Engine oil amount, sump spacer, dipstick, LM2

[Dobermann]

Greetings,

I've got my bike(LM2) with a sump spacer and I am not sure how much oil should I put in. Should I put the standard amount? How much is the standard amount? I did an extensive work on the engine , changed the oil filter too and drained about 3 litre oil as per LM2 manual book. For the first start I've putted again 3 litre oil.
Once I put the correct amount of oil I will check if my dipstick is correctly marked.

Thank you.

[Groover]

I've always wondered about this modification too 

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Your dip stick will not be exactly right. I have had a spacer on my CX100 for some time and what I do is use the 3 qt fill. The idea behind the spacer is to put some space between the oil level and the crank not to increase the amount of oil so the crank windage will be lessened thus blow by will be less.

 

[Dobermann]

Thank you kirby1923. Great advice. I will do exactly as you said.

[Groover]

I have a question ("raising hand" emoji, where are you?..)

What does this exactly mean? "so the crank windage will be lessened thus blow by will be less"

Does this help keep the oil on the crank better?

[kirby1923]

I have a question ("raising hand" emoji, where are you?..)

What does this exactly mean? "so the crank windage will be lessened thus blow by will be less"

Does this help keep the oil on the crank better?

OK
As the crank spins it creates allot of wind (windage) in the crankcase, and with oil splash and the strong pressure  pulses created by the motion of the pistons going up and down (-&+) oil is picked up by the crank and turned into a mist.

This mist can become pretty thick when the distance between the crank and the oil level in the pan is small, and when it does the breather system becomes saturated with oil as it vents the crankcase.

So when you use the sump extender it creates more distance between the spinning crank and the level of the oil carried by the breather system which is often vented overboard.

Phew!
:-)

[Groover]

^ Nice job, I get it now! 

I think I may need one then.

Thanks for the explanation!

[Stevex]

I fitted a sump extension to my LM2 a while back and use the same amount of oil as a standard replenishment.
The owners manual says 3 litres.
As I don't have my fairing side panels fitted I've removed the original dipstick c/w extension tube and use a screw in dipstick which is made for use with a sump extension, available from Gutsibits, here, second one down:

http://www.gutsibits.co.uk/pr/TheShop/index.php?q=sump+extension&f=d&Model=7&search=SEARCH

Although for some reason it doesn't mention LM2 in the fitment guide, it fits and indicates an equal oil capacity at one third down the level scale (high to low marks) as the original does at half way between the same markers.

[ohiorider]

Would the purpose of an oil pump on a small block be to increase the oil capacity?  I've entertained the thought of owning a small block, and understood that some owners install a spacer to increase crankcase capacity.  So, what I'm thinking is that a spacer may be used to solve different issues, depending on whether one is installed on a BB (windage) or SB engine (capacity?)  Just curious.

[TOMB]

I have a Harper's outsider on my 76 convert (spacer filter) and the dipstick
I ended up using was from a 1980's Cali 11.
Works perfectly , plastic ,screws in by hand complete with o ring and correctly
Marked
TOMB

[Dobermann]

About the dipstick -  how you measure the level? With dipstick screwed, or just touching tha case?

[kirby1923]

About the dipstick -  how you measure the level? With dipstick screwed, or just touching tha case?

If you using a new longer stick you have option of choosing between screwed in or not since you making new marks.
I chose to make the two qt/ltr mark my add point.
I believe my manual specified screwed in for the stock set up. My new stick is not threaded so I marked it just pushed in.

:-)

[Spuddy]

As the crank spins it creates allot of wind (windage) in the crankcase, and with oil splash and the strong pressure  pulses created by the motion of the pistons going up and down (-&+) oil is picked up by the crank and turned into a mist.

This mist can become pretty thick when the distance between the crank and the oil level in the pan is small, and when it does the breather system becomes saturated with oil as it vents the crankcase.

So when you use the sump extender it creates more distance between the spinning crank and the level of the oil carried by the breather system which is often vented overboard.

As a kid I remember putting 'windage trays' in the oil pans of V8s.  Supposedly to prevent oil foaming, added friction from splashing oil and to reduce the possibility of air in the oil pump and lines. Does this still (did it ever?) hold true?

Spud

[kirby1923]

As a kid I remember putting 'windage trays' in the oil pans of V8s.  Supposedly to prevent oil foaming, added friction from splashing oil and to reduce the possibility of air in the oil pump and lines. Does this still (did it ever?) hold true?

Spud

Absolutely!
A few of the extended sump pans on the market have cast in "windage" or "baffle" plates for this purpose and there are baffle plates that can be used without the extension also.

I believe that they are worthwhile and does indeed help to lesson splash and windage impact.

Mine has the baffle cast in.

:-)

[rocker59]

Would the purpose of an oil pump on a small block be to increase the oil capacity?  I've entertained the thought of owning a small block, and understood that some owners install a spacer to increase crankcase capacity.  So, what I'm thinking is that a spacer may be used to solve different issues, depending on whether one is installed on a BB (windage) or SB engine (capacity?)  Just curious.

Windage is not a problem on the small blocks, but 1.9 liters scares a lot of people, so they add the spacer to add capacity. 

On my big block Guzzis, over the past ten years, I've used Pete Roper Sloppage Sheets.  A baffle / windage tray to keep the oil in the sump during spirited riding.  An essential add-on for the V11 Sport/LeMans because of oil pick up location, but also nice to have on a Sport 1100 that is ridden as intended.

[ohiorider]

Windage is not a problem on the small blocks, but 1.9 liters scares a lot of people, so they add the spacer to add capacity. 

On my big block Guzzis, over the past ten years, I've used Pete Roper Sloppage Sheets.  A baffle / windage tray to keep the oil in the sump during spirited riding.  An essential add-on for the V11 Sport/LeMans because of oil pick up location, but also nice to have on a Sport 1100 that is ridden as intended.

Thanks, R59 ....... my 790cc 2003 Bonnie took over 3.5 quarts, 3.8 if I recall.  Almost 2x the capacity.  Does the addition of a sump allow for another 1/2 to 3/4 quart of oil? 

Perhaps the Bonneville depended on oil cooling more than the small block Guzzis (?) therefore the rationale for nearly double the oil in the sump.

Bob

[pehayes]

I fitted a sump extension to my LM2 a while back and use the same amount of oil as a standard replenishment.
The owners manual says 3 litres.

Just as a reference, my 98EV uses essentially the same engine and sump casting and comes from the factory with a 1" sump spacer.  The oil spec is still just 3 liters.  Thus, the extra quart of internal space created by the sump spacer is a quart of air and not a quart of oil.

Don't be anal about it.  3 quarts = 3 liters and who cares about the unit differential.  Mark your own dipstick any way that suits you after you do an oil change and add the precise quantity.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[pehayes]

Windage is not a problem on the small blocks

If you have had a smallblock case apart, you will note that the casting already includes a casting area below the crank to separate the oil puddle from the turbulent crank chamber air.

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[Stevex]

About the dipstick -  how you measure the level? With dipstick screwed, or just touching tha case?

The Gutsibits dipstick has markings, I check it after screwing it in.
I find my Guzzi engine finds the oil level it prefers anyway and I stick with that...about half way between the two markers.
Over fill one and it'll chuck it out the breather.

[rocker59]

Thanks, R59 ....... my 790cc 2003 Bonnie took over 3.5 quarts, 3.8 if I recall.  Almost 2x the capacity.  Does the addition of a sump allow for another 1/2 to 3/4 quart of oil? 

Bob

Bob,

Yes.  On the Guzzitech/GuzziPower small block sump spacer, the intention is to add extra oil capacity. 

As Patrick noted, there is webbing cast into the block that serves the function of keeping the oil in the sump.