to 50# (which helps a little) but would be carbureted instead of EFI. I'd expect it to make less HP than the Jackal, maybe even less than the 97 Cali I posted, and that's fine. It wouldn't bother me in any way, nor change my original statement.
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Kev, the only thing I am not confused about is that the Guzzi has 2k more revs than than a "sporty".
Other than that, you can cherry pick all the sporsters you want since the Jackal went out of production 15 years ago, add bald eagle parts to it and win your argument at all costs. Bravo.
My thinking was a stock jackal beats a stock 15 year old sportster and revving another 2 grand helps.
But for sure there are vance and hines-stroker-blower-racing-screaming-nitro-buel- eagle versions that have come out over the last 15 years that can outrun a jackal. Some might outrun my V11 sport too.
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It's all in how you look at it. Either the 2004 and up Sportsters are well thought out, reliable, good looking bikes with no-fuss belt drive and hydro valves, easy to maintain single point fueling, decent brakes and plenty of power for the class they reside in.....OR they are still a beginner bike for gay pirates. Truth is, Sporties are both. I favor the balance, handling and power delivery of the Guzzi, but that is opinion. You pay your $ and ride what you like. Those 500 Rebels ain't looking too shabby, either.
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Kev, the only thing I am not confused about is that the Guzzi has 2k more revs than than a "sporty".
Other than that, you can cherry pick all the sporsters you want since the Jackal went out of production 15 years ago, add bald eagle parts to it and win your argument at all costs. Bravo.
My thinking was a stock jackal beats a stock 15 year old sportster and revving another 2 grand helps.
But for sure there are vance and hines-stroker-blower-racing-screaming-nitro-buel- eagle versions that have come out over the last 15 years that can outrun a jackal. Some might outrun my V11 sport too.
Never mind, you're utterly hopeless.
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I'd advise against most singles. They vibrate like crazy.
I'll stop there- not going the obvious places...
What does she think about dirt bikes? I have a KTM350 that, yes it's a single, is an absolute hoot to ride. Not a highway bike at all though (20 minutes ok, not an hour).
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Most Aussies know everything, the rest just know a hell of a lot.. :wink: