HID Projector Experiment

[Moto Fugazzi]

After trying just an HID retro bulb in my V11S housing, the light was very bright, but not very focused (light was very scattered and blinded oncoming traffic). Most of the reason for this could be because the small shroud in front of the bulb broke off inside the headlight.

Not good to ride like that at night, so time to improve on the headlight. An HID projector may be the answer. I realized that a standard Jeep Wrangler headlight fits right into a standard motorcycle bucket (both are par 56 units). The Jeep has a domed lens, and a projector should fit inside with some mods. Here's what I did.

Bought a Mini H1 projector and shroud from DDM Tuning (I already had the ballast and other bits from them).

Heat the Jeep headlight in the oven. 10 minutes at 275f, and the glue let loose so I could remove the lens.

Dremel the Jeep housing so that the projector would fit. Install shroud over the projector, drill 4 holes in the ho, using so that the shroud and projector will be screwed into place from the backside. The gap in-between the projector and housing should be filled in with epoxy or some other adhesive.

Paint the headlight housing and shroud (optional). I used high temp VHT satin black wheel paint, that's good up to 250f.

Install the lens back onto the housing with a sealer. Most people use butyl roll tape that also works on auto windows. Available from DDM tuning.

My Emgo headlight bucket was 1" too shallow, so I had to extend it. A 1.5" hole saw, and some PVC plastic parts to extend it.

Wire everything up. This requires an electrical feed from the battery (HID unit has a relay in the system). You'll also have to find a place to mount the ballast and relays for this.

Some pics below of what I did. Nothing is sealed up yet, as I'm waiting for the paint to fully cure.
Ken

Projector and shroud. DDM will send one if that's all you need, but you'll have to call them for that.


Jeep Wrangler headlight. 2007-2016, and found on eBay.


Backside of routed out lens. Take note that the gap is not sealed up yet. I freehanded this with a dremel.


Headlight and shroud painted black:


Headlight bucket was too shallow, so I put a small dent in it, and attacked it with a 1.5" hole saw.


Fittings from the electrical department at the hardware store. If the bucket is extended too far, it will rub against the ignition switch. I marked this piece with tape to trim it down 1/4".


Cap added to the backside. Will most likely be painted black.


Mounted on bike.


Front view at night.


Low beam.


High beam. Bike was not quite vertical (leaning a little to the left). It was raining during these pics, and I was worried about my camera phone getting too wet.


In the rain.

[Wayne Orwig]

After trying just an HID retro bulb in my V11S housing, the light was very bright, but not very focused (light was very scattered and blinded oncoming traffic). Most of the reason for this could be because the small shroud in front of the bulb broke off inside the headlight.

Did your HID look like the top one or the bottom one?

[rodekyll]

Excellent write-up!

Why did you cap the back of the headlight bucket?  I left mine open these past 5 years or so with no bad effects.

DDM fould up my last order.  I went for a pair of V2 projectors, 4300k bulbs, the same shrouds you have, two harness extenders, and 55w ballasts.

I got 2 sets of bulbs, two sets of ballasts, and no projectors or harness extenders.  The shrouds were correct.  I'm still waiting on the do-over.

[rbm]

Excellent writeup. Thank you for posting your experience.  I have planned for a while to do this to my V7.  I have a mini projector from theretrofitsource.c om and just need to do the fitment.  This will help me alot.

[Moto Fugazzi]

Did your HID look like the top one or the bottom one?

I have the bottom version. Makes sense why the beam was horrid.
Ken

[Wayne Orwig]

I have the bottom version. Makes sense why the beam was horrid.

Yes, I have the top one. It is shielded well and there is a hole that uncovers the light for high beam.
I got a replacement from DDM and they sent the bottom one. It was horrible. Light scattered and high beam was worthless.
I ended up moving the bare element into the good mount with good results again

[Moto Fugazzi]

Excellent write-up!

Why did you cap the back of the headlight bucket?  I left mine open these past 5 years or so with no bad effects.

DDM fould up my last order.  I went for a pair of V2 projectors, 4300k bulbs, the same shrouds you have, two harness extenders, and 55w ballasts.

I got 2 sets of bulbs, two sets of ballasts, and no projectors or harness extenders.  The shrouds were correct.  I'm still waiting on the do-over.

DDM isn't the best to deal with. My order last year was shipped from China, and took 3-4 weeks to arrive. The order I placed last Wednesday (I lost the clip that holds the bulb in (janky ass clip, IMO)) still hasn't shipped yet.

I didn't install the cap yet, so I might as well leave it open, as it's covered by my fairing. Thoughts on stuffing the ballast and electronics into the headlight bucket? It should all fit, but will it all overheat?
Ken

[rodekyll]

I think if you leave the back of the bucket open it should vent well enough.  Most of the heat is generated to the front -- you can feel it from 6" in front of the lens.  I've put my ballasts wherever handy.  DDM says lifetime warranty, so if I accidently cook a component, they'll send another one.

One thing I did with mine was to put a stomp switch from a guitar pedal in my floorboard for a dimmer.  I find that it takes too long to fumble for the button on the pod with wet gloves, cramped hands, and oncoming traffic. 

Yeah -- I've been getting them from china lately too.  Odd, since I called on the phone for the last order (the one that got so screwed up).  They said it would ship from CA, but the box came in from China.  They said the same thing this time too -- since it was their screw up they'd ship from CA.  It's been way too f***ing long to be shipping from within the USA, and it's got me really pissed that I'm 4 weeks behind on my lighting project based entirely on their mistakes.

But when I first started dealing with them they were great -- parts turnaround in a couple of days and live people on the phone who knew the products.  I hope they get back to that.

[Moto Fugazzi]

I have the bottom version. Makes sense why the beam was horrid.
Ken

I ordered a generic version of the top one and installed it in my stock 8" V11S bucket. Results below.

All of these versions are very different from one another, and I don't see a clear winner. Here's what I noticed.

JW Speaker. Quick install, nice beam down the road, and good wide pattern. At a kelvin rating of 5k, it's not the best for rain/fog.

HID Projector. Nice wide beam, great cutoff, doesn't put much light directly in front of the bike (first 5-7').

H4 HID Retrofit in 8" bucket. Much improved over stock halogen, 4300k color (ideal for me), side to side pattern is decent, but a little spotty.
Ken

H4 HID Retrofit Low Beam:


H4 HID Retrofit High Beam:


JW Speaker LED Low:


JW Speaker High:

[rodekyll]

 Good pics.  Thanks for taking the time to do the comparison. . . and that's what I've been arguing about HID v LED H4 CONVERSIONS as far as both raw light output (favors HID) and FOCUSED output (favors LED).

I am running all HID on the trike with a 6000k 35w main bulb and two 3500k 55w aux lights.  On low the main beam does very well keeping the scatter away from oncoming traffic while giving a very pleasing puddle of light directly ahead of the front wheel.  Judging from the reflected scatter off road signs and such the high beam has the potential to annoy oncoming traffic.  This is unavoidable with the conversions, since the HID bulbs are not designed or intended to run in an H4/E4 motorcycle headlight.

The 55w aux lights though are a different story.  They are 'warmer white' (read that slightly yellow -- like an old tungsten headlight) and the bulbs are fitted to the proper HID projectors.  One is a general purpose headlight and the other is a long range spot.  Like the main light they do hi/lo.  Properly aimed they will sear the paint off of guard rails at a mile and a half.

With these lights working together I do not have the best lighting I have ever had on a motorcycle.  I have the best lighting I have ever had.

[Wayne Orwig]

I am running all HID on the trike with a 6000k 35w main bulb and two 3500k 55w aux lights. 

Let us know how the 6000k compares to the 3500k in foggy rainy conditions, if you can control them separately.
It 'feels' like there is more glare and scatter from 6000k lights. But I've never been able to do a side by side compare to verify that glare issue.

[rodekyll]

I've already done that, Wayne.  The 6000k is inferior in the fog or rain.  I had that temp in all the lights and swapped out the aux for 3500's because I felt the 6000 had too much glare and scatter.  It seemed more tiring to ride behind the harsh blue light.  I also think the more yellow 3500k does a better job with detail and contrast.

[Moto Fugazzi]

I had the Trucklite LED on my old V11S, rated at 5500k. It was downright horrible in the rain and fog. RK has the right idea going with 3500k aux lights. If I could only find affordable LED's rated at that.
Ken

[rodekyll]

I can't find headlight LEDs in good colors for any price.  The mfgrs have lost sight (pun intended) of a headlight's purpose.  It's all funkadelic purple and angel eyes that impede both the owner's vision and that of oncoming traffic.  It looks cool in a MIAMI VICE movie trailer, but that's about it.

The commercial fishermen are very serious about their work lights.  They need to do a dangerous job in rotten weather and visibility conditions.  They use high pressure sodium and other yellow-to-orange tinged lamp arrays to do their work.  These lights are so yellow and so bright that they can be seen from over the horizon.  They mess up my northern lights photography.  My point being that these guys are pretty much obliged to buy whatever works best.  Their lives and individual body parts depend on excellent visibility in any sort of flying spray, snow, rain, fog, etc.  As an industry they went with yellow, not blue.

I'm a half mile or so inland on a flat muskeg @ about 300'asl.  The seiner that is making this light is probably 6 miles on the other side of that fog bank.  He loused up my photography so bad I had to start taking his picture for something to do.  It's a whole lot of not blue.

[Moto Fugazzi]

I had a friend that worked on a fishing but in Alaska for a season. That was enough for him!

A few months ago, I tried a Cyclops led headlight. I returned it because it was too blur. I told him if he ever stocked a 4300k version, I would buy it. He agreed that 4300k is the ideal color, but nobody buys them, they want the blue or purple bulbs. I guess the market dictates what sells.
Ken

BTW, my neighbor has one of those vapor lights on top of his garage. It lit up the entire neighborhood. I finally climbed up there and disconnected it so I can enjoy the darkness in my back yard. The low wattage string lights I installed add a nice ambience.