Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Ncdan on July 04, 2017, 10:34:45 AM
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Hey guys I need a diagnostic. My odometer and trip gauge have quit working. Where do I start looking for the cause and how much stuff do I have to take off to fix, that will determine if I need a real wrench.
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If it has a cable, I would look there. It happens, yours is not the first, but late EV's would break inside. I have sent them to Hollywood, CA to get fixed.
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Speedo still works? Then it's inside the Gauge, probly some plastic gears mashed. What bike?
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Might be helpful to know the make and model bike in question????
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Sorry for the oversight guys I figured y'all would all know my bike, lol. She's an 07 calvan. The speed O works fine but neither odometer or trip work. Bike had 7,000 miles when it quit a few miles ago. I have a trip planed and need a fix ASAP!
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get a Sigma bicycle speedo, way more accurate than the ITI cheap plastic gears model your Guzzi came with.
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get a Sigma bicycle speedo, way more accurate than the ITI cheap plastic gears model your Guzzi came with.
Thanks for the suggestion Foto but I really want the original working correctly and keep an accurate account of the bikes mileage. I'll do what is necessary to fix it properly. I'm hoping someone would have had this issue and can offer an exact fix.
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I'm hoping someone would have had this issue and can offer an exact fix.
Sure, buy a new one. That's what I had to do.
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You can enter your present mileage into the Signa, doubt you can do that with a new stock speedo.
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For the long term fix, maybe this will help you outhttp://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=76486.0 (http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=76486.0)
Adam
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I don't know if things may have improved, but ITI instruments are known for being almost impossible to disassemble without destruction and then you find that internal parts are virtually unobtainable. Palo Alto speedometer hasn't been any help. You might try others. North Hollywood Speedometer? Anyone have any success? If you want it to look correct, leave the instrument or buy a new one. If you want accurate mileage readout then buy a bicycle unit or a SpeedHut gps unit.
Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA
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Do yourself a huge favour and get a set of speed huts c/w Guzzi logo. Speedhut will set the odo to match your old one if you ask them
Also ask them to seal the glass and get the rear reset buttons.
Sent from my shoe phone!
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My CalVin odometer died at 16,000.Opened it up and found metal shards (that used to be gears)everywhere. I did the electric Speedometer and GM sending unit.
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Sure, buy a new one. That's what I had to do.
where
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You can enter your present mileage into the Signa, doubt you can do that with a new stock speedo.
does it fit in the same place as the factory one and look the same?
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Dan,
This happened to my Calvin on the way to a rally, same trip where my fuel pump hose popped off. Speedo fine (electric), ODO (cable) dead. Cable snapped where it took a bend under the seat. New cable, all good. I'd bet a billion dollars the cable is in two pieces. Mine was an '09, and the dreaded speedo bugs had been worked out. Damn, I miss that bike.
Cam
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Dan,
This happened to my Calvin on the way to a rally, same trip where my fuel pump hose popped off. Speedo fine (electric), ODO (cable) dead. Cable snapped where it took a bend under the seat. New cable, all good. I'd bet a billion dollars the cable is in two pieces. Mine was an '09, and the dreaded speedo bugs had been worked out. Damn, I miss that bike.
Cam
AhHa, in that case look for a broken cable (inside the sheath) just up from the tranny where it makes a too sharp bend around the airbox.
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Dan,
This happened to my Calvin on the way to a rally, same trip where my fuel pump hose popped off. Speedo fine (electric), ODO (cable) dead. Cable snapped where it took a bend under the seat. New cable, all good. I'd bet a billion dollars the cable is in two pieces. Mine was an '09, and the dreaded speedo bugs had been worked out. Damn, I miss that bike.
Cam
Cam, can you give me a call at your convenience at 336-416- 0491. Thanks
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Wait wait wait , you had a working odometer ? Sure that wasn't an octopus delusion ?
Dusty
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You still have a working speedometer means that your cable is fine.
There is a worm drive that drives two worms, one worm goes to odometer and other to trip meter.
Sounds like the gear that drives the worns has failed.
You hve to open the case to address this issue. Once the case is open the mechanism comes apart without much effort.
You'll probably need a second instrument for parts. While in there lubricate all components properly.
Or get a good speedometer and open the case to set the odometer to match your true mileage. The odometer cluster just unclips. Play with it a bit, like a rubics cube, and you will find its easy to set each digit without disassembling the odometer stack.
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You still have a working speedometer means that your cable is fine.
There is a worm drive that drives two worms, one worm goes to odometer and other to trip meter.
Sounds like the gear that drives the worns has failed.
You hve to open the case to address this issue. Once the case is open the mechanism comes apart without much effort.
You'll probably need a second instrument for parts. While in there lubricate all components properly.
Or get a good speedometer and open the case to set the odometer to match your true mileage. The odometer cluster just unclips. Play with it a bit, like a rubics cube, and you will find its easy to set each digit without disassembling the odometer stack.
Ron, are you sure that the Calvin has a cable which runs the speedometer and it's not electric and the cable runs the odometer and trip meter?
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Wait wait wait , you had a working odometer ? Sure that wasn't an octopus delusion ?
Dusty
The speed O meter works Dusty, you are confusing an
Already confused mind, or lack of ;)
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You still have a working speedometer means that your cable is fine.
There is a worm drive that drives two worms, one worm goes to odometer and other to trip meter.
Sounds like the gear that drives the worns has failed.
You hve to open the case to address this issue. Once the case is open the mechanism comes apart without much effort.
You'll probably need a second instrument for parts. While in there lubricate all components properly.
Or get a good speedometer and open the case to set the odometer to match your true mileage. The odometer cluster just unclips. Play with it a bit, like a rubics cube, and you will find its easy to set each digit without disassembling the odometer stack.
are you sure the speedometer is not controlled electrically because when my battery went bad best I remember it effected the speedometer. Are you sure it's not electronic operated and the cable runs the odometer and trip meter?
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Are there systems that have a speed/miles instrument that uses separate inputs? Seems odd to bother with a cable if you are already receiving electronic progress signals.
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The speed O meter works Dusty, you are confusing an
Already confused mind, or lack of ;)
I'm stunned the ODO WAS working , keep that bike , it was obviously a Wednesday build .
Dusty
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I'm stunned the ODO WAS working , keep that bike , it was obviously a Wednesday build .
Dusty
ok, seriously, the speedometer works but the odometer and trip does not. If the speedometer is controlled electronically then a broken cable could be the problem, right?
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Cam is competent and I know he wouldn't just make shit up.
If he says he had a Cal-Vin with the same failure (trip/odo, but not speedo) then there's no reason to not check the cable.
I'm guessing n3303j just has experience with a different year/model.
But you could always check a wiring diagram if you're unsure. It's just that there weren't that many years of Cal-Vins for there to be many variances.
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I am not aware of any "hybrid" units on the Cali bikes of the time. All mechanical. If your speedo is working and the odo is not, your trouble is internal to the speedo itself.
If everything stopped working, then the cable has either broken or slipped upward out of the transmission so the square drive stops making contact with the drive gear. I have had this happen to me.
John Henry
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The diagram on the attached link lists the cable as an "odometer cable." The exploded view and parts list may help you figure things out...
http://www.harpermoto.com/parts-by-motorcycle/2000-up-moto-guzzi-motorcycles/california-vintage-1100-2006-2008/dashboard-en-california-vintage-1100.html
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I am not aware of any "hybrid" units on the Cali bikes of the time. All mechanical. If your speedo is working and the odo is not, your trouble is internal to the speedo itself.
If everything stopped working, then the cable has either broken or slipped upward out of the transmission so the square drive stops making contact with the drive gear. I have had this happen to me.
John Henry
I'm not aware of "hybrid" units, either. The odo failing on the ITI speedos was/is entirely too common. Many didn't go past 6K miles from new. The plastic gear is not lubed. There were several threads back in the day, but the consensus was to cut a window in the can, lube it, and put duct tape over the hole preemptively. There were pictures of how/where, but of course, they're all gone.
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The diagram on the attached link lists the cable as an "odometer cable." The exploded view and parts list may help you figure things out...
http://www.harpermoto.com/parts-by-motorcycle/2000-up-moto-guzzi-motorcycles/california-vintage-1100-2006-2008/dashboard-en-california-vintage-1100.html
Ok I'm puzzled, I just poured through the parts diagrams and couldn't find a speed sensor on anything that I would expect to feed signals to the speedo. I would think the timing sensor could be used but only in conjunction with a great position switch which I don't see.
I could only find the usual neutral switch in the transmission.
Now maybe I missed something, but when I checked an earlier EV dashboard parts list it ALSO listed the cable as "odometer" and I'm thinking that's not true on the EV...soooo
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Okay, when my spankin new '09 Calvin died TWICE along the road the day I picked it up from Speakers, it had a faulty charging system (long story). The first symptom of the impending dead bike (battery) was the SPEEDODOMETER failure. Straight to zero then the bike would die. I thought it was cable driven, but it was electric. The cable drives the ODO.
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That would explain why the speedometer runs 10% optimistic, but the tripmeter is pretty accurate...
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I have never seen an electronic speedo with mechanical odometer why would anyone make something like that?
Tachometers on the other hand have been electronic since early 70s
Sent from my shoe phone!
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Okay, when my spankin new '09 Calvin died TWICE along the road the day I picked it up from Speakers, it had a faulty charging system (long story). The first symptom of the impending dead bike (battery) was the SPEEDODOMETER failure. Straight to zero then the bike would die. I thought it was cable driven, but it was electric. The cable drives the ODO.
I think you are confusing the TACH dropping to zero, with the SPEED.
There is no speed sensor to even feed an electronic speedometer.
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I think you are confusing the TACH dropping to zero, with the SPEED.
There is no speed sensor to even feed an electronic speedometer.
Possibly so. It was over 8 years ago. Just spoke to Dan, let's see what he days after checking the cable.
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Gack , you guys have confused the issue even more than it was before :shocked: :laugh:
Someone clear this up before we have aliens or Keebler Elves causing the problem , which of course was my guess from the beginning :grin:
Dusty
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Update
The left side unit housing the speedometer, odometer and trip meter are all operated by the one cable entering the back of the can. The reason for the failure of the odometer and trip is contributed to a small nylon gear which has a short life, in other words it's a cheesy POS according to a gentleman I contacted who fixes them for 285 bucks. I ask him where he gets the cogs and he said he lucked upon a box several years ago from a quzzi dealer going out of business and no he wasn't interested in selling me one:(
I think I will go with the bicycle one recommend here by one of the guys if he would be so kind as to assist me with the needed information. Thanks to all the guzzi gentlemen that attempted to help me with this issue, my hats off to all ya.
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285 bucks
:shocked: The last I knew you could get a new one for less than that..
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Update
The left side unit housing the speedometer, odometer and trip meter are all operated by the one cable entering the back of the can. The reason for the failure of the odometer and trip is contributed to a small nylon gear which has a short life, in other words it's a cheesy POS according to a gentleman I contacted who fixes them for 285 bucks. I ask him where he gets the cogs and he said he lucked upon a box several years ago from a quzzi dealer going out of business and no he wasn't interested in selling me one:(
I think I will go with the bicycle one recommend here by one of the guys if he would be so kind as to assist me with the needed information. Thanks to all the guzzi gentlemen that attempted to help me with this issue, my hats off to all ya.
If your speedometer is the Veglia unit like I replaced on my '98 V11EV I have my old one hanging around available for short money. Cut yours open (see many posts on removing/replacing bezel) and do an autopsy. I might have just the part you need. It's worth a shot.
MEANWHILE:
Cateye Velo 9 will do your job for around $20. There is no internal light.
http://www.cateye.com/en/products/detail/CC-VL820/
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I think I will go with the bicycle one recommend here by one of the guys if he would be so kind as to assist me with the needed information. Thanks to all the guzzi gentlemen that attempted to help me with this issue, my hats off to all ya.
If you meaN ME, ANY SPEEDO FROM A BICYCLE STORE WILL WORK, SIGMA has a good name and I know you can enter mileage. the directions with it will tell how to calibrate, basically you measure the circumference of the front tire and enter that. then your spot on accurate. you will need to glue a magnet to a brake rotor, use epoxy.. I got a bigger magnet than what's supplied from a hardware store.
if you want to be sure it will work on a motorcycle check them out on Aerostich.com.. some bike speedos have a pretty short wire so you want to make sure it will reach down your fork.
note, do not get wireless, theres Rf interference (from motor?) so the one I tried didn't work.
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If you have a smartphone, the REVER app will track your speed/mileage in real time...I'm sure there are others as well....
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If you have a smartphone, the REVER app will track your speed/mileage in real time...I'm sure there are others as well....
I thought of the smart phone and there is an app. This has troubling drawbacks and I want something permanent so if and when I sell the Calvin I want to be able to accurately verify the mileage for any potential buyer. Thanks for the thought though.
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If your speedometer is the Veglia unit like I replaced on my '98 V11EV I have my old one hanging around available for short money. Cut yours open (see many posts on removing/replacing bezel) and do an autopsy. I might have just the part you need. It's worth a shot.
MEANWHILE:
Cateye Velo 9 will do your job for around $20. There is no internal light.
http://www.cateye.com/en/products/detail/CC-VL820/
Thanks for the offer Ron but there ant no way I'm taking that thing apart, heck I thought I'd never get the cable back on without taking the windshield off and I not about to put a used cog on when the new one only lasted 7k miles but thanks for the generous offer the same.
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Sure, buy a new one. That's what I had to do.
Where?
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Moto Int'l had a complete dash set for my EV, I think it's the same as yours or at least the gauges. It was like $200 or so brand new. You might try them. Harpers might have the speedo as well??
When this one dies, I plan to go with the Speed Hut speedo and get the mileage set right.
Tom
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Moto Int'l had a complete dash set for my EV, I think it's the same as yours or at least the gauges. It was like $200 or so brand new. You might try them. Harpers might have the speedo as well??
When this one dies, I plan to go with the Speed Hut speedo and get the mileage set right.
Tom
I talked with curt at harpers today, he said that part is no longer offered by MG
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Eish might have it.
330-738-3944
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Eish might have it.
330-738-3944
Thanks chuck I'll call them tomorrow. I feel like I'm chasing my tail about now. I love my Calvin but I'm getting frustrated. This very thing is the reason I got rid of my 04 EV. Something as basic as a odometer is almost impossible to repair or replace. A great bike with junk parts and no accessories.
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Thanks chuck I'll call them tomorrow. I feel like I'm chasing my tail about now. I love my Calvin but I'm getting frustrated. This very thing is the reason I got rid of my 04 EV. Something as basic as a odometer is almost impossible to repair or replace. A great bike with junk parts and no accessories.
Just wait till you get a flat tire far from home in the rain with those tube type rims..
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03 Stone speedo at MI. Would that work?
https://www.motointernational.com/store/product/GU03762465
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03 Stone speedo at MI. Would that work?
https://www.motointernational.com/store/product/GU03762465
Thanks Chuck, not a match and I couldn't get anyone to answer to assist further
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When the one made by ITI in my 04 EV quit, I actually made a new gear out of JB Weld. The original gear is METAL, not plastic. The engagement distance is wrong and it shears the tips of the metal teeth off.
The JB Weld patch actually worked very well for me. After about 80,000 miles. I tried JB Weld again, and it did not last long. I drilled a new hole, and filled the old hole, for the shaft for that gear. Getting it to mesh deeper lasted about 20,000 miles. At about 125,000 miles total, it failed again and I gave up. I got an aftermarket replacement from Speedhut. Problem solved.
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PM Sent
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Hey guys, I'm not going to beat a dead horse so this is my summary and fix for my dilemma with the odometer on the Calvin. I finally found a place in WA that rebuilds these pieces of junk. He puts all new guts inside the housing you send and guarantees his work, here is his info in case you guys need it. He charges around 150.00 give or take depending on the speedometer.
SEATTLE SPEEDOMETER, PH# 206-369-5063
As for me, I took the advise of a wise man, not going to name him, and went to my local schwinn bike shop and purchased a RIDER 100 GPS. No wires or batteries, attached to the handlebars and rock and roll. My factory speedometer was 5 MPH slow. Dang, I'm glad to be done with this!
I want to thank every last one of you guys that took the time to attempt to help me and offered a comment. Every one of them helped me in one way or the other! I hope I get to meet you guys sometime and yes even Dusty helped by making me laugh, forgetting how aggravating my dilemma was, thanks Dusty:) LMBO
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Time to revive the dead thred!
My 01 EV speedo has always been bouncy but at 84000 miles it's now wild. However the trip and odometer still work. What ever I do I want the trip for a gas gauge and th e odometer for oil change intervals. Any new ideas?