Bike vs. Firetruck

[Triple Jim]

Last summer, just on the other side of a small hill was a calf standing in the middle of my lane.    Fortunately, I had slowed before going over hill to a speed that made it possible to stop fast enough to avoid hitting the little bovine.

I'm glad you  missed him.  Years ago, on a back road near me, I had to slam on the brakes of my van to avoid a horse that darted into the road suddenly.  That's one that's worse than a deer... just as quick and several times bigger.

[papatom]

On target fixation, I road a lot of heavy equipment and it seems to me that the bigger the piece of equipment the more other drivers aim for it.  Blind corners are worse.  Look where you want to go, not at what you wish to avoid. 

[Gary]

I too think it was target fixation.

A couple of years ago, a group of us (Moto Guzzis) were heading to the Virginia Rally from Atlanta. The Honorable Bill Hagan (aka. Leatherbutt) led on a merry circuitous route that probably doubled the miles. Nice roads though. I don't ride nearly as fast as Hagan and company so a couple of us were bringing up the rear. Fortunately I never saw a blind curve I trusted. As I rounded the curve, a tractor with a threshing machine was lumbering toward us in the other lane. I was carefully rounding the curve so there was no drama, but the image of me entering the curve a little too fast or hitting a gravel/sand patch or fixating on the object that must be avoided has occasionally haunted me since.

[oldbike54]

That's a really common mistake.  One of my insurance agents told me that out in the country, the primary way that a rider wrecks is to take a curve faster than he has the skill to do it, but probably not faster than the bike has the ability to do it.  The then grabs lots of brake, straightens up, and rides off the road, often into something like a tree.

It happened to a friend who was riding behind me last year.  He rode right into the woods at a curve.  By pure luck, he found a clear footpath and didn't hit any trees.  Since he was on a Hayabusa, I had assumed he had more skill than that.  I was on my Mille, and I wasn't out for setting any speed records.

 Couple of years back riding a paved pig trail in SE OK I almost had a similar accident . Notice the "similar" part of that statement . Was behind Rocker , and in front of Michael D , and we were maintaining a sporting pace . Using my /5 at about 8/10ths , entered a hard right at about 45 MPH , the front wheel caught a bad groove in the road , and the front end tracked the groove making me stand the bike up momentarily . Looking for a soft spot to land while countersteering pretty hard , no brakes, no throttle . OOPS , here comes a PU in the other direction , the driver acted appropriately , and I never panicked , regained my lane , and rode merrily away . Did slow down a bit until we found some smooth pavement , and of course my heart did enter my throat after the incident . This all occurred in a time span of maybe 4 seconds , although it seemed like it took forever  Not making any claims of being the best or fastest rider out there , but understanding how a bike works , and keeping a cool head are certainly useful things in a panic situation . Later , Michael D commented on how hard I was running the poor little R 60 to keep up , I just shrugged and told him maybe he wasn't as fast as he thought 

  Dusty

[Lannis]

So you're not going to get any blood transfusions either. Lannis, I personally have lost 4 people who dies from aids. One was a Marine officer. His wife got a tainted blood transfusion. The disease was spread from her, to their newborn, and to her husband. So tell me again how his behavior should have been changed.

Yes, I know that people infected with AIDS have gotten their blood into the blood banks.   And, knowing human nature after all these years, I suspect I know why they do it; to try to turn it into a "mainstream" disease so it will get more attention.    They have killed people by doing that just as surely as they would if they had poisoned the water supply.   But, though tragic, that is an EXTREMELY tiny fraction of deaths from AIDS.

The changed behavior for us and our family in the face of this threat is to bank our own blood, and not to trust the public supply.   Sorry if it were too late for some.

And too far off topic, though I was answering a direct question.    No more on this from me.

Lannis

[HardAspie]

Reading all these posts I recall a few close ones. Technical riding. Skills  learned and then drilled in deep by practice. The road may look great and the conditions fine, but all that can change for the worse so quickly. Skills can be there in reserve, luck is less dependable. Glad you are all alive.

[guzzinka]

Hi all, I'm new to this site (though I'm not at all new to Guzzis!).
  Do people frequently post ignorant, bigoted, paranoid sounding things in unrelated discussions and then say something like "I'm done saying ridiculous things now"?

[Lannis]

Hi all, I'm new to this site (though I'm not at all new to Guzzis!).
  Do people frequently post ignorant, bigoted, paranoid sounding things in unrelated discussions and then say something like "I'm done saying ridiculous things now"?

Apparently.   Looks like it just happened again.   Welcome to the show.

Lannis

[Sasquatch Jim]

 Yes.


 BTW, for many years now, I have worn medical dogtags to inform EMTs of my wishes should I be unable to speak.
 One of them clearly states, "NO BLOOD TRANSFUSIONS".  There are two reasons I wear this.  The lesser reason is the hazard of contaminated blood.  Yes it is a reallity, it does happen.  But more important is my stand that blood transfusions and organ swapping are
 nothing more than High tech cannibalsm.  Many doctors use blood transfusion to make up for careless technique in surgery.
 They are not careful to prevent blood loss during surgery simply because they plan on replacing it with someone elses' blood anyway.

[Lannis]

Yes.


 BTW, for many years now, I have worn medical dogtags to inform EMTs of my wishes should I be unable to speak.
 One of them clearly states, "NO BLOOD TRANSFUSIONS".  There are two reasons I wear this.  The lesser reason is the hazard of contaminated blood.  Yes it is a reallity, it does happen.  But more important is my stand that blood transfusions and organ swapping are
 nothing more than High tech cannibalsm.  Many doctors use blood transfusion to make up for careless technique in surgery.
 They are not careful to prevent blood loss during surgery simply because they plan on replacing it with someone elses' blood anyway.

Medical dogtags are a good idea for anyone.   Now that you've mentioned it, I'll get a set. 

What do people generally do?   Wristband?   Helmet tag?   Dogtags?   What do EMTs look for first for someone unconscious or unresponsive?   

Lannis

[Triple Jim]

Tattoo on forehead should get attention.

[guzzinka]

Just like Manson's swastika, right Lanni boy?

[Lannis]

Tattoo on forehead should get attention.

Sounds a little sporty.   Think I'll hold out for the less intrusive solution!

[Markcarovilli]

Sounds a little sporty.   Think I'll hold out for the less intrusive solution!

ahh the drama....

Mark

[Rough Edge racing]

Yes.


 BTW, for many years now, I have worn medical dogtags to inform EMTs of my wishes should I be unable to speak.
 One of them clearly states, "NO BLOOD TRANSFUSIONS".  There are two reasons I wear this.  The lesser reason is the hazard of contaminated blood.  Yes it is a reallity, it does happen.  But more important is my stand that blood transfusions and organ swapping are
 nothing more than High tech cannibalsm.  Many doctors use blood transfusion to make up for careless technique in surgery.
 They are not careful to prevent blood loss during surgery simply because they plan on replacing it with someone elses' blood anyway.

Suppose you suffered bloody trauma  and death was imminent without a transfusion. You would prefer death ?  I understand about being brain dead or severely mangled and refusing...

[Chuck in Indiana]

That's a really common mistake.  One of my insurance agents told me that out in the country, the primary way that a rider wrecks is to take a curve faster than he has the skill to do it, but probably not faster than the bike has the ability to do it.  The then grabs lots of brake, straightens up, and rides off the road, often into something like a tree.

It still amazes me that people don't have the..ahem.. balls to just push harder on that bar. What's the worse thing that can happen? A lowside. Much much better than a highside or crossing the center line and being a Mack hood ornament. :)

[Rough Edge racing]

That's a really common mistake.  One of my insurance agents told me that out in the country, the primary way that a rider wrecks is to take a curve faster than he has the skill to do it, but probably not faster than the bike has the ability to do it.  The then grabs lots of brake, straightens up, and rides off the road, often into something like a tree.

It still amazes me that people don't have the..ahem.. balls to just push harder on that bar. What's the worse thing that can happen? A lowside. Much much better than a highside or crossing the center line and being a Mack hood ornament. :)

 They just can't push harder, it not a reflex everyone has. You have never gone into a turn too hot and found yourself running wide no matter how much you tried to turn tighter?

[canuck750]

Disturbing, likely a whole lot of inexperience meets too much confidence.

On the bright side if you are going to pile head on into a real big truck it may as well be full of 1st responders.

[Lannis]

Disturbing, likely a whole lot of inexperience meets too much confidence.

On the bright side if you are going to pile head on into a real big truck it may as well be full of 1st responders.

Good point.   I never would have thought of that!

[Chuck in Indiana]

They just can't push harder, it not a reflex everyone has. You have never gone into a turn too hot and found yourself running wide no matter how much you tried to turn tighter?

I *have* crossed the center line when over cooking a turn, but never when there was a life threatening event going on.. so I'd say no. I suppose this sounds cocky, but...Every time I've been "about to die", time slows down. Seriously. It's happened with an airplane, motorcycle, car, and a (what was I thinking) boat. :) It seems I have plenty of time to decide what to do, and high siding *isn't* an option.

[Lannis]

Suppose you suffered bloody trauma  and death was imminent without a transfusion. You would prefer death ?  I understand about being brain dead or severely mangled and refusing...

Sometimes it's a matter of principle.   I'd prefer death to some things that other people would live with .... Not this particular one, but some things.   This one's Jim's.

Lannis

[Gliderjohn]

Quote from Chuck in Indiana:
"Every time I've been "about to die", time slows down. Seriously. It's happened with an airplane, motorcycle, car, and a (what was I thinking) boat. :) It seems I have plenty of time to decide what to do, and high siding *isn't* an option."

Have experienced that and it is an amazing thing when one is retrospecting on how one just about died. The other thing I have noticed is how quickly one's mind is feeding ideas of anything one has learned over the years to cope with the moment. Knock on wood it has worked so far.
GliderJohn

[Rough Edge racing]

 Chuck, I told the story here about following a better rider on  more agile machine and finding my self at the limit and had to scrub off speed with the brakes and ...no one was in the other lane but it was enlightening.
 Right now I'm trying to get used to a tube frame Buell, and like other modern handling supposedly quick steering sport bikes I've ridden it's way different handling than 45 years of riding old Triumphs. The Triumph can be leaned over but there's always more available with moderate hand and feet pressure. The modern bikes require serious counter steering because there more mass, power and speed. I can see getting into trouble before learning how to handle the machine properly. And the scene of wacking the firetruck is all too scarey.

[Gliderjohn]

Quote from Rough edge racing:
"The modern bikes require serious counter steering because there more mass, power and speed."

Referring to the above, on a modern bike you can corner to the point of feeling G-force which is kind of scary.
GliderJohn

[HardAspie]

That time slowing down. Yup. I've had that a  few times. Some on motorcycles, once in a car, a few times with asthma. Weird thing ain't it?

[Yukonica]

I sometimes hook up (unintentionally) on a ride with people who ride like that.    When I finally catch up at the next stop, they're often smirking and making comments about "what took you so long?"   I'm FINALLY old enough so that it doesn't bother me.

Lannis,  There was a point in my life I was so deeply ingrained in that mind-set that I'm pretty certain my throttle was controlled directly through my testicles.
In that state of mind the only rules are based on physics..... and a blank space on a form.
I'm afraid to ride fast now. My reactions are slower, my perception bubble is smaller, my awareness of finality is heightened, and most of all: if I allow adrenaline back into my life I may not be able to quit.
I'm too old to die young. Ironic; isn't it?

[HardAspie]

I don't even gots any testacles (hey, wasn't Testacles a Greek philosopher?) and I used to ride warp 7 a lot of the time. Realized one day I had no right to endanger other people and slowed down. Glad I did.

[Rough Edge racing]

Quote from Rough edge racing:
"The modern bikes require serious counter steering because there more mass, power and speed."

Referring to the above, on a modern bike you can corner to the point of feeling G-force which is kind of scary.
GliderJohn

 Modern sport bike also has G's from powerful braking and acceleration. Time gets compressed by the rush of acceleration and line of sight becomes shorter as compared to a slower machine.

[Yukonica]

I don't even gots any testacles (hey, wasn't Testacles a Greek philosopher?) and I used to ride warp 7 a lot of the time. Realized one day I had no right to endanger other people and slowed down. Glad I did.

Close: Telecles.... like the phone company :). 
Extra-legal speed has, in my past experience, nothing to do with the understanding of the consequence of one's actions. It was entirely about indulging in the maximum adrenaline available at that moment. If the next moment turns out poorly; that is unfortunate. Three friends from that era of my life found the next moment turned out poorly. We always picked a route, checked the route (up and back) then threw caution to the wind.
Better choice: fewer variables on a track.