96 Cali tank mount rubber

[philwarner]

When I removed my tank the right side came loose first and the left side took some pulling and wiggling to get it to move back.  Once off I noticed that there was a rubber puck that came off with the right side and none on the left.  I saw a rubber puck bolted to the left side of the frame but none on the right and thought I needed to somehow bolt that puck on, but then I measured the distance from the rear mounting hole and the center of the U shapes on the tank at 20-1/4 inches and that rubber puck on the frame is a good 5 inches ahead of that.  There are two vertical lugs on the frame at 20-1/4 from the captive nut for the rear mount and the lugs have no holes in them.

 MG Cycle sells a rubber bumper Part Number: 39103400 that says it's for gas tank mounts and says you need washer Part Number: 39103500 to mount them, but there are no holes in the tank or lugs for a washer with a hole in it.  SO...Does the tank just sit astride these lugs by friction with no up-down location?  If so what does it rest on?  Is there any kind of rubber disk that fits over these lugs to locate the tank?  Here are photos of my frame and the mysterious lugs.








I also found a single male spade connector under the tank with a brown-with-black wire to it but did not see any female spade connector for it to go to.  Any idea what this connector was for?






And one more question about oil level.  Is it checked with the bike on the center stand?  Do you screw in the dip stick or just insert it til the threads touch? And are the two molded in circles the high and low marks as can barely be seen in this photo?

[pehayes]

And one more question about oil level.  Is it checked with the bike on the center stand?  Do you screw in the dip stick or just insert it til the threads touch? And are the two molded in circles the high and low marks as can barely be seen in this photo?

On the centerstand.

On early V-twin Guzzis, there was an old translation from the original Italian.  Probably done by some school student.  It advised to insert the dipstick "...and screw it up completely."

Drain the oil.  Install precisely 3 quarts.  Done.  Forget the liters.  Forget the marks on your stick.  Install 3 quarts and then mark your stick the way you want to.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Someone has modified your tank mounting points. Does this bike have the original gas tank? If so, it should have a 6 mm hole in the two tabs that stick up on either side the frame here:




Then there's a cupped washer that attaches with an M6 x 16 bolt.




And then the rubber bumper fits over that.





#14 is the rubber bumper and #16 the dished washer in this illustration.

[guzzisteve]

Seems modified, tank has slot area big enough for pucks to slide into. Look down the tunnel in center.

[Kiwi Dave]

I also found a single male spade connector under the tank with a brown-with-black wire to it but did not see any female spade connector for it to go to.  Any idea what this connector was for?

I have any early Manuale Di Officina Workshop Manual for the Cali 1000 & 1100 (including their injector versions).  The only wires that I could find that have the Marrone-Nero (Brown-Black) appear to be for the high beam warning light.

Do you have one of these, and is it working?

[philwarner]

Someone has modified your tank mounting points. Does this bike have the original gas tank? If so, it should have a 6 mm hole in the two tabs that stick up on either side the frame here:




Then there's a cupped washer that attaches with an M6 x 16 bolt.




And then the rubber bumper fits over that.





#14 is the rubber bumper and #16 the dished washer in this illustration.

Thanks for the photos and diagram.  That makes sense that there should be holes in the lugs, but there is no indication there ever were holes in them and no obvious indication of a repair.  The tank looks like all the photos of 96 Californias I have seen (and just like the Maisto 1:10 die cast model I just bought on eBay) so I think it is a stock tank.  The lugs look stock too, but no holes.  Guess I'll order the washers and bumpers and drill my own holes.  Anyone know how far from the top to drill them?  Or should I just wing it?  I'D guess as high as possible since there is not much clearance between the left head and the low fuel sensor I just installed.

  I ended up putting a sawed off rubber electrical plug in the right side tank U and the rubber donut (with a hole in the center) that was on it in the left side tank U and pushing both down over the faces of lugs from the top; the lugs are angled in slightly at the top and the tank only went down so far as it became wedged.  I wonder if it is possible that some years used the rubber bumpers in the Us the same way and let gravity wedge the front of the tank.  BTW, I had thought I heard something snap when the right side of the tank came loose first as I removed it, but I found no extra bits anywhere on the engine or the floor - a mystery

[philwarner]

I have any early Manuale Di Officina Workshop Manual for the Cali 1000 & 1100 (including their injector versions).  The only wires that I could find that have the Marrone-Nero (Brown-Black) appear to be for the high beam warning light.

Do you have one of these, and is it working?

Thanks,   I just checked and no warning light comes on with the high beam switch or the high beam flasher.  There is also what looks like a low beam indicator light in the console which also remains unlit.  Might that one be a "depending on the country" thing since the US requires the headlight to be on all the time?  (or maybe it is burned out)

Darn.  It Looks like I'll have to take the tank off again to try to find where that spade should connect if I want a high beam warning light.  The bike has an LED headlight so the wiring might well have been changed to install it.  One more thing to investigate.

[Wayne Orwig]

I wonder if it is possible that some years used the rubber bumpers in the Us the same way and let gravity wedge the front of the tank. 

My 1994 California 1100 and my 2004 had the same setup as Charlie showed.

For the mounting points that you showed, The 'pockets' in the tank would need to be in a much different location.

Odd.

[Wayne Orwig]

Thanks,   I just checked and no warning light comes on with the high beam switch or the high beam flasher.  There is also what looks like a low beam indicator light in the console which also remains unlit.  Might that one be a "depending on the country" thing since the US requires the headlight to be on all the time?  (or maybe it is burned out)

Darn.  It Looks like I'll have to take the tank off again to try to find where that spade should connect if I want a high beam warning light.  The bike has an LED headlight so the wiring might well have been changed to install it.  One more thing to investigate.

Yes, that year had a low beam light that stayed on 100% of the time. I assume in Europe, where they had a light switch, it would actually turn off.

I had a lot of trouble with those bulbs burning out for some odd reason.

[philwarner]

Patrick,  My goal in life is to not "...screw it up completely".  The PO said he had the oil changed shortly before I bought it, but it does look a bit dark.  Dino or synthetic?  What is the recommended weight? 

[guzzisteve]

In this pic look for the square hole w/circle around it. That is where the metal piece mounts for bumper to fit on.
It had a captive nut w/clips that broke off in that square hole. There should be same thing on the left side.
You could do longer bolt w/washer to mount puck.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

In this pic look for the square hole w/circle around it. That is where the metal piece mounts for bumper to fit on.
It had a captive nut w/clips that broke off in that square hole. There should be same thing on the left side.
You could do longer bolt w/washer to mount puck.

Not on any Cal 1100s I've worked on, but that's only been three and they've all been fuel injected. The square hole on those had a captive nut and then a hex spacer that the steering head "beauty" covers attached to.

The tank mounts were here:




hex spacer:

[philwarner]

In this pic look for the square hole w/circle around it. That is where the metal piece mounts for bumper to fit on.
It had a captive nut w/clips that broke off in that square hole. There should be same thing on the left side.
You could do longer bolt w/washer to mount puck.

Yes, that's where I had thought the tank mount should be, but that square hole is 5 inches too far forward for a tank mount.  In fact it is still exposed when the tank is on.  On the left side opposite that hole is a rubber cylinder bolted to the frame that is also too far forward for a tank mount and is also exposed ahead of the tank with the tank in place and it does nothing in the current setup.  Those points might have been mounting points for the steering damper which has been deleted from my bike or maybe served a purpose on other models that used the same frame(?).





   The points that line up with the "U"s on the inner sides of the fuel tank are the little vertical lugs on the frame about 5 inches behind the square hole on the right side and the rubber thing on the left side, and I am told they should have 6mm holes in them for mounting a disk that a rubber bumper fits over and the tank "U"s fit over the bumpers.  Mine, however have no holes and the tank was just wedged down over those lugs with a puck in the U on one side and nothing I've found in the other.  I put the tank back with a cut off rubber electrical plug for missing puck for now, but I've ordered the disks and bumpers to mount  with bolts in holes I'll drill in the lugs later.

[philwarner]

Not on any Cal 1100s I've worked on, but that's only been three and they've all been fuel injected. The square hole on those had a captive nut and then a hex spacer that the steering head "beauty" covers attached to.

The tank mounts were here:




hex spacer:

There were "beauty covers" for the Cali frames?  Any photos of what these were?  I keep learning new things about my 96 Cali Mutt every week.  Every time I do a little more work on it I run into another odd bit or two, and I'd be lost without the knowledge of the Guzzistas on this forum.

[Tom H]

Not sure if this is the correct model, but it shows where the holes should be:

http://thisoldtractor.com/mg_manuals/spare_parts_catalog_california_ev_2002-05.pdf

Scroll down to the frame section.

Hope it helps,
Tom

[guzzisteve]

Yep, Charlies right again I forgot about those. I don't take mine apart much.

[Tom H]

Images:

https://bikez.com/motorcycles/moto_guzzi_california_1100_1996.php

Tom

[philwarner]

Images:

https://bikez.com/motorcycles/moto_guzzi_california_1100_1996.php

Tom

Thanks Tom, I had not noticed those in reference photos before.  Knowing what to look for now I found this photo with higher resolution.  Were these an option?  They do cover things up pretty well.  I just looked at my Maisto 10:1 model that came today and by golly it has them in black so maybe they were standard?

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Thanks Tom, I had not noticed those in reference photos before.  Knowing what to look for now I found this photo with higher resolution.  Were these an option?  They do cover things up pretty well.  I just looked at my Maisto 10:1 model that came today and by golly it has them in black so maybe they were standard?

The Cal 1100s I've seen all had black plastic covers.

[philwarner]

I've only seen my Mutt in person which has none.  I did a search for "beauty covers", side covers, frame covers, ect and do not see any for sale.  Not that I really need them with the H&H fairing somewhat covering the frame from view, but I was curious.  Better to spend my money on practical things like low fuel sender, oil filter, and sump gasket, but still curious about what this bike might have had originally.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

I've only seen my Mutt in person which has none.  I did a search for "beauty covers", side covers, frame covers, ect and do not see any for sale.  Not that I really need them with the H&H fairing somewhat covering the frame from view, but I was curious.  Better to spend my money on practical things like low fuel sender, oil filter, and sump gasket, but still curious about what this bike might have had originally.

https://www.harpermoto.com/shroud-rh-30472460.html
https://www.harpermoto.com/shroud-lh-a-30472960.html

[larrys]

There were "beauty covers" for the Cali frames?  Any photos of what these were?  I keep learning new things about my 96 Cali Mutt every week.  Every time I do a little more work on it I run into another odd bit or two, and I'd be lost without the knowledge of the Guzzistas on this forum.

Yes to the beauty covers. My Cal has them and they're black ABS plastic. EV's have them, too but they are chrome plated plastic. They fasten to the tab with the square hole that has the captive square nut in it. You bike has the the tab with the square hole, but the nut is missing.
Larry

[philwarner]

https://www.harpermoto.com/shroud-rh-30472460.html
https://www.harpermoto.com/shroud-lh-a-30472960.html

Thanks for the links.  I had done a search on the Harper site without results - Guess I used the wrong words to describe them; I did not think of "shroud".  Maybe a used set will show up on eBay someday.

Speaking of eBay and back to my original question, I found these photos of a 98 Cali frame on eBay.  It has an odd bracket on the left side, but they give me an idea of how high the tank rubbers should be mounted and the rear view shows the lugs angled in at the top like mine are.  I still wonder why mine have no holes in them.

BTW, what did the two tabs on the right side with the sheet metal nut/clips hold?  Mine are empty too.

[Tom H]

Odd bracket on the LH tank mount "should" be for another bracket that holds the steering dampener.

The bolt hole on the upper neck and the stud just in front of the tank mounts are for the plastic cover that hides the wires. BTW: '04 EVT the covers are chromed metal. Yours should be plastic I think.

Tom

[philwarner]

Odd bracket on the LH tank mount "should" be for another bracket that holds the steering dampener.

The bolt hole on the upper neck and the stud just in front of the tank mounts are for the plastic cover that hides the wires. BTW: '04 EVT the covers are chromed metal. Yours should be plastic I think.

Tom

Thanks, Tom.  And the two tabs with the clips for sheet metal type screws?  Was something essential mounted there?

  The chrome metal covers are quite flashy and go well with the chrome side trim on the EVT front fender (mud guard to some).  Mine will have to live without them for now.  Nice to know what the holes were for, though.  I took the superfluous rubber bumper off of mine and fortunately it was bolted through an existing cut out in the frame with washers on either side so no odd hole in the frame to deal with.  I can't imagine why it was there unless it was to hold up the choke cable; time will tell.

[philwarner]

Update:  Got the tank mount rubbers and washers from MG and installed them today.  I drilled and tapped the frame lugs which had no evidence of ever having holes in them and mounted the washers with M6 x1 short bolts. 













When I installed the gas tank it was not as stable as I expected and in fact was less stable than when it was just wedged down over the lugs with pucks in the "U"s.  I put the puck that was in one of the tank "U"s under the back of the tank to get a little more clearance for the low fuel sending unit.  I am not sure this is an improvement, but it is like other Guzzi Calis now.

Yes, I should have painted the lugs.  Maybe later.

[guzzisteve]

You could start putting fender washers behind the metal cup to bring them out towards the tank till it's stable. So rubbers push on tank more, then use some grease so it slides nice.

[philwarner]

You could start putting fender washers behind the metal cup to bring them out towards the tank till it's stable. So rubbers push on tank more, then use some grease so it slides nice.

Actually, the tank was a tight fit width wise on the rubber mounts and I had to grease them to slide it over them.  I think it is the convex rounded shape that lets the tank rock a bit where the flat pucks wedged against the flat lugs did not rock much.  I assume this rocking is typical of the stock tank mounting, and I'll just have to get used to it.  At least there should be less chance of the front of the tank coming loose in the event of a wreck, a situation that had occurred to me when I discovered how it was mounted before.  I am still curious about whether anyone else has run across a frame with no holes in the lugs for what seems to be the standard California tank mount system.  Perhaps my frame was built on a Friday?

Oh, well.  Time to move on to learning to use my new CarbMate to check the balance of those Dellortos and then re-check my Triumph America's Keihin carbs.  The CarbMate should be faster and easier than messing with the home-made manometer I built to balance the Triumph's carbs.