Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: jGuz on August 23, 2017, 10:18:25 AM
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Has anyone else seen out the revamp of the Harley line?
I find it funny that they have pretty much ruined the spirit of the two Harleys I would consider owning. The Low Rider S is gone and the regular Low Rider has one (down from two) front disc brakes. Who thought it would be a good idea to go backwards in performance - then again, this is Harley...And the Street Bob...What have they done? Fork gaiters? A smaller tank? An LED tacho/speedo? Not to mention that the rear shock is internal...harder to swap suspension.
I want to like HD. I really do. I rode a 2016 Street Bob for a day and I found it to be comfortable, well-built, good-looking, and characterful (the same characteristics that leads me to Guzzis). But now these bikes look...diluted.
Armchair rant over.
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Well, look a little closer.
I too lament that they eliminated the dual discs from the lowrider, that's stupid. But they still have it on the Fat Bob.
More importantly here's what they did.
They took the middle of their line-up where they were building something like 12 model variations using 2 frames (Softail and Dyna) with 4 motors (2 cubic inch variations each on solidmount/counterbalanced and rubbermounted TC motors) and reduced it to 8 models, 1 frame, and 2 cubic in variations of one solidmounted motor.
So from a manufacturing standpoint that was smart.
More importantly they also:
* Went to a new more rigid frame. The new frame is lighter and all of the models lost weight. Maybe not a lot, only 20-35#, but it's a step in the right direction.
* MOST models increased both ground clearance and lean angle (though one or two formerly Dyna models lost an RCH of one or the other).
* Moved the oil from a remote tank under the seat to a sump under the motor, good both for center of gravity and removing some un-necessary heat from right under the rider.
* Improved suspensions at BOTH ends. The front use cartridge forks, and the Fat Bob uses USD forks. The rear for all is a new higher quality mono-shock with remote dial preload adjustment.
* Went to LED headlights on multiple models, and tried some out of the box things like the square daymaker headlight on the Fat Bob or the gauges integrated into the handlebar risers on a few models.
Looks like they simplified the detachable system too no longer requiring turn signal relocation and whatnot to install things like backrests, luggage, tourpacks etc.
My only REAL complaint so far is, like you said, they eliminated one of the few models that had dual discs. And what really make it stupid is that they increased power across the board and made the option of a 100 hp / 114" motor on a few models THAT DON'T HAVE DUAL DISCS. FFS why increase power and not add a second disc! JEEEEZ.
My other complaint is that on the two "Bob" models and maybe one other, I forget which, the dropped fuel capacity to 3.6g - dumb.
But overall I think it was a step in the right direction.
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For the Harley-Curious (those who might identify a little pirate-y), today I rode a couple of the new Softails. Generally speaking I'd say Lemmy from ZLA was correct and these aren't the same old Softails.
Actually though still largely cruiserish they seem to be decent modern motorcycles with some get up and go, decent brakes, suspensions etc.
And I say this all as someone who has scorned the Softail line for decades.
A few thoughts about the bikes I rode and inspected:
For starters the Fat Bob (and maybe all of them) look better in person. The Fat Bob finishes look great in person and the design traits blend to a cohesive and somewhat aggressive overall look that says standard more than cruiser.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/542ed4f14ca07c7911415de3a4fbe153.jpg)
That headlight blends seamlessly.
The fenders and tires work, they look the business and not overly styled.
The finishes are fantastic, including the exhaust, especially the mufflers. The pics just don't do justice to how they sparkle in the sunlight.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/280695cb97e7b3a94a0c31de5c41b6ad.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/d8f7306abd8137746b08c22c3577485a.jpg)
Both the bikes I rode (Deluxe and Fat Bob) felt light and nimble. The motors pulled strong, the transmissions were smooth and anything but clunky, the throttle response was great, brakes (even the single) felt strong, steering effort was light, and lean angles were pretty generous. I did manage to scrape the footboards on the Deluxe pulling a right out of the lot, but underway it never happened again (though granted it was a pretty tame route).
Still I walked away pretty impressed with the overall packages.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/e01f7d04662424c06c2349f2986ce8c1.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/fc6158028bd3c2750b9f35d770c585da.jpg)
The turn signals on the Deluxe still looked pretty bad but there's so much else to like you kinda miss it.
There's a ton of brushed aluminum on the Fat Boy and it all looks pretty good. Better than chrome to me but you know how I feel about that.
The Street Bob looked great in person too.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/c6fb29dc60fe6e74583c20f560863313.jpg)
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Yeah , but isn't the MoCo coming out with something like 50 new models over the next year ? :shocked:
Dusty
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Well I suspect those counted as 8, plus the Street Rod and maybe the Roadster were after that announcement so that's 10 already.
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For the OP, maybe one side effect for those who like the older style better is that now there will be 1000's of low mile used bikes to be purchased at bargain prices.
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I've tried I honestly have to like Harley's having owned a Sportster recently and rode my brother's Street Bob for a while.
But they are just don't work for me. My 2007 Griso is light years ahead in every department and makes sense on the UK's bumpy narrow roads that the Harleys just can't handle.
Maybe if I lived in some sunny US state things might be different but I have given up in my futile attempts to like the things.
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Kev,did they drop the price any ??? :boozing: :boozing:
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(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/542ed4f14ca07c7911415de3a4fbe153.jpg)
I take your word that it looks better in person, but this bike is ugly.
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(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/542ed4f14ca07c7911415de3a4fbe153.jpg)
I LIKE IT!!!!!!!!!!!
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Hey I'm not going to try and tell people what to like functionally or aesthetically.
But I do remember a member here who had both a Griso and an XR1200 and said they were functionally very close.
I totally forgot to grab a ride on a new Roadster yesterday. Oh well I'll nab a ride on one eventually.
As for the Fat Bob it's definitely a polarizing design but for me that's part of the charm. It's not just cookie cutter Harley, it's functional, and like I laughed with some of the other riders there yesterday "it's pissing people off and when that happens you know they're doing something right."
Some other interesting points. I saw a fair number of other brands in the parking lot from BMW to Suzuki and that's a good sign they are getting people interested.
Waiting for my rides to come up and eating free burgers and dogs I was chatting with some of the other customers like a guy who buys a new CVO dresser every couple of years. His 2014 was nearly $40k out the door, it's now got 80k miles on it and he's looking to trade it but they are offering $12k [emoji50] [emoji32] [emoji50] looks like they are still making money.
Oh did I mention earlier they'd already sold one of the new Softails by the time I got there (just before noon).
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The headlight on that thing definitely looks wonky to me (though, I do like LED's, I'll put it works very well). I prefer the look of round headlights.
I also prefer gloss paint to the "denim" or whatever Harley is calling the matte finish these days. That topic has been beat to death here with respect to the V7 Stone.
That said, it is good to see Harley trying new things in the design of their bikes, as two posts above show (one hate, one love), some people like the new look, and probably even prefer it over the traditional.
For those of us who like the traditional, the Deluxe is a great looking bike.
The Fat Bob, and the other "new look" models, definitely look fresh, and, while my first reaction when I saw them earlier in the week was "Ugh", I don't think that they look too bad, and they may even grow on me.
After reading Lemmy's article, I'm curious to get a test ride on these new models. The suspension improvements and lighter weight are definitely a move in the right direction!
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"His 2014 (CVO) was nearly $40k out the door, it's now got 80k miles on it and he's looking to trade it but they are offering $12k looks like they are still making money."
A $28 thousand dollar loss makes buying a Guzzi a fairly good investment.
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"His 2014 (CVO) was nearly $40k out the door, it's now got 80k miles on it and he's looking to trade it but they are offering $12k looks like they are still making money."
A $28 thousand dollar loss makes buying a Guzzi a fairly good investment.
I didn't tell the rest of the punch line. He was cleaning the 2018 CVO would set him back close to $50k [emoji50] but he was including TTT, extended warranty, prepaid maintenance plan, and probably a valet to wash and wax it for gawd's sake!
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Dynasoft sounds like a brand of fabric softener .
Dusty
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Dynasoft sounds like a brand of fabric softener .
Dusty
Ha ha but it's still better than the Sportster SuperLow T! [emoji23]
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Ha ha but it's still better than the Sportster SuperLow T! [emoji23]
:laugh: When my niece married her husband (the HD salesman) he owned some vintage of Fat Bob, she innocently asked me who would name a motorcycle Fat "Bob" ?
Dusty
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"His 2014 (CVO) was nearly $40k out the door, it's now got 80k miles on it and he's looking to trade it but they are offering $12k looks like they are still making money."
A $28 thousand dollar loss makes buying a Guzzi a fairly good investment.
"I didn't tell the rest of the punch line. He was cleaning the 2018 CVO would set him back close to $50k but he was including TTT, extended warranty, prepaid maintenance plan, and probably a valet to wash and wax it for gawd's sake!"
I'm glad that I don't get bored with my bikes. Cars I get bored with, but I have never really owned an overly interesting car.
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First, aren't Dynas and Softails are two different lines of motorcycles?
Second, that new Fat Bob is ugly as sin.
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First, aren't Dynas and Softails are two different lines of motorcycles?
They were, until a week ago when both platforms were replaced by a new, lighter, monoshock chassis that now encompasses models from both previous lines.
The new line uses upgraded suspensions, brakes, lighting (LED), and two versions of a dual counterbalance shaft equipped M8 motor.
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Harley Davidson , the newer the uglier they get.... go figure.
seriously , they are the most horrible HD ever built.
For me the Motor co "died" in the 1998, Just my thought and I hope they sell a lot of bikes so ppl can keep their jobs.
good luck.
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They were, until a week ago when both platforms were replaced by a new, lighter, monoshock chassis that now encompasses models from both previous lines.
The new line uses upgraded suspensions, brakes, lighting (LED), and two versions of a dual counterbalance shaft equipped M8 motor.
According to "Hot Bike":
"Harley-Davidson has definitely produced a revolution in V-Twin motorcycles with eight distinctive models based on a single platform. That in itself is brilliant. The fact that the bikes really are among the best-handling and fastest cruisers ever produced by any manufacturer makes it all even more impressive."
wow
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I lurk here more than post, but the post about hoping people keeping their jobs got me to thinking: V-Rod, made in Kansas City Plant...Gone, Dyna Glides, made in Kansas City Plant...Gone. I know they make the new small 500's and 750's in Kansas City, but still, that must leave an awful lot of empty plant space. If I were a line worker at the Kansas City HD factory, I'd be real nervous right about now.
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You know I didn't ask or check where these new Softails are being built, York or Kansas City?
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Pipes and cans on the Fat Bob look straight off the Ducati Diavel. Well, those new cans don't look like a pair of cheerleader megaphones like the Diavel's do, but I still don't think they look right on a Harley Davidson.
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Where are they assembled? Good question. I seem to remember the Softail line being produced in York along with the touring bikes. Nothing says they couldn't move the entire line to Kansas City. Still, Harley Davidson would seem to have excess production capacity.
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Where are they assembled? Good question. I seem to remember the Softail line being produced in York along with the touring bikes. Nothing says they couldn't move the entire line to Kansas City. Still, Harley Davidson would seem to have excess production capacity.
In most recent history, the Dyna and Vrod lines were in Kansas City, The Softail and FLs were run on a common horseshoe line in York.
I guess it could make sense to keep the new Softails in York since they also use the M8 motor, but it's a different version of the motor than the Touring models so that's not critical.
KC still has Sportsters and the new Street models. They lost Vrod and Dyna, but maybe there wasn't much volume in those too?
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I just helped my son get a 05 low mileage well maintained soft tail deluxe a couple weeks ago. The bike rides and runs great. Is this model much different than the new models now? I thought Kev or other Harley experience guys may offer some info on this for me.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/iDBsz5/IMG_2736.jpg) (http://ibb.co/iDBsz5)
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Harley Davidson , the newer the uglier they get.... go figure.
seriously , they are the most horrible HD ever built.
For me the Motor co "died" in the 1998, Just my thought and I hope they sell a lot of bikes so ppl can keep their jobs.
good luck.
But, that still make classic looking bikes, AND, the new styled ones like the Fat Bob. Yeah, that Fat Bob isn't my think, I don't need to buy it. The Deluxe is definitely more my style. I think it is a good thing that the model line has some diversity that they aren't just all cookie-cutters of the same basic bike with just different sized wheels and tires, etc. I'll bet the new styled ones sell well, because they don't look like anything Harley has been selling for the last 20 years. For those that want the traditional style, they make those too.
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I just helped my son get a 05 low mileage well maintained soft tail deluxe a couple weeks ago. The bike rides and runs great. Is this model much different than the new models now? I thought Kev or other Harley experience guys may offer some info on this for me.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/iDBsz5/IMG_2736.jpg) (http://ibb.co/iDBsz5)
They're pretty different, almost as different as two Harleys with the same name could be.
His bike is the first generation TC88B motor. As such it's got the fatal flaw spring loaded timing chain tensioners that wear out prematurely and could take the whole motor with it if not caught in time. The most popular solution other than inspection and replacement (which should happen by 20k but they could last as long as 50k) is to upgrade to the new hydraulic tensioner assembly. This means new oil pump, camshafts, timing chain and tensioners.
I'm not even sure if those early TC88 motors used closed loop injection yet.
And it's the "old" Softail chassis which means it's heavier, has more limited cornering, less capable brakes, lower quality suspension etc. than this new motor and chassis. It's got the twin shocks hidden under the frame and the primary purpose of putting them there was just to hide them. The new monoshock chassis puts a much higher quality single shock at the top rear of the frame where it functions better (especially with the stiffer an lighter chassis).
If he likes it, I'd not suggest he ride a new one yet. I would not think I'm exaggerating to say the new ones are better in every way.
That said there's plenty of people who loved the old ones too and the weight and lean angle differences aren't like the difference between a Ducati and a Chopper or anything like that, it's a few pounds and a few degrees lean on each side.
So hope he enjoys!
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But, that still make classic looking bikes, AND, the new styled ones like the Fat Bob. Yeah, that Fat Bob isn't my think, I don't need to buy it. The Deluxe is definitely more my style. I think it is a good thing that the model line has some diversity that they aren't just all cookie-cutters of the same basic bike with just different sized wheels and tires, etc. I'll bet the new styled ones sell well, because they don't look like anything Harley has been selling for the last 20 years. For those that want the traditional style, they make those too.
That's funny I'd have guessed the Fat Bob would so be your thing, more so than the Deluxe.
I mean the Deluxe is better than ever but it's still a pretty sedate ride, lean angles have INCREASED to like 28° each side, that's up as much as 3° per side! And it's low and long.
The Fat Bob is more nimble, sits higher, has more lean angle etc. It's a hoot. Really got me thinking bad things....
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My first bike & first Harley was a 62 Pan head nearly identical to the one below minus the lights on the fenders. It sure looks a lot like the new Harley Deluxe. 55 years later the style is remarkably similar.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/k5ofK5/Pan_head.png) (http://ibb.co/k5ofK5)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/mZSJ6k/2018.png) (http://ibb.co/mZSJ6k)
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My first bike & first Harley was a 62 Pan head nearly identical to the one below minus the lights on the fenders. It sure looks a lot like the new Harley Deluxe. 55 years later the style is remarkably similar.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/k5ofK5/Pan_head.png) (http://ibb.co/k5ofK5)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/mZSJ6k/2018.png) (http://ibb.co/mZSJ6k)
Sure, and that's part of the charm. You can have a bike that largely looks like that, BUT has feedback EFI making over 100 ft lbs of torque (and near 100 hp), with LED lights, ABS, etc. Basically a reliable modern version of the original that needs nothing more than fuel and oil changes.
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They're pretty different, almost as different as two Harleys with the same name could be.
His bike is the first generation TC88B motor. As such it's got the fatal flaw spring loaded timing chain tensioners that wear out prematurely and could take the whole motor with it if not caught in time. The most popular solution other than inspection and replacement (which should happen by 20k but they could last as long as 50k) is to upgrade to the new hydraulic tensioner assembly. This means new oil pump, camshafts, timing chain and tensioners.
I'm not even sure if those early TC88 motors used closed loop injection yet.
And it's the "old" Softail chassis which means it's heavier, has more limited cornering, less capable brakes, lower quality suspension etc. than this new motor and chassis. It's for the twin shocks hidden under the frame and the primary purpose of putting them there was just to hide them. The new monoshock chassis puts a much higher quality single shock at the top rear of the frame where it functions better (especially with the stiffer an lighter chassis).
If he likes it, I'd not suggest he ride a new one yet. I would not think I'm exaggerating to say the new ones are better in every way.
That said there's plenty of people who loved the old ones too and the weight and lean angle differences aren't like the difference between a Ducati and a Chopper or anything like that, it's a few pounds and a few degrees lean on each side.
So hope he enjoys!
Thanks Kev, I had an 03 electric glide and had to do the cam chain shoes, I had forgot about that. The bike was owned by a 74 year old guy and only has 10k on her so I guess it will be a while before I need to worry about the cam tentioners. I replaced mine around 40k and they had a few miles left but differently showed deep groves and some chipping had occurred. Great info thanks.
PS, that Calvin beside it gives it a run for the money around the end of a ramp:)
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Sure, and that's part of the charm. You can have a bike that largely looks like that, BUT has feedback EFI making over 100 ft lbs of torque (and near 100 hp), with LED lights, ABS, etc. Basically a reliable modern version of the original that needs nothing more than fuel and oil changes.
You forgot to mention the electric starter upgrade. :grin: Took me weeks to master starting that pan head with the retarded spark.
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That's funny I'd have guessed the Fat Bob would so be your thing, more so than the Deluxe.
I mean the Deluxe is better than ever but it's still a pretty sedate ride, lean angles have INCREASED to like 28� each side, that's up as much as 3� per side! And it's low and long.
The Fat Bob is more nimble, sits higher, has more lean angle etc. It's a hoot. Really got me thinking bad things....
I'd have to ride them to know which I like riding better, but, the matte paint and weird headlight take some getting used too. It's not a bad looking bike, but, I guess I'm more traditional.
From your description here, it sounds like I'd like the Fat Bob better, as far as how it rides.
Taking another look at it, the Fat Bob does have a sporty look to it.
I guess I should check to see when any of my local dealers are having a demo event.
(http://www.cycleworld.com/sites/cycleworld.com/files/styles/500_4x3/public/images/2017/08/2018-harley-davidson-fat-bob-114-hero.jpg?itok=tYTSGSxw&fc=50,50)
Raise that seat about 4 inches and replace the forward controls wth some mid-mount controls, and I'm interested.
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My first bike & first Harley was a 62 Pan head nearly identical to the one below minus the lights on the fenders. It sure looks a lot like the new Harley Deluxe. 55 years later the style is remarkably similar.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/k5ofK5/Pan_head.png) (http://ibb.co/k5ofK5)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/mZSJ6k/2018.png) (http://ibb.co/mZSJ6k)
Looking at those pics, one marked difference is the seat height. I'd be much happier with the seat height of the panhead.
I wonder if a police RK seat can be adapted to the Deluxe. I rode Kev M's police Road King with the police solo seat, and really like the ergos of it, as the police seat is a good bit higher than the regular civilian seat. I wouldn't be nearly as happy with the civilian seat..
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My first bike & first Harley was a 62 Pan head nearly identical to the one below minus the lights on the fenders. It sure looks a lot like the new Harley Deluxe. 55 years later the style is remarkably similar.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/k5ofK5/Pan_head.png) (http://ibb.co/k5ofK5)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/mZSJ6k/2018.png) (http://ibb.co/mZSJ6k)
I like the looks of the Deluxe. Just would need to be fitted out like the Pan. The seat would be the only question??
Tom
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I'm sure the police seat wouldn't fit the Softail chassis, too many things would have to be the same.
That said I'm equally sure someone will make a spring seat for the new Softail (if Harley doesn't already have one available).
Red, ha ha excellent point on the starter. [emoji28]
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I'd have to ride them to know which I like riding better, but, the matte paint and weird headlight take some getting used too. It's not a bad looking bike, but, I guess I'm more traditional.
From your description here, it sounds like I'd like the Fat Bob better, as far as how it rides.
Taking another look at it, the Fat Bob does have a sporty look to it.
I guess I should check to see when any of my local dealers are having a demo event.
(http://www.cycleworld.com/sites/cycleworld.com/files/styles/500_4x3/public/images/2017/08/2018-harley-davidson-fat-bob-114-hero.jpg?itok=tYTSGSxw&fc=50,50)
Raise that seat about 4 inches and replace the forward controls wth some mid-mount controls, and I'm interested.
I can't emphasize enough how good it looks in person, though maybe I'm coloring my perceptions from the ride.
Ya know how a girl gets better looking the more you fall for her.
Worse case we could always hit the York Open House this year and ride a few. I could check the dates but it's usually the last weekend in September if memory serves.
It wouldn't be hard for me to zip out on the RK.
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Saturday morning I visiting a local H-D dealer with our Saturday morning group. I turned down a test ride on the new 114 Fat Bob but I'll go back soon to do that.
I expect to see some evolvement of this new line over the next few years but something not being stressed enough is that these are not the old Softail models. The old Softails had very limited suspension travel and their ride quality suffered. That's one reason they weren't labeled "Touring."
These new bikes are totally redesigned and they are H-D's take on a single shock suspension. Gone are the rubber drive train mounts that characterized the older Dynas and created flex issues that had to be dealt with by serious sporty riders. The new pivoting rear subframe has similarities to the Guzzi V11 series.
The rear swing arm pivots from fixed, rigid points wide to each side of the main frame. The new single shock resides under the seat.
More importantly-
The 4.4 inch rear travel of the new Soft Glide is significantly more than the 3.1 stock travel on the former Super Glide Custom.
The 5.1 inch front travel is the same as the former 49mm forks of the Super Glide.
These new bikes could well be a major improvement for performance-minded riders. They are not the old Softails.
In fact, the suspension of the new Soft Glides is even better than the Touring line. Front travel on most of the Touring line-up range from 3.85 to 4.6 inches. Rear suspension is only 2.1 to 3 inches. The better numbers are from the Premium Ride H-D suspension package.
The new Soft Glide models offer better front travel than the latest Premium Ride Touring models, 5.1 vs 4.6 inches, and much better rear travel, 4.4 inches vs 3, for the Premium suspension option. The standard Touring suspension provides only 2.1 inches of travel.
I am not fond of fat front tires and semi-forward foot controls as well as a few other styling cues but the Fat Bob didn't look or feel too mad to me. I didn't see the new Low Rider. That may have potential.
The power of that 114 has got to be awesome. Also, the build quality, low maintenance and reliability of the Harleys is very attractive.
.
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Leaf, you probably caught this, but the oil tank was moved under the motor like on the touring models so what looks like a tank is just a sidecover that hides the shock (and gives access to the preload adjustment knob on models that have it).
With regards to suspension it should be noted there are two shock lengths, so there are still some shorter Softail models, though even the shortest (the Slim) still gained cornering clearance.
And yes the frame rigidity increased.
Oh, on touring models, had I seen this new Heritage before buying my new RK I might we'll have been tempted to opt for the Heritage.
I don't love spoked wheels so that might have stopped me, and you still get "more" on the RK. But the styling is right and the biggest difference between the two platforms is the Heritage is almost 100# lighter, just a little heavier than the original RK. That's attractive.
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It'll be fun to test the bikes.
I put 50000 miles on the first year Softtail over 6 years of ownership (4 speed chain drive) and loved everyone of them. But I was young-and what did I know then?
Wish I kept that bike.
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Kev, I.m glad you say the FAT BOB looks better in person because it is some ugly in pictures. It looks like someone raided an unused parts bin to see what the could cobble together. It kind of reminds me of a poorly executed Victory Judge.
It does appear though that the Motor company is going after the millennial market that grew up with Transformers and GI Joe.
Cheers, Tim
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So I know it's a small sample, but the couple of hours I spent at the dealer on Saturday I observed something interesting (possibly encouraging).
The older guys were largely riding dressers and CVOs (and I'm talking about arriving on them and demo riding them). Sure a number of the older guys were riding new Softails, and a few of them arrived on imports (like BMWs) or on things like Buells.
Conversely the younger guys were largely riding Streets, Sportsters, and Softails. I don't think I saw anyone over 30 on a Sporty or Street. And again, a number of these guys were on imports, largely from JAPanInc.
Now of course most people were probably there to demo Softails, that is what was NEW etc. but there was a lot of enthusiasm. Comments from the rider next to me mid ride "this might make me a believer" and stuff like that.
I truly think this is a nice effort and shows they are trying to evolve.
Kev, I.m glad you say the FAT BOB looks better in person because it is some ugly in pictures. It looks like someone raided an unused parts bin to see what the could cobble together. It kind of reminds me of a poorly executed Victory Judge.
It does appear though that the Motor company is going after the millennial market that grew up with Transformers and GI Joe.
Cheers, Tim
Ha I don't see the Victory Judge (which is a bike I've demoed and liked, and considered buying) in the Fat Bob AT ALL.
Though not sure if I mentioned it in this thread - I find it funny that I DO see some Victory in some models, just not in one you would call Transformer (and BTW, have you SEEN a bike from JAPanInc. lately, again the Fat Bob doesn't look AT ALL like a Transformer compared to them or maybe a new BMW Jeeeez).
But it seemed obvious to me that the guy who lost his job designing turn signals for Victory was quickly snapped up by the Moco and they put him to work on the oddest choice of models:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/e01f7d04662424c06c2349f2986ce8c1.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/fc6158028bd3c2750b9f35d770c585da.jpg)
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Oh , never mind , this is why I will never ever own another HD .
Dusty
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Oh , never mind , this is why I will never ever own another HD .
Dusty
LED turn signals? ! ?
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I have a road glide ultra in my garage, and have demo�d all the other models in the last 5 years. With the touring line being the exception, Harley puts looks above comfort and agility. I will demo the new bikes when I get a chance.
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For the OP, maybe one side effect for those who like the older style better is that now there will be 1000's of low mile used bikes to be purchased at bargain prices.
That's my guess. There are tons of previous-generation Street Bobs around, but unfortunately there are only a few that have ABS. After a handul of unpleasant encounters with non-ABS bikes, I have to have ABS.
The new street bob looks alright, but I can't fathom why Harley would build it with a smaller tank than on the previous generation. I suppose it technically saves weight...but that seems dumb. Also, I liked having the rear shocks on the outside - easier to replace or adjust. If the stock shocks are actually good on the 2018, however, that's a moot point.
Though if Guzzi does something like put the 1200 Engine in a V9 bobber, I would be all over that.
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I have a road glide ultra in my garage, and have demo�d all the other models in the last 5 years. With the touring line being the exception, Harley puts looks above comfort and agility. I will demo the new bikes when I get a chance.
No, Harley puts look above comfort and agility ON SOME models for each platform (usually touring included too).
They've often had some models that paid attention to performance:
883R
1200S
1200R
XR1200/XR1200X
CX
FXR
FXRT
FXDX
FXDB (Fat Bob)
Low Rider/Low Rider S
And yes, most touring models, though over the years they've had a number that were lowered.
Honestly the Softails by definition were usually the line that was MOST compromised. The Softail Slim up till last year literally had lean angles that were limited to 24 degress on each side... 24! YIKEs, that's as bad as a SuperLow (the Sportster designed for super short people).
So it's nice to see them modernize the Softail line and give them better lean, suspension, brakes, etc.
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That's my guess. There are tons of previous-generation Street Bobs around, but unfortunately there are only a few that have ABS. After a handul of unpleasant encounters with non-ABS bikes, I have to have ABS.
The new street bob looks alright, but I can't fathom why Harley would build it with a smaller tank than on the previous generation. I suppose it technically saves weight...but that seems dumb. Also, I liked having the rear shocks on the outside - easier to replace or adjust. If the stock shocks are actually good on the 2018, however, that's a moot point.
Though if Guzzi does something like put the 1200 Engine in a V9 bobber, I would be all over that.
I'm with you on the tank. That's a huge mistake for form over function in my book. I mean crap, that's smaller than the tank on my SPORTSTER! But on a motor that's nearly 550cc bigger!!!! Ugh.
I also think it's a mistake to offer the 114 motor on models like the Heritage WITH A SINGLE DISC BRAKE! Come on man WTF.
I guess the only good news on the Bobber is that you can probably swap on the larger tank pretty easily since it's the same frame. So give it a couple of years and tanks will be available cheaper than new. Or bite the bullet and buy and swap.
A number of guys on Sportsters swap out the 2.2 g for a 3.25 g or the 4.5g. And a few swap the 3.25 for the 4.5g.
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LED turn signals? ! ?
Nah , I can't keep up with what's what . Asked my nephew about the different models , he said they went to school to learn the new models and he is still confused .
Dusty
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Nah , I can't keep up with what's what . Asked my nephew about the different models , he said they went to school to learn the new models and he is still confused .
Dusty
So that apple didn't fall far from the family tree....
:evil: OK, ok, I'll stop, I need to get back to work anyway....
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So that apple didn't fall far from the family tree....
Yeah , except the apple didn't hit me on the head :rolleyes:
Dusty
:evil: OK, ok, I'll stop, I need to get back to work anyway....
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Worse case we could always hit the York Open House this year and ride a few. I could check the dates but it's usually the last weekend in September if memory serves.
It wouldn't be hard for me to zip out on the RK.
I'm in!
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Yeah , except the apple didn't hit me on the head :rolleyes:
Dusty
How can you tell ? :evil:
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I'm in!
Looks like Sept 28 - 30th.
I can go Thu or Fri (28 or 29), can't go Saturday (Jenn's on call) but I wouldn't recommend the weekend anyway, it can get a bit crowded.
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Looks like Sept 28 - 30th.
I can go Thu or Fri (28 or 29), can't go Saturday (Jenn's on call) but I wouldn't recommend the weekend anyway, it can get a bit crowded.
Let's do Friday the 29th, as I'll be on a much tighter time table on Thursday.
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(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/542ed4f14ca07c7911415de3a4fbe153.jpg)
I take your word that it looks better in person, but this bike is ugly.
I can't look twice at any bike with that f*&$# ridiculous peg placement, how are you supposed to ride like that
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Saw somewhere the FXR has a 45 degree lean angle.
I will not be testing that. :boozing:
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I can't look twice at any bike with that f*&$# ridiculous peg placement, how are you supposed to ride like that
I really should have taken a photo of myself sitting on it.
The placement is even less forward than the Scout.
It's possibly less forward than the controls on all the touring models (FLH and FLST) with floorboards.
It's not that radical
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170824/80e5abb8e860461415f788b0cfee0da3.jpg)
Ahh, here's someone from the XL forum:
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/8b20426d2e2ab48f3110b782e805942a.jpg)
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I can't look twice at any bike with that f*&$# ridiculous peg placement, how are you supposed to ride like that
That is the only comfortable way to ride a low slung cruiser unless you have short legs. It is very comfortable for those of us with 32 inch or longer inseams. The only scary part is if the rear tire ever slides out in a turn. You better have strong legs to grip the tank if that happens.
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I'm interested in the motor company's new line of wallet chains. And handlebar tassels, don't forget the tassels.
:kiss:
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I really should have taken a photo of myself sitting on it.
The placement is even less forward than the Scout.
It's possibly less forward than the controls on all the touring models (FLH and FLST) with floorboards.
It's not that radical
The Mayor didn't say radical, Kev.. he said ridiculous. I agree, and am sticking with it. :smiley:
I know you are a foot forward kind of guy, but I'd never even *look* at a bike like that. I'd really like to like the Scout, but there's no way I'd even consider riding something like that. No offence intended to the Scout riders that love em.. :smiley:
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The Mayor didn't say radical, Kev.. he said ridiculous. I agree, and am sticking with it. :smiley:
I know you are a foot forward kind of guy, but I'd never even *look* at a bike like that. I'd really like to like the Scout, but there's no way I'd even consider riding something like that. No offence intended to the Scout riders that love em.. :smiley:
I guess I always wonder why someone would think it was ridiculous or radical.
The funny thing is that I HATE FORWARD CONTROLS.
But in MY world, forward controls mean your toes point UP and you're leaned back. That's not what happens on a bike like this, or say anything with floorboards.
In my world there are 3 seating positions:
* Rear Sets, feet below or behind you, toes pointing down or maybe straight ahead, slight or radical body lean forward
* Mid mounts, feet in front of you, but either below the knees or a little forward, legs bent, toes point straight ahead, body upright
* Forwards, feet way out in front of you, legs pretty much straight, toes pointed up, body slouched back
Now obviously there's gray area between the two not only in bike design, but it could potentially change the definition depending on the size of the person. So it's all this gray area that leaves people wondering.
For me I just can't equate the upright comfortable (sitting in a chair) position of a typical "touring" bike (like a Cali or RK) with the "gyn exam" position of a "cruiser". I think many on this board who are more used to what I'd define as rear sets can't tell the difference and to me the difference is huge both from a comfort and handling point of view.
Not that it matters past a point of discussion.
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(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/8b20426d2e2ab48f3110b782e805942a.jpg)
What is a new motorcycle doing in a clothing store in the mall?
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nice wallet chain
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Just spoke with my nephew , he says there is a limited addition screeching iggle anniversary model that each dealer will get one of that is priced at $53,500.00 :shocked:
Dusty
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Peg Position, I guess everyone has a different definition. To me rear sets are pegs that are behind your butt, standard position are directly under or slightly forward like on a dirt bike (easy to stand up on the pegs), mid controls are more out in front where your knees are bent about 90 degrees, and forward controls are where your knees are bent less than 90 degrees.
Bottom line for me is if I can't stand up on the peg easily (without pulling up on the handle bars), then I can't get comfortable on it. I recently had an XL1200R with mid-controls and just couldn't adapt to that riding position with my knees only bent 90 degrees.
I also always set in a chair with my feet under the seat, not out in front.
I rode a New Indian Scout Bobber a week ago Saturday, and can honestly say that was the most uncomfortable bike I have ever at a dealer. After about 5 miles I was begging to get off it. Way forward foot controls, a low seat and short little straight bars. Bent over at the waist with feet and hands forward. Talk about style over function or comfort. I did like the Scout motor, but that is about it.
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I rode the 114 cubic inch Heritage Softail on Saturday. I'm 5foot 7 inches tall with 29 inch inseam and the bike was comfy for me. The brakes and suspension were very good. I only rode 5 miles so the engine never got to run. I liked it a lot, YMMV.
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Peg Position, I guess everyone has a different definition. To me rear sets are pegs that are behind your butt, standard position are directly under or slightly forward like on a dirt bike (easy to stand up on the pegs), mid controls are more out in front where your knees are bent about 90 degrees, and forward controls are where your knees are bent less than 90 degrees.
Bottom line for me is if I can't stand up on the peg easily (without pulling up on the handle bars), then I can't get comfortable on it. I recently had an XL1200R with mid-controls and just couldn't adapt to that riding position with my knees only bent 90 degrees.
I also always set in a chair with my feet under the seat, not out in front.
I rode a New Indian Scout Bobber a week ago Saturday, and can honestly say that was the most uncomfortable bike I have ever at a dealer. After about 5 miles I was begging to get off it. Way forward foot controls, a low seat and short little straight bars. Bent over at the waist with feet and hands forward. Talk about style over function or comfort. I did like the Scout motor, but that is about it.
Yeah I understand that, bottom line we're built differently and have different preferences.
That said even my RK with the Police seat has a much different riding position than a standard RK. Except when I'm actively shifting or braking my feet are almost in the same position as my XL or my old Jackal. And when I'm shifting they're not that far forward. But with the standard RK seat they'd be bent more and THAT might be a problem. The bend on my V7 or especially the Duc is enough to cramp pretty quickly. My old Breva 1100 was even worse.
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Just spoke with my nephew , he says there is a limited addition screeching iggle anniversary model that each dealer will get one of that is priced at $53,500.00 :shocked:
Dusty
See my earlier post about the guy looking to trade a CVO for another CVO.
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Just spoke with my nephew , he says there is a limited addition screeching iggle anniversary model that each dealer will get one of that is priced at $53,500.00 :shocked:
Dusty
That won't be enough for all the professional athletes and actors to buy one. Never mind all the musicians. You act like that is crazy, but how many cars are there that are over $100,000.
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i like the blue one
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i like the blue one
:smiley: Good point.
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Today I rode my Ambo to the local H-D dealer. I wanted to see the new models, pick up a sales brochure, and say hello to my friend who's a tech there. It's amusing to me there's an additional charge for the primer looking paint. Gloss black is standard, and looks much better IMO. Softail high position shock with battery underneath. So many bikes, so little time & $
(http://thumb.ibb.co/it64z5/IMG_3312.jpg) (http://ibb.co/it64z5)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/cqfWe5/IMG_3313.jpg) (http://ibb.co/cqfWe5)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/ccLmCQ/IMG_3314.jpg) (http://ibb.co/ccLmCQ)
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Wow what a color and cheap looking primer finish. And that godawful plastic looking shinny clutch cover shinny contrasting against the dull paint job and those bag. The lines on that bike just clash and do not work.
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I just spent a week riding a new HD full dresser with a 107 CI 8V water cooled engine that I rented in Salt Lake City. I was very impressed with the bike. The motor was great, had power to spare and would pull easily to 90 or 100 2 up with loaded bags. It had a great intake howl and would pass slower traffic with ease. It is the first HD that made me laugh in my helmet. Shifting, braking & fuel injection were excellent. We put 1,500 miles on it in the Idaho mountains in 7 days and really enjoyed it. I recommend riding one if you get the chance.
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Well, look a little closer. <snip>
* Went to a new more rigid frame. The new frame is lighter and all of the models lost weight. Maybe not a lot, only 20-35#
Now Kev, you gave me he** when I mentioned the Agos shed 28 pounds from the 1400............... .. IIRC, something to the effect of "Insignificant in the grand scheme of things." Yep, being the devils advocate. :evil:
Anyway, back to your regular scheduled program. :coffee:
John Henry
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Now Kev, you gave me he** when I mentioned the Agos shed 28 pounds from the 1400............... .. IIRC, something to the effect of "Insignificant in the grand scheme of things." Yep, being the devils advocate. :evil:
Anyway, back to your regular scheduled program. :coffee:
John Henry
The difference is small no doubt.
But the difference in circumstances is that might be the first time in decades (maybe even history) that a Harley LOST WEIGHT. [emoji23]
I wish I was joking.
So the difference is significant.
More importantly it's the sum of the parts.
Many have complained for years about brakes, suspension, power, handling, etc. They seem to be listening and have made some real improvements across the board. The result is pleasantly surprising.
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Has anyone actually weighed one of these new slightly less porcine critters ? Maybe road hugging weight doesn't mean what it did :evil:
Dusty
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You're right of course Kev. Just couldn't help myself. After all, you did open the door.
ZZ
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You're right of course Kev. Just couldn't help myself. After all, you did open the door.
ZZ
Touche my friend, you are of course correct as well.
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John, was that the same conversation when I was shocked to learn the Audace really did shed some weight over say the Cali Custom or T?
Here's some interesting data for us to chew on new Softails vs Cali.
Reported Wet Weights:
Cali T 753#
Cali Eldo 738#
Heritage Softail 723# (107 motor)
Cali C 701#
Fat Boy 699#
Deluxe 697#
Fat Bob 673# (107 motor)
Breakout 672#
Slim 671#
Low Rider 661#
Audace 659#
Street Bob 653#
Cali wheelbases - ~66-67" / overall lengths ~96"
Softails wheelbases - ~64-67" / overall lengths ~92-95"
They're pretty comparable in a number of gross dimensions, considering there's a 100# spread top-to-bottom.
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gross dimensions.
That's pretty gross, all right.. :smiley:
I'll get me hat.
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(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/542ed4f14ca07c7911415de3a4fbe153.jpg)
I take your word that it looks better in person, but this bike is ugly.
Probably wouldn't Wee on one if it was on fire, but that bike is NOT ugly.
It looks strong and purposeful (which it no doubt is). I reckon it looks pretty damn good. Loaded and on tour you could do a lot worse.
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nice wallet chain
They'll get it off you somehow.
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Probably wouldn't Wee on one if it was on fire, but that bike is NOT ugly.
It looks strong and purposeful (which it no doubt is). I reckon it looks pretty damn good. Loaded and on tour you could do a lot worse.
Strong and purposeful does not sound like it is a good looking bike. Functional maybe but the front fender is too small, the paint job sucks and as functional as the headlight maybe be I keep looking at it and thinking it does not have a headlight or did the headlight get smash in a wreck. They could have put a cover over it. Too cute by a half as they say. I look at some of these new HDs and wonder what in the world are they thinking. Harley's base buyers for decades have been all about chrome and paint and now they have primer tanks and fenders that look like a rat bike and headlights that look like something out of a Mad Max or Alien movie. Cycle World says and I quote "Harley-Davidson used words like Battlestar Galactica and zombie apocalypse to describe the inspiration for the Fat Bob". So don't flame me for my "artistic impression" :grin:
They cannot decide if this is a cruiser or a bobber so they gave it a bit of both. It comes in at 675# with a much smaller 3.5 gal gas tank than previous years. At $17K starting price you have to add ABS at a cool $800 extra and anything but black is also extra.
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Strong and purposeful does not sound like it is a good looking bike. Functional maybe but the front fender is too small, the paint job sucks and as functional as the headlight maybe be I keep looking at it and thinking it does not have a headlight or did the headlight get smash in a wreck. They could have put a cover over it. Too cute by a half as they say. I look at some of these new HDs and wonder what in the world are they thinking. Harley's base buyers for decades have been all about chrome and paint and now they have primer tanks and fenders that look like a rat bike and headlights that look like something out of a Mad Max or Alien movie. Cycle World says and I quote "Harley-Davidson used words like Battlestar Galactica and zombie apocalypse to describe the inspiration for the Fat Bob". So don't flame me for my "artistic impression" :grin:
They cannot decide if this is a cruiser or a bobber so they gave it a bit of both. It comes in at 675# with a much smaller 3.5 gal gas tank than previous years. At $17K starting price you have to add ABS at a cool $800 extra and anything but black is also extra.
As James Dalton (Patrick Swayze) says in Road House - "Opinions Vary"
But just the fact that old grumpy guys (HD "faithful" or not) are bitching about em tells me they're doing the right thing. They're NOT trying to reach the SAME customers or older generations with these products (though I'm encouraged by a number of them that seem to be attracted).
Another funny example is the demin paint thing. All you can say is it "sucks" ok, fine. I think red or black gloss paint SUCKS (I make an exception for Jenn's Duc but that's about it). But I'd rather ride than clean, and guess what, the demin paints are the ultimate ride and forget. They're literally designed to have more character if they start to wear. And they're really growing on me.
But I don't think Harley needs to work THAT hard for my business and I'm under the impression there's nothing they can do to get yours, so really, it's neither or our opinions that matter here.
I still dig it... more and more with each "Hater" - cue Lannis in 3 .... 2 .... 1.... :boozing:
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I would love to have seen what Eric Buell would have done with the Fat Bob!
And as for that nice baby blue HD Deluxe it makes my heart sing.
You mistake my criticism of HOG financials and my criticisms of some of their bikes as well lack of their bikes (300cc-500cc) as being a Harley Basher.
Not so. I'll wait for the reviews on the handling of the Fat Bob and some of the rest. As for the 3.5 gallon Fat Bob gas tank it is stupid to put it on that bike that offers both the 107 and 144cc motors. And the seat down right sucks. Of course it would suck cause my 6'5" frame would never fit it.
The soft tail low rider essentially weighs as much as the Fat Bob and it gets a 5 gallon tank and has more ground clearance @ 5.1" Go figure. Besides it reminds me of the Guzzi Nevada. By the way doesn't the huge Cali 1400 have a full 6.5" of ground clearance. It will be interesting to see the lean angles on the new Harleys.
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The funny thing is that I HATE FORWARD CONTROLS.
I'm with you on that one Kev.
Not only do I think they give you less control but my lower back screams after a very short time.
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I would love to have seen what Eric Buell would have done with the Fat Bob!
And as for that nice baby blue HD Deluxe it makes my heart sing.
You mistake my criticism of HOG financials and my criticisms of some of their bikes as well lack of their bikes (300cc-500cc) as being a Harley Basher.
Not so. I'll wait for the reviews on the handling of the Fat Bob and some of the rest. As for the 3.5 gallon Fat Bob gas tank it is stupid to put it on that bike that offers both the 107 and 144cc motors. And the seat down right sucks. Of course it would suck cause my 6'5" frame would never fit it.
The soft tail low rider essentially weighs as much as the Fat Bob and it gets a 5 gallon tank and has more ground clearance @ 5.1" Go figure. Besides it reminds me of the Guzzi Indiana. By the way doesn't the huge Cali 1400 have a full 6.5" of ground clearance. It will be interesting to see the lean angles on the new Harleys.
You're right I did mistake that. Mea-culpa.
The F Bob handles very well. It's still no sport bike but it felt light and nimble. I liked the Dyna Fat Bob and considered buying one, but this one is definitely an improvement.
Interestingly enough the ground clearance spec is misleading as the new F Bob has less ground clearance but more lean angle than the Low Rider.
Here's a post I made elsewhere last week when starting my research that includes some more dimensional specs:
Comparison new 2018 Softails/Dynatails vs old 2017 Dynas and Softails
Ground Clearance / Wheelbase / Weight / Lean Angles
Street Bob 4.9 / 64.2 / 653# / 28.5-28.5 VS 4.7 / 64.2 / 670# / 30-31
Fat Bob 4.7 / 63.6 / 673# / 31-32 VS 4.9 / 63.8 / 706# / 30-31
Low Rider 5.1 / 64.2 / 661# / 29.6-29.6 VS4.1 / 64.2 / 666# / 29.5-30.5
Breakout 4.5 / 66.7 / 672# / 26.8-26.8 VS 4.3 / 67.3 / 707# / 23.4-23.4
Slim 4.7 / 64.2 / 671# / 27.4-27.4 VS 4.9 / 64.4 / 706# / 24-24.9
Fat Boy 4.5/ 65.6 / 699# / 25.6-25.6 VS 5.1 / 64.4 / 730# / 26.2-27
Deluxe 4.5 / 64.2 / 697# / 28-28 VS 4.3 / 64.4 / 730# / 25.8-26.7
Heritage 4.7 / 64.2 / 723# / 27.3-28.5 VS4.7 / 64.4 / 755# / 24.4-25.9
OK, so I let my OCD run a little for a comparative spec search.
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This is a photo of my 2nd HD bought new in 72.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/hpYTBk/Super_Glide_FX.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hpYTBk)
I called the Super Glide my Ralph Nader bike, as it was truly unsafe at any speed. This was Willie G's lazy, very lazy attempt to copy the Easy Rider look and put the HD badge on it. AMF in its glory days trying their best to take down the Motor Company.
It was virtually a stripped down "74" dresser with a sportster front end and that is all it was. It looked good but did nothing else, even mediocre. Ground clearance was non existent, the rear brake locked up immediately and the front brake couldn't handle the weight of the bike much less the rider. It would fade at 50 MPH. At speed above 85 MPH the front end literally could not stay on the ground. The forks pulsed up and down rapidly but thankfully no dreaded weave. I finally mixed STP and ATF at about a 60/40 ratio that made it thick enough to keep the front wheel/forks from pulsing up and down.
The back fender cracked on it, the oil tank cracked, the license plate cracked. Other things broke that I do not remember. One year and 13,000 miles and it was ready to go. But hey that was the AMF days and it took how many years before Harley was bought out and saved from extinction?
So I wanted a bike that cornered and stopped and found it. I consumed Motor Cycle rags for information and found an early model new Ducati GT that had been languishing in a small town Berliner showroom. Traded straight up for the FX (the dealer knew he could sell the Harley but the Duck was collecting dust) and I was in love with all things Italian on the first test ride.
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If I'd started riding in the 70's or even 80's I'd likely have never stuck with Harley.
I was fortunate to buy my first house and first new bike in the same year 1993 (my early 20's).
It was a new 1200 Sportster and it was not trouble free, but it was reliable and fun, and probably hooked me for life.
I've owned BMWs and Guzzis, and I appreciate both. Hopefully I'll always have at least a Guzzi in the garage too.
But there's always at least one Moco product that speaks to me too. So it's nice to have options.
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If I'd started riding in the 70's or even 80's I'd likely have never stuck with Harley.
:cool: ya hit the nail on the head .......never cared a lick for them and probably never will , back then say in 1972 they built crap and myself and others at the time had other ideas as to what a motorcycle should be.... now i respect them in the fact that they are brilliant at marketing and staying in business , as for their bikes i still say meh.
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Holy smokes, that red oxide primer bike is ugly. Maybe it is just my bias, but it looks like they forgot to paint it.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/542ed4f14ca07c7911415de3a4fbe153.jpg)
This one reminds me of a Yamaha Virago with a custom headlight from an old KLR.
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Holy smokes, that red oxide primer bike is ugly. Maybe it is just my bias, but it looks like they forgot to paint it.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170826/542ed4f14ca07c7911415de3a4fbe153.jpg)
This one reminds me of a Yamaha Virago with a custom headlight from an old KLR.
It can't really remind one of a Virago unless the jugs are offset and the seat is heavily stepped, the tank is awkwardly raked upward, the bars are buckhorns..
Hell everyone knows a Nevada is what reminds you of a Virago! [emoji23]
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170831/fea68f540082fd0086245261527c33be.jpg). Just saying ...
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When I saw the exhaust, I thought Virago. The seat has a pretty big step, just needs button tuck. The headlight also reminded me of bender the robot's eyes.
I have a dearer nearby, guess I will go have a look. The V7 usually gets some comments, and questions when I stop.
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Meh, the rear pipe doesn't go under the motor, the motor isn't a stressed member of the frame...I could go on.
The V7 always gets love at Harley dealers. A few years back I stopped by the York factory for an open house and some employees approached me to ask about it!
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Joking aside, I have no doubt that Harley has upped it's game.
All my bikes are air cooled but I know that water pumps and radiators have been responsible for more performance than turbos were 30 years ago.
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I know there are many differences between the two bikes. The styling cues, first impressions for me is what I meant Kev. I will go see it in person. Sometimes, like you said, pictures do not do the bike justice.
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I got Ducati Indiana name transposed with Guzzi Nevada but then I put all the 4 bikes side by side and realized the softail lowrider looked a bit out of place with the other 3 look alikes.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/cs1tBk/Nevdada.jpg) (http://ibb.co/cs1tBk)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/gWZ245/ducati_650_indiana.jpg) (http://ibb.co/gWZ245)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/eDXdcQ/Virago.jpg) (http://ibb.co/eDXdcQ)
(http://thumb.ibb.co/gtD6Wk/LOWRIDER.png) (http://ibb.co/gtD6Wk)
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I know there are many differences between the two bikes. The styling cues, first impressions for me is what I meant Kev. I will go see it in person. Sometimes, like you said, pictures do not do the bike justice.
I'm just giving you guff, nothing serious...
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I'm just giving you guff, nothing serious...
I figured that. :wink: The bender comment was as well. :grin:
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I can't look twice at any bike with that f*&$# ridiculous peg placement, how are you supposed to ride like that
I really don't like any brand bike with floorboards or foot forward controls and in this case it would probably require the redesigning of the exhaust system and that won't happen. Anyway, I'm probably the demographic who would buy this bike, but it just isn't my cup of tea and I'm not a HD hater. From the fat front wheel,forward foot pegs,risers on the handlebars to the seat/wheat harvester chute rear fender. But I do like the looks of the engine.
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They do have mid-mounts on the Street Bob with the same frame. The question is whether or not you could fit them with the stock Fat Bob exhaust. To my naked eye it looks like the F Bob exhaust sits lower and might interfere. But I'm sure someone could figure that out. Certainly that would be a want for my book too.