clutch inner body not going in far

[motospotter]

I'm gonna start over tomorrow afternoon, thanks for helping out today. I am still not sure what is happening on my blue goose. Also is this normal wear on the cup


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[Antietam Classic Cycle]

I'm gonna start over tomorrow afternoon, thanks for helping out today. I am still not sure what is happening on my blue goose. Also is this normal wear on the cup?

The hole in the center should be ~ 6.5 mm deep when measured from the flat surface.

[guzzisteve]

I didn't see a pic of clutch plate splines on assembled group. Just make sure the protruding lip faces the trans.    Everything else been covered. 

[leroy_can]

I didn't see a pic of clutch plate splines on assembled group. Just make sure the protruding lip faces the trans.    Everything else been covered.

   Good point, surprised no one else mentioned it. Could that screw the release up as well?

[moto-uno]

  After all these years of assembling Guzzi clutchs (eyeball the spring slots and put my pinky in to feel for proper spring seating )
and I've never noticed the mark on the flywheel . Things you discover if you live long enough :) . Peter

[LesP]

[Scout63]

Sweet tool Les. The MG Cycle tool works fine but doesn’t dress up a tool box like yours.

[dxhall]

I’ve never noticed the mark on the pressure plate.  My current technique for in-frame clutch replacement is to clean the spring seats in the flywheel (off the motor) and then to glue the springs into the seats with gorilla glue.  When I put the flywheel back on the crank, the glue holds the springs straight out (ie, horizontal) so when I hold the pressure plate at an angle to the flywheel I can see both the glued-in springs and the spring seats in the pressure plate.  I then turn the pressure plate until a seat in the pressure plate aligns with a spring, and push it together. I hold it in with the MG Cycle compressor.

So far, so good. 

[Kiwi_Roy]

I'm in the middle of putting my loop back together so I took some measurements today.
Excuse my rough sketches.

One thing I noted, If you put the rod and all the components in the gearbox and turn it flange down on the bench the pusher assembly will push back far enough to expose the "O" ring seal.
You can see it in this picture.
----
Nice tool LesP but that means you need the splined boss off the gearbox, I didn't want to take that apart so I hacked out a couple of circles from an old cutting board and added 1 tooth, This allowed me to wind in the second drive plate while lining up the teeth then I simply bolted on the outer plate and torqued it up.

The gearbox slipped right on with a couple of wiggles.

[n3303j]

Just did clutch in my '98 EV.
I couldn't get proper clutch actuation with 6 "O" rings on the actuator rod.
Figure maybe counterbore in the input shaft was a bit shallow.
5 "O" rings worked fine.

[Tom H]

Nice sketch! Saved! Thanks!

BTW: The bearing is the newer one with only one washer. OP has the older style with 2 washers. No idea which is better??

It has been a debate on 5 or 6 O rings. IIRR I did 6 on my loops.

Tom

[Kiwi_Roy]

BTW: The bearing is the newer one with only one washer. OP has the older style with 2 washers. No idea which is better??

I wondered if there was a particular way to put that bearing in, cup inside or cup outside. I think I probably replaced that when I first put the bike back together, it had about 130K miles on the clock then.
Mine took all 6, If my measurements are right there is 10mm space in mine.

[Tom H]

There was a debate here on the 2 piece bearing. The consensus was that it didn't matter IIRR.

Tom

[leroy_can]

 Lots of good ideas coming from this. As far as having to remove the spline from the trans for a tool I agree that wouldn't be practical but by the time you are doing this most owners would have an old one to use for the tool. I didn't know that the flywheel mark coincided with the TDC mark so that's new info. Seems Guzzi puts proper marks at some locations and a dab of paint at others. The mark on the crankshaft to position the flywheel correctly so your timing marks are right is also vague. using glue to hold the springs if the engine is vertical is a good solution for sure.
    I went a little more in depth regarding the clutch spring alignment and if I got my math right there are actually 2 positions that would be right. The pressure plate has 66 teeth so each tooth is 5.454545454545... degrees apart and of course the 8 spring holes are 45 degrees apart.
Thus starting with the marks lined up and everything right to try going to the next choice you would move it either 8 or 9 teeth and instead of the necessary 45 degrees you would have either 43.6 or 49.1. As you go around looking for alignment this varies and some are close enough you might think you had it but not quite. At a couple of points the error is as close as 1.4 degrees which sounds close but again too much misalignment. The only other one that could work is if the pressure plate was moved 180 degrees that would be 33 teeth and   33x5.4545454545...i s 180. So yes you could have ignored the marks and found the opposite position but I expect you will find you were in one of the almost good locations.

[LesP]

Sweet tool Les. The MG Cycle tool works fine but doesn’t dress up a tool box like yours.

Ben, that was the most economical way for me to do it having the old hub, I could have 3D scanned the new splined hub, modded to a solid/hole centre then 3D printed it but that would have taken longer and I was in a hurry with this bike (Get done before fuel reserves ran out)

The holding tool was Acetyl, with a rough drill pattern to suit the spline, pressed onto the old hub then baked in the oven until it slid down and dropped off. (It could have been scanned/printed also)
A few bolts and done.
I still remember the early years (late 1970's on) where a good deal of those things were impossible so nothing is to much trouble these days to make the job easier tool wise.



The clutch in the Eldorado is a very light action (feather light compared to a Bevel drive Ducati) to the point I thought the springs were wrong but does not slip so must be normal.
I put near all new parts in (springs/spring-pressure plate/discs/intermediate/ring gear/plunger/bearing/push rod/cup) and did end up with both Torrington type bearings, one seemed a better quantity than the other (a roller had fallen out in the post) but forget which.

It is odd to me the clutch in question is not working (but all new parts might be different)
If you can hold your finger over the pushrod cycling the rear arm and it goes in and out at the hub end, all should AOK if the cup is fine also.

[Kiwi_Roy]

So that's what you were cooking in the oven,
I have an old clutch plate for that.      To tighten the gearbox nut I bolted the box to a plank and used the same clutch plate with a piece of aluminium strap, made it rasy peasy
           
The 32mm 3/4 drive socket is one I modified to get the nut off a VII Sport, it needs an extra deep socket but the 3/4 drive slips right over the extra long shaft, can't use a 3/4 ratchet of course so I just ground a couple of flats on it.
Its come to my rescue many times.

[motospotter]

Man what a great amount of info shared on this post. I put my bike back together a couple of days ago and have been riding it a bit. What I ended up doing was installing a new rod from an 1100 Sport(found in my parts bin). I also installed a small bearing in the inner cup. Now the clutch works with ease. I might have gotten away without using the bearing but since I need to ride tomorrow I was not gonna take any chances. I have it adjusted and lubricated and will really focus on it after my ride. This post has been very helpful, I will be referring to it when I get back into the clutch/tranny. COLORADO or BUST !!!