V11 Jackal Fuel Filter Mishap -- Damaged Pump?

[ahaussmann123]

Hello All,

I recently picked up a new to me, 40,000 miles 200 V11 Jackal. She needs love, wouldn't idle, worn tires, been sitting, blah blah. But it came with hard luggage and was only $1500 so I couldn't say no.

In the process of giving the bike a refresher, and I made a foolish mistake. Essentially, my brain went soft and I installed a regular hose fitting style fuel filter on the bike, completely neglecting the fuel return line. I started her up, the pump made a weird squelching noise, but the bike idled fine, so I assumed nothing was wrong!

Boy was I wrong. 5 minutes into the test ride, and there's coughing, stuttering, a backfire, no fuel getting there at all. Limped back to the garage and ordered a wix 33008 on Amazon. 

The question I have, is did I do any lasting damage to the injectors or pump with no return line? Started it up multiple times, 5-10 mins of riding. Is there any way to test and be sure? I would like to take the bike on long rides without worrying if the pumps/injectors will go on me because of this foolish mistake.

[oldbike54]

 This series of Guzzi is tough , hook everything up and start it . I'll bet dollar bill it will be fine. It might need to be tuned .

 Dusty

[ahaussmann123]

This series of Guzzi is tough , hook everything up and start it . I'll bet dollar bill it will be fine. It might need to be tuned .

 Dusty

Glad to hear it!

Yeah she was running rich regardless of the fuel all over the plugs now, gotta get to the bottom of it.


Valves are done, gonna do the easy tune up (air screw, tps, tb balance) and check the spark boots as well.

Does this engine have the throttle body balance knob? Couldn’t find anything in the manual and I couldn’t see it when I looked down there 

[s1120]

I really bet you will be fine. Those pumps are pretty tough. I bet she ran REAL rich though at low speeds!!!   Hook it up right, and try it out. I bet your fine.

[fotoguzzi]

The balance is set at the TB with the TPS on it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVTiUqw8hew

[ahaussmann123]

The balance is set at the TB with the TPS on it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVTiUqw8hew

Oh thank you! Very helpful vid! Going to do a bit more reading but that really clears up how it all works.

Glad to hear this bike is tough to my ham fisted wrenching :P

Yeah there was wet fuel all over the plugs and I think I could see some reflecting off the cylinder heads... didn’t run it long enough do any damage tho methinks.

[Wayne Orwig]

In the process of giving the bike a refresher, and I made a foolish mistake. Essentially, my brain went soft and I installed a regular hose fitting style fuel filter on the bike, completely neglecting the fuel return line. I started her up, the pump made a weird squelching noise, but the bike idled fine, so I assumed nothing was wrong!

I have no idea what you mean by 'neglecting the fuel return line'.
Did you plug up the line that would return to the regulator?

There is an over pressure relief internal to the pump.

[ahaussmann123]

I have no idea what you mean by 'neglecting the fuel return line'.
Did you plug up the line that would return to the regulator?

There is an over pressure relief internal to the pump.

I simply did not use a fuel filter with an outlet to that hose, so I didn't connect it to anything.

More question for those on the thread!

1. Any gearbox issues? I've only ridden the bike a few times, but have vivid memories of issues getting into first, as well as the neutral indicator coming in in gear  Any remedies/checkups I can do to make sure the shifter is tight and I don't slam forward a light dropping the clutch in 'neutral' anymore? I'll do new gear oil but would that fix these issues? Any wisdom on the neutral sensor failing in that fashion?

[fotoguzzi]

Which hose in this pic did you not hook up? And did gas spray everywhere?


ignore the yellow hoses, that regulator vents to air not the throttle bodies.

[John Croucher]

If you look inside the inlet side of the fuel pump you will see a screen.  This can get plugged up.

[delrod]

I'm confused. My fuel filter has only two connections. In out no provision for return. Not a function or circuit provided for at the filter?

[ahaussmann123]

I’m not sure exactly which models it differs, but on the V11 jackal it is a fuel filter with banjo fittings, and a T junction on the filter output to the pressure regulator at the top of the tank.

Part of the reason I messed up is exactly that, from year to year & bike to bike on these V11’s the layout changes. I think it’s partially based on the tank style.

 Either way mine is fuel pump in the back, hose to filter, T junction to injectors and pressure relief at the tank. 🤷‍♂️

[oldbike54]

 Something is very wrong with this picture . I have a Jackal , what you are describing doesn't jibe . It almost sounds like you are describing a later model with the filter in the tank <scratches head>

 Dusty

[antmanbee]

I have a 2000 Jackal and it has a T out of the pump. One line goes to the injectors and the other to the pressure valve if I remember correctly.
It doesent much matter where the relief valve is after the pump. Whever, it will keep the pressure where it should be.

[delrod]

After looking at parts breakdown I think I understand now. Was the fitting cut off the line and only the supply to injectors reattached? If so the regulator was taken completely out of the circuit.

[ahaussmann123]

After looking at parts breakdown I think I understand now. Was the fitting cut off the line and only the supply to injectors reattached? If so the regulator was taken completely out of the circuit.

Yeah that's what happened. I mean I didn't cut it, just reinstalled the tank with the line dangling.

Either way, I guess any lasting damage will show itself within the next thousand miles and I don't plan on a long trip until I get to know the bike a bit better, especially the gearbox quirks it has had so far.

[fotoguzzi]

If you left a hose dangling don't you have fuel spewing all over?
So you have the regulator that mounts right on the fuel tank not in line, up front between the tank and steering head? I've seen that and it would make sense to have the T fitting then but you should still have a hose to the regulator from the t fitting as Antmanbee says.

 How are you at taking and posting pics?

The neutral switch is somewhat adjustable if I remember it right, it's a reed type thing on left of the tranny behind the starter. But memory a little foggy so hopefully someone else will chime in on that. You really have to shift with intent on the 5 speeds, it helps to preload the shift lever.

[delrod]

Back to the original questions you had about neutral indicator. The neutral indicator is not reliable the only thing a green light proves is that the bulb is not burned out. Finding neutral is a learned feel and loose linkage elements make it a steeper curve. Search the forum for suggestions. I have replacement shifter and linkage bushing that will probably help Pm me

[ahaussmann123]

If you left a hose dangling don't you have fuel spewing all over?
So you have the regulator that mounts right on the fuel tank not in line, up front between the tank and steering head? I've seen that and it would make sense to have the T fitting then but you should still have a hose to the regulator from the t fitting as Antmanbee says.

 How are you at taking and posting pics?

The neutral switch is somewhat adjustable if I remember it right, it's a reed type thing on left of the tranny behind the starter. But memory a little foggy so hopefully someone else will chime in on that. You really have to shift with intent on the 5 speeds, it helps to preload the shift lever.

I could take a pic of the two different filters if you would like.

My pressure regulator is not inline, it's on the front of the tank. The hose from the regulator to the T fitting was dangling, it only receives fuel from the filter, it would not leak it's got a one way valve and should be filled with pressurized fuel from the fitler. I used a straight filter without the T joint, therefore the hose remained dry and no fuel returned to the tank from the pump. This caused very rich conditions and crazy dangerous power stuttering, choking, stalling, and probably black smoke (I didn't look back I was too busy trying to control the damn thing) for about 5 mins during the test ride.

Today, I'm going to change out the filter to the correct one and that should fix my problems. I'm also going to tune the thing hopefully tomorrow, the season is coming to an end up here in NY but I might get an electric heater for the garage and extend my wrench time into december, I really wanna get this beast working right.

[fotoguzzi]

 
You definitely need a return hose to the tank or that's exactly what happens, it pressurized the line to the injectors way over what they could hold back?
Also, the filter is one way but the fittings should only let you hook it in the right direction.

[John A]

https://youtu.be/0vp3lEH5ATo
I ran across this video where a guy cleans a pump. I never even thought about it but it looks like an interesting thing to do.

[ahaussmann123]

https://youtu.be/0vp3lEH5ATo
I ran across this video where a guy cleans a pump. I never even thought about it but it looks like an interesting thing to do.

Ohhh nice, looks like something worth doing!

Thankfully, I hooked everything up and she seems to be running pretty well! Pump sounds strong again.

Post valves and air+fuel filter refresh, no more stalling! But there is a fairly loud ticking that gets drowned by exhaust above approx 5.5k, it’s annoying. Could be an exhaust leak, or Should I be worried it’s a bad valve, or is it normal??


Sadly no more test rides for a few days, the front tire went flat :( while the wheel is off I’ll do the TPS and maybe attempt throttle body balance.