Why aren't we seeing something similar to this with a Guzzi badge?

[pete roper]

See? Piaggio are quite capable of designing and bringing to market stunning motorbikes.



Although that is a prototype the platform is being launched at the Milan show I believe.

So why can't Guzzi get some of the action instead of just another iteration of its creaking smallblock platform?

Pete

[Knuckle Dragger]

What are you suggesting Pete?  A badge-engineered Guzzi on an Aprilia platform?  Such as perhaps KTM are doing with their own Husqvarna/KTM variants?

Whilst the 'Prillers are good bikes, for me personally they fall a bit short of greatness.  Maybe the new 550/600 twins made from the front half of the V4 might actually break the mould.  Maybe not.

I have an '08 RSV twin myself, but find it impossibly 'sporty' to ride these days.  It's just too small, too cramped, too "superbike" for my ageing bones.  It's a fabulous engine, now long since discontinued from the range, but maybe you're right.  A mid-sized, sporty, liquid cooled Guzzi with the technological & emissions control as the new millennium demands, but with wider bars & hopefully a somewhat less racy posture than Aprilia currently offers.

Something to appeal to a younger generation of riders perhaps?  I can certainly see some merit in this.  My current fave bike is the old BMW/Husky Nuda, which offers me an ideal combination of sprightly, sporting performance in a lightweight but much less extreme chassis package.  Whilst its looks are polarising (to say the least), it had the cred AND the goods that should've spawned a whole new generation of lightweight sporting Italian bikes.

[pete roper]

That pictured above is the Tuono version of the RS660. No way in the world could I ride an RS anything nowadays but a Tuono version would be fantastic! There is also talk of the same powerplant maybe being used in a 'middleweight' ADV platform which would be direct competition for the V85 and really a non contest.

Pete

[fossil]

Why should Piaggio mingle the brands? They build classic scooters (Vespa), modern scooters (Piaggio), the same applies to bikes. Classic (Moto Guzzi), modern (Aprilia). I don´t buy the brand, I buy the bike. I like classic (but more "sporty" than a Sportster), so I bought the V7 Stone. If I like a not-to-big modern bike from Piaggio, I would take a look on the Shiver. It is the same dealer for me, about 6 minutes away with the bike.

I would of course tolerate a liquid-cooled more modern engine from Guzzi, if it is looking as tasty as the engine of a Scout. It may even have an ohc, but it must not (the great engine of the CX 500 did not have one). But it must remain classic in style - otherwise I would not consider it.

[pete roper]

'Classic in style' is one of the things that shits me the most. Who wants to ride a fossil.....Oh, hang on.....

[Knuckle Dragger]

Guzzi made their reputation building modern, innovative, sporty bikes.  Bikes that had a reputation for quality, speed, reliability and racing prowess.

But that was 50+ years ago.  Why can't they still do it now?  Why be stuck inside a half-century old straightjacketed time warp?

[Aaron D.]

Piaggio sales are well up based on Vespa and Guzzi sales. Aprilia not so much.

[SIR REAL ED]

Moto Guzzi is handcuffed by the same marketing/R&D/customer restraints as Harley Davidson.  Both are defined by more than just being a motorcycle.  Both sets of buyers are buying more than a vehicle, they are buying into a brotherhood/sisterhood, tradition, etc.

I once bought a DR 650 from a guy that also owned a Sportster.  He said the DR was a better bike by any measure one could come up with.  When I asked why he was selling the DR rather than the Sportster, the answer was obvious, "Cause it's not a Harley!"

I remember telling that to a friend, and adding "That's why I'll never own a Harley.  Cause I want a motorcycle not a religion."

Er, uh, wait, isn't a Nevada a red Italian Harley.....

[fossil]

Why not? Harley still lives not bad with that receipt. And the most Triumph bikes sells are the classics.

And why a classic? Because the broken lines of most modern bikes hurt my eyes. V85TT marks the border for me.

Let´s ask the question the other way: Why should I buy something from Guzzi that I can already get from Aprilia, Ducati, BMW, Honda, Yamaha, Triumph, Kawasaki, Suzuki ... in one or the other form? And then: Where can I get a Guzzi, small, reliable, classic, beautiful, and by far fast enough for our back roads in the Lüneburger heather? And for commuting to work each day?

[Kev m]

Why not? Harley still lives not bad with that receipt. And the most Triumph bikes sells are the classics.

And why a classic? Because the broken lines of most modern bikes hurt my eyes. V85TT marks the border for me.

And don't forget the fastest growing world wide brand RE.

Frankly Pete there's not a thing about that bike you pictured that I care about/like.

I don't see why Guzzi needs that in their brand. Not when they're part of a brand that offers it elsewhere.

[Frenchfrog]

Yeah...it's all about marketing and the image Piaggio have decided that they want for Guzzi and Aprillia.Different owners of the name would perhaps have a different perception of what Guzzi represents ...at least the brand is still present and spares are still available.There is a very big brick wall looming though...alternativ e power.

[SIR REAL ED]

If anyone wants a modernized Moto Guzzi, there are still early 1980's Honda CX 500's and CX 650's naked models for sale out there.  For touring, Honda made both into "Silver Wings."

In the last year I have seen two pristine models.

[Frenchfrog]

That was 40 years ago !!

[fotoguzzi]

If anyone wants a modernized Moto Guzzi, there are still early 1980's Honda CX 500's and CX 650's naked models for sale out there.  For touring, Honda made both into "Silver Wings."

In the last year I have seen two pristine models.

umm; that's not modern and other than a driveshaft is nothing like a Guzzi.

[blackcat]

I understand the classic description of Guzzi, but why not expand the line with another engine?

[wirespokes]

It's simple, actually. Guzzi isn't run by the same group it started out with. The same values don't apply anymore.

Take a look at Chrysler. They bought and absorbed numerous brands over the years - Dodge and Plymouth to name a few. Ford and Chevy did the same. New owners did what they wanted.

It's nice the Guzzi factory is still where it always was and still building bikes similar to those the original company designed and built before expiring. But the current owner is the one calling the shots. It's up to Aprilia what happens with Guzzi these days. If it doesn't fit into their scheme, then it won't happen. Hopefully it won't be dropped from the line-up like Plymouth was a few years back. But I think it's too different from the other offerings for that to happen.

So the way I see it, it's just one of those things. It's just the way this universe is - things start, they change, decay and then die. The wildly creative days of Guzzi are in the past it appears, but thanks to the genius of guys like Carlo Guzzi, Carcano and Tonti, the brand coasts on. One day it'll be like Norton or Brough or Vincent - kept alive by those of us willing to put the effort into keeping them going.

[lucian]

Holding my breath for a  lemans with the new 850 motor, 4 valve heads twin tb's and for real 85hp  , Hell a liquid cooled 100 plus hp would be alright too.  Don't forget the Tonti style chassis and Ohlins front and rear!

[bad Chad]

Norton is not coasting.  If anything they seem to be twisting the throttle hard.
Www.nortonmotorcycl es.com

[Tusayan]

It's simple, actually. Guzzi isn't run by the same group it started out with. The same values don't apply anymore.

I think Guzzi’s values are truer to their original state than any other manufacturer except perhaps Honda (which has always built highly engineered appliances).  In Guzzis case, the tradition is clever design which gets the most out of the simplest technology that can be used, and thereby provides the owner with a stylish, enjoyable bike that can be maintained for decades.  Carlo Guzzi originated this philosophy, and it was why Guzzi built pretty red flat singles for a very long time. 

It's nice the Guzzi factory is still where it always was and still building bikes similar to those the original company designed and built before expiring. But the current owner is the one calling the shots. It's up to Aprilia what happens with Guzzi these days.

Aprilia and Guzzi are today two brands of Piaggio, neither has existed as a company for many years.  The Aprilia brand struggles just as much as Guzzi, perhaps more so, especially with the recent success of the V85 boosting Guzzi sales while Piaggio continues to pour R&D into expensive designs for Aprilias that don’t sell.

I’m very glad Aprilias continue to prove that plasticky, hard to maintain Japanese style bikes built in Italy don’t sell, and in that way provide a lesson in what Guzzi should never be.

[fossil]

+1 to Tusayans post. An addition: The V85TT has a lot of Aprilia - knowledge in it.

[Roebling3]

Piaggio - MG wear ear plugs 24/7, + holidays.
B4 the rebirth of the V7 and until the series 3 V7's were described I tried peddling a totally different marketing scheme, - including sourcing body kits from Ipothysis. Ipothysis was thrilled to have a shared goal, but the writing remains on the wall.

An Aprilia dealer is 5.7 miles from me. I've been trying to make time to visit. A liquid cooled quad ohc Vee twin with flat plane crank! Or the soon to be parallel twin 660! 

I'm way older than most, here. I don't now ride the RS125 as much. It's a killer ride (truly), on a hot day, in traffic. But when the weather is right, zoom. It's the lack of bulk and weight. 275#.

The 'Apes' we're talking about here weigh in at far less than 400#'s and push 80 to 100+ hp with a torque curve ready to embarrass the rider likely at your side. Easily under 15K$, with the latest Tech. Real performance. Real suspension, front & rear. Your choice? Depending on the day? Hooligan or sport touring?   

If you ride with a big grin, it never hurts the next day. Don't fall off!  Good fortune,  R3~

[oldbike54]

 Pete , mate , I get it , however if I wanted an Aprilia I would buy an Aprilia .

 Dusty

[LowRyter]

See? Piaggio are quite capable of designing and bringing to market stunning motorbikes.



Although that is a prototype the platform is being launched at the Milan show I believe.

So why can't Guzzi get some of the action instead of just another iteration of its creaking smallblock platform?

Pete

If I had any idea I wouldn't've gotten a Ducati.  My guess is they never will.

[pete roper]

I just wish someone at Piaggio had the testicular fortitude to reconsider something similar to the VA10 platform. By all accounts it was awful and was hard to keep on the test bench it vibrated so badly but a smaller, lighter, version with a 90 degree layout rather than the VA's 80 would surely be a better plan for the future than endless rehashing of ancient designs?

[Motormike]

While it would't have the HP to compete with the big boys, it would still be a blast.

[pete roper]

That is one of the most appalling photochops I’ve ever seen! Brilliant!

[Murray]

Don't forget the Tonti style chassis

Why on earth would anyone want a 1970's sport bike frame on anything new is beyond me, The tontis distinguished themselves by been less crap than everything else avliable at the time.

[oldbike54]

 Having no self restraint means not needing a motorbike any more capable of high speeds than an old 2 valve ditch pump in a Tonti frame . Guessing with speed limits , speed cameras , and cops everywhere , most folks don't need anything more either .

 Dusty

[wirespokes]

I think Guzzi’s values are truer to their original state than any other manufacturer except perhaps Honda (which has always built highly engineered appliances).  In Guzzis case, the tradition is clever design which gets the most out of the simplest technology that can be used, and thereby provides the owner with a stylish, enjoyable bike that can be maintained for decades.  Carlo Guzzi originated this philosophy, and it was why Guzzi built pretty red flat singles for a very long time. 

Well said!

But one of the things I was thinking of was the creativity with alternate engine designs in the early years. It seems the V twin defines all things Guzzi these days - not that I mind it. Wouldn't it be fun if they recreated the V8?

Aprilia and Guzzi are today two brands of Piaggio, neither has existed as a company for many years.  The Aprilia brand struggles just as much as Guzzi, perhaps more so, especially with the recent success of the V85 boosting Guzzi sales while Piaggio continues to pour R&D into expensive designs for Aprilias that don’t sell.

Thanks for correcting me.