Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: ohiorider on July 06, 2018, 09:19:13 PM
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As some of you know, I purchased a leftover 2014 Honda CB1100 (actually an 1140cc engine) in April of 2017. Not been happy with this bike since that time. But recently, I spent phone time with a rep from RaceTech, who gave me some tips on tuning the RaceTech Gold emulator valves that now reside in the front forks. The results are encouraging. The front end, though not 100% compliant with some of our frost heaved roads, is worlds better than stock. I'd already changed the fork springs from 1.00 to .90 (lighter springs.) Additionally the rep recommended:
- remove valves, and if only two bleed holes, drill two more in each valve. We did that.
- set RaceTech valve springs at two turns from where spring contacted the adjustment bolt. We did that, too.
- try 10w fork oil, 150mm below top of fork tube with springs out, and forks compressed. Done.
- set fork spring preload initially with fork caps 5mm above tubes, with legs extended. Done.
Having made those changes, and previously adding a set of Ikon shocks to the rear, I'm getting there (I think.)
Forks are still slightly too stiff ..... may swap out .90 springs for a pair of .80 springs (lighter yet.)
There's still adjustments that can be made to the RaceTech valves. RaceTech has invited me to call back with my results after making the first set of changes.
Simply getting used to the low rpm, high torque in line 4 is taking some getting used to. But I must admit, after today's ride, that 1140cc engine truly is a torque monster. Though red line is at about 8500rpm, running to 5000rpm in the first 3-4 gears has the bike moving along nicely. 60mph in 6th gear = 2800rpm (approx)
Remains to be seen whether I'll stay with the Honda. I think it is taking time to get used to a turbine-like engine that makes torque this low, and still has 2500 - 3000 left. I may give the suspension a few more tweaks, and give this bike a fair chance to prove itself. I think it just might do that!
It is an easy bike to handle, and carries its weight very low. The tires are rather narrow, which makes for a bike that switches line quite easily. Controls, in particular the clutch, are light.
Hopefully, I can get this bargain basement bike set up to my liking.
Bob
(https://thumb.ibb.co/fPLwEy/Photo_Honda_CB1100_jpeg.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fPLwEy)
Bob
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Though red line is at about 8500rpm,
that surprises me.. I thought 4 cyl motors rev'd way past that..
but yeah, sell it.
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Though red line is at about 8500rpm,
that surprises me.. I thought 4 cyl motors rev'd way past that..
but yeah, sell it.
Well, then .... remain surprised.
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Have to say, it's a bike I don't get. There are many contemporary 4 cyl Japanese bikes that offer a lot of performance. This one is a contemporary 4 cyl bike bike that offer nostalgia and little else. Of course you would find a genuine classic 4 cyl Japanese bike and have more performance.
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I once had a GPZ that didn't have much torq down low but on the boil would make my eyeballs tear up.. can't really remember but red line must have been over 1200?
(https://photos.smugmug.com/All/i-JbnbqsT/0/9bb5c48b/L/IMG_1467-L.jpg) (https://fotoguzzi.smugmug.com/All/i-JbnbqsT/A)
and this was the tuned down Kawasaki of the era..
(https://photos.smugmug.com/All/i-WhDx6kh/0/af85d3ad/L/IMG_1469-L.jpg) (https://fotoguzzi.smugmug.com/All/i-WhDx6kh/A)looks like it's going 60 on the center stand.
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I almost bought one of those a few years back ( the GPZ ). I'm not surprised they didn't catch on, it's not like the ZX-11 was an uncomfortable torture rack. I loved the torque and thought it looked cool as hell. ( bought my triumph instead).
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I once had a GPZ that didn't have much torq down low but on the boil would make my eyeballs tear up.. can't really remember but red line must have been over 1200?
Wow 1200. My high performance machine idles at 1200. (not one to brag)
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I guess the lukewarm comments speak to the reason that the CB1100 hasn't sold well in the US . . . But my 2017 CB1100 EX is the sweetest motorcycle I have ever ridden. I can run it up to sixth gear at 40 mph and pretend it's an automatic. Suspension, brakes, handling . . . terrific! Never a tank below 50 mpg, and lately I've seen 58 mpg twice.
But no, it's not hard-edged and doesn't touch the performance capabilities that the modern Japanese (or other) bikes have today.
Out of my six bikes, it and the Road King are getting all my attention these (summer) days.
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Hi Bob, I have only owned 1 4cyl. Honda and it was gone within 3000 miles and I have road all makes of 4 cyl bikes and always come back to the twins, maybe you are the same way :bike-037: :laugh:
Bruce
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I've never warmed up to a 4 cylinder bike either, FWIW. Different strokes and all that.
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I've never warmed up to a 4 cylinder bike either, FWIW. Different strokes and all that.
No more I-4s for me because of the high frequency vibrations, but open to a tidy little V-4
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Was at our local car/bike show last weekend, this gentleman had a few tasty custom parts on his CB1100, including the gas tank. Beautiful.
I've had some bikes for many years that have had less then stellar suspension, or some other flaw.
Each one spoke to me in other ways..
If you find yourself trying too hard, where's the fun in that?
You'll figure it out
:thumb:
(https://thumb.ibb.co/kxUPK8/IMG_20180630_190109689_HDR.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kxUPK8)
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I'm looking at your bike collection:
Main ride: 2008 Guzzi 1200 Sport
Recent addition: 2012 Griso 8v SE (sold Sept '15)
Reliable standby: 1991 BMW R100GS
New Arrival: 2014 Honda CB1100
You have 2 bikes in the same, big naked, class. The Sport and the CB1100.
I've generally found that when this happens, you pick one and ride it.
The other sits.
When/if you get the Honda right do you think you will ride it?
Or will you take the Sport?
If so, you might be better off keeping the Sport and trading the CB for a different style of bike?
Perhaps a sport tourer and have the Sport and a LeMans or Ducati ST4S
or a different adventure bike: a Sport and a Stelvio
or a dirt bike? A Sport and a KTM
M
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I'm looking at your bike collection:
Main ride: 2008 Guzzi 1200 Sport
Recent addition: 2012 Griso 8v SE (sold Sept '15)
Reliable standby: 1991 BMW R100GS
New Arrival: 2014 Honda CB1100
You have 2 bikes in the same, big naked, class. The Sport and the CB1100.
I've generally found that when this happens, you pick one and ride it.
The other sits.
When/if you get the Honda right do you think you will ride it?
Or will you take the Sport?
If so, you might be better off keeping the Sport and trading the CB for a different style of bike?
Perhaps a sport tourer and have the Sport and a LeMans or Ducati ST4S
or a different adventure bike: a Sport and a Stelvio
or a dirt bike? A Sport and a KTM
M
Even though on paper the 1200S and CB weight about the same, the Honda carries its weight much lower, and is overall an easier bike for me to handle around town. I think I may be parting with the 1200S due to the fact that at 5'7", she's beginning to feel a bit top heavy for me, plus I think my future rides will be closer to home (day trips.) The CB, when sorted out, would probably be the bike of choice for that kind of riding. I view the 12S as a mile eating sport tourer, and the CB as more of a local ride.
The R100GS will have some $$ thrown at it later this month, and will be in reserve for times when the impulse to travel strikes.
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No more I-4s for me because of the high frequency vibrations, but open to a tidy little V-4
Yeah, that. I had a Honda V4 that had apparently been built by Asian midgets because my "Merican fingers were too big to get into the valve train. :smiley: It *was* an engaging engine to operate, though, even if outrageously complicated.
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You’ve undertaken a good approach with your Honda, Bob. You may find that the journey you and the CB make together as you correct shortfalls will cement a lasting relationship. Different (whether it’s continent of origin or engine configuration) is not necessarily better, but it’s tough to know for sure without properly trying it out. There are no uncorrectable faults, dealers are plentiful, and the Honda is a pretty good homage to an acknowledged classic. Your CB1100 may be just what you need at this stage of your life, but in the end only you can make that judgment...
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4 cyl bikes are very nice. They can have a broader powerband than a twin. They certainly can have more power on top.
My nic with the this CB is it's a nostalgia 4 cyl with the performance of a twin. I've got 75 HP on my Guzzi, I want 100 hp from a four.
Nothing like a I-4 cyl with a pipe on it and running it 10k. V4s really sound good too. So do triples.
But since most new bikes are water cooled,injected and have balance shafts, they can produce 100hp+ out of just about anything whether twin, triple, four, six cyl. It's pretty much order your power and styling into any package you want.
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Bob-
I always like the posts that you make and I try to follow you (but not in a creepy way). I too have got a 1200 sport and just recently this past year, traded my BMW gs in on a V7III in an effort to get a lighter and lower bike.
It started off a little rocky. The bike felt tiny and kind of gutless, but as I’ve ridden it more I’ve come to like ithe easy way of which it rides- it’s a good machine.
Despite this, whenever I see one of those cb1100s, I get a little yearn in my stomach (just the black ones). What I’m saying is- I wish you the best of luck with your bike, and I truly hope that you get it to a place where you positively bond with it. However, if at some point down the road you might consider a swap for my v7 I might be interested. As I’m writing this it seems kinda crazy and if my wife knew what I was doing I’m also wondering how much she would kill me (heehee).
Just throwing it out there- best of luck.
Jim
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4 cyl bikes are very nice. They can have a broader powerband than a twin. They certainly can have more power on top.
My nic with the this CB is it's a nostalgia 4 cyl with the performance of a twin. I've got 75 HP on my Guzzi, I want 100 hp from a four.
Nothing like a I-4 cyl with a pipe on it and running it 10k. V4s really sound good too. So do triples.
But since most new bikes are water cooled,injected and have balance shafts, they can produce 100hp+ out of just about anything whether twin, triple, four, six cyl. It's pretty much order your power and styling into any package you want.
Summed up pretty well. Over the years I've owned more 4 cylinder bikes than any other format. This was one of my favorites:
(https://thumb.ibb.co/dJSmXT/Picture_004.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dJSmXT)
About 110 hp with an ungodly torque curve. Had it for 10 years.
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Aaah, but with the right exhaust there are few sounds as exhilerating as the tortured scream of a japanese multi. (Yes, a twin or triple with the right exhaust can rival.)
Honda's 250 6, CBX with a D&D, a Yoshimura on about anything, LaFranconi Comps are a few examples.
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(https://thumb.ibb.co/mrKBz8/3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mrKBz8)
Looking at the specs, I think I'd rather have a ZRX. Better yet, These first gen 1200 Triumphs are beasts and can be had for cheap.
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Summed up pretty well. Over the years I've owned more 4 cylinder bikes than any other format. This was one of my favorites:
(https://thumb.ibb.co/dJSmXT/Picture_004.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dJSmXT)
About 110 hp with an ungodly torque curve. Had it for 10 years.
I bought a ZRX1100 new the first year they came out and kept it 10 years. Power mods included ZX11 cams, a full titanium Apkrapovic system, pod filters, Ivan's jet kit and ignition advancer. I also installed Woodcraft clip ons, Sato rear sets, a steering damper, a ZX-6 USD fork and a round headlight. It's easy to get 140-150hp using flatslides but I didn't bother. Mine had about 130hp at the rear wheel. My 75 year old father rides a ZX-11 and my ZRX would pull it from 60 to 100mph. I used to troll for kids on GSX-R's in the White mountains and I'd always laugh when they'd inevitably pull over while I was sitting on the side of the road taking a break and ask, "What IS that thing?!" Great fun. The ZRX 1100 and 1200 will be collectables but not for another ten years. In comparison, I took a CB1100 for a spin when they first came out and found it an underpowered, overly heavy, wobbly antique. However, they're finished about 1,000% nicer than a ZRX. I can see the allure of OWNING a CB1100 but I'd much rather RIDE a ZRX.
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For whatever your reasons, if you are not happy with it..."farm it out"...as there are PLENTY of other worthy two-wheels choices out there! :laugh: :grin: :wink:
"Life is too short to drive ANY boring motorcycle..." :thumb: :cool:
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just a bargain bin bike
(https://g1.img-dpreview.com/34AD824BD7AD40C8865DD1ACD0259763.jpg)
82k miles, getting clutch #4.
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As some of you know, I purchased a leftover 2014 Honda CB1100 (actually an 1140cc engine) in April of 2017. Not been happy with this bike since that time.
I should have stopped reading here.... And you should have stopped THINKING there.
That is all.
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Thank you, Kev M. Your thoughts are quite generous.
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Thank you, Kev M. Your thoughts are quite generous.
I hope you know my post was neither a complaint nor an insult. It was an observation, a glimpse of myself, overthinking, missing the forest for the trees, trying again and again to justify with my head the truths my heart already knew...
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Though red line is at about 8500rpm,
that surprises me.. I thought 4 cyl motors rev'd way past that..
but yeah, sell it.
Best I remember our 82 900 CB customs, in-line 4s redlined at 10500rpm
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As some of you know, I purchased a leftover 2014 Honda CB1100 (actually an 1140cc engine) in April of 2017. Not been happy with this bike since that time. But recently, I spent phone time with a rep from RaceTech, who gave me some tips on tuning the RaceTech Gold emulator valves that now reside in the front forks. The results are encouraging. The front end, though not 100% compliant with some of our frost heaved roads, is worlds better than stock. I'd already changed the fork springs from 1.00 to .90 (lighter springs.) Additionally the rep recommended:
- remove valves, and if only two bleed holes, drill two more in each valve. We did that.
- set RaceTech valve springs at two turns from where spring contacted the adjustment bolt. We did that, too.
- try 10w fork oil, 150mm below top of fork tube with springs out, and forks compressed. Done.
- set fork spring preload initially with fork caps 5mm above tubes, with legs extended. Done.
Having made those changes, and previously adding a set of Ikon shocks to the rear, I'm getting there (I think.)
Forks are still slightly too stiff ..... may swap out .90 springs for a pair of .80 springs (lighter yet.)
There's still adjustments that can be made to the RaceTech valves. RaceTech has invited me to call back with my results after making the first set of changes.
Simply getting used to the low rpm, high torque in line 4 is taking some getting used to. But I must admit, after today's ride, that 1140cc engine truly is a torque monster. Though red line is at about 8500rpm, running to 5000rpm in the first 3-4 gears has the bike moving along nicely. 60mph in 6th gear = 2800rpm (approx)
Remains to be seen whether I'll stay with the Honda. I think it is taking time to get used to a turbine-like engine that makes torque this low, and still has 2500 - 3000 left. I may give the suspension a few more tweaks, and give this bike a fair chance to prove itself. I think it just might do that!
It is an easy bike to handle, and carries its weight very low. The tires are rather narrow, which makes for a bike that switches line quite easily. Controls, in particular the clutch, are light.
Hopefully, I can get this bargain basement bike set up to my liking.
Bob
(https://thumb.ibb.co/fPLwEy/Photo_Honda_CB1100_jpeg.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fPLwEy)
Bob
Never heard an Inline four engine described that way. Even my Concours 1400 was docile until you opened the throttle. Unlike my Versys 650 twin and Yamaha FZ-07 twin that would loft the front tire if you gave it some good throttle.
I could have bought a new Honda back in 14 for around $7k and after the test ride on lookout mountain I passed. Good thing, but that was around the time I found the Guzzi Cafe Classic.
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As some of you know, I purchased a leftover 2014 Honda CB1100 (actually an 1140cc engine) in April of 2017. Not been happy with this bike since that time. But recently, I spent phone time with a rep from RaceTech, who gave me some tips on tuning the RaceTech Gold emulator valves that now reside in the front forks. The results are encouraging. The front end, though not 100% compliant with some of our frost heaved roads, is worlds better than stock. I'd already changed the fork springs from 1.00 to .90 (lighter springs.) Additionally the rep recommended:
- remove valves, and if only two bleed holes, drill two more in each valve. We did that.
- set RaceTech valve springs at two turns from where spring contacted the adjustment bolt. We did that, too.
- try 10w fork oil, 150mm below top of fork tube with springs out, and forks compressed. Done.
- set fork spring preload initially with fork caps 5mm above tubes, with legs extended. Done.
Having made those changes, and previously adding a set of Ikon shocks to the rear, I'm getting there (I think.)
Forks are still slightly too stiff ..... may swap out .90 springs for a pair of .80 springs (lighter yet.)
There's still adjustments that can be made to the RaceTech valves. RaceTech has invited me to call back with my results after making the first set of changes.
Simply getting used to the low rpm, high torque in line 4 is taking some getting used to. But I must admit, after today's ride, that 1140cc engine truly is a torque monster. Though red line is at about 8500rpm, running to 5000rpm in the first 3-4 gears has the bike moving along nicely. 60mph in 6th gear = 2800rpm (approx)
Remains to be seen whether I'll stay with the Honda. I think it is taking time to get used to a turbine-like engine that makes torque this low, and still has 2500 - 3000 left. I may give the suspension a few more tweaks, and give this bike a fair chance to prove itself. I think it just might do that!
It is an easy bike to handle, and carries its weight very low. The tires are rather narrow, which makes for a bike that switches line quite easily. Controls, in particular the clutch, are light.
Hopefully, I can get this bargain basement bike set up to my liking.
Bob
(https://thumb.ibb.co/fPLwEy/Photo_Honda_CB1100_jpeg.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fPLwEy)
Bob
Bob, before you sell the bike, do your best to imagine not having the _positive_ experiences you have with it. Forget the negatives. It will be the positives that you will regret not having. If there aren't strong positives of any kind, then the regrets should be mild. Hope your decision works out in the long run either way.
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I hope you know my post was neither a complaint nor an insult. It was an observation, a glimpse of myself, overthinking, missing the forest for the trees, trying again and again to justify with my head the truths my heart already knew...
We both go back a long way on this forum. I sometimes misinterpret a response to something I've posted. In this case, I believe I did. And like you, I often attempt to justify or change what I already know (or think) to be true. Sometimes, I can bend it, other times, not. Remains to be seen about this bike.
Bob
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Bob,
Have you ridden a V7 III yet? If not, you really should.
In fact, ride the CB1100 TO the Guzzi dealer, and then test ride a V7 III, then ride your CB1100 home
If you get back on the CB1100 and think about the V7 III the whole way home, and how much better you like it, then sell the CB1100 and buy the V7 III :grin:
If you get back on the CB1100, and think, "Yeah, I actually really like this bike." Then keep it.
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Best I remember our 82 900 CB customs, in-line 4s redlined at 10500rpm
Made me look at mine in the garage.
Looks like 9500
(https://thumb.ibb.co/fo35Ro/IMG_20180707_222327131_LL.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fo35Ro)
(https://thumb.ibb.co/jbLPK8/IMG_20180707_223552272_LL.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jbLPK8)
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Great bottom pic Tazio.
ohiorider, I am puzzled what was wrong with the factory CB front forks. But I've never modified a stock suspension in my life. either I'm not picky or I am missing the boat. Either way, good luck. I've come to appreciate the technical prowess of the CB.
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Bob,
Have you ridden a V7 III yet? If not, you really should.
In fact, ride the CB1100 TO the Guzzi dealer, and then test ride a V7 III, then ride your CB1100 home
If you get back on the CB1100 and think about the V7 III the whole way home, and how much better you like it, then sell the CB1100 and buy the V7 III :grin:
If you get back on the CB1100, and think, "Yeah, I actually really like this bike." Then keep it.
I think this is a clear and reasoned approach, and a great way to distinguish the way each bike makes you feel. Assuming that the bikes are somewhat equivalent in serviceability, durability, and parts availability, I'd recommend the same thing.
And I know this is a Guzzi forum, so I need to tread softly . . . but does anyone here really believe that the Guzzi would provide the same long, trouble-free service as the Honda? Maybe that doesn't matter . . . :grin:
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The Honda has it’s advantages, but I wouldn’t say reliability is significantly better. The Honda has a better dealer network...for me, that’s about it. Besides, which bike will still have most parts available in twenty years? Honda changes its designs (well, most of them) too frequently to support their bikes indefinitely...
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It's only a motorcycle, some you sell, some you don't . Ideally you should only sell one to get one that you want more. That's the best advice I can give and it works on tools, houses, pistols
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It's only a motorcycle, some you sell, some you don't . Ideally you should only sell one to get one that you want more. That's the best advice I can give and it works on tools, houses, pistols
"When in doubt...farm it out!!" :laugh: :grin: :wink: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
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"Life is too short to drive ANY boring motorcycle..." :thumb: :cool:
Well said. If it doesn't make you smile when you ride it, find one that does!
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Great bottom pic Tazio.
ohiorider, I am puzzled what was wrong with the factory CB front forks. But I've never modified a stock suspension in my life. either I'm not picky or I am missing the boat. Either way, good luck. I've come to appreciate the technical prowess of the CB.
You must either buy only high end bikes with fully adjustable suspension, ride where the roads are race track smooth, or are missing the boat.
I have upgraded the suspension on most of my bikes. Some because they had budget suspension. Some because they were not set up correctly for my weight and riding style. Do you check the static sag of the front and rear suspension on your bikes?
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does anyone here really believe that the Guzzi would provide the same long, trouble-free service as the Honda? Maybe that doesn't matter . . . :grin:
Meh... There are so few guarantees in life. And really, Honda isn't a guarantee. Even IF the odds are slightly more in its favor, does it really matter in the big picture?!?
I'd rather spend double and throw away a bad Guzzi than deny myself one and live with a boring bike I didn't want just because I perceived the odds were better it would be trouble free.
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^^^^ plus one brazillion, Kev. :smiley:
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You must either buy only high end bikes with fully adjustable suspension, ride where the roads are race track smooth, or are missing the boat.
I have upgraded the suspension on most of my bikes. Some because they had budget suspension. Some because they were not set up correctly for my weight and riding style. Do you check the static sag of the front and rear suspension on your bikes?
Oh dear. The only static sag I'm familiar with is that of my aging ball sack.
I honesty don't give a rat's butt. I have a suspension, I'm not riding a Rokon, I'm happy. The only issue I've ever had was my 2013 Stone, the rear suspension was indeed quite bad. It would pogo me right off the seat when I hit a pothole. Other than that, I've lived just fine with all of them.
I have a DR650, it is plush, long travel, it's also dual purpose. For my road bikes, my expectations are lowered but the ride is always manageable.
It may be due to the fact I'm quite large, maybe my size overcomes the harshness of a stock suspension, and if I bottom out I just increase the preload, basically whatever setup is proper for two-up riding works well for me. The bike don't care, and I'm good.
Anything else kemosabe?**
** = click to see full image
(https://thumb.ibb.co/bRFmmo/kemosabe.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bRFmmo)
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Great bottom pic Tazio.
ohiorider, I am puzzled what was wrong with the factory CB front forks. But I've never modified a stock suspension in my life. either I'm not picky or I am missing the boat. Either way, good luck. I've come to appreciate the technical prowess of the CB.
DaSwami,
The short answer. The stock forks and shocks really beat me up riding over our beaten roads. I weigh in at about 165, and the suspension is simply too stiff for me.
The longer answer. I know most on this forum would have no reason to follow changes Honda has made to later models of the CB1100. In 2014, from a 5 speed to 6 speed transmission. With this engine's torque, I could care whether I had a 5 or 6 speed.
However, when they brought the CB1100 back to the US in 2017, one of the most notable changes was supplying the bikes with what they advertised as new Showa Bending Valve Fork technology. Google it for more info than you'll ever want. Here's a link to one article about it.
http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2017/08/2017-honda-cb1100-ex-smooth-ride-from-new-front-fork/
I suspect Honda made this change for a reason. I understand that several newer Harley models equipped with Showa forks come with Showa Bending Valve front suspension. Several of the CB1100 forum owners on the CB Forum have made this upgrade, by swapping out their older fork legs for the ones from the 2017. About $500 a leg.
EDIT: checked BikeBandit website. They sell each fork leg for slightly over $400.00.
Bob
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Shit or get off the pot Bob. This isn't brain surgery.
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i have known a few friends that have bought these. all sold within 6 months due to lack of excitement (paraphrasing those owners). i don't know. there are plenty of retro bikes that do well in the marketplace.
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i have known a few friends that have bought these. all sold within 6 months due to lack of excitement (paraphrasing those owners). i don't know. there are plenty of retro bikes that do well in the marketplace.
If I can just make it to the 29th of this month (July), I'll beat the odds . . . :laugh:
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Oh dear. The only static sag I'm familiar with is that of my aging ball sack.
I honesty don't give a rat's butt. I have a suspension, I'm not riding a Rokon, I'm happy. The only issue I've ever had was my 2013 Stone, the rear suspension was indeed quite bad. It would pogo me right off the seat when I hit a pothole. Other than that, I've lived just fine with all of them.
I have a DR650, it is plush, long travel, it's also dual purpose. For my road bikes, my expectations are lowered but the ride is always manageable.
It may be due to the fact I'm quite large, maybe my size overcomes the harshness of a stock suspension, and if I bottom out I just increase the preload, basically whatever setup is proper for two-up riding works well for me. The bike don't care, and I'm good.
Anything else kemosabe?**
** = click to see full image
(https://thumb.ibb.co/bRFmmo/kemosabe.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bRFmmo)
Don't ever ride a bike with well sorted suspension. Ignorance is bliss and keeps an extra 2 grand in your pocket.
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Shit or get off the pot Bob. This isn't brain surgery.
Fork surgery, Chad
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Guess I'll weigh in here as somebody that actually OWNS and RIDES a CB1100 on a daily basis and currently has 16.9K miles on the odo.
Ohio Rider. I've been following your journey towards a better ride quality on the CB on two sites for a while now. I cant help but believe that SOME of your problem is directly related to your slight stature. I weigh 240 (250 if I've been drinking) and I experience none of the concerns you have related about the OEM suspension. In fact, I knocked out a 600 mile day 3 weeks ago on secondary blacktop across some of the same road surface imperfections you encounter back east (potholes/frost heaves/gaping expansion strips/etc.) and had ZERO complaints about the bikes ride. Not saying it has a Gold Wing like ride or suspension, just that I have no complaints.
An observation: Are you still riding on the OEM seat? The OEM seat in my estimation was BRUTALLY hard. I pulled it off with less than 200 miles on the bike and replaced it with an K&H I bought off the other site you and I frequent. I just went out to the garage and pressed on the seating surface in a number of spots with my thumb. The seat bounced right back. But, under the fabric was a dimple were I pressed. I waited about 30 seconds and that dimple slowly had filled in. Makes me believe that there are two types of material in that seat....a foam base and then some type of gel covering. I then pressed on the stock seat I pulled off the bike. Noticeably harder to compress with my thumb and bounced back immediately, no dimple under the material. The K&H seat is NEVER the reason I pull over for a break.
I can't help but believe that at least SOME of the difference in our opinions about the ride quality of the CB is due to those two factors. Other differences may be I have less chronic back/neck issues than you, more disc material that cushions the impact of road feedback, or in the words of 2wheeladdict "ignorance is bliss" and maybe I don't know what a good suspension should feel like...fill in anything else that may be appropriate here.
Kevin M's comment is EXACTLY what I was thinking when I read your initial post. You eluded to the fact that the bike was a bargain and maybe that was one reason you bought it. I would think with all the suspension work you've paid for the bargain margin has been significantly eroded by now. I'm not going to tell you what to do because I'm not you and it's not my money but as I see it you have a few choices.
1) Sell it and cut your losses NOW.
2) Continue down the path you're on and it may or may not work out in the end.
3) Gain approx. 80-85 pounds, buy a K&H seat like mine and see if my theory is valid.
Hope it all works out in the end for you...Frulk
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Frulk, probably the most straightforward comments I've seen about my issues re the CB1100. I appreciate your observations.
- I'm getting closer to taking your suggestion #1.
- I'll continue, but getting closer to discontinuing this chase (your suggestion #2.)
- the weight gain might not be in the stars .... a different saddle may be (your suggestion #3.)
Bob
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Ohiorider,
The stock Honda seat is horrible IMO, but not for the reason Frulk states. It's as soft as a marshmallow and using the "arse test" (as opposed to the thumb test) it offers little to no support for me, I am compressed right to the seat pan and my posterior and aforementioned sack go nighty night. The K&H transformed the bike for me.
Best of luck, but I'm on my third and fourth CB1100 and I don't think I will ever part with them until I can't push them across the garage anymore.
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Ohiorider,
The stock Honda seat is horrible IMO, but not for the reason Frulk states. It's as soft as a marshmallow and using the "arse test" (as opposed to the thumb test) it offers little to no support for me, I am compressed right to the seat pan and my posterior and aforementioned sack go nighty night. The K&H transformed the bike for me.
Best of luck, but I'm on my third and fourth CB1100 and I don't think I will ever part with them until I can't push them across the garage anymore.
DaSwami, I do have issues with the saddle. Not sure it's softness related. Just seems like I'll need to install handlebars that sit me up slightly straighter, footpegs that are about 3/4" lower and forward, and a saddle that offers more support under the thigh area. Unless I'm running 65-70mph, I currently feel like I'm leaning too far forward, with feet too far rearward, and no saddle support under the thighs. All easily resolved, I think.
I rode my buddy's 2016 T120 a couple of days ago, and it fits me better than the CB. More leg room, footpegs slightly further forward.
Maybe the solution is to sell the CB and 1200 Sport, buy a T120, and throw a few bucks at the R100GS (which is about to happen, anyway.)
Bob
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Maybe the solution is to sell the CB and 1200 Sport, buy a T120, and throw a few bucks at the R100GS (which is about to happen, anyway.)
:thumb:
That sounds like a great solution. The new Triumph Classics are fantastic bikes!
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There are some great I fours out there ........
this is one of them ........the Honda ...not so much .....why ....because they forgot what an inline four is supposed to be ..
https://www.visordown.com/road-tests-first-rides/first-ride-kawasaki-z900rs-review
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:thumb:
That sounds like a great solution. The new Triumph Classics are fantastic bikes!
You're serious when you say you think this sounds like a 'great solution?' Actually, so do I.
Bob
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Bob, I've been following the thread and someone suggested a better seat. Do you have an Airhawk or some other cushion you could try? Perhaps that could help you decide if spending some on a seat would make things the way you want. I'm just thinking experiment with free solutions before spending money.
After that, all I can suggest is to go to dealers and ride things prior to making any decision to lay down your money. Test rides are free after all. Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing the baby Stelvio :wink: but that is a waiting game there.
John Henry
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Bob, I've been following the thread and someone suggested a better seat. Do you have an Airhawk or some other cushion you could try? Perhaps that could help you decide if spending some on a seat would make things the way you want. I'm just thinking experiment with free solutions before spending money.
After that, all I can suggest is to go to dealers and ride things prior to making any decision to lay down your money. Test rides are free after all. Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing the baby Stelvio :wink: but that is a waiting game there.
John Henry
I'm still waiting for the Ippogriffo. :evil: :smiley:
Just the same, Bob.. to me, a bike either does what I want, or endears itself to me in a way that is hard to describe. It doesn't sound to me like the CB does either for you. If it were mine, it would already be gone. <shrug>
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Bob
sounds like the Triumph is the answer - if you are taking votes, that's mine.....
Mark
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There are some great I fours out there ........
this is one of them ........the Honda ...not so much .....why ....because they forgot what an inline four is supposed to be ..
https://www.visordown.com/road-tests-first-rides/first-ride-kawasaki-z900rs-review
Well, it's not supposed to be liquid cooled in my book. Looking at that bike "in the flesh" that radiator is fugly. And the liquid cooled cylinder heads kill the vintage look. IMO. Everyone who reviews talks about the abrupt and snatchy throttle also.
To each their own.
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Bob
sounds like the Triumph is the answer - if you are taking votes, that's mine.....
Mark
Hey, Mark ..... Yeah, it's only money! But before I'd make that move, the 1200 Sport would have to go, along with the Honda. The old Beemer R100GS stays.
Amazingly, some of the suspension changes to the Honda have actually paid off. I am now putting a fair number of miles on the CB, and find it to be a much more pleasant bike than I initially thought. And there's a couple of very inexpensive changes left to do that should make the suspension more compliant.
It (the CB) may not stay in the stable for a long time, but I'm starting to see that with a few additional mods to the suspension recommended by RaceTech, the bike will work better for me. Maybe a new saddle, probably Corbin, and either adjust the current handlebar or try another one.
Several things I can without doubt say is that this bike carries its weight low, is easy for me to get in and out of garage, and up on the center stand. It has nice light controls, and a smooth clutch take up. The fuel injection is dialed in with no snatching when idling through traffic. It lays into turns easily and holds a line with no correction. And the engine pulls like a train. You ride a torque curve that is 60+ ft/lb from 3000 to 7000rpm. CB probably wouldn't have stayed with my departed Griso 8vSE, but I think it'd have no problem staying with or pulling away from my 1200 Sport (2v) or many other 2v Guzzis, whether big block or especially small block. And being fair, I guess it should, with 1140cc. For a guy my age and size, it is an incredibly easy bike to handle.
It's unfortunate that Honda didn't consider the 160 pound rider on our battered Ohio roads when they designed the bike. They hit the mark on so many other things.
Bob
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Bob, as I mentioned the other day, the suspension on your CB1100 is so close to that on my stock T120 so that it is hard to tell them apart that way...but I am 30-35# heavier than you are, so that has some impact. I think the 1100's 4 cylinder is pretty soul-less and very turbine like, the power made by a twin is more to my liking - although I still lust after a ZRX like the one I once had - I scared myself so much with that bike, that I had to sell it to keep my license, I was always over the ton. I digress...I love my T120 but still love my '08 T100, they are both great rides. Not sure a T120 is worth over 2x the price of a good used carb T100 though...just saying.
Tom
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Bob, as I mentioned the other day, the suspension on your CB1100 is so close to that on my stock T120 so that it is hard to tell them apart that way...but I am 30-35# heavier than you are, so that has some impact. I think the 1100's 4 cylinder is pretty soul-less and very turbine like, the power made by a twin is more to my liking - although I still lust after a ZRX like the one I once had - I scared myself so much with that bike, that I had to sell it to keep my license, I was always over the ton. I digress...I love my T120 but still love my '08 T100, they are both great rides. Not sure a T120 is worth over 2x the price of a good used carb T100 though...just saying.
Tom
You make several good points, Tom. Not sure I want to return to a T100, even though mine treated me well for over 6 years and almost 50k miles.
As you and I have discussed, I'm going to throw some $$ toward the 1991 R100GS. It's not the most exciting bike in the world, but there was always that something ................... ... this bike simply called me to load it with tent, sleeping bag, air mattress, and head out for several days.
However, I have to say, your T120 is one nice bike! But before I'd do one, I'd have to sell the 1200 Sport and the Honda. I'm going to take it on the head when I sell the Guzzi, I'm sure! The Honda, probably not so much.
Bob
PS - strangely, after putting a bunch of miles on the CB1100, the inline four doesn't seem so soulless to me as simply different. It is turbine smooth, but damn, does it haul ass! Not sportbike world haul a**, but Guzzi world haul a**!
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You're serious when you say you think this sounds like a 'great solution?' Actually, so do I.
Bob
Yep, I'm serious!