Author Topic: Guzzi VS old Brit bike  (Read 17962 times)

Online Rough Edge racing

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Re: Guzzi VS old Brit bike
« Reply #90 on: March 08, 2015, 06:45:08 AM »
 So we're all on the same page. The differences may be subtle to guys not familiar with this junk. First photo is a 60's Triumph with a "dry" frame, or pipe and brazed lug.. Organic beauty like a woman..

  


  This photo is a 73 -83 OIF or oil bearing frame....Not bad still some curves left...

    
      

  This is the 71-72 first edition OIF....not as organic...

  
  
« Last Edit: March 08, 2015, 06:46:08 AM by Rough Edge racing »
I ride junk, some of it actually goes fast

Online oldbike54

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Re: Guzzi VS old Brit bike
« Reply #91 on: March 08, 2015, 08:20:33 AM »
 Oh my , that '69 model is really nice . Maybe if BSA had just kept using the Burgess style mufflers and organic looking side covers , tail light , and gauges ... Oh well , all history now , at least the Bloor bikes are a success .

  Dusty
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Offline luthier

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Re: Guzzi VS old Brit bike
« Reply #92 on: March 08, 2015, 09:04:07 AM »
Back in 1972 I had a fully race tuned Norton 650SS with the whole deal, clipons rear sets Manx style tank , full fairing, central oil tank, lots of weight removed, Grimeca front brake, the business. This thing clocked 132mph at Bathurst a year before I bought it. Owned by a bike fanatic Barrister , it had lots of money splashed upon it. He reckoned the motor was standard apart from a slightly warmer cam.  The fastest I ever took it up to was 120mph but I was often over the ton, all round the city, one of the ultimate cafe racers. But as the bloke who had owned it warned me, it didn't like sustained high speed at constant revs. He had fitted an oil cooler because it had seized on him a few times on the track. I took it for one long ride and regretted it. I sat on about 80mph for about 4 hours and it seized on me. I was quick with the clutch as he had always been so no further damage was done. But it wasn't any good for going on trips. Vibration was not an issue, as while you were bringing that engine through it's range the excitement was enough to cause no interest in such things as vibration. It just went like stink.
I believe that in this day and age, I would have had the pistons slightly reduced in size and this would have overcome that old seizing thing. Maybe.
I have since owned an Atlas, renowned for the big vibes, but mine with a Mikuni was an easy starter and a lovely backwoods bike.
Still I seized it too, though it had the reduced pistons in the big rebuild, and the reason was the timing could not be done correctly.
Though I took the magneto to the expert, the cam that the points ran from was very badly made so that when one side was correctly timed the other side was 8 degrees wrong and advanced. This way meant it got too hot. The day it seized for the second time was the day I resolved to sell it. My wife and I just wanted to go places on a bike. Maybe we should have persevered and fitted electonic ignition, but we didn't.
So we sold it and bought a Cali 3 which got us around for about 60,000k's till finally that was sold and now I have the T3.
This T3 is one of the smoothest most beautiful, well the most beautiful bike I've ridden. It has more power than anything else I've ever ridden, way more than the 650, though who can say from such a distance. Still there has to be more grunt from  950 with a warm cam than a 650 with a warm cam , at least it feels that way, but I'm not here to test the limits now, I'm 62 but I was 19 with that 650 Norton so these days things just don't happen so fast.
Back in the day I had a Triumph 56 Tbird which was a lumbering piece of shite, but it revved well and being a half share with a mate  who also disrespected it, we had a running competition to see who could blow it up first. But neither of us managed that, so it wasn't too bad for reliability.
I also had a 500 Daytona that I thought was total crap. Didn't do anything that I expected a bike to do. Didn't handle.  Riding on the highway you had to pull over all the time to check it hadn't shat itself because of the truly horrible tappet noise that was emitted by the alloy engine. Piece of crap.
I am surprised by the sweetness of my T3 compared to the Cali though, I'd say there is a considerable difference, both in horsepower and handling. The T3 has Marzochi forks and feels totally stable compared to the old Bitubos on the Cali.
The engines are probably the exact same size and the cams are supposedly both B10's but for some strange reason the T3 is a vastly superior motor. I'd say whoever built it did the real balancing job on it. It has been raced as evidenced by all the drillings of all the nuts and bolts everywhere and I'm told she keeps up with the Jap crowd, but not with me as the pilot. Anyway, a well sorted Guzzi in my humble opinion, is lightyears better than a well sorted Brit bike, nice as they may be.

Offline guzzista

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Re: Guzzi VS old Brit bike
« Reply #93 on: March 08, 2015, 02:59:51 PM »
So we're all on the same page. The differences may be subtle to guys not familiar with this junk. First photo is a 60's Triumph with a "dry" frame, or pipe and brazed lug.. Organic beauty like a woman..

   


 
The pre OIF T120, are absolutely poetry on wheels, let alone a fine ride to boot. As long as the apples and oranges  are kept in their respective areas, threads like  can share folks personal experiences, enthusiasm, and appreciation for some truly great motorbikes of the latter 20th Century. OTOH , when it comes to better versus worse, not only this :beat_horse comes to mind, but it seems like a no brainer that some Guzzi guys would naturally Guzzis are best etc, etc, whereas the OP was just sharing with the group  his ( fantastic , IMHO) build. Thankfully the pics and the actual riders experiences  made up  for the excess stuff
 
1975 750S Tribute bike, 1994 Cali 1100, 2007 Ducati GT1000, 1983 SP1000

Offline Guido Valvole

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Re: Guzzi VS old Brit bike
« Reply #94 on: March 08, 2015, 11:15:39 PM »
Apples and oranges but what the h… I spent time yesterday practicing starting the B40 (1963 BSA 350cc single, Electrex electronic magneto system so no battery, 12v) and a short ride. Lotsa low- and mid-range torque, ~300 pounds wet, SS90 tune so baby desert sled that needs to be revved and is a hooligan hoot. Glad to have the stock sit-up high-drag riding position and two mostly-worthless drum brakes as with a modern chassis and brakes I could easily get in serious trouble. Well, at least up to 55 or 60 mph. "Vibration" is more foot massage than anything bad, no seeing double here. 60 mpg around town, 70 with more 4th gear use. Suck my unburned hydrocarbons Prius drivers!  ~;

Then on to the V50. Felt like a big heavy modern bike. Well, it is, in comparison. lol. Smooth (and smoother than the Monza/V50 III, must be the tiny carbs and resultant mousepower). Much better suspension, don't even think about brakes -- de-linked with Goodridge stainless lines so fronts are awesome and rear is almost worthless. The next generation… but not *too* modern to have all the character removed.

As far as oil leaks and doggy electrics, if the Italians had sold more they could have been a major oil producer. There was nothing in the North Sea oil fields before Notruns, Triumphs, BSAs, Jaguars, and etc etc  :BEER:

All good fun but metric tools sure are easier to find than Whitworth.
cr
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***Wildguzzi Official Logo High Quality 5 Color Window Decals Back In Stock***
Shipping in USA Only. Awesome quality. Back by popular demand. All proceeds go back into the forum.
http://www.wildguzzi.com/Products/products.htm
Advertise Here