Linked brake question

[andyals]

I'm ashamed to admit that after three years with my EV1100, I only figured out the basics of it's linked brakes the other day
I decided to replenish the brake fluid and couldn't figure out why I couldn't bleed the nearside front caliper from the lever
I removed the hose from the caliper and still no fluid coming through, so I figured a blocked hose
It was when preparing to remove it I noticed it wasn't connected to the front and is routed to the rear
So let's see if I've got this right.
The handlebar lever operates front offside caliper only
Foot pedal operates rear and nearside front caliper only.
So would I be right in thinking that for normal braking, you use the foot pedal only ,and for hard stopping, you add the handlebar lever to get maximum dual disc power at the front?
Is that how Guzzi intended the braking method to be ?
Forgive my ignorance
I've been using the lever for normal braking and it always felt fine to me.
I never felt the bike was under braked and was blissfully unaware I was only using one disc.
I'd be interested to know how you use yours.

[bigbikerrick]

You got it figgured out. handlebar lever actuates right front disc. Foot pedal actuates left front disc,and rear disc.  The system works very well, IMHO. I have 2 Tonti bikes with the linked brakes, a convert and a 98 EV.  Its a little tricky to bleed the rear, but not too bad. It usually takes a couple of bleeding sessions to get all the air bubbles out.
Rick.

[bmc5733946]

The best description of the linked braking system and its multiple variations is contained in Dave Richardson's "Guzziology" . You should own a copy. I have a Mille GT with linked brakes, I do not use them substantially differently from any other bike I own or have ridden. Light on the foot lever and a little heavier on the hand lever for normal braking. Hard stopping requires more pressure on both levers. IMHO The system on your bike is one of the best if not the best, iteration of linked braking systems Guzzi accomplished during the run of Tonti framed bikes. Not every one will agree with me I'm sure so please remember, "Your mileage may vary!"  YMMV

Brian

[Guzzistajohn]

I put off bleeding the linked brakes on my two Tonti bikes for about the 1st 10 years. It really wasn't that complicated once I jumped into it. I do it every spring now.

[pehayes]

I would suggest that you always use both foot and hand braking.  In a stress situation, it is a lot easier to add more pressure than to add a whole additional braking system.

The rear brake pedal has a rubber 'nub' near the pedal pivot.  Rest  your heel on that and then just rotate your ankle to modulate pressure.  Some people don't like that and have been known to slice off the pivot nub.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[andyals]

I would suggest that you always use both foot and hand braking.  In a stress situation, it is a lot easier to add more pressure than to add a whole additional braking system.

The rear brake pedal has a rubber 'nub' near the pedal pivot.  Rest  your heel on that and then just rotate your ankle to modulate pressure.  Some people don't like that and have been known to slice off the pivot nub.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

Yes I figured that nub was for resting the heel, but find it very uncomfortable to keep the foot in that position in town for example.

[Tkelly]

Probably more important to use the nub in town traffic than open road,like keeping 2 fingers on the brake lever.

[Bulldog9]

I'm ashamed to admit that after three years with my EV1100, I only figured out the basics of it's linked brakes the other day
I decided to replenish the brake fluid and couldn't figure out why I couldn't bleed the nearside front caliper from the lever
I removed the hose from the caliper and still no fluid coming through, so I figured a blocked hose
It was when preparing to remove it I noticed it wasn't connected to the front and is routed to the rear
So let's see if I've got this right.
The handlebar lever operates front offside caliper only
Foot pedal operates rear and nearside front caliper only.
So would I be right in thinking that for normal braking, you use the foot pedal only ,and for hard stopping, you add the handlebar lever to get maximum dual disc power at the front?
Is that how Guzzi intended the braking method to be ?
Forgive my ignorance
I've been using the lever for normal braking and it always felt fine to me.
I never felt the bike was under braked and was blissfully unaware I was only using one disc.
I'd be interested to know how you use yours.

I think you are on target. I have the linked system on the Convert and do the same. Foot pedal engages the rear and left front caliper, hand lever engages the front right caliper. I mostly use the foot pedal and for posterity and extra braking use the hand lever as well. Between this and having little to no engine braking (what I generally use while in motion, only using brakes to stop) there is always a learning curve when I hop on the Convert, and thus find myself slowing down by comparison. This of course is a good thing......

[chuck peterson]

You got it!

[moto]

I would suggest that you always use both foot and hand braking.  In a stress situation, it is a lot easier to add more pressure than to add a whole additional braking system.

The rear brake pedal has a rubber 'nub' near the pedal pivot.  Rest  your heel on that and then just rotate your ankle to modulate pressure.  Some people don't like that and have been known to slice off the pivot nub.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

Your advice is consistent with the practice of riders I respect [EDIT: (including you!)], but I disagree with it because depressing the rear pedal sends half its power to the right left-side front disk, and this makes the front lever controlling the other front disk seem unusually powerful, leading to easy front wheel lock up. Because of this, riders who use both the lever and the pedal must carefully balance the two as they stop.

Guzzi encouraged riders to use only the rear pedal, which activates both a front disk and the rear disk in proportions that make lock up impossible on normal pavement. (Deep gravel is different.) I have purposely stomped on the rear pedal to lock the rear wheel, which resulted in a most serene and surprisingly short stop. Using the front with the rear in normal stops now causes me angst, just like the usual situation with unlinked brakes.

When rolling out the T3 for its initial test in Motorcyclismo, the tester never used the front lever and rear pedal together. Using only the rear pedal outperformed unlinked brakes in tests on wet pavement.

P.S. The linked brakes went through an evolution of types, but I believe Guzzi never abandoned their goal of rear-pedal-only braking, in routine stops.

[moto-uno]

  I think with a bit more investigation into the linked braking system you'll find it is not 50/50 front and rear , but more biased to the front .

[bmc5733946]

Actually some of the bikes have true proportioning valves. My Mille Gt does, some SPs do. The late model 98-? Californias actually have an active adjustable proportioning valve linked to the rear swing arm that adjusts for load on the rear suspension, more load, more rear braking. The information about this is in Guzziology and that is why I recommended it. It is true that the early bikes really just had a junction, later models not so. Some might like to know what they have on their own bike!

Brian

[elrealistico]

I am used to, more or less. the linked brakes on my EVT. I still will occasionally go too hard on the rear pedal, resulting in an unexpected fork dive, but never a lockup. Thoughtful application of both at the same time results in smooth stops. Still use the front mostly in twisty roads for braking. Linked brakes are still inferior to ABS, IMHO, but they get the job done

[moto]

I was speaking loosely about 50 percent of the rear pedal's force going to the front wheel. I didn't want to get into the weeds. I calculate that the front gets about 56 percent. I have studied Guzziology and other sources, and done some mathematical analysis.

What I am saying here is that Guzzi was trying to make the most effective and safe one-pedal system they could, throughout the various developments. They largely succeeded, with European testers in particular remarking on what I called the serenity of using the early system. Later ones were better.

By the way, the front lever is still needed for the strongest stopping power.

I have too much to say to say more here.