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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Arizona Wayne on January 28, 2018, 03:04:32 PM
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....is this 3 days @ Sepang track. Timed results & rider remarks are listed @ http://www.roadracingworld.com. It's early days but if you are as avid a fan as me you might want to read it some.
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I read that Jorge and Vale are both happier with the new bikes. Duc has improved turn in and Yamaha has gone back to '16 bike design.
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Day 1: four Ducatis inside the top five.
There are at least five legitimate title contenders, six if you take Zarco into account.
Closer to a dozen riders capable of reaching the top step on any given weekend.
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Miller looks like a duck to water on the Ducati.
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Miller looks like a duck to water on the Ducati.
Yeah, that is encouraging. Hope he has a trouble free season. Like his attitude.
Media-wise he could be their next Rossi ~ always on for the camera.
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Son of a gun...........Loren zo ended up with the fastest time on the last day. Miller looks fast too on the Ducati. Dani finished 2nd.
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Yeah, that is encouraging. Hope he has a trouble free season. Like his attitude.
Media-wise he could be their next Rossi ~ always on for the camera.
Yeah but he has to become more likeable and not whinge like Casey did.
Also don't say four letter words on camera !!
Rossi was/is a media God.
Jack never looks as "happy" as Valentino or Marc do, but I sure wish him a trouble free season and hope he can score some (dry) podiums, and finish 2018 in the top five.
In and around Zarco, Vinales, Crutchlow, et al...on any given race day with the obligatory win in the pissing rain.
Casey Stoner "owns" Phillip Island, but I'd love to see Jack with a three year lease !!!
Ultimate dream ?
Casey return with Jack in a two man team on factory Ducati's...
I reckon Casey could force their hand, they LOVE him.
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man, do all the new bikes have ugly fairings on them like Ducs and Yamahas? Dorna needs to ban that shit.
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man, do all the new bikes have ugly fairings on them like Ducs and Yamahas? Dorna needs to ban that shit.
Haven't noticed yet and in racing results is more important than looks. :wink: Besides they're still trying to decide what parts of their bikes are best for this years actual races. In the end bikes may not look like they do right now. A paint job can make a big difference too. :grin:
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Wayne. If you haven't seen the photos, why comment?
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Wayne. If you haven't seen the photos, why comment?
I've seen some photos but like I've said it's still early days on what the bikes are going to look like when they actually start racing. I know some teams are testing with different front fairings right now that have different looks. They have yet to decide what fairings they are going to use later. Some of the bikes have black fairings until they decide which 1s they are going to decide to use. Far as I'm concerned it's still too early to know exactly what the bikes are going to look like until later. :azn:
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Well Wayne, you've seen them or haven't noticed? The photos I saw were painted bikes. I think they're ugly.
We all have our opinions and if you like them fine. But when you say you haven't noticed, then you say you saw some photos, I find it confusing.
My larger point is I hope they don't get into a huge aero war. I thought they were banning this stuff after Ducati ran that ugly fairing last year. And then I saw the new Yamaha (all painted with sponsors logos BTW) and thought "oh no."
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Yes I've seen some of the painted bikes that look like their final product. Whether they're pretty or not isn't important to me. What matters is if they work better than the competitions or as good. The racing isn't a beauty contest. It's a speed contest. Function over form.
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Wayne, so you haven't seen the photos?
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Wayne, so you haven't seen the photos?
Exactly what photos are you referring to? :huh: I've seen the Ducati, Honda, Yamaha new GP photos.
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The fairings with wings and tunnels are ugly IMO. And an aero war could be bad for the sport if it gets out of hand. I thought they banned extreme aero after the ducati from last year.
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The fairings with wings and tunnels are ugly IMO. And an aero war could be bad for the sport if it gets out of hand. I thought they banned extreme aero after the ducati from last year.
They supposedly did, but apparently Honda and/or Yamaha changed their mind. Ducati was not too happy this happened.
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The fairings with wings and tunnels are ugly IMO. And an aero war could be bad for the sport if it gets out of hand. I thought they banned extreme aero after the ducati from last year.
The tunnels weren't banned. It was the winglets. The tunnels were a response to banning the aileron. The ban was to keep riders from being slashed by a thin edge during close quarter riding. There were design requirements for the tunnels; mostly around rider safety.
The teams can test (within time limit of the sanctioned track time) all sorts of bits and pieces up to Qatar. Then they have to declare which bits are this year's bike and engine. The big teams can choose two body configurations, the teams win no recent wins (satellite and Suzuki) are given a few more options over the season and development teams (KTM) can experiment as much as they can afford. I could be wrong in the fine details but that is the gist of Dorna leveling the playing field.
Are the air-dams ugly? Lorenzo probably doesn't care. They work. This is about fast.
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I have no clue what the 'tunnel' reference is about. :huh:
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I have no clue what the 'tunnel' reference is about. :huh:
The original winglets were just a straight out 'fin'. When they were deemed unsafe, the teams added outer support to the fairing. Effectively keeping the airflow pressing down but offering a bigger/blunter surface should it hit a competing rider.
(http://thumb.ibb.co/bBO6Om/Screen_Shot_2018_02_01_at_6_41_47_AM.png) (http://ibb.co/bBO6Om)
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I have no clue what the 'tunnel' reference is about. :huh:
well, just look at the photos that you've might have seen or not.
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I am aware of the original winglets(which were outlawed) and the new version but did you guys name this yourselves a tunnel? :huh:
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Wayne, I have good enough vision to look at photos, that you may or may not have seen, to know what the tunnels are. :wink:
I am not commenting on your vision. :shocked:
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To Huzo:
"Also don't say four letter words on camera !!"
~ it's a cultural thing; example, Pete R :boozing:
"Rossi was/is a media God."
~ that will never change. Once a deity... :thumb:
"Jack never looks as "happy" as Valentino or Marc do,"
~ maybe it is his results. Hard to smile with a whipped butt even when you are world class. :popcorn:
".. but I'd love to see Jack with a three year lease !!!"
~ are you Australian? I heard they might re-write the anthem: In joyful strains then let us sing; another win for Jack our dear. :bow:
"Ultimate dream ? Casey return with Jack in a two man team on factory Ducati's..."
~ you are obviously not Italian. :grin:
"I reckon Casey could force their hand, they LOVE him."
~ mmm? I think Ducati is preparing itself for a Championship win by a European rider ~ they have two contenders in the saddles
It is going to be an excellent year. Enjoy!
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To Huzo:
"Also don't say four letter words on camera !!"
~ it's a cultural thing; example, Pete R :boozing:
Well mate.
With no disrespect to you or Pete.
Yes I'm Australian, I was BORN here.
Pete has a turn of phrase that is a quaint mix of undeniable British wit, mixed in with a goodly dose of Australian vernacular.
But make no mistake Yukie...
There are a few four letter words used regularly in Aussie language beginning with "F" and the third letter of the English alphabet, that I could slide surreptitiously into my sentences to enhance the meaning, but I choose not to.
I suggest mate that there is NOTHING on which you can school me, regarding Australian cultural influences, although feel free to try.
However..
Using the "in and out" word on international television coverage is not conducive to attracting future endorsement opportunities and is not the way to engratiate yourself to the viewing public.
While we're on the topic of Aussie cultural mores, you seem to have gotten a bit of a handle on such things, where did you pick those up ??
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Well mate.
With no disrespect to you or Pete.
Yes I'm Australian, I was BORN here.
Pete has a turn of phrase that is a quaint mix of undeniable British wit, mixed in with a goodly dose of Australian vernacular.
But make no mistake Yukie...
There are a few four letter words used regularly in Aussie language beginning with "F" and the third letter of the English alphabet, that I could slide surreptitiously into my sentences to enhance the meaning, but I choose not to.
I suggest mate that there is NOTHING on which you can school me, regarding Australian cultural influences, although feel free to try.
However..
Using the "in and out" word on international television coverage is not conducive to attracting future endorsement opportunities and is not the way to engratiate yourself to the viewing public.
While we're on the topic of Aussie cultural mores, you seem to have gotten a bit of a handle on such things, where did you pick those up ??
No direct handle on culture nor any want (or ability) to school anyone. We share a commonwealth background.
My family 'settled' on Vancouver Island in the early 1900's. Many of our core values have the same origin barring the first boat trips.
You make a good point on the endorsement front. I can't recall profanity coming from the lips of VR.
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No direct handle on culture nor any want (or ability) to school anyone. We share a commonwealth background.
My family 'settled' on Vancouver Island in the early 1900's. Many of our core values have the same origin barring the first boat trips.
You make a good point on the endorsement front. I can't recall profanity coming from the lips of VR.
No worries mate.
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Motogp threads generate more hate & controversy than politics, guns and religion around here. :weiner:
Keep it up. :boxing:
Always notice that the real mechanical guys like Chuck and Pete don't care about it? :evil:
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It's SPORTS, it's supposed to be passionate.
JL posted great time on the last day, after many were wanting off the Duc at the end of 2017. In a way I am hoping he solves the traction issues over the full race laps and rides to the top, although he is not one of my favorite riders. Dovi looks like Mr. consistency again and should compete again.
Yamaha. Went from the best bikes on the circuit in 2016 to a puzzle with the 2017. Poor Zarco getting the 2017 dumped on him. Jury still out if they have solved traction problems with the 2018.
Honda looked strong focusing on long sessions instead of speed laps. Figure they will be strong with the new engine.
Rest look to need to keep developing, but Aprilia might be watching Zuk and KTM pull away from them.
Can't wait for Thailand tests in a couple weeks. And I agree with John that the aero fairings look ugly but also agree with Wayne that it's all about results. I guess as long as they don't get to crazy I'm OK with them.
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It's SPORTS, it's supposed to be passionate.
JL posted great time on the last day, after many were wanting off the Duc at the end of 2017. In a way I am hoping he solves the traction issues over the full race laps and rides to the top, although he is not one of my favorite riders. Dovi looks like Mr. consistency again and should compete again.
Yamaha. Went from the best bikes on the circuit in 2016 to a puzzle with the 2017. Poor Zarco getting the 2017 dumped on him. Jury still out if they have solved traction problems with the 2018.
Honda looked strong focusing on long sessions instead of speed laps. Figure they will be strong with the new engine.
Rest look to need to keep developing, but Aprilia might be watching Zuk and KTM pull away from them.
Can't wait for Thailand tests in a couple weeks. And I agree with John that the aero fairings look ugly but also agree with Wayne that it's all about results. I guess as long as they don't get to crazy I'm OK with them.
Agree entirely that sport needs passion to be what it is: entertainment. Great entertainment at that.
I'm not anchored to one brand or one rider but I'd sort of like to see Ducati and Ducati battling it out... to an 100% Italian championship settled at the last round. ~ Or a title for VR so he can retire gracefully.
The other wish would be for KTM to podium. A team with the backing of a motorsport giant can't be called an underdog but seeing them build from nothing to where they are is impressive. (and I like PE~ he seems well grounded). Who knows? That trellis might be their foundation for a Panigale killer in the future.
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the only thing I like about Jorge are his initials.
:wink:
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the only thing I like about Jorge are his initials.
:wink:
Thinking about it, I bet you refuse to eat M&M chocolate candies.
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Bring back the "dustbin" fairings-and add some winglets. Now that would be some controversial aero.
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Bring back the "dustbin" fairings-and add some winglets. Now that would be some controversial aero.
.... and it went downhill when FIM caught Rossi testing a new design that they felt would change the playing field;
(http://thumb.ibb.co/gookOm/jetman_yves_rossy_15jpg.jpg) (http://ibb.co/gookOm)
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[quote author=LowRyter link=topic=94369.msg1493347#msg1493347 date=1517619230
Always notice that the real mechanical guys like Chuck and Pete don't care about it? :evil:
[/quote]Is there a message in there ?
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I'm so happy I've built a comprehensive "Ignore" list...Go Dovi!!! Looking forward to watching all the teams and riders fight it out...closest and most exciting motorsport out there IMHO...closely followed by WRC and WEC...watching Bathhurst 12 hours right now...nice to have racing in the dead of winter(here)...
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I'm so happy I've built a comprehensive "Ignore" list...Go Dovi!!! Looking forward to watching all the teams and riders fight it out...closest and most exciting motorsport out there IMHO...closely followed by WRC and WEC...watching Bathhurst 12 hours right now...nice to have racing in the dead of winter(here)...
You haven't ever been to a fast mile dirt track .
Dusty
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You don't know that...
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You don't know that...
So you're saying that motogp has closer racing than a good mile ?
Dusty
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I saw the Peoria Mile in 78 and 79...fun but not particularly memorable...that's just my opinion...if dirt is the medium, I'd rather watch the bikes at Dakar or the Baja...YMMV
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I saw the Peoria Mile in 78 and 79...fun but not particularly memorable...that's just my opinion...if dirt is the medium, I'd rather watch the bikes at Dakar or the Baja...YMMV
Dirt is for racing , pavement is just so your truck doesn't get stuck on the way .
Do you mean you were at the Peoria TT ? Yeah , not great racing .
Dusty
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Chocolate vs. Vanilla....everyone has a favorite...I did get to see Springsteen which was rather special...
Tell the boys at the Isle of Man that pavement isn't for racing, then remember to step back out of reach quickly...
(https://www.iomtt.com/images/cache/a5b5d0b9eb5e3e8e05d170f37cae6c1c.jpg)
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Chocolate vs. Vanilla....everyone has a favorite...I did get to see Springsteen which was rather special...
Tell the boys at the Isle of Man that pavement isn't for racing, then remember to step back out of reach quickly...
(https://www.iomtt.com/images/cache/a5b5d0b9eb5e3e8e05d170f37cae6c1c.jpg)
The only form of pavement racing I follow with any enthusiasm is the Irish National series , which the IOM is just one in the series . The rest are real racing , wheel to wheel at 200 MPH , none of that timed stuff . Kind of dirt track on pavement .
Dusty
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Then why bother with a clearly-labeled MOTOGP thread, eh? :cool:
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Then why bother with a clearly-labeled MOTOGP thread, eh? :cool:
Hey , you guys said you wanted passion , I'm just providing some . Let's see Rossi ride a bucking snorting flat track bike at Springfield :evil:
Dusty
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So you're saying that motogp has closer racing than a good mile ?
Dusty
Actually, more often than not, probably so. But it's a great point to debate. :evil:
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Hey , you guys said you wanted passion , I'm just providing some . Let's see Rossi ride a bucking snorting flat track bike at Springfield :evil:
Dusty
Funny story.
I was at the Indy Mile a few years ago when Kenny Roberts did 4 hot laps on the TZ750. The crowd went nuts. The announcers were yacking, and Kenny was sitting on the bike, he never said a word.
Finally, the announcers asked Rossi, who was a VIP guest and Yamaha rider, "Valentino, would you like to try the Flat Track?"
Valentino answers in his strong accent, "No, it looks a little too dangerous."
And for his first and only words of the evening, Kenny answers, "He's smarter than he looks." :grin:
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Rossi rides dirt bikes in fact he has his own dirt tracks in Italy and invites other racers to join him like Nicky Hayden. He just doesn't ride AMA flat track dirt bikes.
I've been to Sacramento Mile and Lodi Cycle Bowl races and sorry, Dusty, they don't inspire me like they do you compared to road racing tracks.
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Rossi rides dirt bikes in fact he has his own dirt tracks in Italy and invites other racers to join him like Nicky Hayden. He just doesn't ride AMA flat track dirt bikes.
I've been to Sacramento Mile and Lodi Cycle Bowl races and sorry, Dusty, they don't inspire me like they do you compared to road racing tracks.
"No, it looks a little too dangerous."
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"No, it looks a little too dangerous."
No, it looks a little too boring with just 4 corners and not much straightaway and it's mostly flat. :tongue: Wanna compare how many fans come out to see the races between the 2 track designs? I didn't think so. Wanna compare how much $ the best riders get paid for their skills? I didn't think so.
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I saw the Peoria Mile in 78 and 79...fun but not particularly memorable...that's just my opinion...if dirt is the medium, I'd rather watch the bikes at Dakar or the Baja...YMMV
Some of us make an annual trip from your parts up to Springfield, Il. for the mile every Labor Day weekend. You might consider joining the fun. There will be drinking and cigars, lots of great BS and motorcycle riding and racing. Always a good time (especially with Schurke always trying to get a Harley rider to blow up his engine).
But I agree in that to me, MotoGP is more fun to watch, because I like bike racing that uses brakes and turns both directions. :evil:
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Yeah , dirt track is soooo easy , except that it isn't . Every great American roadracer , from Cal Rayborn and Gary Nixon , to Nicky Hayden learned the skills to go fast on pavement racing on those easy left turn only dirt tracks .
Dusty
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No, it looks a little too boring with just 4 corners and not much straightaway and it's mostly flat. :tongue: Wanna compare how many fans come out to see the races between the 2 track designs? I didn't think so. Wanna compare how much $ the best riders get paid for their skills? I didn't think so.
"No, it looks a little too dangerous." Well if you know more than Rossi, go right ahead.
Having seen fatalities at the Indy Mile might have reinforced that. But there's no kitty litter on an oval, there is a fence.
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Some of us make an annual trip from your parts up to Springfield, Il. for the mile every Labor Day weekend. You might consider joining the fun. There will be drinking and cigars, lots of great BS and motorcycle riding and racing. Always a good time (especially with Schurke always trying to get a Harley rider to blow up his engine).
But I agree in that to me, MotoGP is more fun to watch, because I like bike racing that uses brakes and turns both directions. :evil:
Chris can be your roommate. :shocked:
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Yeah , dirt track is soooo easy , except that it isn't . Every great American roadracer , from Cal Rayborn and Gary Nixon , to Nicky Hayden learned the skills to go fast on pavement racing on those easy left turn only dirt tracks .
Dusty
What would you say is the top three most important things to master in Flat Track as compared to road racing?
Me, FT 1) hooking up coming out of corners, 2) track position into corners, 3) straight speed. RR 1) Braking into corners, 2) hooking up coming out, 3) corner speed.
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Darren, I would say that keeping momentum is the most important thing for the big tracks. The means handling, power, traction and handling.
Don't forget handling.
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What would you say is the top three most important things to master in Flat Track as compared to road racing?
Me, FT 1) hooking up coming out of corners, 2) track position into corners, 3) straight speed. RR 1) Braking into corners, 2) hooking up coming out, 3) corner speed.
Well ...
Darren, I would say that keeping momentum is the most important thing for the big tracks. The means handling, power, traction and handling.
Don't forget handling.
All of this .
And cojones made of granite :laugh:
Just to clarify , I was really just poking a bit of fun , top level road racers are amazing , heck , any top level motorbike competitor in any genre is better than me on a motorbike . Trials guys freak me smooth out , extreme enduro riders like David Knight and Taddy Blazusiak leave me speechless, and motocross requires amazing skill .
Just don't be dissing on American dirt track , Kenny Roberts taught the world what a great dirt tracker can do .
Dusty
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I FAIL to see any post on this thread 'dissing' flat track...YOU jumped in with both feet proclaiming how great it was and didn't get the wildly enthusiastic response you were looking for, I reckon... :wink:
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I FAIL to see any post on this thread 'dissing' flat track...YOU jumped in with both feet proclaiming how great it was and didn't get the wildly enthusiastic response you were looking for, I reckon... :wink:
I seem to remember you having a sense of humor . Oh , I guess you missed someone saying flat track is simple and boring :shocked:
Dusty
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Chris, I am aware that any time we have a Moto GP thread that Dusty likes to nudge us a little bit about flat track.
I just wish Dusty would go with us to Springfield or here in OKC and see one.
I think MotoGP is the most exciting racing anywhere. I think Flat Track is the most dangerous. I think all those guys have skills that would shame anyone on two wheels. The upper .000000001%
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Chris, I am aware that any time we have a Moto GP thread that Dusty likes to nudge us a little bit about flat track.
I just wish Dusty would go with us to Springfield or here in OKC and see one.
I think MotoGP is the most exciting racing anywhere. I think Flat Track is the most dangerous. I think all those guys have skills that would shame anyone on two wheels. The upper .000000001%
Well , I have been to at least 6 pro flat tracks races , watched Wayne Rainey win at Laguna in '89, a slew of pro motocross races , and a world trials round in Broken Arrow , so it ain't like I' a virgin.
Actually some of the best racing I've ever witnessed were a couple of VDTRA nationals , and the races in Steamboat and Park City .
Dusty
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Yeah , dirt track is soooo easy , except that it isn't . Every great American roadracer , from Cal Rayborn and Gary Nixon , to Nicky Hayden learned the skills to go fast on pavement racing on those easy left turn only dirt tracks .
Dusty
I don't remember anyone here saying dirt track racing is easy. And far as I'm concerned it's not near as hard as motocross racing. Top road racers practice doing both flat track & MX racing so that should tell you something.
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No, it looks a little too boring with just 4 corners and not much straightaway and it's mostly flat. :tongue: Wanna compare how many fans come out to see the races between the 2 track designs? I didn't think so. Wanna compare how much $ the best riders get paid for their skills? I didn't think so.
I don't remember anyone here saying dirt track racing is easy. And far as I'm concerned it's not near as hard as motocross racing. Top road racers practice doing both flat track & MX racing so that should tell you something.
OK , you only said it is boring and flat :laugh:
Trust me , if you had ever raced flat track you would understand , it isn't boring .
Dusty
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OK , you only said it is boring and flat :laugh:
Trust me , if you had ever raced flat track you would understand , it isn't boring .
Dusty
Yes, as a rider it's far from boring, but as a spectator to me it's boring, unless I'm right next to the fence on the straight as they go by @ 130 mph. :thumb:
Now when I'm next to the track between corners 4 & 5 @ Laguna Seca and they go by flat out @ say 165 mph, that's EXCITING !!! :bow:
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(https://g1.img-dpreview.com/DA5A1010A08549D980B329BCC6945996.jpg)
(https://g1.img-dpreview.com/2E13FA53131548D1BD35EBD384392F06.jpg)
what are these guys doing halfway to the line? 120?
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Is neat to be close to the fence when they come by flat out.
Still watching the MotoGP guys braking down from over 200mph on the back stretch at COTA, back tire barely touching down once in a while, then knees and elbows on the ground before coming out of the corner with the front just skimming the ground is kinda exciting too. Especially when there's a few of them in the back straight drag race.
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(https://g1.img-dpreview.com/DA5A1010A08549D980B329BCC6945996.jpg)
(https://g1.img-dpreview.com/2E13FA53131548D1BD35EBD384392F06.jpg)
what are these guys doing half way to line? 120?
Not sure , but I think they are running about 135 at Springfield and Sacramento .
Is neat to be close to the fence when they come by flat out.
Still watching the MotoGP guys braking down from over 200mph on the back stretch at COTA, back tire barely touching down once in a while, then knees and elbows on the ground before coming out of the corner with the front just skimming the ground is kinda exciting too. Especially when there's a few of them in the back straight drag race.
Once again , I was just poking a bit of fun . Darren , you know I love any kind of motorbike competition .
Dusty
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Is neat to be close to the fence when they come by flat out.
Still watching the MotoGP guys braking down from over 200mph on the back stretch at COTA, back tire barely touching down once in a while, then knees and elbows on the ground before coming out of the corner with the front just skimming the ground is kinda exciting too. Especially when there's a few of them in the back straight drag race.
what I noticed watching them in person was the violence when the riders are braking. These guys are just slamming themselves to the tank and bars, bracing themselves against violent braking forces.
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"violent braking forces"
That describes it pretty well! :thumb:
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zoooooooooommmmmm
(https://g3.img-dpreview.com/AF8E2E4B997048BBA3AABABC2965BC79.jpg)