Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Huzo on July 21, 2017, 04:49:12 PM
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I know this has been covered from a thousand angles, but why oh why does Guzzi REFUSE to build a soft edged sports bike around the V9mill ? I've been told why you can't just put a Griso donk in an MGS 01 and add a couple of lights in Mandello and go for a ride... I reluctantly accept that.
However with their (reputedly) diminishing market share in some parts of the world (Oz), what is the barrier to building something that pays some degree of homage to the MGS, option it up with Ohlins for those who want it, and maybe release a variant with an 850 donk and call it the V8, again a commentary on the legendary past, (it works for the V7 and V9) and make bloody sure you paint the bastard RED !
Here in Oz, the laws are such that it's becoming completely pointless owning and servicing a 300 kph bike and most guys know it, there's not a lot of Panigale's around. Any sports bike that is raw and pseudo race ready gives the average young buyer a chubby, and it MUST be possible after seeing the MGS. Every bastard loves them, but Guzzi won't/(can't) do it. If they don't grab more market share they'll go under eventually, won't they? I'd expect it would need the CARC ass end for the single sided swing arm, so I don't know how that can be done with the V9, I'm just shit scared that they'll eventually realise that they can make a fortune producing bright red flat pack kitchen setups under licence from IKEA or something equally ridiculous and all the bike stuff will be relegated to the back shed, until in 25 years time some rich industrialist will "resurrect" the brand and start putting electric motors in them.
Although it won't be all bad, Roper'll be on his Enfield, Dusty'll be in a rocking chair with pipe and slippers and I'll be dead ! 'Funny thing is, I don't actually want one, I just think lots of potential buyers do, they just don't know it yet ! Guzzi have to stop their model line up being for old farts and hipsters ! They've been going out of business since 1921, if they keep trying, they'll succeed...
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I think that Aprillia fulfills that part of the market for them, remember that Moto Guzzi exists within the Piaggio group along with Aprilia, Vespa, Scarabeo, Gilera, Derbi, and Piaggio. For that reason, we'll probably never see a retro standard come out of Aprilia or a hi-performance sport bike come out of Moto Guzzi. And Moto Guzzi will never go under as long as sugar daddy Vespa continues to subsidize our groovy bikes.
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I think that Aprillia fulfills that part of the market for them, remember that Moto Guzzi exists within the Piaggio group along with Aprilia, Vespa, Scarabeo, Gilera, Derbi, and Piaggio. For that reason, we'll probably never see a retro standard come out of Aprilia or a hi-performance sport bike come out of Moto Guzzi. And Moto Guzzi will never go under as long as sugar daddy Vespa continues to subsidize our groovy bikes.
I don't have the business acumen to wage a decent argument DVB. I just want a bloody MGS01 with a Beetled map and Roper rollered top end and some lights illuminating my legal rear number plate.. Now go and bloody well get me one ! Have it washed and brought to my tent !!!! :drool:
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You been smoking stuff Huzo ??
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You been smoking stuff Huzo ??
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That's been said to me more than once on this forum and the answer is the same as last time..YES !!! But seriously Kev, what's so far wrong with my theory. Surely the more market share the better, no?
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That's been said to me more than once on this forum and the answer is the same as last time..YES !!! But seriously Kev, what's so far wrong with my theory. Surely the more market share the better, no?
No offence meant Huzo- I just have no idea wtf an MGS is / was. I did a search on the interweb and found some reference to MGS modified bikes but no idea which one or ones you refer to.
Send a link for me - and possibly other plebites out here :-)
Cheerz Kev
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Kev, just google "Moto Guzzi MGS 01". You will find many pics.
John Henry
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Yeah Moto Guzzi should build a world beating hyper sports bike , they will sell in the tens , everyone will say how glad they are the company finally built one , as MG goes into bankruptcy because they spent a metric tonne of money developing a bike that 13 people will buy .
Dusty
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Yeah Moto Guzzi shfould build a world beating hyper sports bike , they will sell in the tens , everyone will say how glad they are the company finally built one , as MG goes into bankruptcy because they spent a metric tonne of money developing a bike that 13 people will buy .
Dusty
With all due respect Dusty, that's a ridiculous exaggeration. No one said it has to be a world beater. I know it fits in well with the current line of opinion but what do you say we have a think for ourselves? Lots will agree with you and it will feel good, but is that the opinion that YOU hold? Why would it take a "metric tonne" of money (nice pinch from Roper) to release something like I mentioned? Ohlins front end, V9 derived donk, MGS styling, there maybe more performance available from the current V9, that's over my head, I don't know, but why do the things have to take on the apologetic styling that has started to creep in with the V9? Is the damn thing a cruiser? How much range does it have, where the hell are you going to "cruise" to? I just don't know what the styling is trying to say, and while we're talking, how are the worldwide sales of that particular model going? What have our Mandello wizards done to secure the fortunes of the niche brand we like? The darn thing is apparently a fairly nice jigger if you're prepared to ride one, but they look like someone's stripped a good bike and fitted a tank and seat they found in their Dad's shed.
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No offence meant Huzo- I just have no idea wtf an MGS is / was. I did a search on the interweb and found some reference to MGS modified bikes but no idea which one or ones you refer to.
Send a link for me - and possibly other plebites out here :-)
Cheerz Kev
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ASxfMQnTtFA/UVDLSutJBRI/AAAAAAAABP4/ESFZQBkHMmY/s1600/Moto+Guzzi+MGS+01+Corsa.jpg)
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Anyone who thinks that the idea at least, has no merit, has got a screw loose. Don't know if it can be done or not, but you tell me guys, if it had lights and was registered, would you buy one if you were chasing a sports bike ? Don't bother denying it..
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The V9 is a new motor, give them some time and I suspect it will happen, for now you've got the V7 Racer.
Remember this is Italy and things sometime move slowly there, especially in Mandello. :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu
Paul
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The V9 is a new motor, give them some time and I suspect it will happen, for now you've got the V7 Racer.
Remember this is Italy and things sometime move slowly there, especially in Mandello. :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu
Paul
I'm not chasing a sports bike myself, those days are behind me and I do different stuff. I just bristle a bit when people tell me with an assumed authority that it's a stupid idea that Mandello couldn't pull off. There are those on this forum that know enough to show where the problems lay, but I'm damn sure bigger hurdles than that have been conquered at Lake Como. If there were 100 V9's and 100 V8 (850cc) MGS' suddenly thrust onto the market, which one would sell out first, that's my only point, not whether it could or could not be achieved, smarter engineers than I would be tasked with that, but bugger me, they manage to build them when they want to.
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The V9 is a new motor, give them some time and I suspect it will happen, for now you've got the V7 Racer.
Remember this is Italy and things sometime move slowly there, especially in Mandello. :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu
Paul
Around the V9 motor with its stone age suspension? Yes you have a screw loose or three, the !@#$ing thing wouldn't even out perform an 1100 sport a 23 year old motorcycle that will be eligible for classic registration in a couple of years, it wasn't cutting edge at the time of its release. Yes they should do something more sporty but dressing up the compromised fashion humping hipster bait they they currently fart out as a "sports" bike is a laughable notion, would it even out run a Scrambler 690 Deadcat which would be its most obvious competitor? If they could translate the MGS balance and poise to the road they'd have a winner, even that design is well over 10 years old, it needs to be clean sheet IMO to have any chance of success.
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Geez , thought you Ozzies all had a sense of humor :shocked:
Dusty
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(http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=103581&stc=1&d=1236893011)
Close enough?
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Geez , thought you Ozzies all had a sense of humor :shocked:
Dusty
Sorry Dusty, that one was too well disguised,
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(http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=103581&stc=1&d=1236893011)
Close enough?
No, not a Guzzi
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Sport bikes don't appeal to the majority of riders hence Moto Guzzi main strategy is to sell where non-sporting bikes will sell. As stated, Aprilia is for that market. Vespa and Piaggio scooters is to "bring" the new riders into motorcycles.
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Sport bikes don't appeal to the majority of riders hence Moto Guzzi main strategy is to sell where non-sporting bikes will sell. As stated, Aprilia is for that market. Vespa and Piaggio scooters is to "bring" the new riders into motorcycles.
Yeah,Deep down I kind of know that you're right. But as John Lennon said.. You may say I'm a dreamer... Guess I must nearly be the only one. Wishful thinking I 'spose
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Around the V9 motor with its stone age suspension? Yes you have a screw loose or three, the !@#$ing thing wouldn't even out perform an 1100 sport a 23 year old motorcycle that will be eligible for classic registration in a couple of years, it wasn't cutting edge at the time of its release. Yes they should do something more sporty but dressing up the compromised fashion humping hipster bait they they currently fart out as a "sports" bike is a laughable notion, would it even out run a Scrambler 690 Deadcat which would be its most obvious competitor? If they could translate the MGS balance and poise to the road they'd have a winner, even that design is well over 10 years old, it needs to be clean sheet IMO to have any chance of success.
This! And the V9 is a new motor in the same way a peach is wildly different from a nectarine!
The MGS-01 is a beautiful styling excercise but it's totally obsolete technology and also grossly over-stressed. Read the service manual, you throw most of it away every few hours! It's a race bike, if you de-tune it to the point it's reliable when used in anger it would be feebly uncompetitive even if it was, miraculously, able to meet noise and emission regs!
Every few years this question is asked. Many times in the past the management of Guzzi has obliged and produced something more modern or designed to appeal to those asking the question. These self same people then stay away in droves and the bikes sit on the showroom floor like a stale bottle of DA!
This isn't just true of bikes with 'Sporting' pretensions either. The wretched V9's have been available for a couple of years now and only now that they are being deeply discounted are people starting to buy them, (In the US at least. Over here you still can't give them away!). I mean when did we get the first post from a V9 owner here on WG? A couple of months ago? And there are still only a couple of owners contributing or asking questions, one of whom had a bike that's stuck in the dealer with something wrong with it!
(Spittle-flecked Rant Mode off!)
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Kev, just google "Moto Guzzi MGS 01". You will find many pics.
John Henry
Oh yeh, thanks for that. Cool [emoji41] bike for sure but it never got off the ground as a sport bike did it ?
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Do you always have to wake me out of my dream as I'm getting to the good part. I just want to believe it can happen and ignore the facts, but thanks for the truth. (Again)
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Oh yeh, thanks for that. Cool [emoji41] bike for sure but it never got off the ground as a sport bike did it ?
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Nup
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It would be funny to see a sport Guzzi marketed now. I can see the comments. "Lousy riding position. Handlebars too low. Can't pack a weeks worth of stuff. Not good for touring." :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
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Do you always have to wake me out of my dream as I'm getting to the good part. I just want to believe it can happen and ignore the facts, but thanks for the truth. (Again)
Lol, I just woke up after dreaming we had a big earthquake- a not uncommon event here in kiwi land.
I checked geonet.co.nz for any reported shakes and none.
Turns out my missus was shaking me to stop the snoring [emoji42]
Zzzzzzz
Keep dreaming Huzo :-)
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I suspect the good folks at Moto Guzzi probably cringe when they hear their bike and the rider of same called a bastard, and their beloved CARC an ass, even though they all are terms of endearment in Australia and part of the common jargon. Maybe if you re-write it as cazzo and stronzo, their ears might perk up a bit! :)
Keep dreamin! It's a good dream, a great dream in fact, but like all such dreams you're just going to wake up in the wet spot...OR, you could build one yourself!!
You've got the skills Huzo - should be easy enough to put the donk in the bonk and the cork in the dork and you'd have your own RED BASTARD to ride...and you could ship it alongside the Norge to Mandello, drive it up to the factory and show the bastards what you have done! You'd be an honorary Guzzi factory worker for sure or just send them pics and see what they say!
They might even name it the Huzzini!
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I suspect the good folks at Moto Guzzi probably cringe when they hear their bike and the rider of same called a bastard, and their beloved CARC an ass, even though they all are terms of endearment in Australia and part of the common jargon. Maybe if you re-write it as cazzo and stronzo, their ears might perk up a bit! :)
Keep dreamin! It's a good dream, a great dream in fact, but like all such dreams you're just going to wake up in the wet spot...OR, you could build one yourself!!
You've got the skills Huzo - should be easy enough to put the donk in the bonk and the cork in the dork and you'd have your own RED BASTARD to ride...and you could ship it alongside the Norge to Mandello, drive it up to the factory and show the bastards what you have done! You'd be an honorary Guzzi factory worker for sure or just send them pics and see what they say!
They might even name it the Huzzini!
That's a great post PJ very humorous. I'll print it off and put it on the wall, I love it when people talk about me, 'saves me doing it myself !! :rolleyes: Now that I've been dragged kicking and screaming back to reality, what frame is under that dripping bodywork, is it a clean sheet design, or tarted up from something else ?
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Do you always have to wake me out of my dream as I'm getting to the good part. I just want to believe it can happen and ignore the facts, but thanks for the truth. (Again)
R U dreaming about that sport bike ya don't want...... sure you are. :violent1:
Paul
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R U dreaming about that sport bike ya don't want...... sure you are. :violent1:
Paul
Maybe it's a bit like perving on the cute girl and saying all you really want us a quiet drink, you don't actually have pretentions of anything more, until you start messing around. (If you get the chance that is)
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Thread, I spit at thee. From Hell's heart I stab at thee.
Die thread, die...
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Oh yeh, thanks for that. Cool [emoji41] bike for sure but it never got off the ground as a sport bike did it ?
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131 made (we think) between 2004 and 2009, Corsa version only fantastically balanced IMO.
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Just ignore it Beetle.
Think he's been smoking something too Huzo [emoji23]
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Think he's been smoking something too Huzo [emoji23]
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If he's gunna destroy brain cells, can I have the bit that builds maps first please ? For me I'm just having BS flight of fancy regarding the MGS, I'm as toey as a Roman sandal, only 8 days to go ! :drool:
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I wonder how many Thruxton R owners would really rather have a MGS?
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I wonder how many Thruxton R owners would really rather have a MGS?
The discerning ones...
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(https://cdn.rideapart.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/2013-moto-guzzi-v7-racer.jpg) So, this was not pretentious enough? :evil: I guess 5 more BHP will make it a KILLER. :laugh:
Isn`t this a Sport Bike? It`s called racer.
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Yes, and a chrome tank confirms it.
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It's a cafe racer.
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It's a cafe racer.
Meaning it is only slightly faster than a cafe ?
The V7 racer would have been considered a sport bike in 1965 , 40 HP 400,LBS , 105 MPH top speed.
Dusty
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Uh no......it's only if you want fast coffee. :shocked: :grin:
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Below is an interesting article, covering some of the arguments mentioned:
http://www.odd-bike.com/2015/01/millepercento-moto-guzzis-filling-void.html (http://www.odd-bike.com/2015/01/millepercento-moto-guzzis-filling-void.html)
Personally I would have liked to own this Super-Griso:
(http://thumb.ibb.co/dgA80Q/Millepercento_Moto_Guzzi_BB1.jpg) (http://ibb.co/dgA80Q)
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105 MPH top speed.
Only if launched from orbit. :laugh:
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If he's gunna destroy brain cells, can I have the bit that builds maps first please ? For me I'm just having BS flight of fancy regarding the MGS, I'm as toey as a Roman sandal, only 8 days to go ! :drool:
Lol, I like that one re the sandal, they used to make them from rope did they not Roper had to sneak in again.
That post from Yan is interesting- seems like those guys share your views
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It just gives me the squirts Kev. Have a look at that thing and then tell me I'm talking crap, it's got me rooted. Personally I don't give a tinker's cuss how "fast" it is or is not. It gives me a chubby and for heaven's sake if You had an ex track day MGS and a Griso donk, how long do you think it would hold Beetle and Roper up, if they pooled their talents. I'd re birth the bastard somehow with Griso numbers and take the risk. If those two buggers said, "we'll build it and you get it past motor reg" you'd shit it in, if you had the proper engineer on the task to sign it off, it must be possible. Just have a look at some of the unadulterated piles of steaming pus that are "built" in the name of "Custom Bikes" or "Choppers" and they get through. Go on everyone, tell me I'm a tosser...
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Thread, I spit at thee. From Hell's heart I stab at thee.
Die thread, die...
I do respect your word on things Beetle, so I ask in total seriousness. Why? Please don't answer in Shakespearean verse.
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It's Melville, actually.
I'll gather my thoughts and post a response in due course.
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BTW, I've done an indicated 160 on a Racer. Just. A most frightening experience. An extra 8 km/h? Bwahahaha!
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squirts
crap
rooted
tinker's cuss
chubby
Griso donk
birth the bastard
two buggers
you'd shit it in
piles of steaming pus
tell me I'm a tosser...
Pay attention everyone...a lexicon of Australian jargon to use as a reference for future discussions! Take notes!!
You've got me rolling on the floor Huzo...my sides are splitting!! One funny guy! :)
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Lol, I like that one re the sandal, they used to make them from rope did they not Roper had to sneak in again.
That post from Yan is interesting- seems like those guys share your views
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I share no *Views* with the Millercento mob. I think their offering is tiresome. It's based from memory on an 1100 engine that has water cooled heads and it's been bored to an enormous capacity. It's basically just a big old 2 valver. That excites me about as much as the idea of being flogged with a wet lettuce leaf. What IMHO is far worse is that I believe it still uses the twin plate clutch! Now don't get me wrong, it's a good unit, but it was originally designed to take whatever power and torque a V7 from 1967 made. Yes, it was latterly given an extra two springs but if the motor produces anywhere near what it's supposed two a couple of hard starts would turn it into a smelly, smoking ruin!
Look, if that is what floats your boat? That's fine! It doesn't float mine. It is neither clever or elegant, it's simply sledgehammer engineering.
Last time I expressed those views I was told by some Finnish braggart who claimed to own one that I was simply jealous because I couldn't afford one. I think that probably sums up the market segment they're aiming for. LOMBARD's.
Pete
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Pay attention everyone...a lexicon of Australian jargon to use as a reference for future discussions! Take notes!!
You've got me rolling on the floor Huzo...my sides are splitting!! One funny guy! :)
Well ok mate.. um fair enough but it all sounds a bit try hard when they're cobbled together like that but anyway there you go. Sometimes a small string of 3 or 4 words can carry the same meaning as a full sentence but in any case, that's what happens when you type like you talk. One thing that makes me cringe is when someone overdoes that type of thing to try to "sound" funny.... it never works. Also BTW, vulgarity of itself is not necessarily funny, kinda like the stand up comic who can't get a laugh so he just starts using the in and out word hoping for a giggle, it's sad.
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Pay attention everyone...a lexicon of Australian jargon to use as a reference for future discussions! Take notes!!
You've got me rolling on the floor Huzo...my sides are splitting!! One funny guy! :)
Oh.. ok, if you pull it to bits, it's really no big deal, look.
Squirts= an expulsion from the colon bought on by tension of the lower abdomen.
Crap=a generic term for an item or substance worthy of being consigned to the rubbish bin, also a slang term for human excrement.
Rooted=placed in a position where neither forward or backward motion can be achieved either physically or metaphorically.
Tinker's cuss=an expletive laden verbal outburst made by a metal worker from the 19 th century.
Chubby= the physical manifestation of the onset of male arousal.
Griso donk=the locomotive unit under the tank of a Moto Guzzi Griso.
Re birth the bastard= to alter the identifying numbers and letters of a said motorcycle whose exact parentage is indeterminate.
Two Buggers= A gathering of more than one and less than three males of undisputed skill in a known sphere, that can cause one to bristle on occasions.
You'd **** it in= The desired outcome can be achieved with similar amount of concentration and physical effort as a healthy ablution.
Piles of steaming pus= A mass of unsavoury excretion from an open wound, warm enough to vaporise in the ambient conditions.
Tell me I'm a tosser= To accuse me of being someone who engages in the act of moving ones hand in an oscillatory motion, generated primarily from the wrist and most likely in a palm up configuration. The motion akin to dispensing wheat or other grainy substance to chickens or land based fowl...
So if one was to insert those definitions into the monologue, the meaning would be no more clear, and one may lose ones audience.
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No offence meant Huzo- I just have no idea wtf an MGS is / was. I did a search on the interweb and found some reference to MGS modified bikes but no idea which one or ones you refer to.
Send a link for me - and possibly other plebites out here :-)
Cheerz Kev
I'm as much a pleb as anyone mate, none taken. The only reason I know what one looks like is I've got a dog eared magazine with a picture of one in the centrefold hidden in the woodshed, the staple is right between the V of the cylinders. (Funny that!) Nothing's changed in 45 years, had a sorta similar thing when I was 14! Not as pretty though...
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I do respect your word on things Beetle, so I ask in total seriousness. Why? Please don't answer in Shakespearean verse.
There have been many threads like this one in these hallowed pages. They invariably have many posts lamenting the decline of Moto Guzzi, or pondering the current model line while referencing the V11 series, or the CARC series, or MGS01 etc. There's usually questions on why the CARC series couldn't be continued, or speculation on when will they release a water cooled engine. There's mention of the custom work by the likes of Millepercento or Radical Guzzi, followed by praise for their wonderful creations, even though said creations use questionable engineering like a carbureted, big bore 8V engine shoe-horned into an older frame designed for a 75HP engine, replete with bevel drive for same, then claim 130HP. Then the fantasy brigade roll in, posting pics from Bike Exif of similar, with a photo-shopped Le Man's based on the Bellagio. They can't fathom that the 2V big block is dead (and ain't never coming back), or why people would prefer a mono-shock rising rate rear end over a pair of conventional shocks because that's what real motorbikes have. Then we get stories of "I know a guy who's best friends second cousin works for a fellow who's uncle knows a dealer that spoke to a suit from Piaggio who said there's a 200HP water cooled engine in the works."
It's tiresome.
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Well I did ask. Thank you...(I think)
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It's tiresome.
But remember, Beetle, as Alexander Pope said:
Hope springs eternal in the human breast;
Man never is, but always to be blessed:
The soul, uneasy and confined from home,
Rests and expatiates in a life to come.
If we weren't optimists (at least in some degree or manner), we wouldn't ride Moto Guzzis. Heck, we probably wouldn't even ride!
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I share no *Views* with the Millercento mob. I think their offering is tiresome. It's based from memory on an 1100 engine that has water cooled heads and it's been bored to an enormous capacity. It's basically just a big old 2 valver. That excites me about as much as the idea of being flogged with a wet lettuce leaf. What IMHO is far worse is that I believe it still uses the twin plate clutch! Now don't get me wrong, it's a good unit, but it was originally designed to take whatever power and torque a V7 from 1967 made. Yes, it was latterly given an extra two springs but if the motor produces anywhere near what it's supposed two a couple of hard starts would turn it into a smelly, smoking ruin!
Look, if that is what floats your boat? That's fine! It doesn't float mine. It is neither clever or elegant, it's simply sledgehammer engineering.
Last time I expressed those views I was told by some Finnish braggart who claimed to own one that I was simply jealous because I couldn't afford one. I think that probably sums up the market segment they're aiming for. LOMBARD's.
Pete
Pete, I meant it sounded to me what your mate Huzo was raving on about.
Personally I don't have the ability or desire to redesign my bike. They are just eye candy nice to look at but not practical or within my reach. I'm happy with their standard models like my old Cali 1100i though it's still in bits.
Got the new gearbox bearings in and seals done, next job is to check the selector end float as described in your doc on this old tractor. I assume nothing's changed since you wrote it & my bike does suffer
from false neutrals so worth doing.
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I'm as much a pleb as anyone mate, none taken. The only reason I know what one looks like is I've got a dog eared magazine with a picture of one in the centrefold hidden in the woodshed, the staple is right between the V of the cylinders. (Funny that!) Nothing's changed in 45 years, had a sorta similar thing when I was 14! Not as pretty though...
Mm funny that particular publication was drooled over by many a young lad, must be why we like twin pots so much I reckon.
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Got the new gearbox bearings in and seals done, next job is to check the selector end float as described in your doc on this old tractor. I assume nothing's changed since you wrote it & my bike does suffer
from false neutrals so worth doing.
If you haven't yet found it John Noble's photoessay and summary of a five speed overhaul is far more detailed and better than mine. I think it's on the same site, if not its in the archives of Guzzitek.dk
Pete
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Oh also, if you pull it to bits, it's really no big deal, look. Squirts= an expulsion of the colon bought on by tension of the lower abdomen. Crap=a generic term for an item or substance worthy of being consigned to the rubbish bin. Rooted=placed in a position where neither forward or backward motion can be achieved either physically or cereberally. Tinker's cuss=an expletive laden verbal outburst made by a metal worker from the 19 th century. Chubby= the physical manifestation of the commencement of male arousal. Griso donk=the locomotive unit under the tank of a Moto Guzzi Griso. Re birth the bastard= to alter the identifying numbers and letters of a said motorcycle whose exact parentage in indeterminate. Two Buggers= A gathering of more than one and less than three males of undisputed skill in a known sphere, that can cause one to bristle on occasions. You'd **** it in= The desired outcome can be achieved with similar amount of concentration and physical effort as a healthy ablution. Piles of steaming pus= A mass of unsavoury excretion from an open wound, warm enough to vaporise in the ambient conditions. Tell me I'm a tosser= The act of moving ones hand in an oscillatory motion generated primarily from the wrist, generally in a palm up configuration. The motion akin to dispensing wheat or other grainy substance to chickens or land based fowl. So if one was to insert those definitions into the monologue, the meaning would be no more clear, and one may lose ones audience.
:afro: Shyte Huzo, you shdda been on the stage - .... the one that left town half an hour ago
One of my trusty old schoolboy jokes ;-p
have fun on your travels
Kev
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:afro: Shyte Huzo, you shdda been on the stage - .... the one that left town half an hour ago
One of my trusty old schoolboy jokes ;-p
have fun on your travels
Kev
Nah....I used to think the theatre was a great institution, I just wasn't ready for an institution!
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If you haven't yet found it John Noble's photoessay and summary of a five speed overhaul is far more detailed and better than mine. I think it's on the same site, if not its in the archives of Guzzitek.dk
Pete
:embarrassed:
Great Techy resource that page............... .mine are piffling..Pete's engine rebuild and my gbx effort should be enough to tear down a Tonti and put it all together with a little bit of care
http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzitech.dk/gb_en_complex-technical.htm (http://www.thisoldtractor.com/guzzitech.dk/gb_en_complex-technical.htm)
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Nah....I used to think the theatre was a great institution, I just wasn't ready for an institution!
How do you manage to type in that straight jacket ????
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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If you haven't yet found it John Noble's photoessay and summary of a five speed overhaul is far more detailed and better than mine. I think it's on the same site, if not its in the archives of Guzzitek.dk
Pete
Thanks Pete
I'll check it out, I think Roy mentioned this months ago too / brain fade.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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How do you manage to type in that straight jacket ????
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It's ok as long as I only type in straight lines ! :undecided:
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Hey I just stumbled over this thread while searching for some stuff..
A fair bit of it sounds less ridiculous than two years ago, especially the bit about putting a revamped V9 donk in something less cringeworthy than a Roamer..
Check out opening post.. :wink:
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I’ve been shopping for “something special” for a year now. I’ve got my bagger (Victory Vision Arlen Ness Edition). I’ve got my bar-hopper (Victory Vegas). I’ve got my Japanese ginsu-knife (Interceptor 1000). Now I want something special. Something that removes you from reality, like a drug. The MGS-01 brought me to Moto Guzzi. Realizing I can’t get one made me dig deeper into their portfolio to see if another model speaks to me. There’s the Daytona. Extremely rare in northern Illinois. The V11 doesn’t really work for me. The Griso...close, but not enough. That leaves a Sport 1100 from the mid 90’s. That was a long time ago. I do like kinda like em. But, I have never ridden one, or any Guzzi for that matter. I have found a nice one that seems fairly priced. But the “pull” isn’t quite there like it was for my previous acquisitions. The MGS-01 has it. Settling for a 95 Sport 1100....? Man, I don’t know. The two seem so far apart. The powers-that-be seem so stupid to not build that EXACT bike, with a streetable engine.
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A fair bit of it sounds less ridiculous than two years ago, especially the bit about putting a revamped V9 donk in something less cringeworthy than a Roamer..
Like an anchor locker? :P
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Like an anchor locker? :P
Or a V85
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I’ve been shopping for “something special” for a year now. I’ve got my bagger (Victory Vision Arlen Ness Edition). I’ve got my bar-hopper (Victory Vegas). I’ve got my Japanese ginsu-knife (Interceptor 1000). Now I want something special. Something that removes you from reality, like a drug. The MGS-01 brought me to Moto Guzzi. Realizing I can’t get one made me dig deeper into their portfolio to see if another model speaks to me. There’s the Daytona. Extremely rare in northern Illinois. The V11 doesn’t really work for me. The Griso...close, but not enough. That leaves a Sport 1100 from the mid 90’s. That was a long time ago. I do like kinda like em. But, I have never ridden one, or any Guzzi for that matter. I have found a nice one that seems fairly priced. But the “pull” isn’t quite there like it was for my previous acquisitions. The MGS-01 has it. Settling for a 95 Sport 1100....? Man, I don’t know. The two seem so far apart. The powers-that-be seem so stupid to not build that EXACT bike, with a streetable engine.
They did. They didn't sell. Daytona 1000 and Daytona 1100RS come up for sale occasionally. You can't really quibble over the prices however.
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They did. They didn't sell. Daytona 1000 and Daytona 1100RS come up for sale occasionally. You can't really quibble over the prices however.
The RS is also a 1000 unfortunatly the US got the flacid A kit motor in the RS, niether handle anything like a MGS there is close to 15 years between the frames and geometry. I've never ridden one maybe @old jock can comment, annecdotally the Magni Australia handles very well, however if you think a RS for sale is hard to find and expensive the Magni is next level.
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Totally agree. :thumb:
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Since I’ve never ridden any of these bikes...and really wanting an MGS-01... I don’t think a Daytona even comes close to being acceptable? And that’s a shame since once every 5 years one pops up. The MAGNI is extremely rare and expensive. And the 95 Sport is probably not even worth considering because it’s just so sedate in every way. The generational jump from model to model is probably so extreme. Unlike a Honda CBR1000RR. The differences from one generation to the next are more subtle due to there being so many generations in the same block of time. That’s why they need to make another MGS-01. Moto Guzzi needs to try harder to attract new customers. Or not........
JUST BUILD THE DAMN BIKE !!!
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A lightly tuned and well sorted Sport is pretty close to the A kit Daytona or slightly better its ine ball. They are 25 plus year old bikes and shouldn't be confused with anying that has modern performance. The MGS won't keep up in the top end with the likes of an R1 of similar era and its a bit porky when compared to a modern sports bike, something like a 1198 might come close, the Aprilia RSV1000's on paper should be close to the MGS but the're not.
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If you're looking for a sport Moto Guzzi. "Ain't" happening. Wrong brand. Piaggio's answer is the Aprilia line.
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If you're looking for a sport Moto Guzzi. "Ain't" happening. Wrong brand. Piaggio's answer is the Aprilia line.
With thimble sized fuel tanks that might get you to the next servo, if you ride in a manner unbecomming of a sports bike. BMW HP2 sport is probablly the closest thing anyone made to MGS-01 for the road.
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I know this has been covered from a thousand angles, but why oh why does Guzzi REFUSE to build a soft edged sports bike around the V9mill ? I've been told why you can't just put a Griso donk in an MGS 01 and add a couple of lights in Mandello and go for a ride... I reluctantly accept that. However with their (reputedly) diminishing market share in some parts of the world (Oz), what is the barrier to building something that pays some degree of homage to the MGS, option it up with Ohlins for those who want it, and maybe release a variant with an 850 donk and call it the V8, again a commentary on the legendary past, (it works for the V7 and V9) and make bloody sure you paint the bastard RED ! Here in Oz, the laws are such that it's becoming completely pointless owning and servicing a 300 kph bike and most guys know it, there's not a lot of Panigale's around. Any sports bike that is raw and pseudo race ready gives the average young buyer a chubby, and it MUST be possible after seeing the MGS. Every bastard loves them, but Guzzi won't/(can't) do it. If they don't grab more market share they'll go under eventually, won't they? I'd expect it would need the CARC ass end for the single sided swing arm, so I don't know how that can be done with the V9, I'm just shit scared that they'll eventually realise that they can make a fortune producing bright red flat pack kitchen setups under licence from IKEA or something equally ridiculous and all the bike stuff will be relegated to the back shed, until in 25 years time some rich industrialist will "resurrect" the brand and start putting electric motors in them. Although won't be all bad, Roper'll be on his Enfield, Dusty'll be in a rocking chair with pipe and slippers and I'll be dead ! 'Funny thing is, I don't actually want one, I just think lots of potential buyers do, they just don't know it yet ! Guzzi have to stop their model line up being for old farts and hipsters ! They've been going out of business since 1921, if they keep trying, they'll succeed...
Couldn't agree more Huzo. I've always lusted after one myself. Just the merest glance leaves me literally turgid with desire. A full 2 1/2" of Sheffield-steel-hard throbbing gristle. Yet the desire will never be fulfilled, let alone satiated. Its rarity, too much moolah, too tight a racing crouch, and obviously the "trackday only" application renders it simultaneously impractical & unattainable.
It's also not really a 'proper' Guzzi! Ghezzi & Brian were contracted to design & build the prototype, build that special engine & I suspect much of the ensuing bodywork & oh-so-gorgeous handcrafted rear-end alloy 'arm & vestigial parallelogram linkage. As such it's probably the last hurrah of in-house/specialist subcontractual Guzzi race R&D. Making it all the more sexy, desirable & erotically exotic.
But to me the MGS 01 represents perhaps the purest expression yet of the Moto Guzzi marque. In exactly the same way as the bevel drive 750/860/900SS Ducatis of the late 70 & early 80's do for the Bolognese bikes. Selling mine is probably one of my greatest regrets.
This is the only road version that I've ever seen: so at least one saw the light of day....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edHTbI6fMmA&t=47s
& in reverse perspective so that sonorous Termingnoni bark can weave its magic....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hk_msGD3icE
I would've loved to've ridden with my dad. However he hadn't ridden since the '30s (AJS & Douglas) & died nearly 30 years ago. Took him out a few times on my old Duke, which he loved.
Yet sometimes these obects of youthful lust & desire are in reality best left unrealised. Just as The Who's 1967 song 'Pictures of Lily' states, that hornbag motorcycle may be much better viewed at a distance. That stunning ubermodel "Eccentrica Gallumbitz, the triple-breasted whore from Eroticon VI whose erogenous zones start several meters from her actual body" (with profound apologies to the late Douglas Adams for paraphrasing his comedic masterpiece), whilst the object of vigorous pubescent masturbatory fantasies may in reality actually be well-aged, sagging, wrinkled, overweight & pox-ridden".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BmkBroiw1s
Guzzi's MGS 01 is very much like that in my own mind. Its purity of design, curvaceous lines and husky, sexy means of communicating with the rider is I fear better left as mere fantasy. For fear the translation to reality is actually much more prosaic or pedestrian. Better to metaphorically keep 'spanking the monkey' than to face the risk of post-coital letdown & disappointment!
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You only have to want to badly enough.
See here’s the thing.
There are many stinking custom bikes and one off specials that are constructed from bare tubing and checked by engineers to pass local regs.
Now if it’s possible to do that, where is the point where you hit the wall if you had an MGS and worked towards grafting a Griso or Daytona mill into one ?
If Pete walked out one morning and found an MGS on his doorstep with no engine and a red ribbon tied in a bow around it, and had a Griso donk under the bench, do you think he’d die wondering if it could be shoehorned in ?
Earlier posts on this subject revealed the sad news that the alternator would not have enough room, or the fuse box has nowhere to go except zip tied to the left foot peg or some other trifling technicality.
If a Griso mill passes emissions regs in a Griso, should it not pass the same regs in an MGS ?
Lights , horn and other ancillary equipment would be hurdles to overcome in isolation.
Pete says it’d be pointless, why then is it not just as pointless turning 1200 Grisoes and Stelvioes into 1400’s ?
Beetle says when referring to the thread..
“From hell’s heart I stab at thee..”
Ok..!
But that is not an empirical statement of why it is a worthless notion.
If it’s not as fast as a Panigale or similar, why own a “mighty” Griso for heaven’s sake, an overweight underpowered slug compared to a Desmosedici Ducati, yet hard nosed Guzzisti who’ve been riding since Christ died, go weak in the nether regions at the very utterance of the Griso name..
BS..
If our man from down under decided he wanted to do it, who among us would bet against him succeeding ?
And if he put it up for sale with 12 months rego hanging off it’s gorgeous arse, how long would it remain his ?
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With thimble sized fuel tanks that might get you to the next servo, if you ride in a manner unbecomming of a sports bike.
Has the same capacity as a Griso..
(Nice try though)
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It cracks me up how some old bikes are seen through such heavily tinted rose colored glasses, and how " facts " evolve over time.
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I was just browsing on TradeMe tonight and someone had a Bellagio for sale here in Canterbury. I was just imagining it with a V7 style tank on it instead of the flaccid whale penis; would look nice. Don't know why they put that style of tank on it.
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It cracks me up how some old bikes are seen through such heavily tinted rose colored glasses, and how " facts " evolve over time.
Do any of the bikes featured in your stable fit that bill ?
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Has the same capacity as a Griso..
(Nice try though)
With twice the HP you want 200hp out you've got to put it in.
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(https://i.ibb.co/0cX47b5/D2273-FD1-B977-4247-88-D1-498594-F886-AD.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0cX47b5)
Well they did make this gem, fast enough to kill me and generates lots of nice comments when I post pics
Or park it.it is a widow maker too.
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The RS is also a 1000 unfortunatly the US got the flacid A kit motor in the RS, niether handle anything like a MGS there is close to 15 years between the frames and geometry. I've never ridden one maybe @old jock can comment, annecdotally the Magni Australia handles very well, however if you think a RS for sale is hard to find and expensive the Magni is next level.
Well you asked, so
I don't really get the fuss over the MGS-01. Don't get me wrong, I do think it's stunning and if the specs are anything to go by it will go like S**t off the proverbial shovel. The downsides for me are it does appear very Ghezzi & Brian (and as Knuckle Dragger pointed out one of them were in collaboration with Guzzi on the styling). It's a track bike as well and needs more maintnenance than your average helicopter.
As far as cost it commands a higher price than any Magni Guzzi that I know of
Comparing the early Daytona I owned for a long time and the Australia. The Daytona you sat quite high in, it had all the steering speed of a supertanker and on twisties after a few miles I felt like Popeye such was the arm pump and muscle required to get it to turn in. Oddly It also gave me the impression at slower speeds that it was going to fall over as it entered the turn. That said get it on a fast road with sweepers and it was a complete blast. Very stable both upright and in the turns, lots of confidence at speed and no drama, unless you needed to change direction in a hurry, then things got very exciting very quickly. The engine was wonderful and I like the styling on the early Daytonas too. I should point out later bikes got rid of the useless Marzochis and I think the head angle was steepened a little, apparently these mods went a long way to sorting the lazy handling.
The Australia is just capable simply that it tracks and handles better than any other Guzzi I've ridden, all I can tell you is it's a very capable and fun bike. The power and sound out the full fat C kitted engine is glorious too. I reckon that US Australias will also have the C kit on the Series II bikes as Magni as a low volume manufacturer was able to escape a lot of the regs Guzzi had to adhere to a (high?) volume manufacturer
I agree that although a well tuned sport comes pretty dammed close to a Daytona engine, IMHO it just does not have the same urgency. The 4V is just much more fun and feels faster. The tone, the revs, the way the power comes on is a bigger rush for me. The Sporti is more linear, I love the Sporti too, just not as much as the Australia.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/2-wX7tA73SUT4S874O-h6a4M11ybeVOro6nGO7YqfuEsf6BSVAvDwSZXQ_WWvFVYr9NwYeG2501020u696YjuyfARfHX855_3IgMwOoxYE8LBjDP_Mdb4EV3tCJqJ0hFVKE0ZY5_xbWqoMLqdUu8Xyc36GXHrCzIvl1KUdxemmRwV4Hq-w_gWUnLWvaDTXfCWyEVQcDzUZ0Hr6HMN6BgNXTCR1by7dwywJpVNouhvk0Q-cfYd4a2PYL51y-SYKoHnNsK03un24nixJfkso9WXNOsRZ4WZMwQV8mAzwp3uzhXG_O7plFzBOu9UYlWrwy9vweP9I3QoAX6wPzIc_Vn4kRQMjwjdhpopmAJJ25pDRHPToZAKTt7nmgDfhAo9UqVFX7UVJ1TWX6H2w_h54ZE9dQAowgC1QdxCZxoaqZnK6RqkDSuhteDRpfRNm_3smVVtkXUhEOQEt7OfhaEzKtP9Jz1fl7KXeNrfAkAyK-nwwMHP8iKVZMvsg0YzxJ2bim8hjTygpOycSspAspqAWmHWfagd46i-Su-O7096yUsffMTFVN_IVkDMhak1N9AyLZMUmrJhBUMfzHDpVDxt47aPGjGB923rgKEugsw6jxft0CGIXQEx2I0SFC8kN9Xd_qYam03J-58T8pNz-OmfDy0lGH-gNYXSpM=w1284-h856-no)
Perhaps Litre 1000 might be interested in this
https://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=98136.msg1550285#msg1550285 (https://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=98136.msg1550285#msg1550285)
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Quote from: Turin on Today at 03:10:42 AM
It cracks me up how some old bikes are seen through such heavily tinted rose colored glasses, and how " facts " evolve over time.
Do any of the bikes featured in your stable fit that bill ?
No, but bikes I owned a long time ago would fit the bill as memory fades as why I got rid of them. I've had Cagiva Alazzurras on the brain lately because I had one when I was 18 and I "remember" how smoking fast it was. Reality is, if bought one now I'd be completely disappointed, and end up breaking the bank in pursuit squeezing out a few more horsepower.
There are no rose colored glasses when I own something, use it and have to deal with it on a daily basis good and bad. My latest Lemans SE has been knicknamed the MFG (Mother F****'n Guzzi ) as it leaves me stranded, pops of vent hoses, and slowly reveals it's gremlins.
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Huzo, The "soft-edged sport bike" of your fantasy may be nearing reality: Except that it will be better than just wrapping a sporting chassis around the V9. There have been multiple reports from Guzzi spokespeople that Guzzi has already created and is testing a road-oriented bike based on the V85 engine. Reportedly this bike is in testing/refinement as we write, and said to be performing "very, very well". There you go: Engine is V9 configuration, size and weight, but evolved and redesigned to produce about 80 HP. None of the V85 testers has complained that the V85 is underpowered. But they extoll the charm, easy tractability and pleasantness of the engine. Does a fun sport bike really need 125+ HP to be entertaining? It appears that Guzzi is in the process of creating just the bike you describe in your opening post- but better. I am looking forward to this bike. If the V85 is the runaway hit cited by many Motopress observers, then the road-oriented variant should be enticing.
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Good news.
It’ll be good to see some of these bloke who chuckled uncontrollably, have to pull their heads in when it surfaces.
I might have one of them too, to go with the V85.
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With twice the HP you want 200hp out you've got to put it in.
Was an answer to the gripe about the “thimble sized fuel capacity” Murray.
Not engine size.
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Was an answer to the gripe about the “thimble sized fuel capacity” Murray.
Not engine size.
One feeds the other the end result is instead of enjoying the ride you've got to constantly manage your range.
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(https://i.ibb.co/VShRwL3/image.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VShRwL3)
I love this pic, even if it's only computer-photo shopped.
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Huzo, The "soft-edged sport bike" of your fantasy may be nearing reality: Except that it will be better than just wrapping a sporting chassis around the V9. There have been multiple reports from Guzzi spokespeople that Guzzi has already created and is testing a road-oriented bike based on the V85 engine. Reportedly this bike is in testing/refinement as we write, and said to be performing "very, very well".
More heresay? I'll repeat what I said before.
Then we get stories of "I know a guy who's best friends second cousin works for a fellow who's uncle knows a dealer that spoke to a suit from Piaggio who said there's a 200HP water cooled engine in the works."
Sources, please. Blurry pics of imaginary motorcycle accepted.
Except this time it has a 72 RWHP 2V pushrod air cooled motor that despite all the hype about titanium valves et al, is still a prehistoric engine design. I fully expect it will not have rising rate mono shock suspension, but a single fixed shock (still not a "real" motorbike). It will have a fully loaded whiz-bang electronic instrument panel, riddled with CANbus gizmo's that will instill dread into the Luddites.
Pete says it’d be pointless, why then is it not just as pointless turning 1200 Grisoes and Stelvioes into 1400’s ?
Because in the case of embiggening a 1200, Guzzi has already done the hard work. There's no modification of frame, or alternator, or fuse box required. It's about as simple as it gets. You said it, If it’s not as fast as a Panigale or similar, why own a “mighty” Griso for heaven’s sake, an overweight underpowered slug compared to a Desmosedici Ducati, yet hard nosed Guzzisti who’ve been riding since Christ died, go weak in the nether regions at the very utterance of the Griso name..
BS..
Yes, it's an overweight, underpowered slug. My Griso now has exactly the same amount of underpowered bulk it had immediately prior to the embiggening, but it has a torque curve to be envied, more power and torque than any Guzzi you currently own, or plan to own, and who gives two buggers about fuel economy? It's not a tourer. It's just to make me smile, and boy, does it. Yes, it's knee-weakening. And it's mine.
No, there will be no "pulling in of head", but there might be some sighing and shaking of head.
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(https://i.ibb.co/VShRwL3/image.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VShRwL3)
I love this pic, even if it's only computer-photo shopped.
Me too. Later iteration of my B750.
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One feeds the other the end result is instead of enjoying the ride you've got to constantly manage your range.
How do the Griso boys manage ?
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How do the Griso boys manage ?
Seriously? I'm assuming you've had a few afternoon sherberts, I'll spell it out the Aprilia's use fuel at about 30-40% faster than the griso's because the engine makes more power/ depending on mean throttle position thus they don't go as far.
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If they do a well styled road/sport version of the V85TT I am in..
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I agree that although a well tuned sport comes pretty dammed close to a Daytona engine, IMHO it just does not have the same urgency. The 4V is just much more fun and feels faster. The tone, the revs, the way the power comes on is a bigger rush for me.
The Daytona/RS in either engine form is much more powerful, the US version with original style cams makes 15 more HP than a Sport assuming only velocity stack extensions, different rear exhaust and fuel mapping to match - 93 RWHP versus 78 RWHP, and it’s not easy to get more from the Sport. The C-kit version of the RS makes another 7 HP or so, just over 100 RWHP. The 4V/cylinder engine is very responsive to minor mods whereas the pushrod engine is not, and that makes the Daytona feel substantially more capable as a sport bike... assuming it’s been set up right. The smaller displacement engine is also smoother. Way back when the magazines tested completely stock bikes and it was really only a indication of how badly they were set up as delivered.
A well sorted 1100 Sport is lighter handling than a Daytona RS but assuming suitable tires are installed either bike has neutral steering, no instability and in my experience can be hustled down the road equally well. They are very sensitive to the type of tires installed (I have about 15-20K miles of sport riding on each model with various different tires)
I think Aprilias are completely unappealing given the price and Piaggio company ownership - there is no chance of me buying one when the Japanese build Japanese-style bikes better and for less money. However I think the existence of Aprilia will continue to be a thorn in the side of anybody who would like Guzzi to be a full line manufacturer of Italian-style bikes. My bet is on a street standard version of the V85TT within the next two years, not a sport bike. I’d be happy to be wrong!
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Seriously? I'm assuming you've had a few afternoon sherberts, I'll spell it out the Aprilia's use fuel at about 30-40% faster than the griso's because the engine makes more power/ depending on mean throttle position thus they don't go as far.
I was referring to the fact that an MGS has the same fuel capacity as a Griso, I wasn’t referring to an Aprilia at any stage.
You were.
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The Daytona/RS in either engine form is much more powerful, the US version with original style cams makes 15 more HP than a Sport assuming only velocity stack extensions, different rear exhaust and fuel mapping to match - 93 RWHP versus 78 RWHP, and it’s not easy to get more from the Sport. The C-kit version of the RS makes another 7 HP or so, just over 100 RWHP. The 4V/cylinder engine is very responsive to minor mods whereas the pushrod engine is not, and that makes the Daytona feel substantially more capable as a sport bike... assuming it’s been set up right. The smaller displacement engine is also smoother. Way back when the magazines tested completely stock bikes and it was really only a indication of how badly they were set up as delivered.
A well sorted 1100 Sport is lighter handling than a Daytona RS but assuming suitable tires are installed either bike has neutral steering, no instability and in my experience can be hustled down the road equally well. They are very sensitive to the type of tires installed (I have about 15-20K miles of sport riding on each model with various different tires)
I think Aprilias are completely unappealing given the price and Piaggio company ownership - there is no chance of me buying one when the Japanese build Japanese-style bikes better and for less money. However I think the existence of Aprilia will continue to be a thorn in the side of anybody who would like Guzzi to be a full line manufacturer of Italian-style bikes. My bet is on a street standard version of the V85TT within the next two years, not a sport bike. I’d be happy to be wrong!
I was referring to a stock Daytona Vs 1100 Sporti, I agree that a C kitted bike is a completely different kettle of fish, iin terms of performance
When comparing handling I was referring to the early Daytona Vs the Australia. That's my only real experience, although I've had brief rides on later Daytonas I've not done enough miles to form an opinion
Which version of Daytona are you referring to Tusayan?
Maybe we just beg to differ but I ran the Dayona on a couple of different tyre types, and totalled about 12-14k miles on it . The bike was one of the first into the UK.
It was a fun well handling bike just as long as you chose your route and stayed clear of roads with continuous tight bends, I enjoyed my time with it. There was nothing dangerous about the handling, once it was rolling it was extremely stable and predictable, perhaps too stable. However the early bikes handling was slooooooooow.
Maybe it is just me, I'm not doubting your opinion one bit. Perhaps you are just a better rider and able to extract performance I'm not, which would not be hard.
BUT you will never convince me that an early stock Daytona could (or can) hold it's own on a tight road for mile after mile after mile. It was the bike's Achillies heal, it didn't sour me towards it, there were a lot of complaints about it and Guzzi fixed it on later models.
Anyway I'll get ma coat
John
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It's just to make me smile, and boy, does it. Yes, it's knee-weakening. And it's mine.
No, there will be no "pulling in of head", but there might be some sighing and shaking of head.
Ok then..
If that’s the final line of the saga, then the same can be offered in defence of those who can manage a grin at the thought of a “prehistoric engined” V85, (you know, the one we were never going to see.. :embarrassed:)
So my 2VPC Norge or my stinking old Mk2 must be in the same bracket as your locomotive engined Griso, because it makes me grin, (so does Fawlty Towers..) and it’s mine, (so is the sponge I wash my bike with..)
Although the likes of the V85 with it’s lousy 2VPC layout will always attract torrents of manufactured vitriol and thinly disguised stealing of phraseology, from those who are knowledgeable enough to hold an informed opinion and the rest who want to attach themselves to the coat tails of the established luminaries (so as not to taste their wrath), may I point out that the “mighty Griso” whether standard or punched out a bit, is still a relatively prehistoric offering.
It just has a couple more valves and the cam/s a bit closer to your arse.
Nonetheless a wonderful display of engineering acumen and electronic wizardry to be as successful as it demonstrably is, but just a crank of the lens to keep it all in perspective..
Sure the 1400 pulls like a 14 year old boy with a Penthouse and drinks like a fish, but it’d bloody well want to with a displacement like that, would it not ?
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Seriously? I'm assuming you've had a few afternoon sherberts, I'll spell it out the Aprilia's use fuel at about 30-40% faster than the griso's because the engine makes more power/ depending on mean throttle position thus they don't go as far.
Ok Muzz.
No need to spell anything out.
If I can drag you back kicking and screaming to the point I (attempted) to make..
The comment was made by some bugger that the MGS would be worthless as a road bike because of the piss weak fuel range and I (rather bravely) dared to suggest that a Griso seems to be the weapon of choice of some very discerning Guzzisti, that do have a solid grasp of the difference between shit and clay..(an Aussieism for some bastard who knows damn well what he’s talking about..).
So consequently a mythical Griso engined MGS would have the same range as a Griso...No ?
So what does that do to the above line of reasoning ?
I’ll ask this question AGAIN...
If Roper had an MGS rolling chassis in one greasy paw and a Griso donk in the other..
Who here would bet against him making it work, he’s done cleverer shit...
That is all I was trying to ask, but as usual extraneous bullshit has been injected into the topic so as to steer it in a direction that it was not intended to go.
And y’all reckon I’m a troll...?
Jeeez.
And for the record ?
No, I’m not on the piss Muzz..
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(https://i.ibb.co/VShRwL3/image.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VShRwL3)
I love this pic, even if it's only computer-photo shopped.
If Tamburini got hold of it (916 Ducati and MV Augusta F4), and rounded off the angular sharp edges a bit, with a slight increase in faring size for visual balance, it’d be getting closer.
As it is, it smacks of a red ZX 10 Kawasaki or similar in it’s styling cues..
The fairing looks like something they found under their Dad’s bench and glued it on..
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Huzo Wrote:
I’ll ask this question AGAIN...
If Roper had an MGS rolling chassis in one greasy paw and a Griso donk in the other..
Who here would bet against him making it work, he’s done cleverer shit...
I think the lack of response is your answer. You did ask who would bet against him. I wouldn't.
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Huzo Wrote:
I think the lack of response is your answer. You did ask who would bet against him. I wouldn't.
I don’t want to be accused of kissing his arse, (although I’ve seen worse.. :wink:)
But I’d have a quiet 10 Grand on him.. :bow:
Furthermore.
I’ll bet my flat tappets that if Beetle wanted to, he could fart in the general direction of the ECU and for a trifling increase in fuel usage per kilometre, could produce a map that would result in the best looking Guzzi ever built of that ilk, that would power wheelie out of tight hairpins... :thumb:
Oh dear..
Excuse me, I have to duck off for a few minutes... :wink:
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I was referring to a stock Daytona Vs 1100 Sporti, I agree that a C kitted bike is a completely different kettle of fish, iin terms of performance
When comparing handling I was referring to the early Daytona Vs the Australia. That's my only real experience, although I've had brief rides on later Daytonas I've not done enough miles to form an opinion
Which version of Daytona are you referring to Tusayan?
Maybe we just beg to differ but I ran the Dayona on a couple of different tyre types, and totalled about 12-14k miles on it . The bike was one of the first into the UK.
It was a fun well handling bike just as long as you chose your route and stayed clear of roads with continuous tight bends, I enjoyed my time with it. There was nothing dangerous about the handling, once it was rolling it was extremely stable and predictable, perhaps too stable. However the early bikes handling was slooooooooow.
Maybe it is just me, I'm not doubting your opinion one bit. Perhaps you are just a better rider and able to extract performance I'm not, which would not be hard.
BUT you will never convince me that an early stock Daytona could (or can) hold it's own on a tight road for mile after mile after mile. It was the bike's Achillies heal, it didn't sour me towards it, there were a lot of complaints about it and Guzzi fixed it on later models.
Anyway I'll get ma coat
John
Mine is a US spec Daytona RS that makes 93 RWHP. It is a better, faster, smoother sport bike than the 78 RWHP injected 1100 Sport it replaced.
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Mine is a US spec Daytona RS that makes 93 RWHP. It is a better, faster, smoother sport bike than the 78 RWHP injected 1100 Sport it replaced.
That’s nice..
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If Tamburini got hold of it (916 Ducati and MV Augusta F4), and rounded off the angular sharp edges a bit, with a slight increase in faring size for visual balance, it’d be getting closer.
Massimo Tamburini won't be getting hold of anything, given that he's dead. :wink: In his lifetime, his work was the exact opposite of retro and I don't think he would have put himself within 100 meters of anything that copied the past.
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I was referring to the fact that an MGS has the same fuel capacity as a Griso, I wasn’t referring to an Aprilia at any stage.
You were.
I haven't sat down and dnone the numbers but the MGS likes to drink at a track day you will fit another 12 to 14 litres in at lunchtime if the leave it you'll get the wonderful sounds of silience half way through a session. The other quirk of the MGS actually its not a qurick its really !@#$ed is the tank is black plastic, the consturction of the tank is not the problem the colour is.
No fuel gauge no low fuel light and unlike carbs which will give you cough cough splutter when the FI pump runs out of pressure it just stops. Trying to determine the level down through the rather skinny filler neck is a PITA. The only real way is to calibrate a stick or fill it, filling it is a bit hit and miss as the tank goes from a very large volume down to a very small filler neck very suddenly so you don't get a lot of warning. Normally however you are at a track and have trailered it to the track with associated support parafinalia like some extra fuel which at worse you are a couple of kms away from. Not wondering if you can do 30-60 kms on the low fuel light.
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Massimo Tamburini won't be getting hold of anything, given that he's dead. :wink: In his lifetime, his work was the exact opposite of retro and I don't think he would have put himself within 100 meters of anything that copied the past.
Well in the light of that, I guess we’ll never know.
But I’d like to hope that you get my point.
Nice one though.. I wish i’d known that, I guess that makes everything I’ve said, a complete nonsense.
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Could be the reason ....
(https://oi1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic008/design%20fault_zpsueajvt9t.jpg)
:cheesy:
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I haven't sat down and dnone the numbers but the MGS likes to drink at a track day you will fit another 12 to 14 litres in at lunchtime if the leave it you'll get the wonderful sounds of silience half way through a session. The other quirk of the MGS actually its not a qurick its really !@#$ed is the tank is black plastic, the consturction of the tank is not the problem the colour is.
No fuel gauge no low fuel light and unlike carbs which will give you cough cough splutter when the FI pump runs out of pressure it just stops. Trying to determine the level down through the rather skinny filler neck is a PITA. The only real way is to calibrate a stick or fill it, filling it is a bit hit and miss as the tank goes from a very large volume down to a very small filler neck very suddenly so you don't get a lot of warning. Normally however you are at a track and have trailered it to the track with associated support parafinalia like some extra fuel which at worse you are a couple of kms away from. Not wondering if you can do 30-60 kms on the low fuel light.
Trivialities my dear Muzz.
My flight of fancy if you recall, was to have a Griso donk in the mythical MGS, so the fuel slurpage would be as it is in a Griso.
I don’t give a rats about track days, just the look of the darn thing is intoxicating, remember when passion ruled your commonsense ?
If it’s as quick as a well ridden Griso, you should be able to keep your licence long enough to get home for tea..
Look, it really is this simple..
If Roper decided that HE wanted to put a Griso donk in an MGS, could he do it ?
I am not seeking the opinion of others as to the worth of such a creation.
And.
Is the V85 or the expected road version that much different to the V9 based roadster that I (and others), posed as a viable creation.
If it’s too much of a stretch to confine ourselves to that empirical idea, let’s just forget it and farkle our Cali’s and other such erection inducing pursuits..
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Hi Huzo
Rather than an MGSed Griso, how about this very nice 1200 Sport transformation?
http://www.guareschimoto.it/gc-corse-kit-varano/
I personally like the idea of a V85 LeMans knock off.......errr..... ...tribute. Given who it is catering to, clip ons not too low and rear sets not too high.
Surely it is time for something like this, V7 'specials' surely can't have too many more variants left in them?
Cheers
Jason
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Hi Huzo
Rather than an MGSed Griso, how about this very nice 1200 Sport transformation?
http://www.guareschimoto.it/gc-corse-kit-varano/
I personally like the idea of a V85 LeMans knock off.......errr..... ...tribute. Given who it is catering to, clip ons not too low and rear sets not too high.
Surely it is time for something like this, V7 'specials' surely can't have too many more variants left in them?
Cheers
Jason
Berloody hell..!
That’s not far off the money.
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Trivialities my dear Muzz.
My flight of fancy if you recall, was to have a Griso donk in the mythical MGS, so the fuel slurpage would be as it is in a Griso.
I don’t give a rats about track days, just the look of the darn thing is intoxicating, remember when passion ruled your commonsense ?
To the latter when I forked out for my MGS, a Griso donk would be utterly disappointing in an MGS chassi's.
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Hi Huzo
Rather than an MGSed Griso, how about this very nice 1200 Sport transformation?
http://www.guareschimoto.it/gc-corse-kit-varano/
I personally like the idea of a V85 LeMans knock off.......errr..... ...tribute. Given who it is catering to, clip ons not too low and rear sets not too high.
Surely it is time for something like this, V7 'specials' surely can't have too many more variants left in them?
Cheers
Jason
I posted the link to the WG thread on that back bike at #86 and it went completly un-noticed :wink:
I really like the look of that machine it appeals to me more than an MGS. If I had the cash I'd go for it, except I'm getting too old and still have to sort out a bunch of issues on the bikes I already own.
Making it road legal wouldn't scare me it's far from being beyond the wit of man to slap on a tail-light and an HID projector lamp or a reflector in the fairing, similar to these
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/XfqMDtNEdDT2yLywyrmbSsPVU_5tPyLWZxh1KbdEDMwBmFFUEHyLHXGAnBH5cERg9BWQuetcotp44PvhChk9jcm1zhoKI9wEjASWIAN7BzO84jBEChmbthbD4Eh4XTK_ZSf5qkjN3bK6fZRlIHXyfNUkOgLl8NE5V0f7-y9q2x1P-OGrc0mIZKdJYEKSzhuE7ecWFAFw40wfnAvk5u0_1MlthLuK6VNNfl0Kzazrrq05wuTkKqdpq-JXA9Bj8OBRLrdue59kUPQTVOOXulj-FrbGCfpIjXwelC8rTNKixeyn4uEcHZpnvH68RyIRpIoQis5Lr3fxghf9nuv32TRsWjoKT4HgAneyAohUIKOwzsIqnU74HVOcLwSnVLkCJTfKbd9SXl2Tn20F3xeZefYI_dcNfS_Ak5x22wR-H5dEJFgwydzsCCIko4_Bd_dyP5604kQdEDmSPIwni3MeVnmMS3bYe6vxjiCVzVD9CaE_pnNtyEU6GfHdyc1g7B1ZsGp9XKsM12EXE4AN7QaEJfeTUmnYF7d1smvPQROMVFZrcTC-zwyqqxJ-96VJsy4xRalXshnyHyznnUBVYmiFc20mdp72j02fBhVRWNcOu5Y_OldWBr9t0oyPdYhV38TJOlLtFXn1aiZGD5SeocjKm_o6OCu3SKJQTWg=w858-h930-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/VGOlgDoCJLdvvhCGUnMaR6WBqxk-4SCWIsVLD_I7zyVnpqgm7JeIhdA_5gJt_xlmqabhDD71ajfPyOtVFd7qBPMnBnxl0WugTTvkp-mRGM1wqOmGLhfSyk57fqoCg7-0bSoPz_lgF3ZnDsytLDQkIYL2X5rhA0UvqE9abVHD0VB8aw_l8sJFyZSKOb2CyyJF_hE6nw7IdSpqFWtII54JaYCPRlLJ2WNblObkAGCEzSSHz5LW4efF9KG6kX_CvyMZt_o0WaVp3H22Y9aWZ9p5WSUN-pOu7zIN5YFOLVLCFIHbfqoe180hqYXM_Nk9WvB7eOcghC1IYIwn8B6ol2YyTDZyVdaCjKMSn8EtUMbwtmhtbo4BInUZ250fqOJMOne3EotKrv6ADPqIIRjEk9_j4vu3ZVo-PYSooiZvf2rqn0T9iFrpmAOrBJMZwspag6FhvOkELPDE8uNNL-Ufjra4UGVHCYSWRBm8DUpjkAgRvJj1hgXm7ajMjQDulf1HDQaM5HWToOa3TaEczyuv6liVZAPTlsAPmO6AXmc0HLrDIUarne5fTeEfwOWtNkleh6Mgut6FD4fmeBQRZZaqcrl_CJLUxNslbmLOy_gnrbGMDLjq-5GTkSByNMJzU_As_QH-2VGTN2HxsaE16guLVSg7Sv9YpGeDJjQ=w1200-h800-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/b_es-nycfFMC4GTLaw5d7tM1_mslCMsbZOJlb_3Cn0cXugxuXNRhxANyWRYee69mGuzSvzPPFEi781xaC0LQC8mhxh7KIjTANyGAVMGIGyroFCUgaA_c2VdQtpOPbJG0HgSN91lFQD8C3L7EXbnzJJSyPKqEx5IbHolECnquV73JgBAMwgmbB0wJjY3C13PSJOKK2yFDngqEs7NEWYkKkqz26ganfKRGIppuzd_BIVB2zNA-SLX_MVy2ZK5O0_ZiRp2x1QCXNljzO5E_lKODcAwVZs_sqEK2okdamO0P3hE3HRlWCkfQIuZ77u-9uQTj3aU4xVVzGWjAVtnykA-bZG2K3uKsybr6DuhPqNxD8g6c3h1Z6rsyrBaIfb1Wk_B776Q0mAkmPDL-03Es3t1q8YjoVbT42EaNEgEaQdy1h_wC3kzdRJqvjz21pxbaYe0vAbZ7uj9fCKweoYP2U1t1lf54UYy_ycuXf5xqvh5Wneq1hHPU0N6jn-3exgLBhEl5AU-s5i4sgkCu66IL83aVQNfW1F8T-50ybB80YAZxWIA32h2kZJHFB5cpT_d9m5P5cf6XPt2vGyWlR2qTqb8qVIprgK4YNx0KKv1VUMWVESOlx6BKUjwo32JWd6d1OHD8yU6SQKfYujpiWZuUjsLO9-RkM0fGFDM=w1284-h856-no)
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To the latter when I forked out for my MGS, a Griso donk would be utterly disappointing in an MGS chassi's.
Not to me Muzz.
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One problem when you start building bikes like the MGS and Panigale is cost. These bikes usually sell for about $35000+ which puts them out of reach of most people.
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One problem when you start building bikes like the MGS and Panigale is cost. These bikes usually sell for about $35000+ which puts them out of reach of most people.
Dunno mate..
People pay that for Harleys and similar...?..
What’s your taste extend to ?
A streetable MGS 01 or a bucket of pus ?
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Just give us the road version of the V85TT. Im hoping there will be a Monza, a standard looking one, and a Mini Norge. Then maybe later a 4V Lemans version.
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Just give us the road version of the V85TT. Im hoping there will be a Monza, a standard looking one, and a Mini Norge. Then maybe later a 4V Lemans version.
I'm sceptical, Scotty.
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All these comments about small fuel tanks is cracking me up. I rode 137k miles on my 4 gallon Yamaha xs 1100 that got on a good day 33 miles per gallon. Sucking fumes at 120 miles. Did it for 30+ years. It is ALWAYS what you make of it.
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All these comments about small fuel tanks is cracking me up. I rode 137k miles on my 4 gallon Yamaha xs 1100 that got on a good day 33 miles per gallon. Sucking fumes at 120 miles. Did it for 30+ years. It is ALWAYS what you make of it.
Yeah, and I used to ride Harley Sportsters with 2.25 gallon and 3.25 gallon tanks. Great when I rode mainly around a metro area and didn't take long trips. Loved those bikes, for their intended purpose.
Doesn't change the fact that spending time in gas station SUCKS! And short range SUCKS!
Give me 5-gallons+ and 200-miles+ range, please. One of the cool things about most of the Guzzis I've owned is the generous range they have.
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All these comments about small fuel tanks is cracking me up. I rode 137k miles on my 4 gallon Yamaha xs 1100 that got on a good day 33 miles per gallon. Sucking fumes at 120 miles. Did it for 30+ years. It is ALWAYS what you make of it.
In a place that is literally 1.5 times the size of Texas with 8% of the population?
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Always enjoy gas tank size discussions, brings out the extreme examples :boozing:
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Always enjoy gas tank size discussions, brings out the extreme examples :boozing:
I do love a good “mine’s bigger than yours” story. :popcorn:
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I do love a good “mine’s bigger than yours” story. :popcorn:
:whip2:
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Could be the reason ....
(https://oi1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag77/Penderic/Penderic008/design%20fault_zpsueajvt9t.jpg)
:cheesy:
That geezer/guy/bloke, on the bike looks a like a budding mechanic I met in Bungendore..!
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Always enjoy gas tank size discussions, brings out the extreme examples :boozing:
I must be insane to expect it to also function as transport, 200kms when ridden in a sportsman like manner is what I expect/require, Aprilia V4 is between 120 and 140kms ducatis 1098 is about 150 ish through recent years manufacturers have been putting smaller and smaller tanks with steadily more powerful engines.
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I rode my H-D Sportster with peanut tank and bolted to a side car for two years,
lots and lots of gas stops. =my example of an extreme example.
So is bringing up riding in a place "literally 1.5 times the size of Texas with 8% of the population"...
I just didn't get your point.
I would think these types of examples cover an extremely small percentage of potential buyers.
Maybe I'm wrong.
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I'd just like Guzzi to come up with something original for a change. I'm a mite fed up with all this derivative crap. Multitudinous microvariations around a basic theme that only a non-discerning hipster might love.
Retro be buggered. All this 'artisinal' palaver is all very fine i suppose if it appeals. But to me it's not the Guzzi I remember. Guzzi were traditionally renowned for innovation and a heavy dose of 'difference'. These days it's anything but. Change the colour, the OEM supplier of maybe some wheels/mufflers/suspension, add a handful of cubic capacity & call it 'new'... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
OK. The Racer was maybe 'different' but it also seemed to try a little too hard on the retro-cool front too. The current efforts, worthy as they may very well be, are just a bit too safe, a bit too bland, a bit too much like what has come before. Those now discontinued 'big block' models: Griso & Stelvio were sufficiently 'different' to qualify as original. Yes, there's been litrebike plus roadsters & cruisers before, not to mention the previous 650NTX & Quota, but each of these 2 latter-day models is nevertheless uniquely divergent too.
The V85 is sufficiently, commendably revised to perhaps qualify as 'new'. It's pretty far removed from its rough road predecessors, and all the V7/V9 Roamer, Bobber, Racer, Ducker, Weaver, Wobbler, Tosser, Wanker derivative clones. Despite being described as a 'classic' Enduro of the same lineage as the NTX & Quota.
Let's see yet another 'original' V85 roadster next down the production line eh Piaggio? Not just another slightly different colour or combo of OEM supplied componentry......pl ease.
Of course, I'm just as likely as anybody else - maybe more so - of talking out my arse. I've always had the propensity. But much as I'd love a 'new' MGS-01 or even Le Mans variant that actually 'works' well, as opposed to merely looking good, it isn't going to happen. The extremity of the former (guessing here, never ridden one), and the sheer shittiness of operation of the latter (slow, gutless, abysmally suspended, heavy extreme clutch & unwillingness to corner with anything approaching acceptability) ensures neither will Thankfully ever see the light of day. At best, only a fairly bland, relatively characterless pastiche of their former idiosyncratic nature will result, pleasing only perhaps the uninspired and uninitiated.
The Piaggio/Aprilia/Guzzi collective can produce great bikes. Given enough rope. Their latest model's almost universal acclaim supports my thesis. Coming as it does from such mundane & pedestrian origins, componentry and a developmental micro-budget it against all odds appears to be a resounding success.
But I fear that producing yet another variant of what has gone before for a fickle, sycophantic bunch of beard-balm wearing hipster fashion-victims will eventually fail. Guzzi's greatness has historically arisen from their uniqueness & innovation, rather than their ability to produce clones for clones.
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What do you mean ?
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Not really sure Huzo. Just summat that hasn't been recycled a half dozen times already.
Something fresh (for MG anyway): a barebones stripper maybe? An Ohlins-clad USD forked Super Moto? A protectively faired super-tourer? A knobby tyred scrambler? Buggered if I know really.... I'm really only navel-gazing a bit. It's sometimes fun to speculate about what-ifs.
As sure as shooting it'd prolly be a crap seller anyway. Which is why I suppose Piaggio management keep such a tight reign on proceedings, esp. the purse-strings. The 'safer' option might be boring, but I assume this is where the sales figures are.
Still, it's nice to dream....
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An update on the B750 with the V85TT engine, and a half fairing, single shock as per the TT.
Guzzis are still unique - no engine anything like it.
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The guys who are good at making sport bikes can't sell sport bikes. That model is struggling.
You have not seen much advancement in Japanese sport bikes because no one buys them. Ducati is doing 'OK', but they can tolerate lower volumes.
Small (newbie), naked, and adventure bikes are what is selling. Dumping money into a bike not even the OP will buy...not a smart move. They will be heavy and slow. Not a good combo. Look at how many people went out an bought a V7 racer...
The 1200s are dead (and so is the CARC),
the 1400s are on the way out
the V7,8,9 are all small blocks of ancient tech. I wouldn't hang my hat on an under powered heavy 'sport' bike.
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Just joking Knuckles.
A good read, nice to get some buggers talking.
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They need to build a V4 and single! :wink: :grin:
(https://i.ibb.co/2Nj58Ds/moto-guzzi-prototipo-v4-1-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/2Nj58Ds)
(https://i.ibb.co/tP1VX3q/moto-guzzi-prototipo-v4-sfoglia-la-gallery.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tP1VX3q)
(https://i.ibb.co/Fqp4cCp/moto-guzzi-prototipo-mono670-2-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Fqp4cCp)
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A V4 of about 1200-1300 with decent ohlins suspension and a kerb weight of under 200 kilos and a riding position like the Griso or a R9T would be brilliant.
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A V4 of about 1200-1300 with decent ohlins suspension and a kerb weight of under 200 kilos and a riding position like the Griso or a R9T would be brilliant.
Its called the Aprilia Tuono they've recently beefed up the midrange in the latest edtion.
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I'm hoping they don't sit on their hands for too long. Just paid off the mortgage..... :cheesy:
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I'm hoping they don't sit on their hands for too long. Just paid off the mortgage..... :cheesy:
This is the issue I have I don't buy bikes very often and the last one put it off for quiet a bit of time but I'm getting to that piont, the local shop is complaining he is hemoraging customers that had Lemans 1100 sports daytona's etc and there is nothing to go to from Guzzi. The workshop pays the bills not the sales but with no bikes to bring in repeat customers, it has a lifespan, the cali's V7's kinda ticking over the V9's have done nothing.
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I haven't sat down and dnone the numbers but the MGS likes to drink at a track day you will fit another 12 to 14 litres in at lunchtime if the leave it you'll get the wonderful sounds of silience half way through a session. The other quirk of the MGS actually its not a qurick its really !@#$ed is the tank is black plastic, the consturction of the tank is not the problem the colour is.
No fuel gauge no low fuel light and unlike carbs which will give you cough cough splutter when the FI pump runs out of pressure it just stops. Trying to determine the level down through the rather skinny filler neck is a PITA. The only real way is to calibrate a stick or fill it, filling it is a bit hit and miss as the tank goes from a very large volume down to a very small filler neck very suddenly so you don't get a lot of warning. Normally however you are at a track and have trailered it to the track with associated support parafinalia like some extra fuel which at worse you are a couple of kms away from. Not wondering if you can do 30-60 kms on the low fuel light.
Murray..
Please re read your comments, add punctuation, fix the spelling and proof read before posting.
Here...is....the... .point...!
The MGS tank will hold 20 litres.
A Griso tank is 17 litres......?
A mythical MGS with a “ mighty Griso” engine will therefore go about 15% FURTHER on a tank of fuel than a lard arsed Griso.
The other stuff is extraneous dribble.
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Dunno , who started this unicorn thread anyway ?
Dusty
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Dunno , who started this unicorn thread anyway ?
Dusty
Sometimes I go and re- read something that holds new significance in the light of changing circumstances Dusty.
I only wanted to point out in response to the “small tank” comments in regard to the MGS, that it holds significantly more than a Griso and it would not have the thirst issues of the MGS mill, given that the engine is standard Griso in my lovely little dream.
And also Dusty..
There are longer running threads by a large margin than this one... :wink:
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I can’t believe they are going to abandon the 1400 motor. I think we will see it in something new soon.
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I can’t believe they are going to abandon the 1400 motor. I think we will see it in something new soon.
1400s sold in the hundreds while V7s and V9s have sold in the thousands.
I will not be surprised to learn that the 1400s are dead and gone. It's interesting that there are none newer than 2017 on the market, which probably indicates they're already out of production.
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I'm pretty certain the 1400 won't be around much longer. It is riven with engineering challenges and barely works as it is. The Big Block has reached the end of the line. It's time for it to be put in a boat and given a Viking Burial, sad but true.
As for the rest of this discussion? The person I think sounded closest to my beliefs was Knuckle Dragger. Nothing they are currently producing really has much originality or innovation. If I was in charge I'd axe all the current models, abandon the V-Twin and shaft drive and see if they couldn't start building something exciting and different again. A big single like the Vitpillen would be my choice.
Pete
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As for the rest of this discussion? The person I think sounded closest to my beliefs was Knuckle Dragger. Nothing they are currently producing really has much originality or innovation. If I was in charge I'd axe all the current models, abandon the V-Twin and shaft drive and see if they couldn't start building something exciting and different again. A big single like the Vitpillen would be my choice.
Pete
Well, yes. Only I wouldn´t buy it. Either Kawasaki (W800) or Royal Enfield (650 Interceptor) would sell me a bike. Perhaps even a Sportster Roadster or a Triumph Bonneville could make it. And I would still weep about the loss of the shaft drive.
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I guess I'm totally off the planet. I LIKE my V7-a lot. I'm not supposed to because it's a throwback-old tech-rehash of something? Had plenty of 125 plus horse power bikes-prefer the V7. The three guys I know with 1400's absolutely love them. Two had Harley prior and one had a CalVin. All say they'd never go back to their old motorcycles. When I wanted a full fairing bike I rode them all. Norge was the best of the lot-especially for the money-by a long shot. There is no way a BMW RT is worth the extra 10K.
I feel like that kid in The Incredibles movie; "Sometimes I don't know what ANYBODY is talking about!"
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I am happy, really happy when I ride my V7 Stone. Which I bought new at 15 March 2013 (yes, at the 92. birthday of the factory). Whether I ride alone or with friends, whether I make a training at a circuit of the ADAC, I can ride fast through twisties and I always feel I am riding a mechanical, man-made device. Which is beautiful, sounds, feels, smells and looks like a bike from my youth but is cleaner, much more reliable and safer than the old offerings. This is what I wanted. And not a KTM Duke in disguise. I will never say anything against the quality of modern motorcycles. But they mean nothing to me.
The V85 TT however...
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I’ve often thought that technology applied to motorcycles is best used to make them simpler, not more complex. A sophisticated single is one way to do that, and obviously has the attribute of only one cylinder, but I think the V85TT engine has done the same, only better: a fairly light air cooled engine with 4 valves total, one cam, one throttle body, one crank throw, no counter-balancer and so on... providing fully up to speed, modern performance. That’s what Guzzi is all about: clever, not complex.
Once again, the self appointed ‘experts’ on things like the ability of air-cooled engine to meet smog laws, Guzzi small blocks to produce more power and the rest have been proved wrong by engineers who do it.
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The 1400 “barley works “??? That’s absurd Pete.
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The 1400 has to have everything 'Just so' otherwise it will drink oil, or expel it, like a bastard! The condensor system is easily overwhelmed and I'm convinced that one of the reasons they opted for the weedy porting was to try and mitigate the tendency to expel oil.
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I would put my money on that a scrambler, based on the V85, is the next thing they will present. For the future I hope they soon get a new engine with watercooling, then you might see some performance models.
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I would put my money on that a scrambler, based on the V85, is the next thing they will present. For the future I hope they soon get a new engine with watercooling, then you might see some performance models.
Both remarks: what for?
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Both remarks: what for?
Because to build a scrambler from the V85TT is very simple and the days of aircooled engines are nearly over(pollution restrictions)
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Bump for Kremmen, most of youse have read this already.
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this was a fun post. i have learned a lot of Australian words.
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I know this has been covered from a thousand angles, but why oh why does Guzzi REFUSE to build a soft edged sports bike around the V9mill ? I've been told why you can't just put a Griso donk in an MGS 01 and add a couple of lights in Mandello and go for a ride... I reluctantly accept that.
However with their (reputedly) diminishing market share in some parts of the world (Oz), what is the barrier to building something that pays some degree of homage to the MGS, option it up with Ohlins for those who want it, and maybe release a variant with an 850 donk and call it the V8, again a commentary on the legendary past, (it works for the V7 and V9) and make bloody sure you paint the bastard RED !
Here in Oz, the laws are such that it's becoming completely pointless owning and servicing a 300 kph bike and most guys know it, there's not a lot of Panigale's around. Any sports bike that is raw and pseudo race ready gives the average young buyer a chubby, and it MUST be possible after seeing the MGS. Every bastard loves them, but Guzzi won't/(can't) do it. If they don't grab more market share they'll go under eventually, won't they? I'd expect it would need the CARC ass end for the single sided swing arm, so I don't know how that can be done with the V9, I'm just shit scared that they'll eventually realise that they can make a fortune producing bright red flat pack kitchen setups under licence from IKEA or something equally ridiculous and all the bike stuff will be relegated to the back shed, until in 25 years time some rich industrialist will "resurrect" the brand and start putting electric motors in them.
Although it won't be all bad, Roper'll be on his Enfield, Dusty'll be in a rocking chair with pipe and slippers and I'll be dead ! 'Funny thing is, I don't actually want one, I just think lots of potential buyers do, they just don't know it yet ! Guzzi have to stop their model line up being for old farts and hipsters ! They've been going out of business since 1921, if they keep trying, they'll succeed...
The answer to this and just about every other question regarding Guzzi marketing and model decisions over the last 30 years is covered in Dave Richardsons new book. Its worth reading, it has the answers.
Ciao
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Bump for Kremmen, most of youse have read this already.
I had too. Several times. :tongue:
It's RIGHT up my alley, haha.
The answer to this and just about every other question regarding Guzzi marketing and model decisions over the last 30 years is covered in Dave Richardsons new book. Its worth reading, it has the answers.
Well that just went to the top of my reading list. Ta.
Dave's other book is good too. :tongue:
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I believe P'joe's limited aluminum 'allotment' for each of its children,does not include MG. It really rots that in this century MG makes damned near everything out of iron. Does any other manufacturer build 750cc bikes with the performance of 500cc's and the weight of an 850?. Yes, I'm old enough to be grumpy. I don't need the stress and danger of riding 500# motor bikes. Most of the fleet is going on the block. Anything weighing more than 400#'s is out of here. R3~
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any thread worthy enough to bring father Pete back into the discussion is worthy of all of us chiming in as well. I have been guilty of the same wet dreams as brother Huzo . I actually was really enamored with the new v85 intro but held back in anticipation of what may never be. My feeling is that all the cards are in there favor ,at this point of sport bike development. Whats out there now has soo much horsepower that they need nanny aids just to keep street riders from becoming statistics. If anyone can build a masterpiece of art and function for sport street enthusiast, without all the overkill of track purpose top end, Guzzi can. And by the time they get it done I'll be ready with cash in hand. It will happen , they have been at it way to long to forget their past. And as time marches on the market void grows ever larger.
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any thread worthy enough to bring father Pete back into the discussion is worthy of all of us chiming in as well. I have been guilty of the same wet dreams as brother Huzo . I actually was really enamored with the new v85 intro but held back in anticipation of what may never be. My feeling is that all the cards are in there favor ,at this point of sport bike development. Whats out there now has soo much horsepower that they need nanny aids just to keep street riders from becoming statistics. If anyone can build a masterpiece of art and function for sport street enthusiast, without all the overkill of track purpose top end, Guzzi can. And by the time they get it done I'll be ready with cash in hand. It will happen , they have been at it way to long to forget their past. And as time marches on the market void grows ever larger.
My main gripe was and still is Lucian, that there is a nucleus of otherwise well informed people out there who are incredulous that such a device would be considered. They are just saying it because their contemporaries are saying it.
Again I suggest..
If a dealer had 20 Panigale’s and 20 MGS’ on his floor both road ready, he’d sell out of the Guzzi first.
Outright power is no longer the drawcard that it was, the raw appeal of an optioned up MGS, would eclipse the Ducati in the desirability stakes.
Why would an MGS with a cosmetically re worked Griso engine, be more expensive than a Panigale or similar ?
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If a dealer had 20 Panigale’s and 20 MGS’ on his floor both road ready, he’d sell out of the Guzzi first.
Outright power is no longer the drawcard that it was, the raw appeal of an optioned up MGS, would eclipse the Ducati in the desirability stakes.
Why would an MGS with a cosmetically re worked Griso engine, be more expensive than a Panigale or similar ?
I think you are off with the fairies thinking the Guzzi would sell first,
The Griso motor isn't road legal it doesn't pass emissions, it's too old.
MGS would be more expensive there is this thing called scale of economy,
The Griso and Guzzi's layout precludes a number of not so modern sport bike feature like slipper clutches etc.
Outright power still matters, most sport bike buyers do track days pretty regularly and some of us don't live in a police state :P .
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. I actually was really enamored with the new v85 intro but held back in anticipation of what may never be.
Yeah, I know that feeling.
Way more pessimistic nowadays though. Took a lot to get me there, I believed in the MGS 01 Serie and the VA10 and the 2008 Terblanche bikes and the TTR1200 and even the first few of the yearly "new Le Mans definitely actually happening" rumours... I sat up and paid attention again to the ALL NEW V85 ENGINE, WE'RE GOING TO DO A WHOLE SERIES OF EXCITING NEW BIKES YOU GUYS, NO REALLY WE MEAN IT THIS TIME, IT'S ALL NEW SO COMPLETELY NEW stuff. But...it's just a refresh on the smallblock...isn't it? Is it me who's mad or just the factory and we're all humouring them? OK, great job getting more power out of it and meeting Euro Umpteen, but geeze some of the marketing. :undecided:
They've abandoned sports machines and litre motors and now even cruisers. What are we down to now - 3 basic models? They've got lucky with a well-received ADV at the height of a craze for that kind of machine but fashion is fickle and this tiny line-up makes the DeTomaso era look like a golden age by comparison.
So it would be reassuring to see evidence, soon, that someone at Piaggio sees Guzzi as more than an almost boutique hipster-bike/ADV maker. But I don't really think we will see anything on the V85 platform beyond modest V85 variants. It's already been 2 years.
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Outright power still matters, most sport bike buyers do track days pretty regularly and some of us don't live in a police state :P .
Can't argue. I think they'd have shifted a good number of bikes in 2002-2005 or so but the gulf which has opened up since then is just massive; 122hp looks quaint now and if you take a good close look at a Panigale, which I did the other day...well. I'd *love* for Guzzi to throw a bone but that'd be much of the year's budget gone on something that they'd sell to me and a handful of other weirdo obsessives. It's the kind of thing that a bespoke/boutique maker might do but not the factory, under Piaggio.
Reckon we're not going to get anything really interesting from Guzzi again before the end of petrol but I look forward to the inevitable EV 'tribute' bikes with their distinctive "air cooled V-twin" battery packs... :tongue:
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Reckon we're not going to get anything really interesting from Guzzi again before the end of petrol but I look forward to the inevitable EV 'tribute' bikes with their distinctive "air cooled V-twin" battery packs... :tongue:
This where I see opportunity Piaggio are messing with hybrids and the like with the MP3 etc, they should go racing with the Guzzi brand which has traditionally been and engineering based brand in the Zero GP/TT series won't encroach on Aprilia's road racing efforts, it is a long term thing 4-5years before we really see something for the road, Guzzi is so obscure in the public's eye they won't have the mountain to climb that HD have with the Livewire. They can keep punching out V7's to keep the base customers happy.
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someone posted either here or another site about a competition between a new Pangale and a 2005 GSX1000. Two good amatuer riders. Both riders were able to post faster laps on the old Gixxer. they said that they felt more comfortable on the older bike (less power, less nannies).
so, if a 122 hp bike was brought out today that was very controllable, composed and that inspired rider confidence, could a good rider make use of it and more importantly, would he pay for the honor (if shaft drive)? maybe they are scratching their corporate heads over this in Mandelo, or, just going out to get another cupachino?
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someone posted either here or another site about a competition between a new Pangale and a 2005 GSX1000. Two good amatuer riders. Both riders were able to post faster laps on the old Gixxer. they said that they felt more comfortable on the older bike (less power, less nannies).
so, if a 122 hp bike was brought out today that was very controllable, composed and that inspired rider confidence, could a good rider make use of it and more importantly, would he pay for the honor (if shaft drive)? maybe they are scratching their corporate heads over this in Mandelo, or, just going out to get another cupachino?
Yeppp...
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someone posted either here or another site about a competition between a new Pangale and a 2005 GSX1000. Two good amatuer riders. Both riders were able to post faster laps on the old Gixxer. they said that they felt more comfortable on the older bike (less power, less nannies).
so, if a 122 hp bike was brought out today that was very controllable, composed and that inspired rider confidence, could a good rider make use of it and more importantly, would he pay for the honor (if shaft drive)? maybe they are scratching their corporate heads over this in Mandelo, or, just going out to get another cupachino?
The Griso never made 120hp Guzzi had to squeeze the old Daytona motor pretty hard to get it for the MGS, output of a 2005 GSXR1000 is closer to 160hp, even back in that era 122hp wasn't really a competitive sports bike.
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That's a fun vid that one. I think they concluded the North American importer had fitted a softer shock spring on the Panigale for some reason and it was affecting performance.
A 122HP bike would sell, sure, eh 45HP bikes sell. But if it looks like it should be able to blitz everything on the planet? It's up against 300HP opposition these days which is as sexy and infinitely more refined.
I'd be fine with that myself, but I'm okay with it being a little bit weird to be fine with that. :tongue:
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This where I see opportunity Piaggio are messing with hybrids and the like with the MP3 etc, they should go racing with the Guzzi brand which has traditionally been and engineering based brand in the Zero GP/TT series won't encroach on Aprilia's road racing efforts, it is a long term thing 4-5years before we really see something for the road, Guzzi is so obscure in the public's eye they won't have the mountain to climb that HD have with the Livewire. They can keep punching out V7's to keep the base customers happy.
Sounds logical to me. Build some enthusiasm in the base/wear down resistance for the new tech at the same time. If it's already been around for years as race kit it's not going to be as much of a wrench making the switch, yeah? Desirable, even.
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i wasn't thinking of a hyperbike, just a great sport bike that you could squeeze everything out of with a great big honking torque band.
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There comes a point where you can't keep on dressing up the same old turds.
Guzzi needs something new, and proven before they release it. They didn't prove the hydro engines before their release. Look what happened. How many repair kits were issued?
And calling the V85 engine modern is like saying the Model T is up to date.
Guzzi is trying to be the Vespa of motorcycles.
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There comes a point where you can't keep on dressing up the same old turds.
Guzzi needs something new, and proven before they release it. They didn't prove the hydro engines before their release. Look what happened. How many repair kits were issued?
And calling the V85 engine modern is like saying the Model T is up to date.
Guzzi is trying to be the Vespa of motorcycles.
After a while it ceases to matter what “they” call it..
You either want one or you don’t. I put my deposit down when the first post appeared here on WG, I was having one regardless.
As soon as the 200 hp bikes are relegated to the back shed because all the owners have lost their licences, the reality of their worthlessness will become apparent, who buys a Hyabusa these days ?
Case in point, I would not buy another 30 hp for my Norge or V85 if it was gunna’ cost me ten bucks. If you turn up to a ride day here in Oz on a Desmosedici or similar these days, you look like a tosser.
That great philosopher Bob Dylan put it best when he said...
“The times they are a changin’...”
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for guzzi to squeeze something north of 130hp, it would probably have to be water cooled. then, to me, it wouldn't be a guzzi. i l have had water cooled and it was ok, but i like guzzi specifically because the engine sits proud because it doesn't look like a patient in the emergency ward with hoses going in and out and it doesn't need a bunch of plastic to cover it's ugliness. would you want it?
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You can squeeze 130 -140 out of a high cam engine, just don't expect to be tiddling about on it or putting on loads of miles. I have a magazine test somewhere, Cycle World i think. I'll have to go hunting through the stack. Anywho, they had a pro-rider test it and his thoughts were it was a 25lbs to heavy and needed more horsepower.
I think at 122 hp, back in 2003 it would be right up there with a 999 or a mille. If they introduced a street version now, and it wasn't crazy expensive, I might be a player.
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You can squeeze 130 -140 out of a high cam engine, just don't expect to be tiddling about on it or putting on loads of miles. I have a magazine test somewhere, Cycle World i think. I'll have to go hunting through the stack. Anywho, they had a pro-rider test it and his thoughts were it was a 25lbs to heavy and needed more horsepower.
I think at 122 hp, back in 2003 it would be right up there with a 999 or a mille. If they introduced a street version now, and it wasn't crazy expensive, I might be a player.
I think that was a millepercento big block more than a hi cam which is water cooled. As for not buying a Guzzi because of the aesthetics of its cooling system it's not really part of the criteria for me anyway.
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The Millepercento is a total different kettle of fish. Dynotec GmbH coaxes stupid amounts out of Guzzilla.
https://www.translatetheweb.com/?from=de&to=en&ref=SERP&refd=www.bing.com&dl=en&rr=UC&a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.dynotec.de%2f (https://www.translatetheweb.com/?from=de&to=en&ref=SERP&refd=www.bing.com&dl=en&rr=UC&a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.dynotec.de%2f)
I'm curious how many hours these engines are meant to run before a teardown.
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would you want it?
Yes. Even a Honda CX has those good transverse v-twin vibes, I rode a clapped out one 9000kms around Europe in a month or two. Tons of fun, got back almost what I paid for it too. I'd probably have been a pre-order buyer for one or other of the VA10-engined things that might've been.
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I'm curious how many hours these engines are meant to run before a teardown.
I'm presuming it's a case of 'if you need to ask', haha. Awesome things though.
Edit - Turin, did you mean the MGS or the Millepercento big bore?
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The Millepercento is a total different kettle of fish. Dynotec GmbH coaxes stupid amounts out of Guzzilla.
https://www.translatetheweb.com/?from=de&to=en&ref=SERP&refd=www.bing.com&dl=en&rr=UC&a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.dynotec.de%2f (https://www.translatetheweb.com/?from=de&to=en&ref=SERP&refd=www.bing.com&dl=en&rr=UC&a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.dynotec.de%2f)
I'm curious how many hours these engines are meant to run before a teardown.
(https://i.ibb.co/tL5sXjC/mgs-01-maint.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tL5sXjC)
Ciao
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I think the attractiveness of a road MGS, lay in the fitment of a Daytona or Griso engine.
If I knew my engine life was measured in hours, I wouldn’t find riding it enjoyable.
I thought the attractiveness lay in the possibility of a Griso or Daytona motor going in the frame and the bolts going through. It would be a massive disappointment to have a drag with an Aprillia RSV 1000 and get hosed, it’s never been about performance bragging rights, just a solid mid range and looks to die for..
I bet if Pete Roper decided to do it, there’d be a massive ground swell of support.
I further bet my arse that if I had an MGS rolling chassis and a Stelvio or Griso motor, I would get it in and get the bolts through. The rest is ancillary equipment and engineer’s signatures.
People have succeeded with more outlandish pursuits than this..
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I think the attractiveness of a road MGS, lay in the fitment of a Daytona or Griso engine.
If I knew my engine life was measured in hours, I wouldn’t find riding it enjoyable.
I thought the attractiveness lay in the possibility of a Griso or Daytona motor going in the frame and the bolts going through. It would be a massive disappointment to have a drag with an Aprillia RSV 1000 and get hosed, it’s never been about performance bragging rights, just a solid mid range and looks to die for..
I bet if Pete Roper decided to do it, there’d be a massive ground swell of support.
I further bet my arse that if I had an MGS rolling chassis and a Stelvio or Griso motor, I would get it in and get the bolts through. The rest is ancillary equipment and engineer’s signatures.
People have succeeded with more outlandish pursuits than this..
You would need a V11 gearbox and final drive, griso don't fit (V11's barely fit) you would need to do something about the charging system again griso system won't fit will most likely need to fit it to the front of the crank shaft and even then the motor might not fit, the belts on the mgs out the front are outside the frame pickups the extra width from the 8valve timing chains, and yes a RSV1000 V twin of the same era would hose you, the OG MGS motor will eat the RSV not some much in outright power but in mid range out of a corner. This is why I continue to say such a bike would be a massive disappointment and a complete sales failure similar to the V9 IMO.
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(https://i.ibb.co/02JdmVN/20200917-092710.jpg) (https://ibb.co/02JdmVN)
I read somewhere at one point they were expecting to shift 8000 units...per annum. I think there might have been some over-optimism there given Sport/Daytona figures were only, what, half that? For all years put together.
I can't even use half the capacity of my Sport so an MGS wouldn't be any kind of disappointment to me *but* I do recognise that's a crap rider talking. :tongue: :laugh: I should have learned to ride at a younger age, I was 27 or something. Not counting chook chaser stuff when I was a kid.
I would defo like to know how to fit a Griso donk into a spiney without some horrible charging compromise because if it can be done it will deliver more reliable and usable real-world power at a fraction of the cost but all I have seen so far are track-only mods.
First set of goodies arrived today. Build the MGS 01 In Only Two Hundred Weekly Instalments!
Murray you are a jammy sod, I wish I had a whole bike's worth of these. God they are nice bits.
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Probably included the road version and the thing cause a lot of fuss at the time, part of the same design exercise was a bike called the Griso which generated far less noise and that seemed to do ok. Frankly if you really wanted fitting MGS body work to a Griso frame would most likely be least path of resistance process. The frame of the MGS isn't just a revised Daytona or V11 frame, it is its own thing you won't get the balance or the handling but most likely pretty close. BTW there is a reason I'm driving around in an old car and my road bike isn't cutting edge.
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For goodness sake what is wrong with the Guareshci, I know I'm in a minority but I find it even better looking than the MGS and the frame is made to take a Griso engine.
It's a track bike too, but all that would be needed would be some lights and you'd be ready for the road.
They do a roadgoing version but they really screwed up the positioning of the projectors, it looks awful
All the track bike would need is one projector with either a "Halo" or an integral side light and then a tail tidy of some description
Even if you wanted the exhaust ala Ducati underseat a special could be made.
I don't get the groundswell for the MGS-01 for the road when a pretty close model is already out there.
I'm sure they are selling but they are in no way close to the number that seem to be saying that if Guzzi brought out an MGS style bike that had a Griso or Daytona engine they'd purchase in a hearbeat.
The MGS is pretty for sure but I very much doubt if Piaggo launched it, iit would sell in anything other than very limited numbers.
Sportbike owners would not pay Ducati money for a bike that would probably have about 50% of the power (if that and a shaft drive to boot). Personally I think anything over 100bhp and perhaps a good deal less is just froth when road riding, but you can't be the baddest Mothaf**a if your bike has only 1/2 the ponies of the other guys down the pub
I've looked into the MGS a little, it's a total one off, the frame I'll leave to Murray to comment about but even the engine is a very special one off. It is radically different to a HiCam in many many ways, even if it looks the same on the outside
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People were rabid for it, I was too. Seemed to wear off rapidly for most but I do think it would have outsold the Sport 1100 especially if they could have gotten it to market quicker than they did with the Griso.
Oh yeah. Two Hundred Weekly Instalments of Less Than $2000 Each! My car's 11 years old and set to get a fair bit older before anything changes.
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For goodness sake what is wrong with the Guareshci, I know I'm in a minority but I find it even better looking than the MGS and the frame is made to take a Griso engine.
The GC Corse? Pretty nice I think, not a fan of the tail but the rest is very decent. What is wrong with it?
Edit - slow on the uptake tonight. Answer: Australia. I can probably get away with just a fine if I'm caught on a modified V11 or Centauro. I could potentially even get the mods certified. But just putting lights and mirrors on a race bike isn't an option, if it was someone would have done it by now.
The Corse road bike isn't something Guareschi does as such, it was a single promo bike that was auctioned off IIRC. I didn't like the projectors either. I'd have it in a heartbeat anyway haha.
The MGS frame is really interesting. I can't use a real one but what I have drawn up so far might be a satisfactory compromise. Lets me use the airbox as intended, I'd like that. Spendy, heavier than a real one but not heavier than a normal spine frame.
As Murray says I might end up settling on just the cosmetics. The law changes all the time; this could end up being something that'd send me to jail for the term of my natural life before I get finished.
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Kremmen
No idea what Austrailan rules are like, but the yeah trhe GC corse is a track bike, I haven't enquired but it's simply a Griso in a special frame and the road bike version is probably the same as the track bike with lights slapped on to make it road legal
I don't know if they still do it but they offered it as a kit where you took a donor Griso and added the Corse parts and bodywork.
In the UK you can do that sort of thing, then take the bike along to a VOSA testing center where they asses it for roadworthiness. Get by that hurdle and you can use it on the road (although you'll probably get stiffed for iinsurance).
That's for now though, with ever new regs making it tighter and tighter all the time who knows what will happen down the line and sooner rather than later. Makes me sad, that we're all exchanging our freedoms for staying safe,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,we're not goanna live forever whatever we might tell ourselves. May as well have some fun along the way
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My car's 11 years old and set to get a fair bit older before anything changes.
That's a third of the age of mine, although admittedly I could probably purchase a newer one with what the MC2 would sell for, but then I wouldn't have a MC2.
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I was waiting for the other shoe to drop. :laugh: :laugh:
My 11yo car replaced a 20yo 323. :tongue:
OTOH my oldest car will turn 100 pretty soon. I suppose it'd better stop being a shed queen for that!
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No idea what Austrailan rules are like, but the yeah trhe GC corse is a track bike, I haven't enquired but it's simply a Griso in a special frame and the road bike version is probably the same as the track bike with lights slapped on to make it road legal
It's any CARC bike really, you can put QVs, 2Vs or anything in it provided you have the CARC 6-speed and drive. It's still available, I think it was only made available last year in fact? Maybe 2018.
In the UK you can do that sort of thing, then take the bike along to a VOSA testing center where they asses it for roadworthiness. Get by that hurdle and you can use it on the road (although you'll probably get stiffed for iinsurance).
Yeah. I don't envy the UK for the yearly MOT - had to do it last time I was there, right pain - but the kit car and bike rules are fantastic.
That's for now though, with ever new regs making it tighter and tighter all the time who knows what will happen down the line and sooner rather than later. Makes me sad, that we're all exchanging our freedoms for staying safe,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,we're not goanna live forever whatever we might tell ourselves. May as well have some fun along the way
Ever see the movie Idiocracy? If we DON'T allow some risk all the people who used to wipe themselves out early will go on to have kids instead. Be afraid, be very afraid. :tongue:
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Idiocracy - one of my favorites.
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Bumped for the benefit of Andyals.
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Idiocracy - one of my favorites.
It’s got electrolytes
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i wasn't thinking of a hyperbike, just a great sport bike that you could squeeze everything out of with a great big honking torque band.
Im flashing back to the 1990's and Ducati 851's running toe to toe with the 750 supersports.
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Idiocracy should be required viewing by all 8th graders in the country.
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Idiocracy should be required viewing by all 8th graders in the country.
Like in health class? Everyone should watch it, if only so they understand the reference.