Wildguzzi.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Perazzimx14 on December 31, 2018, 03:16:26 PM
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So I have a lead on what I am being told is a 1984 R100. What I could see of it the left side, its mostly there but dirty crusty and rusty. Tailight is broken off and I'm sure many other things. I'm told it runs but w/o hearing it roar to life its a non runner.
Are parts remotly avalaible?
Asking $1,000 I counter offerd $475 he came back with $500 even??
What say you?
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I haven’t had any problems getting the basic stuff for my ‘84. It’s in nice shape, 33,000 miles. I thought $4400 was fair when I bought it last year. It’s a last edition RS with nice fairing, which probably raised the price.
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Just got off the phone with a buddy and his thoughts are its $500 worst case is part it out.
I told the seller I'd like to see the entire bike and if it right side looks the same or better as the left I'm in a $500 :thumb:
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We will need more info . Is it an R100R , S, RT , CS ? Clear title , all there , are the snowflake wheels in good shape ? If he is already willing to come down to $500.00 , offer him $487.50 :grin: Oh , parts will be no problem , unless it needs a fuel tank , those things are not cheap . That will be a last edition R100 , still fairly high compression , big carbs , etc . In good fettle it will run all day long a 90 MPH 2 up loaded with gear .
Dusty
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We will need more info . Is it an R100R , S, RT , CS ? Clear title , all there , are the snowflake wheels in good shape ? If he is already willing to come down to $500.00 , offer him $487.50 :grin: Oh , parts will be no problem , unless it needs a fuel tank , those things are not cheap . That will be a last edition R100 , still fairly high compression , big carbs , etc . In good fettle it will run all day long a 90 MPH 2 up loaded with gear .
Dusty
Side panel had R100 that's all I could see. Looking at pics on the internet I'm guessing a CS?? Rear wheel looked to be in good shape couldn't see the front. What I could see it all look there but tomorrow will be the tell tale when its coaxed from it current resting place.
It is supposed to have a title signed by the previous owner along with a photo copy of the previous owners drivers license. Not ideal but enough to work with.
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Side panel had R100 that's all I could see. Looking at pics on the internet I'm guessing a CS?? Rear wheel looked to be in good shape couldn't see the front. What I could see it all look there but tomorrow will be the tell tale when its coaxed from it current resting place.
It is supposed to have a title signed by the previous owner along with a photo copy of the previous owners drivers license. Not ideal but enough to work with.
If it has a drum rear brake it is a CS .
Dusty
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If it has a drum rear brake it is a CS .
Dusty
Out of the entire bike I could maybe see 30% of it. The right side was not visable so I couldn't see if it was drum or disc. Honestly didn;t pay that much attention to it. What I did see was something that was reminisant of my Eldo when I 1st layed eyes on it. A dirty crustly old bike relagated to an out building.
No matter it'll give me $500 worth of entertainment over the winter just fiddeling with it.
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Out of the entire bike I could maybe see 30% of it. The right side was not visable so I couldn't see if it was drum or disc. Honestly didn;t pay that much attention to it. What I did see was something that was reminisant of my Eldo when I 1st layed eyes on it. A dirty crustly old bike relagated to an out building.
No matter it'll give me $500 worth of entertainment over the winter just fiddeling with it.
Yes , it will . Looking forward to more on this .
Dusty
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If it has a drum rear brake it is a CS .
Dusty
Well, not necessarily, this is an '83 R100, just a straight R 100, not a CS although it looks a great deal Like one, rear cowl and all that.
If that thing IS a CS, buy it. Yes, worth the 500 bux for the entertainment if nothing else..
Best,
Rob
(https://imageshack.com/a/img923/3156/IQC2o7.jpg)
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^^^You are of course correct Rob , gonna blame a bad memory for that :laugh:
See your's has a Brown's stand :thumb:
Dusty
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What would you say is the best years for the R100 motors. Does it follow the usual "purchase the latest" which in the Airheads case would be 1995?
I always keep an eye out for an RT and see one in my future.
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What would you say is the best years for the R100 motors. Does it follow the usual "purchase the latest" which in the Airheads case would be 1995?
I always keep an eye out for an RT and see one in my future.
It depends , the '80-'84 1,000 CC engines made a bit more power than the second gen '88-'95 motors , some say the later bikes handled a bit better.
Dusty
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As Dusty mentioned, the pre 1988 engines came with 40mm Bings, and I think the exhaust ports may have been 40mm also. I think some of the non-US bikes may have continued with the 40mm intake and exhaust ports, (Dusty?) Factory hp ratings on some of the older R100RS bikes was in the mid to high 60hp range. By comparison, the factory rated my 1991 GS at 58hp.
Bob
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Let us know how the meeting turns out. An 83 R100 is a good one to bring back - they've got nikasil cylinders, 40mm bings, decent brakes, light flywheel, stronger and lighter acting clutch, plus they handle well.
Also, unlike Moto Guzzi and the V7S, when they hit a home run with the 90S, they continued that bodywork for ten more years and bits of it for a long time later.
For five bills it's hard to go wrong. The wheels and tank, if decent are worth that.
Parts? Unlike Guzzis, parts are everywhere - used and new. Guzzi parts are available, but not in the amount available used for airheads.
Yes, the 85-95 bikes handle a bit better, but the engines got strangled from about 77 or 78 and power started dropping along with fuel efficiency. Cam timing got changed, compression went down, jetting got weird (similar to what happened with the Guzzis), but in 1981 a lot of changes were made - that's when they converted to Brembos, lightened the flywheel, beefed up the clutch, changed the shifting mechanism - stuff like that.
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Actually an early 1,000 CC engine , '79-'84s were as potent as the earlier 900's , the R90S was the exception with the Dellorto carbs , but from personal experience an early R100 will run right with the R90S . Don't get too bogged down in the small differences performance wise in the early large displacement airheads , final drive ratios have more to do with how much *sparkle* those bikes had than what the engine specs were .
Oh , Bob , seem to remember that the Euro models from '88 on were the same as US spec engines , although the transmission and final drive ratios were sometimes different . (Don't make any bar bets on my memory :laugh:)
Dusty
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As Dusty mentioned, the pre 1988 engines came with 40mm Bings, and I think the exhaust ports may have been 40mm also. I think some of the non-US bikes may have continued with the 40mm intake and exhaust ports, (Dusty?) Factory hp ratings on some of the older R100RS bikes was in the mid to high 60hp range. By comparison, the factory rated my 1991 GS at 58hp.
Bob
The only US airheads to get 40 mm exhausts and sport cams were the '77 sports and police bikes.
All the 83s had 38mm exhausts. CR was less than 9:1. Head design changed from the classic hemi with flat squish bands like the Guzzis to slanted squish bands. Even with the lower compression they pinged like crazy.
I dual plugged and shaved the head on my '83. That helped reduce pinging. Then bored the exhaust ports for 40 mm pipes and installed the sport cam. The eliminated all the pinging and got 62 RWHP on a dyno. That same day an identical but stock '83 only got 47 RWHP.
Pete
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The only US airheads to get 40 mm exhausts and sport cams were the '77 sports and police bikes.
All the 83s had 38mm exhausts. CR was less than 9:1. Head design changed from the classic hemi with flat squish bands like the Guzzis to slanted squish bands. Even with the lower compression they pinged like crazy.
I dual plugged and shaved the head on my '83. That helped reduce pinging. Then bored the exhaust ports for 40 mm pipes and installed the sport cam. The eliminated all the pinging and got 62 RWHP on a dyno. That same day an identical but stock '83 only got 47 RWHP.
Pete
No snark intended , but neither of my 1,000's ever pinged , even under heavy load , Neither did either of my /5's . Sounds like something was wrong with your airhead .
Dusty
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We will need more info . Is it an R100R , S, RT , CS ? Clear title , all there , are the snowflake wheels in good shape ? If he is already willing to come down to $500.00 , offer him $487.50 :grin:
Give me the contract info, I'll give him $512.50. :evil:
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^^^Troublemaker :laugh:
Dusty
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^^^Troublemaker :laugh:
Dusty
:angel:
I'm just a bit envious that I can't find deals like that. Seriously, a running complete '84 (or '83) R100, or ANY airhead for that matter is a good deal at $1,000.
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:angel:
I'm just a bit envious that I can't find deals like that. Seriously, a running complete '84 (or '83) R100, or ANY airhead for that matter is a good deal at $1,000.
We haven't seen any pictures yet , it could have bent forks , a bashed in fuel tank , a cylinder torn away from the crankcase , broken fenders , no headlight , cooties , the heebie jeebies , and what an old airhead guru from years ago referred to as *poorly planned owner modifications* :shocked:
Dusty
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We haven't seen any pictures yet , it could have bent forks , a bashed in fuel tank , a cylinder torn away from the crankcase , broken fenders , no headlight , cooties , the heebie jeebies , and what an old airhead guru from years ago referred to as *poorly planned owner modifications* :shocked:
Dusty
Good point.
I'm waiting for the notice of what day he's taking it to the dump, because he can't get his price for it. :evil: :kiss:
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Good point.
I'm waiting for the notice of what day he's taking it to the dump, because he can't get his price for it. :evil: :kiss:
No more notices. Now I just throw stuff away. So much less drama!
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If I recall correctly early 80's R100's cupped/ate valves due to fuel changing issue. The airhead club offers a LOT of info.
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:popcorn: I have about any part u need---rt fairing saddle bags probably even find ol skin from burns +big hunks of knuckle tissue,as always Fubar will give you a good shellacking, no thats waxing no that isn't right either----howes about u just buy me a beer at Cedar Vail :boozing:
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If I recall correctly early 80's R100's cupped/ate valves due to fuel changing issue. The airhead club offers a LOT of info.
One of mine swallowed a valve at 100,000 miles , and one of my /5's broke a valve at about 150K , so yeah , they will , but usually not until serious mileage . Of course both of those bikes lived at 5,500 RPM's , or more . I was in a hurry to get places :laugh:
Dusty
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Lots of good Airhead technical info, tips, etc here:
http://bmwmotorcycletech.info/technical-articles-list.htm (http://bmwmotorcycletech.info/technical-articles-list.htm)
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^^^You are of course correct Rob , gonna blame a bad memory for that :laugh:
See your's has a Brown's stand :thumb:
Dusty
Unfortunatly Dusty, this is not mine... yet. I too had hoped that is would end up being a CS...!
I service this R100 for a friend eevery other year or so, have several times. This past Spring I offered to Jeff to just leave it and I would pay him the difference on the service bill, he thought about it but finally declined. Hopefully he will relent one of these days and it can stay here.
Yes, I installed the Brown's stand a few years ago, just a sweet R100, a bit tatty but runs great, handles well. Neat rig.
Rob___
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(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/49101835_10156824318184705_3579652557414334464_n.jpg?_nc_cat=103&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&oh=d4bd03111c9da7b402872ef2fe2aaf4f&oe=5CD2DE98)
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/48387033_10156824326324705_945434391906091008_n.jpg?_nc_cat=100&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&oh=04c6d18b64b2b663b9b8da34d5350191&oe=5C9100E0)
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What would you say is the best years for the R100 motors. Does it follow the usual "purchase the latest" which in the Airheads case would be 1995?
I always keep an eye out for an RT and see one in my future.
The early 80's were just perfect in my estimation. That did not stop me from buying this '91 RT a year or so back... Has all cases as well.
(https://imageshack.com/a/img921/8306/loDHLI.jpg)
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The main thing to remember is to tip it to the right before parking on the side stand. At least true for older models.
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81-84 had the valve recession problems. The valve seats were changed anticipating trouble with unleaded, but it was a poor move and the seats didn't flow heat very well. The exhaust valves would over-heat and tulip. A work-around was larger valve settings allowing the valve to rest on the seat longer transferring more heat.
They're still rideable with that going on, you just need to check rocker clearance more often. If the gap closes down to nothing, they're difficult to start and it's obvious - pull the rocker cover and adjust. It's not like the bike is down till the work is done.
That's a pretty one radguzzi.
After 1984, all of the engines were variations of the 800. Same cylinder heads and carbs. I think all of the cams were the same before that. The heads were changed in 85 and are supposed to flow much better than the earlier ones, but power was down with the lower compression.
I totally agree - $500 for just a parts bike is an incredible deal these days.
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I am new to this form just have bought a 1994 California 1100 carburated, I have been riding airheads since the 70’s an r75/5. Currently own 2 r100rt’s, an 81 and an 88. I concider the California an airhead so I am not out of my element.
The Machine you are looking at is worth more than 500 dollars even if it doesn’t run. It would not take much to make it run smoothly again, a lot of maintence very little parts if any, It would be in my garage already if it were near me.
Don’t let the valve recession scare you , as long as you have adjustment in the rockers you will be ok, when time comes you can fix this if done properly. To many people think they know how to recut the heads and put in the valve seats and valves and end up with a bad job, you need to find some one who is qualified to do this and there are only a few in the country that can do it right in my opinion.
It sounds like this bike has some good bones and would be worth while to buy, the secret to these machines is to do your own wrenching when all possible. Dealship labor is very expensive on these bikes for what they do.
If you buy this bike you need to join airheads.org, a group dedicated to these bikes, good luck.
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One more thing, I would guess that 95% parts of this bike can be purchased at a bmw dealer, 100 % of the important ones , things like gauges, and body parts are na. But they are out there used and no problem to find. Most guys I know including myself keep these bikes running with good used parts at a fraction of the cost of new.
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The sellers and my schedules didn't line up today so I didn't get the bring the BMW home today. Postponed until later in the week.
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The sellers and my schedules didn't line up today so I didn't get the bring the BMW home today. Postponed until later in the week.
I'll buy it if you change your mind.
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I'll buy it if you change your mind.
I'm still buying it just waiting to hear back from the seller what day works for me to P/U.
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Can I ask why?
If you don't there's a good possibility it'll smoke on start up. There's a lot of oil splashing around in there while the engine's running. Turn it off and it settles behind the pistons and in the bores. The right side will be tilted up, so it'll drain. But the left side being tilted down will see the oil pooled against the piston. Since rings don't seal perfectly, the hot oil, being thin, can wiggle its way into the combustion chamber.
So either tilt the bike to the right for a minute or two, or park on the center stand.
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If you don't there's a good possibility it'll smoke on start up. There's a lot of oil splashing around in there while the engine's running. Turn it off and it settles behind the pistons and in the bores. The right side will be tilted up, so it'll drain. But the left side being tilted down will see the oil pooled against the piston. Since rings don't seal perfectly, the hot oil, being thin, can wiggle its way into the combustion chamber.
So either tilt the bike to the right for a minute or two, or park on the center stand.
Tilting the bike to the right will only ruin your back and possibly dump oil into the right cylinder if you can tilt it as far as the right kickstand leans them. You are right about putting on the center stand, the airheads pre 85 were not ment to spend much time on it side stand, so aftermarket side stands were made to allow the bike to sit more upright. Both of mine have brown side stands. I also do not run the bike full of oil ,only in the running range and both bikes are happy with that and I have very little smoke after setting for days coming out of the right cylinder at start up.
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I ment left cylinder
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I ment left cylinder
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I ment left cylinder
I ment left cylinder
OK man , we heard you the first time :grin:
Dusty
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Yes, just lean it against your right leg for a few seconds should do it, doesn't take much unless you want to make sure when it will be setting for a while. And as said above, optimum oil level is half way between full and add. I have a 1958 R69 and an R75/5.
For final sync of the carbs I leave the left cable adjustment lock nut loose and go out riding. Stop, twitch the screw a little, take off. Repeat until as smooth as possible when accelerating and at speed. Then tighten the locknut.
Of my 6 motorcycles. my EV is my new favorite, even over my all time ultra favorite R69.
Don
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Well I'm supposed to pick up the R100 Saturday morning. I'll fiddle with it a little to see if it runs or wants to run on Saturday. The it'll be a late winter project as I have some other motorcycle maintenance I want to get caught up on my everyday whip :thumb:
Stay tuned
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Well I'm supposed to pick up the R100 Saturday morning. I'll fiddle with it a little to see if it runs or wants to run on Saturday. The it'll be a late winter project as I have some other motorcycle maintenance I want to get caught up on my everyday whip :thumb:
Stay tuned
As with high mileage Guzzis, these older BMW flat twins have their own unique issues. I recently had a very good BMW technician who now works as an independent shop do a bunch of work on my 1991 R100GS. I was at $1100.00 in replacement parts before the driveshaft was pulled, and found to be shot. Add $700.00 to the parts list.
Now, to be fair, some of the replaced parts may not have been totally shot. But a carb rebuild was in order, and the tranny was dismantled, all shaft bearings replaced, along with shift mechanism wear items. Petcocks were 27 years old, one weeped fuel, so both these were replaced. Clutch plate and diaphragm springs also replaced. Amazingly, the pressure plate still had some of the machining marks on it. I do treat these single plate clutches with some respect.
Guess the point of what I'm saying is ....... just like Guzzis, old airheads have a lot of parts that need replacement periodically. Be prepared to shell out some cash to get this old gal in shape, especially if you're going to farm out the labor.
Happy New Year!
Bob
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Guess the point of what I'm saying is ....... just like Guzzis, old airheads have a lot of parts that need replacement periodically. Be prepared to shell out some cash to get this old gal in shape, especially if you're going to farm out the labor.
But, also like old Guzzis, after this is all done, it'll go another 150k miles.
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my 1958 R69 has 64,000 on it, I put on everything over 14k since 1977. I replaced the clutch a couple years ago. The rivets gave way. That's it for mechanical failures. It still cruises at 70mph on the 4 lane.
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But, also like old Guzzis, after this is all done, it'll go another 150k miles.
I'm hoping! Well, as I approach my 76th birthday in January of 2019, the question of my R100GS making it for another 150,000 miles (with me doing the riding,) is purely academic! Or pure fiction! It took me from 1991 to 2018 to put the first 156,000 miles on the old gal. Not sure I'm up to doing this again.
Bob
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Sure you are!
A lot of times these bikes can be wakened from a long slumber with very little work. Usually, the carbs need cleaning and a few jet o-rings replaced. Jets don't need replacing - maybe the needle and needle jet if they're worn. I've rarely replaced the diaphragms and don't recall the last time. So rebuilding carbs (at great expense) isn't usually necessary. But cleaning, yes.
Transmissions can fail, no different than any other car or bike. Rather than pulling it and opening it up to see what sort of shape it's in, just ride it. If it's noisy, pops out of gear, shows slivers and chunks in the drained oil, well, yeah - tear into it.
Sometimes the petcocks leak. They're easy to disassemble. Water settles to the lowest spot in the tank which will be the petcock. The flow is stopped by the selector disc that's part of the handle. So what happens is the water pits the aluminum disc which then doesn't seal off the flow anymore. The solution is to carefully file away the pitting and polish it up. That usually solves it. I've found this to be true of Guzzi petcocks as well.
The other issue with older bikes whether they've been sitting or not is electrical connections. Those two things, electrical connections and carb cleaning are the two main things that usually need attention. Seals my leak and need replacing, or maybe not. When the shaft dries out (oil has completely left) the seal can chatter on first start up. It's possible the spring can fly off and then for sure it will leak. So the solution preventing that possibility is turning the engine and trans over by hand getting oil pumping or splashing everywhere needed. And once the engine is first started, keeping RPMs low. Run it through the gears while on the center stand.
Some guys go in and replace everything that's not absolutely perfect. That's one way of doing it, but I prefer replacing only what's needed.
I've got an 85 LM parked in 91. What I just mentioned was what it took to get it running again. I've gotten many airheads running this same way since 1990. About 1995 I got what I figured was a parts bike (1974 R90) because it looked awful (sitting under a tarp for about three years, then another two after the tarp disintegrated) but going through this procedure brought it back to my surprise. I did have to replace just about every seal after I started riding it. It goes that way sometimes.
So don't get the idea you'll have to rebuild the carbs ($200 in parts) or a transmission for a grand. I hear this all the time - needing to rebuilding carbs. Jet's don't wear out - it's only the needle and needle jet. Even diaphragms last a long time, and even when they fail, it's not a disaster. The bike will run, just not the best. So it's a pet peeve of mine rebuilding carbs, when a good cleaning will do the trick.
Post some pix of the bike when you get it home.
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As with high mileage Guzzis, these older BMW flat twins have their own unique issues. I recently had a very good BMW technician who now works as an independent shop do a bunch of work on my 1991 R100GS. I was at $1100.00 in replacement parts before the driveshaft was pulled, and found to be shot. Add $700.00 to the parts list.
Now, to be fair, some of the replaced parts may not have been totally shot. But a carb rebuild was in order, and the tranny was dismantled, all shaft bearings replaced, along with shift mechanism wear items. Petcocks were 27 years old, one weeped fuel, so both these were replaced. Clutch plate and diaphragm springs also replaced. Amazingly, the pressure plate still had some of the machining marks on it. I do treat these single plate clutches with some respect.
Guess the point of what I'm saying is ....... just like Guzzis, old airheads have a lot of parts that need replacement periodically. Be prepared to shell out some cash to get this old gal in shape, especially if you're going to farm out the labor.
Happy New Year!
Bob
Having been there done that. I won't let it become the money suck the Eldo, 850T or the T3 were. I'm going in guarded on this potential revival. I have budget in mind and although its not thousands of dollars its a decent amount. I'm also only worried about the mechanics of the bike and not the aesthetics. If I can make it a reliable runner I really don't mind if its a frankenbike or crusty.
Once I get the bike home I can more thoroughly access the bike and if the budget is enough to make it a reasonably reliable rider. If it is I'll place my orders and get to work. If not.......well I cross that bridge when I come to it.
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Best of luck in bringing this Fraulein back to life! There's plenty of on-line expertise and a bundle of parts available for these old airheads. Combine that with your love of resurrecting older bikes, I'm sure you'll be riding the Beemer this spring/summer.
I rode my '91 GS out West in 2005 and again in 2009. Took the 1200 Sport in 2011. Thinking I'd like to get in another R100GS ride to Utah this summer, and am trying to make the old gal as dependable as possible. Therefore the reason for many of the new parts.
Bob
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Got a text from the seller today saying the bike is sold :shocked:.
I text back if it fall through I have cash waiting and am free Saturday morning.
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Bummer. Wasn't me. :wink:
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Got a text from the seller today saying the bike is sold :shocked:.
I text back if it fall through I have cash waiting and am free Saturday morning.
I've learned over the years, when you find a good deal, you need to complete the deal ASAP, if not, they often fall through.
And, for the record, it wasn't me either.
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Late 80's-early 90's were the best R1000's made. 95's were junk, many had vibes cause molds were past due to be replaced. That's why they quit making them then brought them back.
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I've learned over the years, when you find a good deal, you need to complete the deal ASAP, if not, they often fall through.
And, for the record, it wasn't me either.
I tried but we had conflicting work schedules during the week. While I'd have liked to have gotten the BMW this might be the incentive I needed to start working on the 850T again. Its a lot further along (especially financially) than the BMW would have been.
I'm also on the lookout for a 850T frame, swingarm and triples in good condition and cheap.
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Late 80's-early 90's were the best R1000's made. 95's were junk, many had vibes cause molds were past due to be replaced. That's why they quit making them then brought them back.
I'm not on the hunt for a BMW especially an older one. This just presented itself and for the money was worth a shot. If I was truly looking for another project It'd be another 70's era Guzzi.
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I tried but we had conflicting work schedules during the week. While I'd have liked to have gotten the BMW this might be the incentive I needed to start working on the 850T again. Its a lot further along (especially financially) than the BMW would have been.
I'm also on the lookout for a 850T frame, swingarm and triples in good condition and cheap.
I might have some triples for you. Cheap. Off of the frame in the foreground.
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/37551898_1629844267137698_2324251350713499648_o.jpg?_nc_cat=101&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&oh=6b421d0d71443bdde0f9a915e131f212&oe=5C8F060A)
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I tried but we had conflicting work schedules during the week. While I'd have liked to have gotten the BMW this might be the incentive I needed to start working on the 850T again. Its a lot further along (especially financially) than the BMW would have been.
I'm also on the lookout for a 850T frame, swingarm and triples in good condition and cheap.
At least your 850T is a known quantity to you know.
What's wrong with the frame, swing arm and triples?
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At least your 850T is a known quantity to you know.
What's wrong with the frame, swing arm and triples?
Fortunately nothing is wrong with the T other than cosmetics.
Frame, swing arm and triples are for another project.
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I've learned over the years, when you find a good deal, you need to complete the deal ASAP, if not, they often fall through.
And, for the record, it wasn't me either.
And be careful about how much info you put out here. There are a few snakes in the grass...
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Fortunately nothing is wrong with the T other than cosmetics.
Frame, swing arm and triples are for another project.
I see. Do tell?
Start a project thread?