Dealer Service

[ssrealty]

Just curious... It seems like so many of us want to do our own motorcycle service. We don't want the dealership to do oil changes, reset service lights, etc. on our motorcycles. Yet we wonder why Moto Guzzi dealers are going out of business? I see similar comments on Ducati forums. Why is there so much anti-dealership service sentiment? Don't we want Moto Guzzi to stay in business and continue to invest in new models?

I personally want to support my dealership. I don't want to change the oil and am happy to support my local dealers in servicing my Ducati and Moto Guzzi bikes. Honestly, I don't know how they stay in business with high overhead costs, financing floor inventory costs, etc. I encourage motorcycle enthusiasts to support their dealer. This is a dying industry, and not supporting our dealers won't help the motorcycle industry.

I like going on dealer sponsored track days, group rides, and test drive lunch events. Just something to think about.
 

[Ncdan]

I realize this will probably be a  controversial thread and subject so I will be as discreet as possible. I’m not going to pay anyone three times more for servicing my bike than I can drop an oil plug and screw a filter off and on. I’m not going to pay anyone 500.00 dollars for replacing two tires on my bike when I can do it for less than 200.00. Even if I could afford to do so. However anyone can feel free to have their work preformed by a dealer if they wish and I understand your point and don’t disagree. 

[Tusayan]

I've never seen dealer service or repairs as a big factor in motorcycling, and I've always viewed working on your motorcycle as an intrinsic part of ownership.  Letting somebody else touch my bikes remains a foreign concept to me, after 45 years on motorcycles. I used to buy more parts from the local dealer, it was slow and imprecise but in the past there was no other way.

Small airplanes have much the same issue except that at the bottom end of the market dealer service mostly went away decades ago, replaced by people doing their own work where it's legal, including building the plane, and independent mechanics assisting where it's not.  If motorcycling were to go the same way with new bikes sold at events by distributors and service (for those needing it) provided independent of the OEM, it would be OK with me.

[Lannis]

I change my own fluids and do my own simple tuning adjustments.

About half the time, I change my tires myself - the other half, I take the wheels in to the dealer and let him do it (with his tires).

I set my own valves, and have changed out my own handlebar switches (meaning gas tank removal on the Stelvio).

I replaced my own swingarm and steering head bearings, using instructional videos on this very list, and replaced my own fork springs and seals.

I've replaced a Loopframe and a Tonti clutch, which is a major pain in the arse just because of all the parts involved.

This is all very simple work, requiring not many special tools and no specialized mechanical knowledge like welding or machining.

Beyond that, it's going to be unusual to have any work for the dealer to do unless you're putting a lot of miles on a bike, or something goes wrong that shouldn't have.

My dealer has done recall work like my Stelvio centerstand, and did the roller cam follower conversion.   Beyond that, what other work can I throw his way to help him stay in business?   

This would mostly be true for any bike, not just a Guzzi, although I'm NOT going to tackle the "camshaft out" valve adjustment on my '14 Triumph triple ....

Lannis

[fotoguzzi]

For me it takes a real leap of faith to let some kid work on my machine.

[Kev m]

I've had more than a dozen techs working for me at a given time. If you heard the stories you wouldn't trust anyone else to work on your vehicles either.

It genuinely pains me to hand any of my motor vehicles over to someone else to work on, especially my bikes.

But I do it occasionally (usually under warranty, but sometimes out of laziness).

[Sheepdog]

My nearest dealer is 300 miles away. I've always done my own basic maintainence and tire changes (even on the Beemer). However, I would use a dealer if I had one within a reasonable distance; for some stuff, anyway. Heck, I have to drive over an hour just to get to a Cycle-Gear.

[kingoffleece]

For stuff I can't do I use my trusted mechanic.  It's a real shame that plenty don't have access to guys like the crew at Hamlin Cycles.
For what I do at home I'll have them ship me the required parts (less fluids).  My way of helping to contribute while still doing all the basics myself.

[LowRyter]

Many of us like to work on our bikes to the extent that we can.  Beyond the hobbyist point of view, there is also a reliability and safety aspect.  Riders should be proficient to keep the bike running on the road and be able to inspect and make sure the bike is clean and safe.  I think the less riders work on their bikes, the more vulnerable they are to missing latent maintenance issues.

Now the idea that riders can't reset maintenance minders is maddening.  Especially considering that European motorcycle dealers are hours away for may riders.

Having said all that, I did submit to my desires and purchased a used Ducati.  The bike had 14 months of warranty on it and I did take it to the dealer (to get hosed) for the "annual service" (aka oil change).  I thought it was wise.  The dealer did shut off a check engine light earlier for no charge, so I did feel a little bit of loyalty. 

For the Ducs, there is a work around for the maintenance minder, just back date the calendar on the dash.  Luckily, I also have an independent shop (and GuzzI dealer) that has all the software and expertise to maintain my bike.  He also does maintenance work for the Duc dealer.  Frankly, if he wasn't here, I might not have considered buying the Duc.

[coast range rider]

We know many Guzzi design features such as less plastic bodywork, screw adjustable valve tappets and shaft drive, and free access to GuzziDiag make our bikes ideal for owner servicing. That was one of the main reasons I purchased my Guzzi. So manufacturing service friendly bikes that are appreciated by non-professional mechanic/owners should help Guzzi stay in business. To help Guzzi's be appreciated and highly valued we need to help get the word out that this bike needs less from the dealership, no $15,000 scanner required.

So if dealerships are less profitable due to this, I may end up buying a new bike from a picture on Amazon, and waiting a couple days for delivery, just like everything else. If it comes to that, manufacturers may have to load new models on trucks and drive them around the county, scheduling stops to allow people test rides.

I cut my own lawn instead of paying the neighbor's son to do it. Does this mean I don't want him to develop a healthy work ethic and save up enough money to purchase his first dirt bike or car?

I don't heat my house by burning coal. Does this mean I want the coal industry to disappear. Oh wait, I do. Nevermind.

Supply and demand is a beautifully efficient, sometimes harsh reality. Survival of the fittest is ok by me.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

What dealer? The one 120 miles to the west? I doubt they'd know the first thing about working on any of my Guzzis...

[wymple]

2 weeks ago I bought a 700 Honda Shadow for my grandson. It needed fork seals. I called the Honda shop in Keokuk, Iowa, where they have a shop attached and do warranty work, to buy a pair. They informed me they don't even stock fork seals. Same thing in West Burlington, Iowa where they sell Yamahas. I got them from my old school dealer, R&K Cycle just across the river in Illinois about 60 miles from me. When I wanted a new gasket for the stator cover on my GS850 Suzuki, guess who stocked it? If I need cables, guess who again? I get all my tires from him. He is currently working on some stuff for my Cal 2. Why would I let anyone else touch my bikes when they don't carry the simplest of things? Seems to me it's come down to old school or no school. I buy from him when I can, use the net for everything else.

[Cage Free]

If it was free I wouldn't take my bike to a dealer for service. I really love getting out in my garage, popping open a beer, putting on some music and doing maintenance,repairs, or just cleaning my bikes. For me this is part of owning and riding bikes and one of the reasons I ride Guzzi's because of how easy they are to work on.

[willowstreetguzziguy]

I realize this will probably be a  controversial thread and subject so I will be as discreet as possible. I’m not going to pay anyone three times more for servicing my bike than I can drop an oil plug and screw a filter off and on. I’m not going to pay anyone 500.00 dollars for replacing two tires on my bike when I can do it for less than 200.00. Even if I could afford to do so. However anyone can feel free to have their work preformed by a dealer if they wish and I understand your point and don’t disagree.

I AGREE!!!

[s1120]

I've had more than a dozen techs working for me at a given time. If you heard the stories you wouldn't trust anyone else to work on your vehicles either.

It genuinely pains me to hand any of my motor vehicles over to someone else to work on, especially my bikes.

But I do it occasionally (usually under warranty, but sometimes out of laziness).

After 25 years working for a new car dealer I agree fully!!  Also as I get older, I learn that "the pros" sometimes really don't know anymore then I do in a lot of cases.. they are just guessing with someone elses money.

[davedel44]

Dealer Sevice not an option for me.  Nearest in Austin 250 miles away.
Dont think the last dealer in Houston lasted long, and I know of two bikes that they screwed before they dropped Guzzi. 

Service options for me.
Myself.
Myself and one or two of my local Guzziti.
Myself and local Guzziti plus my dear friend Charlie - longtime Guzziti and master mechanic.
Haul the bike MYSELF to MPH in Houston so Mike Haven can deal with it, but Mike is so busy it may be a month before he can look at it. Never for normal service stuff only the worst cases.

Then maybe AF1 in Austin.

When Mike was a Guzzi dealer with a large staff I  bought 3 Guzzis from him and he regularly serviced them.

If you have a dealer close that you trust by all means use him. 

Wish I did.  Doing a first service on a V7111 with a friend.  this afternoon in 90 degrees and 90 percent humidity, because we dont have a dealership close by.

If I couldn't or wouldn't do regular maintenance I'd have to give up Guzzis.  Not ready yet.

Dave
Galveston

Dave
Gal

[usedtobefast]

I was going to use my dealer for service.  First service for my v7 III racer was going to be $550. Say what!?  Sorry can't do that.  So I did it myself. Was easy and enjoyable.

[twowheeladdict]

If it was free I wouldn't take my bike to a dealer for service. I really love getting out in my garage, popping open a beer, putting on some music and doing maintenance,repairs, or just cleaning my bikes. For me this is part of owning and riding bikes and one of the reasons I ride Guzzi's because of how easy they are to work on.

 

Definitely part of the fun of owning bikes. 

[bad Chad]

But this isn’t the automotive industry.  I don’t know the numbers but maybe it’s something like 1 motorcycle to 100 cars, how is a dealer going to survive?

[Siamese]

My attitude with regard to motorcycle maintenance is, if you're not doing your own fluid changes, valve adjustments, and general small repairs, who wipes your butt? 

As others have stated, one of the main reasons I bought my V7III was because of the ease of doing my own valve adjustments.  I considered a 500 Honda parallel twin, but just getting all the plastic and hoses out of the way is reported to be a 2.5 hour job.  And a valve adjustment is required immediately after break-in! 

And, my dealer's too far away.

And, I'm not in charge of how a dealer is supposed to make money.  That's a burden I don't need, and a guilt trip I won't take. 

The bikes aren't very popular, so dealers are scarce.  There's not much I can do about that.   

[coast range rider]

If it was free I wouldn't take my bike to a dealer for service. I really love getting out in my garage, popping open a beer, putting on some music and doing maintenance,repairs, or just cleaning my bikes. For me this is part of owning and riding bikes and one of the reasons I ride Guzzi's because of how easy they are to work on.

Thank you @Cage Free, for that great post many of us here can identify with! It cannot be denied that this type of service ritual provides us a closer connection to our bike compared to  those who only ride.

The other side of the coin, well expressed by @Perazzimx14, "some folks that are well into their 70's that used to do their own maintenance now are content to let someone else do it."

Here's my Moto Guzzi love story:
Got a great deal on a great used bike, my 2010 Multistrada. First major service I did oil 'n filter change, timing belts, valve adjustment, coolant change, plugs, air filter, chain and sprockets, and by the way I worked in my garage all day, 3 days straight to get this done.
Rode a bit, second major service I got the task down to only 2 full days in the garage.
Rode a bit, repeat. Rode a bit repeat. Even one more time after that.
I am in my 60's but this stuff was starting to get to me, like a headache. Instead of becoming content to let someone else work on my bike, I sold it, bought my Stelvio, and now I'm back to a good time in my garage doing Stelvio major service, less than 2 hours, no headache.

Very true, @Perazzimx14, some people are "...more deadly than Ebola if you put a screwdriver in his hand. Just because you ride a motorcycle doesn't mean you are or have to be a mechanic."
But for the people in the middle, Moto Guzzi's seem to make the garage time the easiest.

[bad Chad]

Why are you guys judging folks for not doing their own work?   To look down on someone for that is absurd.

[ken farr]

I do most of my own stuff.
I took my B1100 into a well known, established dealership because I had oil presenting itself on the rear tire/wheel.
I figured that either the final drive was leaking or the trans was leaking and traveling down the carc tunnel.
I explain, set up an appointment, drop off the machine, and then get home using a combination of public transit, and a friend picking me up at the train station.
Call to be sure the work is done, get there and, nope we haven't stated yet.  Why was I told it was done ?  Dunno, we'll get on soon......
Get the machine back, and what they did for $400 was to smear sealant around the final drive and the carc tunnel.  Replace any seals? Nope.
They just couldn't understand why I wasn't happy with a $400 sealant job.
That is why I will never go back to Glendale.
A Guzzi shop opened in Thousand Oaks, not that one, a good one.  A woman owned the place and had a real hand in the operations.
The service staff was on point, they looked wide eyed when I explained the Glendale situation.  They replaced the offending seal, and now @ 6 yrs. later looks like I 'll have to do it again.
Unfortunately she sold to a Multi brand outfit down the road, and the service staff dispersed to the four corners....
My point is, I generally do my own stuff, but if I think I need help, I will send it off.  But finding a competent shop is an issue.

[Bulldog9]

Just curious... It seems like so many of us want to do our own motorcycle service. We don't want the dealership to do oil changes, reset service lights, etc. on our motorcycles. Yet we wonder why Moto Guzzi dealers are going out of business? I see similar comments on Ducati forums. Why is there so much anti-dealership service sentiment? Don't we want Moto Guzzi to stay in business and continue to invest in new models?

I personally want to support my dealership. I don't want to change the oil and am happy to support my local dealers in servicing my Ducati and Moto Guzzi bikes. Honestly, I don't know how they stay in business with high overhead costs, financing floor inventory costs, etc. I encourage motorcycle enthusiasts to support their dealer. This is a dying industry, and not supporting our dealers won't help the motorcycle industry.

I like going on dealer sponsored track days, group rides, and test drive lunch events. Just something to think about.

For me it all depends on the dealer.... and the Techs in their shop.  If I'm going to put my life in your hands, you better know your stuff..... and be interested in treating my bike/car like its your own.

I avoid dealers of all types unless I know the tech, trust their work ethic and style and competence.  I WANT to have a good local dealer, but havent since I left Seattle area, but doesn't matter as MI closed its doors. Even then, I only wanted one of the techs to put hands on my bike. I've got a Guzzi dealer 8 miles to my house. Why dont I bring them work? 1. The single tech I met wouldn't be trusted to hold my dogs leash while I took a leak, and......... 2. They wanted $275 plus tax to mount and balance two tires.  That was with bringing them the tire & rim.....  I really like my selling dealer but they are 3+ hours away, Richmond has a great rep, but I've not been there yet, they are 1+ hours away.

But in the end, I prefer to wrench on my bikes because I LOVE it..... Everything else is just a bonus.

[Bulldog9]

I want to personally tank Al Gore for inventing the internet.

You're welcome...

[Lannis]

They wanted $275 plus tax to mount and balance two tires.  That was with bringing them the tire & rim.....  I really like my selling dealer but they are 3+ hours away, Richmond has a great rep, but I've not been there yet, they are 1+ hours away.

The local Honda shop here will mount and balance a tire for $15 each.   For $275 it should include purchasing both tires AND the mounting and balancing.   

Wonder how they justify that?   It's as if, in a town full of Jiffy Lubes that will change your oil for $45 including the oil and filter, that a Qwik Oil shop opens that offers to do the same job for $500 .... How do they even stay in business?

Lannis

[Ncdan]

The local Honda shop here will mount and balance a tire for $15 each.   For $275 it should include purchasing both tires AND the mounting and balancing.   

Wonder how they justify that?   It's as if, in a town full of Jiffy Lubes that will change your oil for $45 including the oil and filter, that a Qwik Oil shop opens that offers to do the same job for $500 .... How do they even stay in business?

Lannis

How do they stay in business? Short answer is...fools;)

[Bulldog9]

The local Honda shop here will mount and balance a tire for $15 each.   For $275 it should include purchasing both tires AND the mounting and balancing.   

Wonder how they justify that?   It's as if, in a town full of Jiffy Lubes that will change your oil for $45 including the oil and filter, that a Qwik Oil shop opens that offers to do the same job for $500 .... How do they even stay in business?

Lannis

Lannis,

NOVA is ridiculous for any kind of decent price on most things. I need to look at a few smaller shops in the area including Maryland.  Bill uses Winchester,  may give you a ring. This dealership stays in business because the owner owns the property and a used car lot next door. They also sell a ton of Vespas and scooters to all the DC yuppies and GOV Interns our area is inundated with. It's a mess....  $15/tire? that may make an early morning drive and coffee with you worth it.  Perfect excuse for a little road trip with the German GF.....

I'd love to open a real old school bike shop in my area someday, one that caters to guys who like to wrench on their own bikes, sponsor rides, events, open shop nights, and take a consortium approach, but is likely a bridge too far.

Steve

[Lannis]

Lannis,

NOVA is ridiculous for any kind of decent price on most things. I need to look at a few smaller shops in the area including Maryland.  Bill uses Winchester,  may give you a ring. This dealership stays in business because the owner owns the property and a used car lot next door. They also sell a ton of Vespas and scooters to all the DC yuppies and GOV Interns our area is inundated with. It's a mess....  $15/tire? that may make an early morning drive and coffee with you worth it.  Perfect excuse for a little road trip with the German GF.....

I'd love to open a real old school bike shop in my area someday, one that caters to guys who like to wrench on their own bikes, sponsor rides, events, open shop nights, and take a consortium approach, but is likely a bridge too far.

Steve

You're welcome to come down any time, stay the night, we got lots of room .... I've been dealing with the Honda shop for years and for all I know the $15 is the "Lannis" price .... when I bought my last Michelin Pilot Road 5 there last month, they told me that they weren't able to match the Internet price like they usually do, so they installed the tire for free!    Plus I've got all the stuff we need to change the tire in my shop if you want.

This Honda shop has been here for 50 years to my personal knowledge ... lots of young guys run it now, but it's still the kind of place where they'll turn you loose in their old parts boxes to find a bit of Keihin linkage for that old Kawasaki you're getting back on the road.

I really do think that your idea about an "old school" shop would work well.   There have been recent articles in Cycle World and such about shops that will work on your bike OR provide the space, lifts, specialty tools like pullers and drivers etc for folks who want to work on their own.   Lots of guys would like to work on their own bikes but don't feel confident about doing it alone in the back of their garage, or who are scared that they'll go into a fancy shop (especially in a price-jumped-up place like the DC area) with their '85 Interceptor that's worth $1000 and find that they've been hit with 8 hours work at $125 an hour to change the spark plugs or something.

No one would make a lot of money running a shop like that, but I'll wager that with your pension and all, you'd be happy with just a bit of tobacco money from such an operation ....

Lannis

[Lannis]

I've never seen dealer service or repairs as a big factor in motorcycling, and I've always viewed working on your motorcycle as an intrinsic part of ownership.  Letting somebody else touch my bikes remains a foreign concept to me, after 45 years on motorcycles. I used to buy more parts from the local dealer, it was slow and imprecise but in the past there was no other way.

Most of us who have responded to this thread are ones that will do as much work on our own motorcycles as we can; however, that doesn't mean that most Guzzi riders will do work on their own bikes, because only those of us who DO our own work would be motivated to respond to such a thread.

Howsomever, I was just skimming through the recent last few months of posts on the "Introductions" thread where the new folks on the list introduce themselves, and the number of people that do mechanical work for a living, or who have already torn their new-to-them Guzzi down to the cases, or are looking forward to info from the list so they can work effectively on their bike, makes up a majority of the people coming on to the list.

I know some very high-mileage riders who take the opposite view from many of us ... they're all about "I'm here to RIDE my bike, I've got no time to have it scattered all over my shop, ordering parts, finding manuals, etc.   I pay a shop to do that.  I'm going to spend my time on the road ...."

Either way is great.

Lannis