Left side tire wear/learned something new

[BRIO]

Naa, I think it's probably the Coriolis force..

Well... you know... at the speeds I ride it's entirely plausible. My Norge has GCC (Geostrophic compensation control) along with ABS

[BRIO]

Why are left turns faster?

Because the radius of a left hand turn in a right hand country is greater thus a higher speed can be carried.

[Stormtruck2]

Occam's razor Maurie , Occam's razor 

 Dusty

I thought Occum had a beard and never shaved?  Kinda like John Barleycorn. He has grown a long long beard.

[oldbike54]

I thought Occum had a beard and never shaved?  Kinda like John Barleycorn. He has grown a long long beard.

 Dunno , but Frank Beard is sans same while Billy Gibbons is beginning to resemble a tree dweller of the primate family 

 Dusty

[Huzo]

The real answer is simply the slight banking of most roads , but nobody wanted to believe that , so you get silly answers .

 Dusty

Touche' old bean, the simplest answer is sometimes the one, but back to........???

[Huzo]

I think you're over thinking it...

Have you got photos to post?

If the wear is slightly off-center, and you ride mostly straight 2-lane blacktop, then thank the crowned roads.

If you're wearing your tires well to the left side, then it has to do with your riding style and the roads you're riding.

Some people are more comfortable turning one way over the other and will push harder when turning that direction.  Maybe you like hard-charging the lefts because you have a good sight line?  Maybe you have more lefts on your rides?

Maybe you sit wonky on your bike and ride down the road with a few degrees of list?

The answer is probably "some of all of the above".

Yep !!!

[charlie b]

I always seem to attack left turns harder than right - hell, who am I kidding, no question that I do.

Some might say it's a reflection of political leanings on my part but lefts in cars or on motorcycles are just more comfortable to execute aggressively.

This, I see in the more greatly diminished "chicken strips" on the extreme left.

General extra wear just off center? Yup, road crown.

Too though, there's this... What side do you carry your wallet on? Maybe time for a "man-purse"?



Todd.

I have to say I take left turns a bit faster than right, regardless of camber, and I lean to the right of center on most things  :)   Why favor left turns?  Don't know.  Probably several things.  When turning left, if I slide I go off the road or into a guard rail and not into oncoming traffic.  Maybe that has something to do with it.  Maybe it is protecting my right arm.  Maybe because I don't feel like I am controlling the bike in a right turn as well since my 'pushing' hand is also trying to modulate the throttle.  Maybe it is because when I was a kid, doing skid turns on my bicycle meant hitting the brake with my right foot and pushing, making a left turn skid and my left foot was out dirt track style for balance.  Maybe it is because when I come to a stop I put my left foot down (most of the time).

I know I take left turns faster in cars as well.  I think that's a psychological thing from sitting on the left side of the car, when the car leans it doesn't feel like it is going to roll over on you.  You can see better through the turn looking out the side window.  Again, if you slide you go off road, not into traffic.

And, no, I've never noticed my bike tires wearing more on one side than the other.  :)

[bacongrease]

  Ride left of center.  Problem solved.     

[Huzo]

I have to say I take left turns a bit faster than right, regardless of camber, and I lean to the right of center on most things  :)   Why favor left turns?  Don't know.  Probably several things.  When turning left, if I slide I go off the road or into a guard rail and not into oncoming traffic.  Maybe that has something to do with it.  Maybe it is protecting my right arm.  Maybe because I don't feel like I am controlling the bike in a right turn as well since my 'pushing' hand is also trying to modulate the throttle.  Maybe it is because when I was a kid, doing skid turns on my bicycle meant hitting the brake with my right foot and pushing, making a left turn skid and my left foot was out dirt track style for balance.  Maybe it is because when I come to a stop I put my left foot down (most of the time).

I know I take left turns faster in cars as well.  I think that's a psychological thing from sitting on the left side of the car, when the car leans it doesn't feel like it is going to roll over on you.  You can see better through the turn looking out the side window.  Again, if you slide you go off road, not into traffic.

And, no, I've never noticed my bike tires wearing more on one side than the other.  :)

Funny about that Charlie, although I'm just average on a dirt bike, I do like sliding around left corners so the throttle is close in to my body, if I'm gonna high side it'll be on a right turn, I don't have the same confidence in throttle control when sliding on dirt in a right hander. Of course this has no bearing on a faster turn on the road 'cos the handlebars are almost perfectly straight, ( not counting offset!), but a lot of it is between the ears I guess.

[Scorpione]

The answer is simple.

In Aus, we ride on left.
Therefore to do a right turn, you are longer on the side of the tyre as that turn has a greater radius, therefore a longer arc. Nothing to do with speed.
On a left turn, the time spent of left side of the tyre is less as the radius of that turn is shorter, therefore a shorter arc, so less wear.
Over time, the difference in distance travelled on each side of the tyre adds up. More time is spent on right side of tyre during turns  than the left, hence the greater wear.

For right-side driving countries the above is reversed.

 

[Huzo]

The answer is simple.

In Aus, we ride on left.
Therefore to do a right turn, you are longer on the side of the tyre as that turn has a greater radius, therefore a longer arc. Nothing to do with speed.
On a left turn, the time spent of left side of the tyre is less as the radius of that turn is shorter, therefore a shorter arc, so less wear.
Over time, the difference in distance travelled on each side of the tyre adds up. More time is spent on right side of tyre during turns  than the left, hence the greater wear.

For right-side driving countries the above is reversed.

 

Oh ok, that's an interesting one Scorpy, how much further do you think it is to ride around the outside of a circle the size of Oz, versus the inside, given that the circumference of a circle is about 6 times the radius ?

[Penderic]

OK. That makes sense now. 


But only in a perfect world would you have perfectly flat roads.

[Huzo]

Just for fun if you work out the distance around a circle 1500 km radius it's about 9,426 km. Now if you go around the outside of the circle in Australia that's clockwise, you have increased the radius of the circle by 15 metres or so if you think about the average width of a two way road. Following that reasoning, you've increased the circumference by .06 of one metre. Suffice to say mate that the outside of the corner argument, leaks like a Vita Wheat biscuit.

[Scorpione]

Oh ok, that's an interesting one Scorpy, how much further do you think it is to ride around the outside of a circle the size of Oz, versus the inside, given that the circumference of a circle is about 6 times the radius ?

Hmmm...

Aus road Highway 1 is 14,500 km all the way around.
Assuming that is the circumference of the outside (ie clockwise direction for LHS driving), I calculate the radius of that 'circle' would be 2307.748624 km (or 2307748.624 metres).
Given that the standard general traffic lanes here in Aus are 3.3-3.5 metres (lets use 3.5 metres), the inside line going anti-clockwise would have a 'circle' radius of 2307.745124 km (2307745.124 meters).
This calculates out to a circumference of 14499978.01 meters (14499.97801 km).

Therefore I make the difference to travel overall at 14500000m - 14499978.01m = 21.99113 metres

YMMV !

 

[Scorpione]

Just for fun if you work out the distance around a circle 1500 km radius it's about 9,426 km. Now if you go around the outside of the circle in Australia that's clockwise, you have increased the radius of the circle by 15 metres or so if you think about the average width of a two way road. Following that reasoning, you've increased the circumference by .06 of one metre. Suffice to say mate that the outside of the corner argument, leaks like a Vita Wheat biscuit.

Sorry Huzo, it's your theory that leaks. I am talking about urban corners, not one big circle ride. The circumference difference matters more when the radius is shorter.

Let's use the 3.5m wide lane and assume you are in center of that lane.

Therefore you are 1.75m from LHS curb and turn 90 degree left to a spot 1.75m from the LHS curb.
The radius of that turn is 1.75m, so the circumference is 10.99557 m
You only ride one quarter of that circle so you travel 2.748893 m in your left turn.

On your right turn from same spot, you are 3.5 m plus 1.75 m = 5.25 m from the RHS curb
The radius of that turn is 5.25m, so the circumference is 32.98670 m
You only ride one quarter of that circle so you travel 8.246675 m in your right turn.

Therefore, for each right turn you travel 5.497782 m further than an equivalent left turn.

 

[jacksonracingcomau]

I think you're over thinking it...

Have you got photos to post?

If the wear is slightly off-center, and you ride mostly straight 2-lane blacktop, then thank the crowned roads.

If you're wearing your tires well to the left side, then it has to do with your riding style and the roads you're riding.

Some people are more comfortable turning one way over the other and will push harder when turning that direction.  Maybe you like hard-charging the lefts because you have a good sight line?  Maybe you have more lefts on your rides?

Maybe you sit wonky on your bike and ride down the road with a few degrees of list?

The answer is probably "some of all of the above".

This

I go faster (lean more) on lefts because it's "safer" when riding on left, apex is kerbside, when turning right apex is in middle of road
So when riding on right I go faster on rights,
Tyre wear proven that for years, opposite of OP but true

[rodekyll]

OK. That makes sense now. 


But only in a perfect world would you have perfectly flat roads.

That has been my argument for compromise between round and flat earthers since I was in high school.  A real win/win.   

[Huzo]

Sorry Huzu, it's your theory that leaks. I am talking about urban corners, not one big circle ride. The circumference difference matters more when the radius is shorter.

Let's use the 3.5m wide lane and assume you are in center of that lane.

Therefore you are 1.75m from LHS curb and turn 90 degree left to a spot 1.75m from the LHS curb.
The radius of that turn is 1.75m, so the circumference is 10.99557 m
You only ride one quarter of that circle so you travel 2.748893 m in your left turn.

On your right turn from same spot, you are 3.5 m plus 1.75 m = 5.25 m from the RHS curb
The radius of that turn is 5.25m, so the circumference is 32.98670 m
You only ride one quarter of that circle so you travel 8.246675 m in your right turn.

Therefore, for each right turn you travel 5.497782 m further than an equivalent left turn.

 

That's beautiful Scorpy, what I love about your reasoning is that you can back up what you say with solid reasoning not some ill conceived half backed backwater logic that won't stand a small amount of scrutiny. Shortly after I made the post I was feeling a bit chuffed then began to wonder if the smaller was the circle, the greater was the rate of change of circumference with respect to radius. I reckon you've set me back on my heels a bit and I love it, just like Kirby did. I'm not fully convinced that this is the effect that magnifies the wear asymmetrically, but I'll cower back under my rock with my slide rule and sulk. Well done mate.

[Scorpione]

That's beautiful Scorpy, what I love about your reasoning is that you can back up what you say with solid reasoning not some ill conceived half backed backwater logic that won't stand a small amount of scrutiny. Shortly after I made the post I was feeling a bit chuffed then began to wonder if the smaller was the circle, the greater was the rate of change of circumference with respect to radius. I reckon you've set me back on my heels a bit and I love it, just like Kirby did. I'm not fully convinced that this is the effect that magnifies the wear asymmetrically, but I'll cower back under my rock with my slide rule and sulk. Well done mate.

Hi Huzo,

Baffle 'em with numbers! 

Anyhoo, just a theory. It really must have something to do with this or in combination with road camber etc., as that would be only explanation for the wear being on opposite sides depending on whether you ride on the correct side of the road a we do here in Aus, or the incorrect side as done in those foreign countries.

[jbell]

The answer is simple.

In Aus, we ride on left.
Therefore to do a right turn, you are longer on the side of the tyre as that turn has a greater radius, therefore a longer arc. Nothing to do with speed.
On a left turn, the time spent of left side of the tyre is less as the radius of that turn is shorter, therefore a shorter arc, so less wear.
Over time, the difference in distance travelled on each side of the tyre adds up. More time is spent on right side of tyre during turns  than the left, hence the greater wear.

For right-side driving countries the above is reversed.

Bingo!  Snickers Bar of the week goes to you.

 

[jbell]

In a predominantly Jewish area it's known as the coriolis Schwartz effect

May the Schwartz be with you.

[M0T0Geezer]

Why are left turns faster?

Depends on which side of the equator one lives.

Toilets swirl in opposite directions in northern vs southern hemispheres.

Motorcycles always turn faster & easier into the same direction as ones toilet swirls (especially Harleys).
 

[sib]

In a predominantly Jewish area it's known as the coriolis Schwartz effect

May the Schwartz be with you.