Question about how robust the swingarm, driveshaft and final drive are on V7, V9

[ohiorider]

I've never owned a small block.  I'd like to hear from some Guzzi small block riders and mechanics who do their own wrenching and have some long-term experience with these bikes.

After owning two CARC bikes, with their swingarm built like a bridge girder, the small block 'looks' very lightweight.  I didn't say it is, just that it give me that impression.

Straighten me out on this.

Bob

[Kev m]

I would think the best answer would come from Ed Milich:

http://www.guzzipower.com/racing/

[guzzisteve]

It used to be a weak link and was somewhat unchanged until the V9 came out. Smaller than a BB and this roundish ball on the back end. This has been addressed some but nothing like a BB in a Tonti frame or the bigger yet CARC shaft.                                                                                                                                               Todd or Ed change things for racing cause they do break. I have twisted the older set-up and trashed it all. You can do it in less than 1000mi. One reason I stayed w/BB more robust.

[M0T0Geezer]

I've got 55,000 trouble-free miles on a 2004 Moto Guzzi Breva 750.  No engine, tranny, shaft or rear end problems.  No problems at all, actually.

Will check back at 75,000 and let you know if any drive train probs have arisen.

45 hp (on a good day) don't take a bridge girder to lay down.  But she's a sweet-lovin' thang and I love her dearly

'Geezer

[ohiorider]

A good riding buddy of mine rode a similar silver Breva 750 (except for having 30L HB Junior hard bags)  for several years and several thousand miles.  I rode it only once, and didn't get into it, but I think that was because I'd spent several thousand miles on my 1200 Sport, was used to the way it made power, and probably needed to get acclimated to the way the 750 small block made power.  In tight turns, he could fly on that machine.  And he had no issues with it on the highway.  Made me look a bit clumsy on my Sport.

I think his only mechanical issue was a sticky side-stand interlock switch.

[SmithSwede]

68,000 miles on 2013 V7 Stone.  No issues with final drive, swingarm, or driveshaft.

I just change the final drive oil regularly and lube the rear drive splines whenever I change the rear tire (about 10K mi).  I do the front, clutch side splines about every other rear tire change (20K miles).

My only minor issue was water would sometimes get past the rubber boot by the swing arm if I rode for hours in a frog drowning rainstorm.  Fixed that with some silicon sealant. 

[twowings]

Beeyootiful bike, M0t0Geezer!!! 

[Arizona Wayne]

I currently have my `04 750 Breva swingarm apart @ 48K miles because the clutch needs fixing.  In the past the wife & I have ridden thousands of miles 2up w/40L saddlebags loaded + a top case, + a tank bag with no known wear on the drive shaft/u-joint.  Haven't taken the tranny off yet but right now the u-joint/shaft is still attached to the tranny housing unlike a big block setup.  I can feel no slop in the u-joint at this point.  The u-joint is nothing like the big block version and is attached to the long shaft as 1 assembly.  My steel drive shaft is 10" long a 5/8" thick.  I know the `04 swingarm/wheel/disc brake assm. is different than the `80's smallblock version.

[pete roper]

There has never really been any *Problem* with the smallblock parts mentioned. On any model with off road pretensions there was always the risk of smashing the back off the gearbox and the single coupling driveshaft imposed high loads on the Cush system, especially on longer travel suspension models.

With the advent of the V9 there is a more robust final drive mechanism with a twin trunnion driveshaft which would seem to have been part of a strategy to 'Get with the program' heading towards the promised nirvana of the V85 with its alleged 80HP and cavalcade of dancing unicorns or whatever the marketing wonks are saying will happen.

I'm not sure if the V7-III uses the new final drive or not but from my blurry memory of pictures it seems to still use the earlier swingarm etc. it does use the six speed gearbox shared by all current smallblocks though and this has a different case design to the earlier five speeds. While the swingarm is still mounted on the gearbox case they may of beefed it up to help prevent fractures. I don't know not having taken one apart but as an 'Outsider' I still think it's a shit idea.......

Pete

[malik]

I really don't think that that there are insurmountable problems with the small block rear end. I suppose that it depends upon your definition of inconvenience.

The V7 Classic rusted out the drive shaft splines at 67,500km (42,000 miles), but that was before I knew I was supposed to grease the drive shaft splines regularly to combat water getting past the boot & sitting there. The bevel box first leaked oil at 103,000km (64,000 miles) & I had the seals replaced. Replacing the seals is supposed to be tricky & not all that straight forward. At this time I was told there were some signs of wear on the inside, but not enough to warrant replacement. Now at 170,000km (106,000 miles) it still seems to be operating well.

The V7 Special now has 99,000km (61,000 miles) under its belt without problem, other than a tendency to use up cush rubbers faster than the V7C.

Occasionally greasing the drive shaft spline is a bit of a pain, but a lot easier than chains & sprockets. Removing & replacing the rear wheel is sometimes fraught, principally because of those cush rubbers, but with practice  it gets easier. The swingarm bearing & pin system is a delightful design & expentionally simple to remove and replace.

Both my V7's occasionally spew a little over the back wheel in sustained long distance running, but clean the muck off with degreaser, check the final drive oil (usually still full) and they seem good for another 5.000km or more - at least until the next oil change interval. Use mineral oil in the final drive, not synthetic - those leaking problems appear to have started with the use of synthetic.

There may well be some wear in the moving & mating parts back there, but so far they seem to be holding up well. Adequate for their purpose? Most likely. Future experience will show how well the V9 & the later IIIs, if different, fare over the long haul.

Mal

[pyoungbl]

I can see how the antique V7 drive train is open to critique.  Heck, I hate to change the rear tire just because it's a tight fit and those damn cush drive rubbers keep falling out.  With that said, the design must be 'good enough' because we don't hear a steady stream of failure complaints.  Compare that to the flat tappet/roller situation, the Stelvio aux lights, BMW's rear drive failures, or the KLR 'dohickie' and now the V7 drive train looks pretty bulletproof.  Yes, the V9 double U joint design looks better than the single U joint system.  Hell, I'd love to have a scaled down CARC single side swingarm but that's just a pipe dream.  The bottom line is that, with minimal maintenance, the V7 drive train seems to work just fine for the normal rider.

[SmithSwede]

Use some kind of flexible rubber cement or sealant to glue the rubber cush drive pieces to the rear wheel.  Makes installing the rear wheel much simpler. 

[oldbike54]

 "Dancing Unicorns" 

 Wait , are they coming as standard equipment on the new small blocks ?

 Dusty

[sign216]

Rear drive has been fine on my '09 V7, but I did have premature failure of a rear wheel bearing at approx. 20k miles.  The factory used quality SKF bearings, but one fell apart.  No obvious reason.

Replacing wasn't hard, although the first time I forgot to re-install the wheel spacer.  AArgh!  And had to do it all over again.
Joe

[Arizona Wayne]

Use some kind of flexible rubber cement or sealant to glue the rubber cush drive pieces to the rear wheel.  Makes installing the rear wheel much simpler.

I just put General Purpose grease on the rubber cushions to keep them in place long enough to reassemble the rear drive/tire assembly.  Put GP grease on the splines/coupler when apart too.   Since I live in dry country never have any  issues with water getting into these parts even tho I some times ride thru rain once in awhile.    Or maybe it's really from humidity ?   We don't have any of that or rust here in the desert.

[Toecutter]

Not saying it's common... but just my experience on my '14 Special.

bevel box started slinging oil all over my rear tire at about 6000 km. Had the seals replaced under warranty.  At 20,000 km it started again, and I had the entire bevel box replaced. Havent' had any issues in the 10,000 km since *knock on wood*.

I chalk it up to a "friday bike" issue. Porbably a "last Friday in July" bike issue, to be honest, as my Special was a PITA for the first 20K. My wife's '14 Stone has been trouble free.