2020 Moto Guzzi V7 lll Stone S

[Kev m]

I think that at least SOME of what we are seeing in this thread are differences in ambient conditions.

And rider weight.

The suspension is designed for a rider of a certain weight, and as a cheap/economy system, if you're far from that ideal weight, the suspension will be even worse.

Rich A

ABSOLUTELY - On a Harley 883 every(guy) bitches about the suspension, but my petite wife found it just fine.

On a MK I V7 a lot of the smaller guys around here talked about being launched, but I don't know how many big guys like me ever mentioned it.

[MMRanch]

 

Maybe the V-7 shocks are made for Tn. Roads ,   They seem to work just fine around here and many points South of here too.   Ridding solo they might be a little stiff , but the wife loves that Corbin dual seat and a little added weight makes it ride great !   

[JohninVT]

I think the real question everyone should ask is why doesn't it have a supercharger?  A supercharger is cheaper than a set of Ohlins shocks and forks.  Every $7,000 should have a supercharger AND Ohlins suspension.  It should also weigh under 350lbs.  I'm sure the liberal use of titanium and magnesium would get it down to 350lbs.  While Guzzi is at it, they might as well improve the fuel economy.  A hybrid drive with regenerative braking would do the trick.

No matter what though, they can't go much above 8-9k in the MSRP.  As long as they can add a supercharger, full Ohlins, magnesium and titanium everywhere and hybrid power for 8 grand I'm sure they'd sell at least eleven in the US.  Maybe twelve.   

[Mayor_of_BBQ]

I think the real question everyone should ask is why doesn't it have a supercharger?  A supercharger is cheaper than a set of Ohlins shocks and forks.  Every $7,000 should have a supercharger AND Ohlins suspension.  It should also weigh under 350lbs.  I'm sure the liberal use of titanium and magnesium would get it down to 350lbs.  While Guzzi is at it, they might as well improve the fuel economy.  A hybrid drive with regenerative braking would do the trick.

No matter what though, they can't go much above 8-9k in the MSRP.  As long as they can add a supercharger, full Ohlins, magnesium and titanium everywhere and hybrid power for 8 grand I'm sure they'd sell at least eleven in the US.  Maybe twelve.   

No way man, I'm going to wait 3 years & buy a new old stock one off the showroom floor for pennies on the dollar! HAHA

[Perazzimx14]

You don't get it.  That's OK.  The bikes seem to sell well at their pricepoint with their shitebox forks and shocks.

If a maker names a bike "S", "Sport", "R", "Racer", the expectation is upgraded forks, shocks, brakes, wheels, tires.

I have enjoyed several motorcycles over the past couple decades which were equipped with nice suspenion.  If you have not, you don't know what you're missing.  And horsepower has nothing to do with it.  These bikes could benefit from better cycle parts.

Those of us who want the nice suspension understand that it won't be at a $6990 price point, but we'll have to pay for it.  Just look at the offerings from Triumph.  You can buy a bargain basement Bonneville with shitebox suspension.  You can buy a Bonneville with top-shelf brakes, shocks, wheels/tires, and USD forks.

Guzzi really has jumped the shark with the never ending parade of "bold new graphics" "models" on the V7 platform.

Give me a V7 III S with nice piggyback shocks, nice USD fork, 17" wheels/tires, dual disk brakes.  No, it doesn't have to be Ohlins, though that would be great.  Showa would be fine.

At least one other person gets it!

Maybe the "S" stands for "same old" and not "sport"

[kingoffleece]

To be clear, I knew exactly what I was getting for my $$$$.  I fully expected Jim to change the front and rear to my preference.  I have ZERO issue with that-it's the cost of cool.  What I like is that the bike is what I like.

I don't blame the OE's at all.  As stated, many never change as much as pre-load.  Nobody says you have to.

[bad Chad]

No, Rockers right, you just don’t, “get it”. 

[Griso8V]

Looks like a very nice looking bike, I would ride it.  Very nice...  Besides this bike has more than adequate capabilities for 90% of riders out there anyway.  
Tony C

[kingoffleece]

So, what you're saying is some are simply doomed to an inferior existence?
Such is life............... ...

[Rich A]

Surely, Guzzi could put on a set of premium suspension components on a V7 for the cost difference between the basic and better parts ($500-1000?). That would be fine for a rider weighing, maybe 150-170 lbs, but what would the dealer do if the buyer weighed 195 lbs and wanted the suspension adjusted accordingly?

The dealer would have to remove some the premium parts that came with the bike and replace the springs etc. to tailor the suspension for the difference in the riders' weights. So, the dealer would say something like, “The replacement kit from Guzzi is $500 (?), and it will cost $300 (?) to install it. We could have it here in a week if it is in stock and it would be about another week to install it.”

This wouldn’t seem like a great deal for either the buyer or dealer.

Rich A

[rocker59]

Surely, Guzzi could put on a set of premium suspension components on a V7 for the cost difference between the basic and better parts ($500-1000?). That would be fine for a rider weighing, maybe 150-170 lbs, but what would the dealer do if the buyer weighed 195 lbs and wanted the suspension adjusted accordingly?

The dealer would have to remove some the premium parts that came with the bike and replace the springs etc. to tailor the suspension for the difference in the riders' weights. So, the dealer would say something like, “The replacement kit from Guzzi is $500 (?), and it will cost $300 (?) to install it. We could have it here in a week if it is in stock and it would be about another week to install it.”

This wouldn’t seem like a great deal for either the buyer or dealer.

Rich A

I honestly don't understand your comment, so I'll give you some examples of my own experiences with Guzzis which came with nice suspension:

1996 Sport 1100.  WP shock was fantastic as delivered.  Just dialed in preload to my satisfaction and set the damping on the dials.  It was good for over 20 years, never requiring a rebuild.  Marzocchi M1 fork was good, as delivered, but a little softly sprung.  After a decade of ownership, I installed WP springs, and 10wt oil replaced the 7.5wt oil.  Then it was perfect.

2004 Nero Corsa. Ohlins at both ends.  Very nice, as delivered, for solo riding.  Just a few adjustments to preload and damping had me set for several years.  It was a very nice suspension.  Then, one day I started using the bike for 2-up touring.  Adding the passenger showed that the rear spring was too light.  So, I removed the shock, and replaced the spring with a heavier Ohlins piece.  Adjusted preload and damping to taste, then it was good for the remaining years and tens of thousands of miles which I owned it.

Both bikes were well balanced and handled pavement imperfections nicely as delivered, and were easy to adapt to my changing needs.  That was only possible because both bikes came with nice, adjustable suspension, from the factory.

I've had similar experiences with Showa-equipped Triumphs and Ducatis.   

Oh, and like many American Guzzisti, I'm well north of 200 lbs.

[Rich A]

Basically, my argument is that the function of the suspension is dependent on the weight of the rider plus the weight of the bike (plus any accessories)--I don't think there is any doubt about that. Guzzi can't provide a premium suspension that would be optimized for all riders because their weights vary over quite a large range. It would be expensive to have the shocks and forks modified to suit someone outside the target weight range (I don't know that that is, but I can't imagine it'd be more than +/- 20 lbs).

Rich A

[Kev m]

And not for nothing but BOTH the 1996 Sport 1100 and 2004 Nero Corsa were far from the base models in the line-up at the time, correct?!?

[Rich A]

https://www.motorcycle.com/specs/moto-guzzi/standard/2004/v11/le-mans-nero-corsa.html

shows the base price of the 2004 Nero Corsa as $13,990. The inflation calculator (https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/2004?amount=13990) shows that as $19,059.13 in 2019 dollars.

Rich

[Perazzimx14]

And not for nothing but BOTH the 1996 Sport 1100 and 2004 Nero Corsa were far from the base models in the line-up at the time, correct?!?

What was the base model that the was upgraded to make the 1996 Sport?

[Mayor_of_BBQ]

And not for nothing but BOTH the 1996 Sport 1100 and 2004 Nero Corsa were far from the base models in the line-up at the time, correct?!?

this is what i was thinking? The flagship sport bikes of the model year vs. the entry level retro standard??

Of course everyone is assuming that the Stone 'S' is supposed to be a 'Stone Sport' but maybe the S stands for special or stupendous or same-old same-old or Silly underpowered shitebox?

Seems like if the Stone S was supposed to be a 'Sport' designation, it would have clip-ons and rearsets and/or a solo seat?

[Perazzimx14]

this is what i was thinking? The flagship sport bikes of the model year vs. the entry level retro standard??

Of course everyone is assuming that the Stone 'S' is supposed to be a 'Stone Sport' but maybe the S stands for special or stupendous or same-old same-old or Silly underpowered shitebox?

Seems like if the Stone S was supposed to be a 'Sport' designation, it would have clip-ons and rearsets and/or a solo seat?

More like - Stone "S"imilar

[rocker59]

https://www.motorcycle.com/specs/moto-guzzi/standard/2004/v11/le-mans-nero-corsa.html

shows the base price of the 2004 Nero Corsa as $13,990. The inflation calculator (https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/2004?amount=13990) shows that as $19,059.13 in 2019 dollars.

Rich

There is some falacy in your assertion...  Straight calculations like that don't translate to real world pricing.  Inflation, or currency rate of exchange...

2009 V7 Classic - MSRP $8490   ($10,184 in 2019 dollars)

2019 V7 III Stone - MSRP $8990

[rocker59]

And not for nothing but BOTH the 1996 Sport 1100 and 2004 Nero Corsa were far from the base models in the line-up at the time, correct?!?

1996 Sport 1100 was the only model in its family that year.  In 1997, Guzzi added Daytona RS above the Sport 1100 injection.

Yes, in 2004, standard V11 Sport/LeMans came with Marzocchi forks.  The premium models had Ohlins.

The entry level Marzochhis from the V11 were nice and would be a huge improvement over stock on a V7 III.

[Kev m]

1996 Sport 1100 was the only model in its family that year.  In 1997, Guzzi added Daytona RS above the Sport 1100 injection.

Yes, in 2004, standard V11 Sport/LeMans came with Marzocchi forks.  The premium models had Ohlins.

The entry level Marzochhis from the V11 were nice and would be a huge improvement over stock on a V7 III.

You mis-understand.

Neither the Sport 1100 or the V11 Sport/LeMans were BASE LEVEL MODELS for the BRAND.

[rocker59]

this is what i was thinking? The flagship sport bikes of the model year vs. the entry level retro standard??

There is a wide gulf, filled with good options, between USD Ohlins and the conventional bargain basement stock suspension of the V7 line.

While I would love to see Ohlins front and rear on the top shelf V7/V9 variant, there are lots of options in-between that would be worlds better than current OEM.  I'm sure Showa has a number of options to fill that bill.

Every one of the many "models" and variations of the V7 and V9 have the same crappy forks, and that's too bad...

[rocker59]

You mis-understand.

Neither the Sport 1100 or the V11 Sport/LeMans were BASE LEVEL MODELS for the BRAND.

You are correct, sir.

However, the Californias had really nice forks that would be a huge upgrade on the V7s.

This is not an either/or discussion.  Zero or 100%.  Top or Bottom.  There are many better suspension options out there that would make the V7/V9 line much nicer to live with. 

[JohninVT]

You are correct, sir.

However, the Californias had really nice forks that would be a huge upgrade on the V7s.

This is not an either/or discussion.  Zero or 100%.  Top or Bottom.  There are many better suspension options out there that would make the V7/V9 line much nicer to live with.

Ok.  Totally agree with this post.  An incremental upgrade in suspension components would make a really nice bike...nicer.  What I don’t agree with is people thinking that a 45hp bike needs Öhlins to sell.  The V7 is far and away the most popular model for Guzzi and has been since it was introduced.  I think the V7 is in an extremely price sensitive segment.  There is no market for an 11 or 12 thousand dollar V7.  You’re not getting a full Öhlins suspension for an additional 5-800 on the MSRP.  It’s usually more like 2-3k.  The S could have had rebound adjustment added to the preload on the shocks and at least compression adjustment on the forks for 5-800.  If I was going to buy a V7 and that was the price difference between the S and a regular Stone I’d certainly pay the premium. 

[Kev m]

FYI both the Racer and Bobber Sport have Ohlins shocks now.

The Stone however is THE lowest price variant in the whole Guzzi lineup.

Please show me the competitive 750cc, $8-9k, base-model that even has rebound adjustment on their shocks?

The Street Twin and T100 Bonnies@ $9100-$10.5k (nope)
The HD Street 750 @ $7599 (nope)
The Harley 883 Iron @ $8999 (nope)
The Ducati Scramblers @ $9500-$11k (nope)

Note: I'm not sure about the HD Street Rod, it does have piggyback reservoir shocks at only $8699, but the website doesn't mention adjustability.

[rocker59]

FYI both the Racer and Bobber Sport have Ohlins shocks now.
 

and, unfortunately, they have the same forks as the others. 

[Mayor_of_BBQ]

and, unfortunately, they have the same forks as the others.

AND the 2020 Racer is losing even the rear Ohlins :-/

[Rich A]

tOf course everyone is assuming that the Stone 'S' is supposed to be a 'Stone Sport' but maybe the S stands for special or stupendous or same-old same-old or Silly underpowered shitebox?

Probably satin. As in satin chrome tank.

[Kev m]

and, unfortunately, they have the same forks as the others.

And what models of their competitors have Ohlins forks and at what prices?

[rocker59]

And what models of their competitors have Ohlins forks and at what prices?

As I've repeatedly noted, it's not simply about "Ohlins".  It's about anything that's better than the crap forks found on Every farking V7 and V9 in the lineup...

But for comparison, I would like to refer you to the Triumph Bonneville website.

https://www.triumphmotorcycles.com/motorcycles/classic

[Kev m]

As I've repeatedly noted, it's not simply about "Ohlins".  It's about anything that's better than the crap forks found on Every farking V7 and V9 in the lineup...

But for comparison, I would like to refer you to the Triumph Bonneville website.

https://www.triumphmotorcycles.com/motorcycles/classic

I'm well familiar with the Bonnies. And I don't think you see better forks until at least the T120.