Borrani Wheel restoration

[motogman]

I have been meaning to do some searches to research wheel restoration.  I know Canuck750 has a good description in his V7 Sport restoration thread and I hope to get to that yet tonight.  But I thought I would also start a wheel specific thread and see what wisdom I can find before I do damage or hurt myself.

I decided to pull the wheels completely apart to get them cleaned up looking better so I spent some time in the garage tonight doing the disassembly on the rear wheel.  I have run into two problems illustrated below.

So here are some pics and some questions...


Getting started...  tires removed.



As I worked around the rim to loosen the spokes I was tapping the spokes through the hub with a wood drift on the nipple end to move them through the hub.  Some were much more difficult than others but most came without problem.


Unfortunately I missed one and it is stubborn.  I tried some heat but it did not budge.  I decided to quit while I was ahead, have a glass of wine and see if any of you have a good idea.  I will go at it again tomorrow.


The other problem I have is that I went to unbolt the drive hub and removed the 6 bolts.  But the hub did not come loose.  So what is the deal here?  Why is it so intimately retained to the aluminum hub?  I whacked it a couple of times with a rubber hammer and then with a wood drift but no luck.  Again I backed off this until tomorrow.  The other question is regarding the bearings and the how these are pressed in and how to press them out.  I need to go look at the parts manual but you guys always have good advice... (except when it comes to buying another motorcycle  )



As always I appreciate the input and help.

[canuck750]

Good on you for saving an original Borrani

I am in the middle of restoring a pair on my 750S project, just built the front wheel this evening.

The two rims where pretty corroded and scuffed. To speed up the refinishing I would recommend using the NAPA Aluminum brightener diluted 50% in a mister bottle. Once the rim is separated from the hub tale the hub and rim to a coin car wash, use a full face respirator and soak the two parts and let sit for a minute then blast off the crud, you will probably need to repeat the process three or four times to get a spotless rim and hub.

I use a 400 grit sanding pad on a foam backed rotating hand sander, work over the outside faces of the rim until all scuffs are gone. This save a ton of polishing. I use a rouge polishing paste on a bench grinder mounted buffer to polish the rim, takes about half an hour rotating the rim outer and inner surfaces across the face of the turning buffer pad, keep dressing the wheel and adding more rouge.

For the spokes I clean them on a fine brass wire wheel on my bench grinder, cleans up the stainless pokes and brass nipples to like new. A final buff of the nipple threaded onto the spoke shines them up.

The splined hub will press out in a hydraulic press, they are tight fitting. I would not remove it unless the splines are worn and you are installing a new spline.

To get the bearings out pry the grease seal out with a flat blade screwdriver, the bearing in its flanged retainer will fall out, there is a distance spacer between the bearings inside the hub and most importantly a shim or shims on one end of the distance spacer between a bearing, It is critical you rebuild the bearing and spacers with the shims installed as per original.  Clean the bearings up with paint thinner, and then repack them by hand with wheel bearing grease.

I clean the hub brake drum with a scotch bright disc in a drill.

Good luck with your build!

Cheers

Jim

[Cal3Me]

Jim,,,,,,, once you wash the crud off  do you bead blast at all? And to start the polishing how do you get in between the grooves of the hub to polish them? Then once polished up do you coat them with anything to help preserve the shine. I'm at the same point with my project,, but a little hesitant to break apart a wheel.

Tim

[motogman]

Thanks Jim.

I was just reviewing your V7 thread and have refreshed my understanding of the process that you used.  I have to go to the NAPA store and get some of that cleaner.

Why didn't you just bead blast the hubs?  Or did you?

Your polished rims look fantastic.  How were the Borrani's supplied - ie originally finished?  On the bike from the museum that you posted some pictures of they looked more of a dull aluminum finish and not the bright polished finish.  I am trying to decide how to proceed.

After looking at the parts manual and service manual I see that the rear drive hub is pressed into the aluminum hub and I have no reason to disturb that intimate relationship so I will clean the bolts up and reassemble them.

I see in your thread that you sourced a "correct" Borrani wheel with the word 'record' stamped in.  Mine has these with about a 1.24" rim height on the rear and about 1.06" on the front rim.  So what is the deal with these?  What is special about the 'record', where were they used and why are they hard to find?  Inquiring minds....

[motogman]

Jim,,,,,,, once you wash the crud off  do you bead blast at all? And to start the polishing how do you get in between the grooves of the hub to polish them? Then once polished up do you coat them with anything to help preserve the shine. I'm at the same point with my project,, but a little hesitant to break apart a wheel.

Tim

I was also afraid to pull mine apart but after talking to some people and getting a quote to have someone else clean them up, I bit the bullet, had a sip of whisky and went at it.  After cleaning, I am planning on lacing them myself and then having a 'professional' do the final tightening and straightening.  Should be an hour or two of labor rather than many hours.

[John Ulrich]

I used a Craftsman Polisher/Buffer (now discontinued) clamped to the workbench.  Using sticks of polishing compounds (Eastwoods) I would push the rim into the spinning wheel for hours.  For in between the spokes I had a flex shaft chucked to my drill press with different buffs (Eastwoods) on the end of it.  For the brass nipples I put them on a phillips screwdriver shaft and again used the buffer to shine them up.  That buffer once caught it's cord on the spinning buff wheel and snapped the power cord in half......that's the type of power you need to create the heat needed to put a "shine on"
If you can see the bolt holding the fender stay & lower fork pinch bolt.  They are stainless with the markings filed off and polished like chrome using the high rpms generated by a high torque buffer.  Your small benchtop grinder wheel does not make the torque needed.

[canuck750]

Jim,,,,,,, once you wash the crud off  do you bead blast at all? And to start the polishing how do you get in between the grooves of the hub to polish them? Then once polished up do you coat them with anything to help preserve the shine. I'm at the same point with my project,, but a little hesitant to break apart a wheel.

Tim

I don't bead blast with glass bead or sand, the NAPA aluminum brightener works so much better than blast media, there is no comparison in results or how little time it takes with the brightener. Sometimes I follow up with soda blasting, I use industrial baking soda that I buy in 5 gallon pails. Soda works by the crystal fracturing upon impact on the surface and the fractured soda crystal scours the surface. Glass bead does not scour as effectively as soda and takes a long time to remove aluminum oxide.

I do not polish the hubs, Guzzi never polished the hubs on the Loops or Tonti frame bikes.

After I finish building a wheel I wash it down with brake cleaner sprayed into a rag then wipe on ACF50.

Rear wheel hub cleaned with brightener only, scotch pad wheel in a drill polished the inside of the hub and bearing races, same scotch pad wheel cleaned up the brake drum surface

[canuck750]

Thanks Jim.

I was just reviewing your V7 thread and have refreshed my understanding of the process that you used.  I have to go to the NAPA store and get some of that cleaner.

Why didn't you just bead blast the hubs?  Or did you?

Your polished rims look fantastic.  How were the Borrani's supplied - ie originally finished?  On the bike from the museum that you posted some pictures of they looked more of a dull aluminum finish and not the bright polished finish.  I am trying to decide how to proceed.

After looking at the parts manual and service manual I see that the rear drive hub is pressed into the aluminum hub and I have no reason to disturb that intimate relationship so I will clean the bolts up and reassemble them.

I see in your thread that you sourced a "correct" Borrani wheel with the word 'record' stamped in.  Mine has these with about a 1.24" rim height on the rear and about 1.06" on the front rim.  So what is the deal with these?  What is special about the 'record', where were they used and why are they hard to find?  Inquiring minds....

The Borrani rims where polished from the factory, they will dull with time as surface oxidation builds. If you get the surface straight and free of cuts and deep nicks with sanding it will not take too long to polish the rim. Though a wheel can be polished when laced I would recommend stripping the rim, cleaning off all oxidation and checking for cracks at the spoke holes.

The V7 Sport came with the Borrani Record rims, they are slightly different than the standard Borrani rims as used on the Loops, 850T and T3 amongst other. Record rims go for around $500 a piece of you can find one. Unless you are building a 100% stock V7 Sport I wouldn't spend the money on a Record rim.

Todays work, front wheel for a 750S, the rim is polished but not to a mirror look, the hub was cleaned with Aluminum Brightener, then hit with a pass of soda blast. Spokes and nipple polished. lace up all spoke nipples finger tight, then tap the spoke head into the hub with a brass pointed hammer, re hand tighten, then tap all spoke heads once more and finger tighten the nipples, I will then true the rim with a dial indicator on a wheel truing stand.

[motogman]

Very nice...  At my pace you are weeks, no, maybe months, possibly even years ahead of me...   :-)

I plan to finish the rear wheel disassembly today and take the front apart as well.  I am planning to go to a friends shop on Saturday and will do a walnut shell blast of the parts and see where I am.

I don't think I am going to do the high level mirror finish you did you your V7.  I like the look and level of shine you have on the 750S wheels you are doing now.

It looks like you have new bolts for the front wheel assembly.  Mine were pretty corroded when I pulled the front hub apart and I will be sourcing new bolts as well.  I was thinking a standard 10.9 grade bolts but 8.8 might be just as good or even better as they are likely less sensitive to fracture if they develop corrosion pits.  What did you go with?

Your work is always amazing and I appreciate all the details you share.  (If my emoticons were working you would get one of the bowing ones...)

[Oldrat]

Please think twice before letting any bead blasting near your precious Borranis.

I took lots of bits for prep to a local metal refinisher, he mixed up the order and instead of vapour blasting he sand blasted my Borrani rims. They came out with a finish exactly like sandpaper.  It's taken an age, lots and lots of elbow grease, not to mention a loss of detail, to get them anywhere smooth like original.


All they really ever need is a good polishing.

[canuck750]

It looks like you have new bolts for the front wheel assembly.  Mine were pretty corroded when I pulled the front hub apart and I will be sourcing new bolts as well.  I was thinking a standard 10.9 grade bolts but 8.8 might be just as good or even better as they are likely less sensitive to fracture if they develop corrosion pits.  What did you go with?

I use high grade bolts for the disc flanges, just standard cad plated, not stainless.

This is the soda blaster kit I use that I got at Harbour Freight

http://www.harborfreight.com/15-lb-portable-soda-blaster-60802.html

The pressure bottle is really not necessary, all you need is a plastic pail with a lid, drill a hole in the lid, fill the pail up with some baking soda.
Harbour Freight sells a hand grip spray nozzle with a rubber hose attached and a fitting to connect to an air compressor.

Not quite like this but similar idea, I can't find the description of the cheap siphon sprayer I bought a couple years ago.

http://www.harborfreight.com/air-tools/paint/air-siphon-spray-gun-kit-61456.html

Hook up compressed air to the nozzle fitting and stick the rubber hose into the pail of soda. Venturi effect draws the soda up the rubber hose and the compressed air forces the soda out the nozzle. The soda is not reusable, just sweep up the finished soda and throw it out.

Soda will clean up the most corroded aluminum parts without risking any damage to the part.

Do not use glass bead blasting on any internal engine, transmission or drive parts.

Keep at it, once you get the hang of wheel building it will go pretty quick.

Cheers

Jim

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

I don't bead blast with glass bead or sand, the NAPA aluminum brightener works so much better than blast media, there is no comparison in results or how little time it takes with the brightener. Sometimes I follow up with soda blasting, I use industrial baking soda that I buy in 5 gallon pails. Soda works by the crystal fracturing upon impact on the surface and the fractured soda crystal scours the surface. Glass bead does not scour as effectively as soda and takes a long time to remove aluminum oxide.

I do not polish the hubs, Guzzi never polished the hubs on the Loops or Tonti frame bikes.

In my experience, bead blasting does a better job than soda blasting or just cleaning with any acid. Using high volume and low pressure (15 psi), oxidation is removed in one pass and the aluminum left clean and looking factory fresh. <shrug>

Bead blasting has another benefit for drum brakes: it "roughs up" the drum surface, shoes bed in faster and better braking is the result.

Guzzi did polish a portion of drum brake hubs - the flat edge where the spoke holes are.

[ed.bremner]

 

he mixed up the order and instead of vapour blasting he sand blasted my Borrani rims.

I can't imagine it is a common mistake, but 29years ago when I was re-building my T3 Cali, some idiot did exactly the same to my Borranis.  I think I cried solidly for a week.  I simply couldn't face polishing them all back to shinny, so just polished the outer edges of the wheels.  It looked kind of cool with the inner bits matt and the outside shinny, but after a while it ended up looking pretty crap. 

The biggest problem is that they are simply impossible to keep clean.  I just gave up about 10-15 years ago and let the inner parts stay mucky and polish the outer edges.

Yours look just beautiful.  I am very jealous 

Best

eib

[canuck750]

In my experience, bead blasting does a better job than soda blasting or just cleaning with any acid. Using high volume and low pressure (15 psi), oxidation is removed in one pass and the aluminum left clean and looking factory fresh. <shrug>

Bead blasting has another benefit for drum brakes: it "roughs up" the drum surface, shoes bed in faster and better braking is the result.

Guzzi did polish a portion of drum brake hubs - the flat edge where the spoke holes are.

I am guessing it depends upon the grit of the glass bead, I use a #7 or finer and lately have pretty much abandoned glass bead as a process. A heavier grit of any media will cut quicker but it will also cut deeper. Despite the inherent dangers of working with Aluminum Brightener, with proper safety equipment (full face respirator and gloves) the removal of oxidation is complete and there is no residue of abrasive material to contend with. Blast media, particularly glass bead can and will embed in an alloy surface, where there are bearings present I would avoid the use of glass media.
Just my opinion, there are many ways to get to the same result so whatever works best in a particular circumstance is the way to go.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Blast media, particularly glass bead can and will embed in an alloy surface, where there are bearings present I would avoid the use of glass media.

At 15 psi it's impossible to embed glass beads into an aluminum surface and the beads themselves   last much longer.

[Cal3Me]

That Kiwi juice is good stuff  I like that finished shine on the norton. Would look good on my Eldo

JU......your bikes insane shine is crazy man but I like it too

Then there is JB ,,,,,,,, :1:

Then there is the texas turnip 

Your all an inspiration 

[jabberwocky]

So prior to this thread, I thought all the Borrani rims on  Tontis were Records, but it's been said here that they were special to the V7 Sport. I checked my stash (2 front and 2 rear wheels) and they are all stamped Record. They all came from 850Ts, unless they were all replaced at some time. What is different about them anyway?

[canuck750]

Borrani Record Cross rims were used on the V7 Sport bikes, I think I read that the disc brake 74 V7 Sport front rim is not a cross rim.

this is a correct Record Cross rear rim for a V7 Sport



Example of the height of the flange on a Record Cross



As compared to a standard Record rim

[motogman]

Jim,  Evidence from my bike suggests you are correct about the 74 disc models not having the "CROSS" reference on the front wheel.  The sport I am working on is a 74 disc model and from everything with it so far I think it is very original.    However, as is usual, this inspection and comparison raises some other questions.  The wheel markings are as follows:

Front:  BORRANI WM - 3 / 2.15-18 / 40 RM-01-4745 / RECORD / MADE IN ITALY



Rear:  BORRANI WM3 18 RECORD RM 01 4566 CROSS



There are several differences in how your wheel is labeled and how these are.  My rear rim does not have the "3/2.15-18..." marking but the front does.  As you note the front is not marked "CROSS".  Where my rear is marked CROSS the sequence is different than how yours is marked and mine does not have the "Made in Italy" stamped.  When you look at mine the stamping of the 4566 (might be 4666) and the CROSS are stamped quite different (lighter) than the rest of the markings.

The flange height on the rear agrees with the larger of the measurements you show and the front is the smaller value.

What are the markings on your front wheel?

[canuck750]

I will take some pictures and measurements of my 73 V7 Sport front wheel tomorrow and post them to compare.

I have a couple original Eldorado Borrani rear wheels and there are different markings on a couple but I am sure they are all original. The Record Cross rims have a taller flange and a thicker cross section to the extrusion.

[canuck750]

V7 Sport Front Borrani Record Cross rim





850T Borrani Record front rim

[motogman]

Have you decoded what the various markings mean on these wheels?

Also - what tires do you run and do others recommend for the V7 Sport - as I finish the wheels I need to get them dressed.   

[canuck750]

I have installed Bridgestone BT45's on my V7 Sport and S3.

I have heard that the Pirelli Sport Demon have been favoured as well.

[earemike]

Jim,  Evidence from my bike suggests you are correct about the 74 disc models not having the "CROSS" reference on the front wheel.  The sport I am working on is a 74 disc model and from everything with it so far I think it is very original.    However, as is usual, this inspection and comparison raises some other questions.  The wheel markings are as follows:

Front:  BORRANI WM - 3 / 2.15-18 / 40 RM-01-4745 / RECORD / MADE IN ITALY

My V7 Sport (disc front) has the same rim as yours. I think the 750S also had this rim.

I had my hubs vapour blasted.