Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: falcone on November 28, 2017, 02:03:54 PM
-
I have a T3 Guzzi and am considering fittiing a Silent Hektik ignition.
I am currently having a Morgan style three wheeler made for this engine.
I enquired of the British Guzzi, I think unofficial suppliers a well respected company called Muzzi Moto. They said as I had fitted a none Bosch Electrex world stator kit it would not work or would be very difficult to make work?
Does anyone have any such a combination?
OR the similar Elektronik Sachse unit?
I currently have an early C5 ignition fitted and it will just not work!! Sadly the warranty has run out and I have never used apart from checking it worked when fitting BUT it looks like I didn't run long enough as that is the problem in the three wheeler. It starts and feels strong and sounds good BUT will never keep for more than a few minutes and eventually cuts out!
David
-
Board member Triple Jim might be able to help .
Dusty
-
Thanks for that Dusty hopefully I'll here from him. Dave
-
The guy who makes the C5 is also a member here or used to be, maybe he could help.
-
Thanks for that Guzzisteve I realise that and I have been discussing with him :-)
-
The Silent Hektik I installed came from Europe, don't know of a distributor in USA.
-
I am in the UK for my sins :-)
-
Silent Hektik is a bit of a mystery to me, I knew a guy who had one on a Le Mans and didn't have any issues
However I think it was a Silent Hektik unit that was responsible for burning one of Pete Roper's mate's Guzzi to the ground.
When I looked at them I couldn't figure how they worked as there seemed to be several different length triggers on them, which looked odd. I really don't know enough about to make a judgement, so I just stayed clear of them.
I have a Sachse unit on my LM 1000 and it works well, I don't know if they are producing them again or not since Volker's untimely death.
Main thing about crank based rotors is that the unit will be wasted spark.
Some will tell you that all wasted spark units should be avoided at all costs and there could well be merit in that
What you DO want to try and avoid is a system where the wasted spark is produced when the other cylinder requires a spark for ignition, this is the worst option due to the firing order.
It means the RH cylinder will get a wasted spark on the induction stroke, this can lead to blow back. The mixture ignites and blows back through the inlet valve into the carb. At normal running it's just a cough and a missed beat. However at low RPMs or starting, blowback and lack of suction produced by the engine can lead to the mixture igniting the float bowl and then it gets very exciting.
I'm not trying to terrify I actually had a RITA on the bike when I got it and had that for many years, it used a similar sort of system, just alerting you to a potential danger
The Sachse system produces a wasted spark 360 degrees out of phase on each cylinder, effectively the timing of each spark is independent of the other. So less danger of blowback.
If going to Silent Hektik it is a question I'd ask, before committing to it
John (also in the UK)
-
Board member Triple Jim might be able to help .
Dusty
:thumb: Bump on Triple Jim. He has years and years of building CDIs for KAW triples and has since started making CDIs for Guzzi's. He is running one on his Mille. He knows his stuff and stands behind it. I believe he has a couple of variations of CDI units with points and with sensors. He should speak for himself so I do not screw it up.
http://www.lakeserv.net/kaw/
-
Silent Hektik is a bit of a mystery to me, I knew a guy who had one on a Le Mans and didn't have any issues
However I think it was a Silent Hektik unit that was responsible for burning one of Pete Roper's mate's Guzzi to the ground.
When I looked at them I couldn't figure how they worked as there seemed to be several different length triggers on them, which looked odd. I really don't know enough about to make a judgement, so I just stayed clear of them.
I have a Sachse unit on my LM 1000 and it works well, I don't know if they are producing them again or not since Volker's untimely death.
Main thing about crank based rotors is that the unit will be wasted spark.
Some will tell you that all wasted spark units should be avoided at all costs and there could well be merit in that
What you DO want to try and avoid is a system where the wasted spark is produced when the other cylinder requires a spark for ignition, this is the worst option due to the firing order.
It means the RH cylinder will get a wasted spark on the induction stroke, this can lead to blow back. The mixture ignites and blows back through the inlet valve into the carb. At normal running it's just a cough and a missed beat. However at low RPMs or starting, blowback and lack of suction produced by the engine can lead to the mixture igniting the float bowl and then it gets very exciting.
I'm not trying to terrify I actually had a RITA on the bike when I got it and had that for many years, it used a similar sort of system, just alerting you to a potential danger
The Sachse system produces a wasted spark 360 degrees out of phase on each cylinder, effectively the timing of each spark is independent of the other. So less danger of blowback.
If going to Silent Hektik it is a question I'd ask, before committing to it
John (also in the UK)
As you say, Rita fires both together, we fitted loads in 80’s many of them including my uk bike still working and never thought of burning. Seen many others burnt with single fire ignition
One that Pete mentions, Hektic one , as op asks, fires wasted same as yours, every 360, so no difference in that respect asfaik. Two pick ups on stator, two coils wired independently.
Only one I know that fires simultaneously on both is Rita
-
Jacksonracing
I'm not doubting you but I am confused, Going to the Silent Hektik site for Moto Guzzi, the picture I get is this
(https://www.silent-hektik.de/LiMa_3b.jpg)
Now maybe I'm looking at the wrong thing and as the site is all in German, I don't know what it's trying to tell me. But that looks like a multiple trigger single pick up. As I said maybe the system uses magic beyond the limited scope of my intelligence. It looks beautifully made.
The Sachse system uses dual pickup single trigger, like this
(http://www.maxi-allgaeu.de/blaue-ratsche/bilder/guzzi-zue1.jpg)
I'm just baffled how the Hektik system knows which cylinder its to send the spark to, whereas the Sachse system each pickup is independent, so the left or right can only be the left or right
It could well do it though clever programming I guess
If you do know more I'd love to be educated
John
-
That top pics rotor bolt has seen better days.
-
David,
What make cycle car are you going with. Triking?
-
Thanks for all the replies guys.
To update I am now going for the Sachse unit as they are incredible helpful. Silent Hektik gave a polite but firm 'no'.
Sachse have been very good with all the Emails and want my alternator sent to them to make up what is needed, which they can offer if others are in a similar position. Have to wait 'til mid January though as they are relocating.
There are a number of issues they or I will have to sort out such as the spacer (already has the larger spacer) now being too short. In the time being I suspect I will get away with a second spacer but have already arranged for a friend to make me a compete IF Sachse don't do it anyway.
Had heard of the 'fire' on the Hektik elsewhere. Very rare I'm sure.
The car isn't a Triking it is an Aero Merlin. I'll add a photo, although Arthur Rayner, the constructor, has built some 46 none and mine looks rather different to this with two seats, MG wheels and much more. More details at:
http://www.spitfireart.com/veetwintrikes.html
(http://thumb.ibb.co/kk0BKb/BROCHURE_COVER_P1_29_6_13.jpg) (http://ibb.co/kk0BKb)
There is also a blog on the making at:
http://aerocyclecars.blogspot.co.uk/2016/07/hello-i-am-arthur-rayner-of-aero-cycle.html
Dave