Righto, another blooming suspension question

[Ozzydog]

Greetings people who are cleverer than me and especially those of you know something about suspension. And hello warmly to everyone else as well!

Two years ago I had a few spare bucks at one stage so I shouted my Jackal (Now a T3 replica sort of) new suspenders each end. In the front forks I had installed a Matris kit, new internals and springs with adjustable compression and dampening. At the rear I installed Wilbers remote reserviour shockers that have adjustable compression and dampening.

Im struggling a bit with these! A mate of mine says if a bloke has two watches he is never really sure of the right time. Im a bit the same with my suspenders, too much variability and Im not really nailing the set up.

When I bought them the bloke asked what my riding weight was and I said around 200 lbs but he specifies springs to suit 220 lbs. I really feel the bike is oversprung, so my question to the cleverers is do you reckon that difference in what I actually weigh in my riding gear 198 lbs (actually measured now) and the spring specified weight of 220 lbs would result in too stiff springing? 

Adjusting compression for instance does never take away that very firm feel on encountering a bump, even when the compression is backed right off!

Im getting closer but never achieving the complaint ride I expected from a 2K investment.

Any thoughts?

Thanks
Andy

[kingoffleece]

You need to start with correct sag settings at both ends.  Plenty of vids available on how to do it.  That will tell you in your spring rate is correct or not.

[Sheepdog]

+1.
Your suspension should sag under your weight about 15mm on both ends of the bike. If that isn't right, you will find it difficult to dial in the dampening. If this much sag cannot be achieved by reducing pre-load, new springs may be necessary.

[Ozzydog]

Thanks Sheepdog and Kingoffleece (notice the connection there -))
Ive done the sag settings with a friend, as per all the videos and instructions going around. The thing that intrigues me is that the compression on the front is now wound almost all the way back , 25 stops out of 30, yet seems to have only a small effect. IE, when I sit on the bike I can hardly make the suspension sink at all. Its all a bit odd!
Thanks anyway

Andy

[pyoungbl]

Andy, if you have the preload backed out but do not get any (or not much) sag the springs are too stiff.  I had exactly the same problem with some custom shocks, their calculated spring rate was too stiff.  I swapped out to the next softer spring and suddenly my adjustments started to make a difference.  It's worth the extra effort to get those springs correct.

Peter Y,

[kingoffleece]

Absolutely correct.  Your springs are specked for a greater weight.  Depending on the manufacture you may need to go down one or two spring rates.

I went thru that with Hagon on the Triumph Thunderbird 1600 (MY 2010).  The Calif folks were unfamiliar and working of what they though the supplied springs were much too stiff.  After some trial and error we were able to supply them with measurements and rates for that motorcycle.  It just takes a bit of time and trial to get it right-but it's worth it.

[jacksonracingcomau]

Andy
Did you get preload adjusters with fork kit ?
Back right off
Cable tie around fork leg tells you everything, static sag to travel used
Same on shock shaft
Damping settings later, get your sags and travel first
When you want to try my test track again, we can have a butchers
I have a few sets of shock springs but not forks for yours, could lend to try
What numbers are written on shock springs ?
Trial and error gets you there, springs nominally for given weight just a guide, not an absolute, took me a few goes with my Wilbers, I want every mm of travel but never bottom out hard. Final damping settings a compromise by definition, we are not setting up for one particular racetrack

MH

[Ozzydog]

Thanks again guys, I'm convinced now to follow the spring rabbit hole for a while. (with as always much joy:-)). Very encouraging answers. Its spooky science this suspension stuff. Hey Martin, I'll take you up on the offer soonish , I'm off to the orient to see the killings first. Did you see your name mentioned in the mag?:-)
Andy