Any recommendations for tires?

[Arctic Fox]

Hello,

Newbie here (I just did my introducing post  ).

Sorry my first (probably stupid) question will concern tires. My bike is Moto Guzzi Nevada. Original sizes of tires are: front: 100/90-18'' and rear 130/90-16''.

I admit I'm pretty inexperienced rider  ... but that is what it is (can not help on that and only time will help) and riding on sand roads (with small rocks) was so scary experience ... so I wonder could I made my bike any easier on that with using different kinds of tires (next riding season)? Opposite I would not want to make road riding too unpleasant/hard/difficult either. Naturally nothing off road with Nevada ... but I meant roads like this:










What I have found:

Front tire:

Dunlop D602
https://www.tiregom.co.uk/dunlop/d602/tire-100-90-R18-56-P-45157501500

Bridgestone Adventurecross scrambler AX41S
https://fi.mynetmoto.com/shop.cfm/mnm000011487/bridgestone-100-90--18-(56h)-adventurecross-scrambler-ax41s.html


Rear tire:

Bates Baja 90
https://www.wwag.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/WebSite.woa/wa/DirectAction?page=!WW42765

Duro HF-904 Median
https://www.wwag.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/WebSite.woa/wa/DirectAction?page=%21WW41404

Bridgestone Trail-wing 202 (but this is wrong size: 120/90-16'')
https://www.caferacerwebshop.com/en/bridgestone-trail-wing-tw202-120-90-16-tt-63-p.html

Could any 3.25/18 - 4.0 /18 tire fit to front tire and any 4.25/16 - 4.5/16 tire to rear tire  ?

Free to recommend anything  .


PS: My dream bike would be either Triumph Tiger 800 or Moto Guzzi V85TT (if those will not feel too high  ). Guzzi wins all other ways,
      except I have weird soft pot against sound of Triumph's 3 cylinder engine. I hope nobody will kill me here now  .
      I still will need to wait years before I can buy either of those (until selling prices of used ones have dropped enough).

[Huzo]

No question here will be seen as stupid..
Answers to your query will be along shortly. Welcome.

[Kiwi_Roy]

Nice pictures, that sort of surface can be tricky especially when dry, it seems to be better when damp.
Welcome to the forum, you will get lots of help with tires when everyone wakes up
Can we assume North is North America?

[Arctic Fox]

Nice pictures, that sort of surface can be tricky especially when dry, it seems to be better when damp.
Welcome to the forum, you will get lots of help with tires when everyone wakes up
Can we assume North is North America?

Sorry, nope. North-Europe (Scandinavia). The smallest roads of rural areas/country sides can be like those. In my case, if I for example ride to our family's summer place/log cabin ... I'm forced to face something like that.

[Tkelly]

Tires will not make much difference.The only way to get comfortable on gravel roads is to practice and wear protective gear.Ride a dirt bike off road until you are comfortable.

[Arctic Fox]

No question here will be seen as stupid..
Answers to your query will be along shortly. Welcome.

Thank you.

I though to ask that if  anyone would have tested ''all round tires'' or ''80/20 tires'' etc. in their bikes (and could share their experiences).

And who knows some might have even transform this kind of small Guzzi to scrambler type of bike?

I'm also interesting to hear (opinions) how much I could differ from the original sizes (tire dimensions). Just because options are pretty limited. Wheels (wide) alone will set some limitations, but I more like think handling of bike.

[Arctic Fox]

Tires will not make much difference.The only way to get comfortable on gravel roads is to practice and wear protective gear.Ride a dirt bike off road until you are comfortable.

Honestly, this was the answer I hoped not to hear. Of course if it is true, then I guess there is nothing to do about matter 

I have no money for another bike (plus insurances are not cheap either). And even if I would it is not possible to change bike just then needed (from one to another).

[Murray]

Cruisers make it a little more diffcult on unsealed roads, however wieght the pegs with you feet, grip the tank with your knees keep your shoulders and arms relaxed and don't chase every tweak that comes through the bars. Lean opposite to the bike i.e. not what you do on the road and keep your wieght in a line above the wheels, look where you want to go and powering out will give more stability wheel speed = more gyroscopic stability. More importantly go do it.

[Arctic Fox]

But why scramblers have different kind of tires? Are those just for looks? Here're few (internet pictures) ... bikes done from Nevadas.

[Bert Remington]

Artic Fox -- tires are definitely a challenge for your Nevada, especially that 16 inch rear.

Consider adding the Kenda K761 Dual Sport to your list of candidates.  The front tire is a lower profile but should not be a problem.

You are correct in considering tires outside the profiles Moto Guzzi specified.  For your Nevada and the roads you pictured, I think a bit narrower profile should provide more stability.

You need the following accessories: engine guard (eg, Hepco & Becker), centerstand (eg, Hepco & Becker), tall windscreen (rock protection), Pazzo brake and clutch levels (short not long), and SPOT Gen4 Messenger.

You also need a good two-piece riding suit (not leather, I'm partial to Aerostich), boots with lugs (but not motocross boots), and gauntlet gloves with palm protection.

It is likely you will be surprised by the road and find you are no longer "two wheels down".  So you want to increase the likelihood you and your Nevada get back on two wheels and headed down the road again.  Or if you can't let your friends and family know where you are.

I drove a BMW K100 to work from my rural home in the mountains including rain and snow with street tires.  Sometimes the dirt road was so slick I had to get off the motorcycle, drive it into the gully next to the road, and walk the motorcycle up the hill.  Yep I fell dozens of times.  Never with an injury to myself or the motorcycle.

The folks at the Adventure Rider forum can provide additional suggestions for traveling on graveled roads.

I think once you get some miles with new tires and riding gear, you will discover the joys of adventure riding.

[GeorgiaGuzzi]

Tires will not make much difference.The only way to get comfortable on gravel roads is to practice and wear protective gear.Ride a dirt bike off road until you are comfortable.

I must respectfully disagree. Proper tires are a must. A strictly street tread will be extra slippery on unpaved roads no matter your riding experience. Especially a Nevada that is difficult to stand up on because of feet forward.

Artic Fox, I run 80/20 Shinko 705’s. They do fine on gravel roads. I also commute with them and get aggressive lean angles on pavement. Great all around tires. My rear is about worn out, I’m replacing Tuesday with Dunlop trailsmart 90/10 bc they were on sale. I’ll let you know how they work.

My friend had shinko 805 tires on his Triumph Scrambler 1200. He raves about them. Those are what I’m putting on my Quota next, after I go thru the 3 Dunlops I bought.





My Trophy 900 is getting a sport touring tire for its front. Again, proper tire for intended use. I don’t wear my steel toe work boots to golf in.

[pebra]

Guys,
Don't make this more difficult than necessary.
Our young friend will do some of her riding on good, but unpaved roads. Not off road.
Like all sensible Finns I'm sure she has good protective gear. She's just starting out riding, and will gain experience.

She has a concrete list of suggestions  -  is there anybody who can comment on those?
(I can't,  don't know those tires and don't do any riding on gravel to speak of)

Welcome to the Board, Arctic Fox!
I hope you'll enjoy your Nevada, and that there's a V85 in your future! 
You have a beautiful and well equipped bike. Admittedly I don't know anything about the Finnish Guzzi community, but I wouldn't be surprised if you'll find the world's foremost expertise on Guzzi small blocks, including the Nevada, here on Wildguzzi!

[Arctic Fox]

Artic Fox -- tires are definitely a challenge for your Nevada, especially that 16 inch rear.

Consider adding the Kenda K761 Dual Sport to your list of candidates.  The front tire is a lower profile but should not be a problem.

You are correct in considering tires outside the profiles Moto Guzzi specified.  For your Nevada and the roads you pictured, I think a bit narrower profile should provide more stability.

You need the following accessories: engine guard (eg, Hepco & Becker), centerstand (eg, Hepco & Becker), tall windscreen (rock protection), Pazzo brake and clutch levels (short not long), and SPOT Gen4 Messenger.

You also need a good two-piece riding suit (not leather, I'm partial to Aerostich), boots with lugs (but not motocross boots), and gauntlet gloves with palm protection.

It is likely you will be surprised by the road and find you are no longer "two wheels down".  So you want to increase the likelihood you and your Nevada get back on two wheels and headed down the road again.  Or if you can't let your friends and family know where you are.

I drove a BMW K100 to work from my rural home in the mountains including rain and snow with street tires.  Sometimes the dirt road was so slick I had to get off the motorcycle, drive it into the gully next to the road, and walk the motorcycle up the hill.  Yep I fell dozens of times.  Never with an injury to myself or the motorcycle.

The folks at the Adventure Rider forum can provide additional suggestions for traveling on graveled roads.

I think once you get some miles with new tires and riding gear, you will discover the joys of adventure riding.

Here's my Nevada.
 











As you see I have some kind of engine guards on it and very high windscreen  (even to high for me, I'm just 1,64cm ... ex. owner). I also have heated grips on it (lovely here at spring and autumn times) & handlebar wind protectors. Led clock, thermometer, voltmeter combo. I have oil thermometer on bike. I got old TomTom navigator from my Dad (incl. European maps) and bough suitable motorcycle case for it. I also bough case for my mobile phone. Plus with bike I also got 2 cameras system (front and back + 5'' screen) new on box, mechanical cruiser (new on box), tire pressure system (new on box). So there is something to think now as winter is coming (not only those tires). And the best? I got all the original parts with bike, so I can return it back anytime (if needed).

Oh and what comes to safety issues!? Shortly; I did not save money here (even if the bike was not expensive). I bought Schubert C4 helmet (phone + radio  ), good quality jacket and pants (protectors, waterproof, removable linings), good boots, 2 gloves (for different weather), neck protector and even separate chest - back protector.

[ejs]

I got Shinko 705 tires on ny California ev. Gold on gravelroads.

[Arctic Fox]

I got Shinko 705 tires on ny California ev. Gold on gravelroads.

Am I right if I say that both Shinko 705 or 805 tires are out of picture (there are not much offerings for 18'' and 16'' wheels) ? 

https://shinkotireusa.com/product/705-series-dual-sport-tire/211929

https://shinkotireusa.com/product/e804e805-adventure-trail-tire/211930

[Bert Remington]

Arctic Fox -- you certainly are thoroughly prepared.

Some observations:

1. Your saddlebags will augment your engine guards on getting the motorcycle back up after a fall.

2. The short Pazzo levers are less likely to bend in a fall.

3. If the Scandinavian cell phone coverage includes your gravelled roads then you don't need the SPOT's global coverage.

4. The extended moment arm of the two driving lights mounted on your forks may affect stable handling.  Consider relocating them to the engine guards.

WRT Shinko 705s, I don't see any 16s and I would use the narrower 4.10 over the 120/80 front.

WRT Shinko 805s, 150/80 is a big rear.

I think you have better tire choices.

[Arctic Fox]

Guys,
Don't make this more difficult than necessary.
Our young friend will do some of her riding on good, but unpaved roads. Not off road.
Like all sensible Finns I'm sure she has good protective gear. She's just starting out riding, and will gain experience.

She has a concrete list of suggestions  -  is there anybody who can comment on those?
(I can't,  don't know those tires and don't do any riding on gravel to speak of)

Welcome to the Board, Arctic Fox!
I hope you'll enjoy your Nevada, and that there's a V85 in your future! 
You have a beautiful and well equipped bike. Admittedly I don't know anything about the Finnish Guzzi community, but I wouldn't be surprised if you'll find the world's foremost expertise on Guzzi small blocks, including the Nevada, here on Wildguzzi!

Thank you.
(Yes, I need to be worse kind of Finn .... ''a swede'' born & lived in Finland  ; I have dual nationality).

You're right (what comes to those roads).

I will need to change the tires before next season. So the question goes, have I anything to lose here?
How the bike will handle on asphalt roads? I'm not so worry if new tires would wear bit faster or would be tine louder. But if the handling of the bike will become more difficult (dry or wet roads); that is negative matter.

Oh, if tires will really have no influences at all, then I might buy some whitewall tires to my bike. 

[roadventure]

Honestly, this was the answer I hoped not to hear. Of course if it is true, then I guess there is nothing to do about matter 

I have no money for another bike (plus insurances are not cheap either). And even if I would it is not possible to change bike just then needed (from one to another).

I agree with previous post stating that tires won't make much of a difference.  Having ridden off-road for 35+ years, I became very used to the lose, insecure feeling when riding on gravel roads.  So, when riding street bikes not having maximum traction has never bothered me.  Although, I do know people who have never ridden off road that become very fearful when encountering gravel roads.

Maybe some "adventure bike" style tires will work for you, but the thing that is going to work best is to get more experience riding on gravel roads and learn how your bike feels when riding on lose surfaces.  Another thing to consider, is that speed is often your friend.  Trying to ride very slowly with a fear of falling can be more difficult than riding faster (40kph as opposed to 10kph which can add stability). 

Practice and increased confidence will help more than anything.

[Bert Remington]

Arctic Fox -- GeorgiaGuzzi gave you excellent tire advice.  You're looking for an "Adventure" tire often rated in the road/off-road ratio 80/20 or 90/10.  Today's Adventure tire compounds and tread designs are much superior to those when your Nevada first same out (actually I don't think the category existed yet).  As GeorgiaGuzzi pointed out, today's Adventure tires have good road-holding properties and adequate off-roading properties.  Although I don't know of any in WhiteWall.

When I say "off-road" I'm referring to non-paved "improved" (ie graded, etc) roads.  I am not referring to trail-riding which is very much different due to terrain, grooving, hazards, etc.  Adventure riding and Trail-riding require different tire compounds and tread designs as well as suspensions, footpeg locations, weight distribution, riding technique, etc.  Compare Arctic Fox's Nevada pictures with the scrambler pictures.

One note: when packing put the heavy stuff in the side cases and minimize the weight in the top case.  Same reason as driving light -- reduce moment arm.

[Bert Remington]

roadventure -- concur aggressively-treaded street tires are good enough for dry flat gravelled roads but Arctic Fox looks to be prepared for more adventure-some roads: cold, wet, muddy, maybe snow, probably hills.  If I had 80/20 adventure tires back when I was riding my K100, I could have ridden all the warm home in the mud and snow instead of getting off, driving the motorcycle into the gully, and walking beside it IN THE RURAL DARKNESS to get home.  Certainly skills are needed but I take advantage of technology when offered.

[Arctic Fox]

FRONT TYRES:
Here's something about Dunlop D 602
https://www.dunlop.eu/en_gb/motorcycle/tires/d602.D602.html#/

Here's something about  Bridgestone Adventurecross scrambler AX41S
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4Ku7Vy4ioY

Here's something about Kenda K-761 (wrong side 120/80-18'')
https://adventuremotorcycle.com/gear/gear-kenda-k761-enduro-tires

Here's something about Heidenau K67 (wrong side 4.0-18)
https://www.heidenautires.com/product/k-67/

Here's something about  Bridgestone AX41 (wrong side: 100/80-18'')
https://adventuremotorcycle.com/gear/bridgestone-battlax-ax41-tires


REAR TYRES:

Here's something about Bates Baja tire:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6d9Wc8Povc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKR_8z8gPu8

Here's something about Duro HF-904 tire:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6abQc3l2WE

Here's something about Bridgestone TW 202 (wrong side: 120/90-16'')
https://www.bridgestone.co.uk/motorcycle-tyres/trail-wing/tw202/
http://justbikethings.blogspot.com/2015/12/bridgestone-trail-wing-tw202-review.html

Here's something about  Bridgestone AX41 (wrong side: 120/90-16'')
https://adventuremotorcycle.com/gear/bridgestone-battlax-ax41-tires

[Arctic Fox]

Although I don't know of any in WhiteWall.

I was partly joking. But if the outcome is that it is all the same what kind of tires I'll put ... then I could think of those (just based on looks). But there would again be problem with that front tire (100/90-18). I would need to put wider tire on front ... 4.0-18''. There are no whitewall front tire at size 100/90-18.

Just to say ... I have ride that same road with neighbor's Kawasaki KMX 125 with speed of 60 - 70km/h without any fear/problems and now scared like hell with Guzzi at speed 25 - 30km/h. Few times basically needed to put my feet down and simply stop just to not fall down. Hills down were the most hardest. It felt like riding on small marbles/ball bearings.

[Bert Remington]

I'm not recommending Kenda it's just hard to find an Adventure tire in 16".  Kenda K761 has a 110/80-18 front (close enough) and a 130/90-16 rear, both tubeless so check for bead compatibility before deciding.  Beyond that I have no tire suggestions.

Yep you've just summarized the gap between a trail bike and a street bike.  The Nevada will never handle like the KMX but as you see many of us on this forum think with Adventure tires and some practice you'll be comfortable at 60kmh.

I knew those sunny, flat, picturesque roads you showed us were just postcards, probably not even Scandinavia and maybe even northern Italy.  I just knew you were going to ride much more challenging roads.  And I was right!

[Arctic Fox]

I'm not recommending Kenda it's just hard to find an Adventure tire in 16".  Kenda K761 has a 110/80-18 front (close enough) and a 130/90-16 rear, both tubeless so check for bead compatibility before deciding.  Beyond that I have no tire suggestions.

Yep you've just summarized the gap between a trail bike and a street bike.  The Nevada will never handle like the KMX but as you see many of us on this forum think with Adventure tires and some practice you'll be comfortable at 60kmh.

I knew those sunny, flat, picturesque roads you showed us were just postcards, probably not even Scandinavia and maybe even northern Italy.  I just knew you were going to ride much more challenging roads.  And I was right!

Those pictures/roads were really from Finland. But to get the idea.of ''problem'' .. they maintenance those roads like this. Now keep in minds ... the weather conditions are ''hard'' here. 4 different seasons. Every winter the frost goes in the ground. Raining at autumn, snow at winter, melting snow (water) at spring time etc.












There are loose small rocks on the roads. That will not influence a lot if you drive a car (except that Finland has produced lots of Rally driver World Champions  ) ... but to bike those are poison.

[malik]

I don't do enough riding on dirt to warrant changing from the road tyres, so I don't have advice for specific tyres, but generally narrow tyres work better on dirt. I wouldn't go any wider than the 100 on the front & the 130 on the rear if possible. A slightly chunkier tyre, not the aggressive, full blown dirt version, should be enough to give you a better sense of control, so a 90/10 or 80/20 should be enough. While the 16 inch rear wheel is not ideal for dirt (as you've noticed) it should be manageable. Familiarity breeds contempt, they say - so the secret is practice. I do note that those who grew up riding dirt tend to be be better riders than those of us who didn't. They tend to have had more practice with unstable surfaces. A steady throttle works better. Practice going up and down those roads again & again, preferably with the bike unladen, and you'll end up building up speed and confidence, (and knowing every every dip, bump, stone, soft patch on the road, and in all conditions). The bike can handle it, and likely better at a speed higher than you are comfortable with at present. Those roads look like they are decent 60-80kph roads, comfotable in 4th & 5th gear. The pea gravel on corners after the road has been recently graded require some care. Enjoy yourself, it's supposed to be fun. You'll be throwing the rear wheel out, under control, in no time at all.

[Bert Remington]

Arctic Fox -- great pictures.  Finland is serious about its unpaved roads.  Here in Southern California, I think the County government borrows a grader from the State government for a few weeks and pretends to scrape a few roads.  If someone gives them some gravel, they'll dump most of it next to the paved road.

The pictures confirmed several things:

1 -- deep gullies paralleling the road (not much fun to ride in, best avoided)
2 -- grassy areas paralleling the road (grass in almost any condition is slick and you will be riding on grass at some time for some reason)
3 -- not all that gravel is going to stay on the road, some will be in the air for a number of reasons

Therefore irrespective of your cellphone service, I repeat my recommendation you get a GlobalStar SPOT Gen4 one-way messenger and location tracker.  It provides various types of reporting functions including manual check-in with family and friends and automatic reporting if you stop moving for a certain period of time.  My Firefox browser doesn't accept GlobalStar's SSL handshake but I'm pretty sure coverage includes Finland.  And when you're not using it, your trekker and rally car friends can.

malik's point on tire width is excellent.  You might want to expand your search to a size down.

[GeorgiaGuzzi]

Am I right if I say that both Shinko 705 or 805 tires are out of picture (there are not much offerings for 18'' and 16'' wheels) ? 

https://shinkotireusa.com/product/705-series-dual-sport-tire/211929

https://shinkotireusa.com/product/e804e805-adventure-trail-tire/211930

Apologies, I am at work and type faster than I think. Not that that’s hard to do. I included a pic of my bike so you could have an idea of the style of tread I was referencing. Not really the specific tyre. Having seen what type of road maintenance you’re speaking of, I would recommend the Dunlop D602 for front, the Bates followed by the Duro for the rear. You want blocky open tread over directional tread. The more paved road riding you do vs unpaved the directional treads will be better. Stay out of the loose stuff on the edges of the road. That deep gravel requires experience. You’ll gain experience with time and soon be comfortable on even bad roads.

[Arctic Fox]

Apologies, I am at work and type faster than I think. Not that that’s hard to do. I included a pic of my bike so you could have an idea of the style of tread I was referencing. Not really the specific tyre. Having seen what type of road maintenance you’re speaking of, I would recommend the Dunlop D602 for front, the Bates followed by the Duro for the rear. You want blocky open tread over directional tread. The more paved road riding you do vs unpaved the directional treads will be better. Stay out of the loose stuff on the edges of the road. That deep gravel requires experience. You’ll gain experience with time and soon be comfortable on even bad roads.

Now I also looked speed rates and load indexes of these tires.


Front tire:

Speed rate of Dunlop D602 is low; P (150km/h).
H (210km/h) seems to be standard with normal tires offered to Nevada.
Of course whole bike will not go nearly that fast  . Even T would be more than enough.

Bridgestone Adventurecross Scrambler AX41S speed rate would still be that H and load index same 56.

Kenda K-761 speed rate would also be H and load index bit higher 58 (vs 56) Size is not exactly same 110/80-18 vs 100/90-18, but pretty close?
https://www.tacomaworld.com/tirecalc?tires=100-90r18-110-80r18

Bridgestone AX41 speed rate is P (150km/h) and more wrong tire side (100/80-18'')

Lastly Heidanau K-67 speed rate is T (190km/h), but tire is also more different (4.0-18 = 4.0/100-18)
https://www.tacomaworld.com/tirecalc?tires=100-90r18-101-100r18


Based on just those above: Bridgestone Adventurecross Scrambler AX41S  and Kenda K-761 could look someway interesting?


Rear  tire:

Bates Baja 90 speed rate is T (190km/h) and load index bit higher 73 (vs 67).

Duro HF speed rate is bit lower S (180km/h) and load index that 67.

Kenda K-761 speed rate would be H and load index that 73 (bit higher)
https://www.wheelhousetyres.co.uk/130-90-16-73h-k761-kenda-rear-t-l.html

Bridgestone  TW202 speed rate is P (150km/h) and load index 63. Plus wrong tire side: 120/90-16''.

Bridgestone AX41 speed rate is P (150km/h) and same ways wrong tire side (120/90-16'')


Again Kenda K-761 looks quite interesting. Same Bates Baja 90.








 

[GeorgiaGuzzi]

The Kenda 761 is similar to what I run. I have good traction on gravel roads unless I get into deep gravel, then I have to slow down.

The bates baja 90 will also be fine. Slightly more expensive than the Kenda tire. And it also looks slightly more aggressive tread wise so it may do better in loose gravel and dirt. Really depends on your personal preference.

I’ve rode cruisers with street tires on gravel roads. It’s very uncomfortable.

Something I forgot to second, like Burt mentioned check out advrider.com for good info, most people there are nice.

And no, there are no stupid questions. Feel free to ask whatever.

[Arctic Fox]

The Kenda 761 is similar to what I run. I have good traction on gravel roads unless I get into deep gravel, then I have to slow down.

The bates baja 90 will also be fine. Slightly more expensive than the Kenda tire. And it also looks slightly more aggressive tread wise so it may do better in loose gravel and dirt. Really depends on your personal preference.

I’ve rode cruisers with street tires on gravel roads. It’s very uncomfortable.

Something I forgot to second, like Burt mentioned check out advrider.com for good info, most people there are nice.

And no, there are no stupid questions. Feel free to ask whatever.

Well, luckily these are not so expensive (and I can always take them away if my decisions would turned out to be totally wrong).

Oh, now I learned that even as (for example) Bates Baja 90 are ''tubeless'' tires, with spoke wheels they still are recommended to use with inner tube and chafing strips (right kind of; valves are center in Nevada's rims).

I guess that is same with all tires.