Tell me how bad I’ve messed up

[Anomaly]

This is an update/continuation of my thread "T3 Fork Rebuild Suggestions" so if you want/need more background go there but I thought this disserved a new thread. As previously recounted, I put everything together after installing new fork dampers, springs, seals, oil.... but the protruding tabs on the spring cup didn't really seat, especially the outward facing tab. This is the part in question:




I had second thoughts about going forward with my reassembly given that the outward facing tab never seemed to seat in the corresponding recess in the bottom of the outer fork leg. My guess is that the tabs are just slightly too wide for the recess I had hoped to carefully reduce the tab width just enough to get them to seat. But, when I went to take the forks apart, I ran into a problem--- I couldn't fully extract the bolt that goes up inside the bottom of the fork leg. I had put that bolt in with some Blue Loctite on it (perhaps too much) and while I could get the bolt to initiallly break loose, it then just spun without coming fully out of the extension piece on the damper which it threads into. I could hear it just spinning inside the fork but could not get it fully out and I can't get the fork apart to try to remedy the problem with the tabs on the spring cup.

What do I do now?

Signed, feeling stupid right now

[Fontain25]

Just an observation , Japanese manufacturers make special tools for such things.

[pehayes]

Worst case  you could drill off the head of the bolt, extract parts out the top, and then remove/replace the remaining bolt portions.  Of course, drilling would be problematic if the whole system spins too easily as the drill bit bites into the head.  Who's idea was the LocTite?  :-(

Spark erosion maybe?

You have my sympathies.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[smdl]

Try compressing the fork leg as much as possible to put tension on the assembly while removing the bolt (two sets of hands would help!). You might be able to introduce enough drag to overcome the Loctite and get the bolt out.  Best of luck.

Cheers,
Shaun

[faffi]

As Shaun said, keep the spring and top retainer in place, as this will increase friction and reduce the spinning. If you can also clamp the lower leg in a vise - I prefer to use the caliper mounts in soft jaws - you can have a helper put additional load on by compressing the fork.

But the most important thing you need now is a rattle gun. It will virtually always manage to shock the bolt out. If it is still unwilling to move, you can vary between tightening and losening to further encourage movement.

[Anomaly]

But the most important thing you need now is a rattle gun. It will virtually always manage to shock the bolt out. If it is still unwilling to move, you can vary between tightening and losening to further encourage movement.

I used a rattle gun initially and it did break the bolt loose but now it is spinning while still attached to the damper extension which prevents me from removing the bolt completely.

As to who suggested using Blue loctite (which MAY be holding the spinning parts together), it wasn't me but there is no point in naming names.

[faffi]

I have never had a Guzzi fork apart, and I cannot really understand how it works from the picture in this article about fork rebuild https://www.thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_tonti_fac_damper_rebuild_information.html#google_vignette



Can you use a blow torch from the bottom of the fork, without causing damage? If so, that will quickly soften the Loctite and should ease removal. If you cannot use a torch, an electrical heat gun and some extra time should yield the same result.

On my Virago, one damper rod bolt was just spinning when I wanted to tighten it. It got threaded all the way in, but would not allow me to torque it, even with a rattle gun. I used a 16 or 17 mm (forget what size) hex socket and a long extension to hold the rod when tightening the retaining bolt to speck, and it would have worked just as well to slacken the bolt, of course. However, it does not look like the Guzzi use the same design? However, if there is something you can get into the fork to prevent the rod from spinning, that would be the best solution if softening the Loctite does not help.

Virago damper rod

[Frenchfrog]

I think your best bet is to cut or grind the head of the bolt ...going to be a bitch though.
You back in Italy or still in France?

[Anomaly]

I think your best bet is to cut or grind the head of the bolt ...going to be a bitch though.
You back in Italy or still in France?

I'm back in Italy, poised (hah! for the vendemmia). My heart sank reading yours and others ' suggestions to cut the head of the bolt off.  I think that would have been next to impossible to do because the head was still mostly recessed in the fork leg. Fortunately, a small miracle happened! I had seen a tip to try brake cleaner (it dissolves Loctite) so I removed the air valve at the bottom of the fork and sprayed some in there being careful to incline the leg to keep the spray away from the new seal. After allowing for the spray to dry, I tried again to loosen the bolt. Success cane when I inserted a pick down the air valve hole (see photo).

Once I got it all apart, I found that I had sheared the outward facing tab off one of the spring cups (the other one was fine). I have written to Barnabe to see about ordering a replacement .

I can tell now that I need to do a better job cleaning out the bottom of the fork leg. It looks to me like some grease/dirt may be filling up the recess where the tab is supposed to slot into enough to cause the spring cup to just spin.

My education continues. ..

[Frenchfrog]

Congrats at getting the bugger out !
And don't beat yourself up 

[Anomaly]

Congrats at getting the bugger out !
And don't beat yourself up 

Thanks Chris. I personify an old saying: Wisdom comes from experience, but where does experience come from? From a lack of wisdom.

Learning all the time... Think I'll reward myself with a long autumn ride once I get it all back together (correctly).

[Chuck in Indiana]

Ms. Experience is a tough teacher. First, she gives you the test..then the lesson.  Attaboy!

[cliffrod]

Glad you got it loose but I think you having the opportunity to teach many of us that brake cleaner dissolves Loctite is a very big deal.  Thanks, man!!

[Anomaly]

Glad you got it loose but I think you having the opportunity to teach many of us that brake cleaner dissolves Loctite is a very big deal.  Thanks, man!!

I learn so much from this site, it's nice to be able to reciprocate if even just a little.

I should note that I don't think ALL brake cleaners will work. The YouTube clip where I learned of this suggested CRC brand. I'm in Italy and didn't have that on hand so I tested what I did have and both of these (see photo) "melted" the Loctite right off the test threads even though one isn't technically a brake cleaner.

[Stretch]

Brake cleaner melts Loctite?!

Oh, that's DEFINITELY something to remember. 

Many thanks for the tip, and glad you got the bugger apart.

                                           -Stretch

[Pescatore]

Fortunately, a small miracle happened! I had seen a tip to try brake cleaner (it dissolves Loctite)...

It reminds me why I read so many posts.  Looking for miracles.
That's a new miracle tip for me.

[Beowulf]

Having done my fair share of stupid things working on vehicles this isn’t one to hang your head about. As others commented it was educational. Thanks for sharing

[Anomaly]

To clarify: in my mind, the mistake I made was not the Loctite (OK, maybe I overdid it a bit . . ). No, the bonehead move was to torque it all down when I knew the outward facing tab wasn't seated. 

[bigbikerrick]

Good tip!   
Rick.