V Strom vs Norge

[mach1mustang351]

I have a 2007 VStrom 650. I have had it since New and it had served me pretty well for 30k miles.  I have been looking to upgrade and a 2007 Norge has come up for sale.  It has about 12k miles and looks to be in good shape.   I was wondering if anyone could provide insight as to how much of an upgrade this would be.

[Vasco DG]

Not so much an upgrade as a complete change of vehicle type I'd say. One advantage though with the Norge is that you will no longer look like a Hungarian root vegetable salesman when you are riding. This is the biggest problem with V-Stroms. They're great bikes.

Pete

[flip]

What is it about your V-Strom that you aren't happy with that you would like to get from another bike?

[segesta]

One advantage though with the Norge is that you will no longer look like a Hungarian root vegetable salesman when you are riding.

What was that? I was busy tying several cages full of chickens to the back of my V-Strom.

Anyway... the comparison I want to see is the Norge vs the upcoming MV Agusta Turismo Veloce. Quite different bikes but with the exact same mission. Too bad the MV Agusta won't be available in the USA until the autumn.

[oldbike54]

 Hey , I dated a Hungarian root vegetable salesperson  She was cute , although she always smelled faintly of onions 

  Dusty

[mach1mustang351]

What is it about your V-Strom that you aren't happy with that you would like to get from another bike?

Not much really.  I still struggle with a bit of comfort.  I have been through a few seat combinations with no luck.  It is predictable, it handles fine, it has lead me on several high mileage days, most recently a 940 mile day riding back to Alaska.  I guess the worst thing about it is... it's kind of boring. It does dirt roads okay, it does what I ask of it... it's just not exciting or fun to ride. Does that make sense or am I sounding crazy??

[menzies]

You are not sounding crazy, the V Stroms are great bikes just boring IMO. There has been a thread on here about character and the Norge and Guzzi's have it and UJMs do not. I have heard it said the Strom is an appliance and the Guzzi is a motorcycle.

[ChuckH]

You are not sounding crazy, the V Stroms are great bikes just boring IMO. There has been a thread on here about character and the Norge and Guzzi's have it and UJMs do not. I have heard it said the Strom is an appliance and the Guzzi is a motorcycle. 

I completely agree.  My previous bike, before the Stelvio, was an '09 650 Strom.  I used it for long distance touring.  It was a great bike but it was boring.  I use the Stelvio for the same purpose and I have a lot more fun riding it.  In almost 30K miles on the Guzzi, I have not one time regretted the decision to change. 

As far as the Norge/Strom comparison -- the Norge will not be comfortable off-road, it will have a bit more leaned-over riding position, it will be heavier, it is probably more top-heavy, it will require/demand more attention from you as the owner.  Ride safe.

[Cam3512]

What is it about your V-Strom that you aren't happy with that you would like to get from another bike?

Uh, it's NOT a Guzzi.  If you have to ask, you don't get it.

[toma nova]

I went from a 2008 Wee to a 2008 1200 Sport (and finally to a Stelvio!).  I liked my Wee (as I had a 2006 as well) but loved my 12S!

Wee pros compared to 12S
Leg room (I'm 6'3")
Wide flat seat with room to move front to back (OE gel seat +1")
Never needed any maintenance or attention
50+ mpg
Passenger seat and room to move

12S pros compared to Wee
Clean air from small fairing, never any buffeting
Sound, torque, power delivery
Looks and exclusivity
Ease of maintenance, especially valves
Slight forward lean, more comfortable for my lower back
Weight and wheelbase make it more stable
Better brakes and adjustable suspension

Ride the Norge and Wee back to back - I think you'll find the riding experience very different, then you can decide which you prefer.

BTW, I replaced the 12S with a Stelvio - all the benefits of the Wee riding position and room with the MG character.  Unfortunately, it also has the Wee buffeting, but I'm working through that.

Tom

[mach1mustang351]

I went from a 2008 Wee to a 2008 1200 Sport (and finally to a Stelvio!).  I liked my Wee (as I had a 2006 as well) but loved my 12S!

Wee pros compared to 12S
Leg room (I'm 6'3")
Wide flat seat with room to move front to back (OE gel seat +1")
Never needed any maintenance or attention
50+ mpg
Passenger seat and room to move

12S pros compared to Wee
Clean air from small fairing, never any buffeting
Sound, torque, power delivery
Looks and exclusivity
Ease of maintenance, especially valves
Slight forward lean, more comfortable for my lower back
Weight and wheelbase make it more stable
Better brakes and adjustable suspension

Ride the Norge and Wee back to back - I think you'll find the riding experience very different, then you can decide which you prefer.

BTW, I replaced the 12S with a Stelvio - all the benefits of the Wee riding position and room with the MG character.  Unfortunately, it also has the Wee buffeting, but I'm working through that.

Tom

I may hold out for a stelvio.  I sold myself on buying a GS BMW but I see the Stelvio has all my requirements checked off ... and its a Guzzi. I have liked the styling on the Norges.... Norgi.... (whatever the plural of Norge is) so they have been sort of in my thoughts. I have thought something that can run the Alaska construction roads, and dirt roads needs to be tall and dual sport like.  I see lots of street oriented rigs around so I wanted to look into this.

[menzies]

I think the Stelvio would serve you well, mine has been a work horse with no issues whatsoever.

[MariusD]

I can relate to what the OP is saying. I own a '12 650 strom.

I did a 450 mile trip last saturday and it really wore me out. Though it was fun to cover the miles and see the sights in reasonable comfort, I got home feeling like I had been slapped around all day and was just beat to heck. Like the OP, I could never really dial in comfort perfectly, even thought I have a russell seat, foot peg lowering kit, and 2in pivoting bar risers. Even with the mods I still tend to squirm a lot, yet comfort wouldn't be my chief complait.

The bigger issues exacerbating fatigue on this bike are that the cheap suspension gives the rider more road feel than you need/want on an extended ride, and also the buffetting is pretty bad. Mind you, my bike is also fitted with an AF research shield.

Thus in my book, the Norge would be a superb upgrade if it at least addressed those two issues 1) road absorbtion and 2) buffetting, without adding any new ones to worry about, lol!

[ChuckH]

....The bigger issues exacerbating fatigue on this bike are that the cheap suspension gives the rider more road feel than you need/want on an extended ride, and also the buffetting is pretty bad. Mind you, my bike is also fitted with an AF research shield.

Thus in my book, the Norge would be a superb upgrade if it at least addressed those two issues 1) road absorbtion and 2) buffetting, without adding any new ones to worry about, lol!

I agree.  I went through both ends on my '09 Wee -- Emulators and springs up front and a complete shock rebuild in the rear.  Made a huge difference in how the bike felt on the road and conformed to rougher road surfaces.

The thing that has not been talked about in this discussion is the difference in the suspension travel of the Adv Touring (AT) bikes as compared to the Sport Touring (ST) bikes.  Typically, the AT bikes will have several inches more travel than the ST bikes.  In my experience from riding a very good Concours C-14 ST bike and then a (modified as above) Wee-Strom and my current Stelvio, the AT bikes are much more compliant and easy to ride over typical rough road surfaces.  The ST bikes, on the other hand, can be set up to be compliant to the road surfaces but tend to be more harsh and give a lot more negative feedback to the rider.

Ride safe.

[ohiorider]

I went from a 2008 Wee to a 2008 1200 Sport (and finally to a Stelvio!).  I liked my Wee (as I had a 2006 as well) but loved my 12S!

Wee pros compared to 12S
Leg room (I'm 6'3")
Wide flat seat with room to move front to back (OE gel seat +1")
Never needed any maintenance or attention
50+ mpg
Passenger seat and room to move

12S pros compared to Wee
Clean air from small fairing, never any buffeting
Sound, torque, power delivery
Looks and exclusivity
Ease of maintenance, especially valves
Slight forward lean, more comfortable for my lower back
Weight and wheelbase make it more stable
Better brakes and adjustable suspension

Ride the Norge and Wee back to back - I think you'll find the riding experience very different, then you can decide which you prefer.

BTW, I replaced the 12S with a Stelvio - all the benefits of the Wee riding position and room with the MG character.  Unfortunately, it also has the Wee buffeting, but I'm working through that.

Tom

Tom, I'm still loving my 12S.  Almost at 56,000 miles.  The two valve engine continues to amaze.  Trannys on the CARC bikes shift very smoothly for shaft drive bikes with engine-speed clutches.  A wonderful machine whether running 70-80mph on the 'slab,' or riding the sweepers.  Stock saddle not so good for extended rides, but that's why I have the Corbin in waiting.  Good suspension.  One of the best overall ST machines I've owned.  And you're 100% on the mark re the small fairing ..... punches a nice hole thru the air, but doesn't buffet.

[mach1mustang351]

I agree.  I went through both ends on my '09 Wee -- Emulators and springs up front and a complete shock rebuild in the rear.  Made a huge difference in how the bike felt on the road and conformed to rougher road surfaces.

The thing that has not been talked about in this discussion is the difference in the suspension travel of the Adv Touring (AT) bikes as compared to the Sport Touring (ST) bikes.  Typically, the AT bikes will have several inches more travel than the ST bikes.  In my experience from riding a very good Concours C-14 ST bike and then a (modified as above) Wee-Strom and my current Stelvio, the AT bikes are much more compliant and easy to ride over typical rough road surfaces.  The ST bikes, on the other hand, can be set up to be compliant to the road surfaces but tend to be more harsh and give a lot more negative feedback to the rider.

Ride safe.

It has been a while since I have ridden a proper "street" motorcycle.  I have had the v strom as pretty much my only machine for 8 years. I am comfortable on that adventure style bike. I like my feet under me and being a little more upright.  I think up here in Alaska, with what I do I still need the off road ability. Maybe the norge won't fit in. I'll still think on it.  OR maybe I need a Norge AND a Stelvio 

[MariusD]

It has been a while since I have ridden a proper "street" motorcycle.  I have had the v strom as pretty much my only machine for 8 years. I am comfortable on that adventure style bike. I like my feet under me and being a little more upright.  I think up here in Alaska, with what I do I still need the off road ability. Maybe the norge won't fit in. I'll still think on it.  OR maybe I need a Norge AND a Stelvio 

If not the stelvio, then give the super tenere a hard look. Thats a do it all bike thats hard to beat for the money.

[mach1mustang351]

If not the stelvio, then give the super tenere a hard look. Thats a do it all bike thats hard to beat for the money.

The tenere looks great but I think I am off of Japanese bikes for a while. They are good but they have the edge tuned out of them. Maybe a multistrada, GS, Stelvio, Triumph or some such thing.  I'm kind of weird though, I have two Volvos an AMC and already a Guzzi.

[Doppelgaenger]

I imagine that the size of the Stelvio isn't going to be a problem for you if it hasn't come up yet?

The stelvio is a very large and heavy bike, make sure that you're comfortable picking it up (or just able to) when it's fully loaded. Same is true for the 1200GS.

I had an SV650 so same engine as your 'strom but a little taller gearing. Now I have an 06 Breva 1100 so same bike basically as the 07 Norge you're contemplating.

There is no comparison. The Guzzi is so much more fun to ride and MUCH easier to maintain. The torque is endless fun at all revs and the engine pulls strong past 4500 rpm. People trip out over the engine all the time.

The Guzzi does get a little tiring after the engine has had a chance to shake you for a couple hundred miles and the saddle isn't anywhere near as good as some reviewers made it out to be, but it's still better than the suzuki stock saddle by a lot. The engines require oil that is slightly unobtanium (10w60 synthetic, get it from NAPA) Guzzis are never still unless the engine is off, but if you're going offroad you're getting shaken to bits anyway.

For what it's worth, I think I'd rather have chain drive to go offroad, if only because the CARC shaft drive system is big and bulky and it clunks and bangs when you take it offroad. Having said that, I still hate chain drive with a passion.

Have you considered the KTM 990 or 1190? They really are the top name in the business when it comes to making ADV bikes. Expensive as hell to fix and run tho...

[mach1mustang351]

I imagine that the size of the Stelvio isn't going to be a problem for you if it hasn't come up yet?

The stelvio is a very large and heavy bike, make sure that you're comfortable picking it up (or just able to) when it's fully loaded. Same is true for the 1200GS.

I had an SV650 so same engine as your 'strom but a little taller gearing. Now I have an 06 Breva 1100 so same bike basically as the 07 Norge you're contemplating.

There is no comparison. The Guzzi is so much more fun to ride and MUCH easier to maintain. The torque is endless fun at all revs and the engine pulls strong past 4500 rpm. People trip out over the engine all the time.

The Guzzi does get a little tiring after the engine has had a chance to shake you for a couple hundred miles and the saddle isn't anywhere near as good as some reviewers made it out to be, but it's still better than the suzuki stock saddle by a lot. The engines require oil that is slightly unobtanium (10w60 synthetic, get it from NAPA) Guzzis are never still unless the engine is off, but if you're going offroad you're getting shaken to bits anyway.

For what it's worth, I think I'd rather have chain drive to go offroad, if only because the CARC shaft drive system is big and bulky and it clunks and bangs when you take it offroad. Having said that, I still hate chain drive with a passion.

Have you considered the KTM 990 or 1190? They really are the top name in the business when it comes to making ADV bikes. Expensive as hell to fix and run tho...

I'm not so worried about the weight. Most of my time is spent on road or on hard packed gravel type roads. No singlet track or anything like that.  I really want to like a KTM but I also hate chains. I want the next bike to be shaft drive.  I dont know that I care so much about the engine vibrations. I like to ride a lot of miles but if the comfort is better overall I think engine character can be dealt with. I appreciate all the feedback this is getting. Thanks for all the help everyone

[katanaman]

Go A Stelvio..... you will never look back!!!