Author Topic: new vibration through right footpeg  (Read 1288 times)

Offline yackee

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new vibration through right footpeg
« on: October 03, 2022, 04:54:31 PM »
Hi all,

Some of you kindly responded to my earlier post about my clutch slipping. I am now wondering if I have bigger problems. I did the mineral spirit flush, and drove without incident to the grocery store. Clutch was working fine. But by the time I got home, I was getting a very noticeable but intermittent high-frequency vibration through the right foot peg that travelled through my doc Martens to my foot. It was like a focused foot vibrator massage. The vibration would last a few seconds, then stop. I took the bike out again today to the store and was now getting a noticeable grinding noise that sounded like it was coming from below my rear end somewhere, along with the vibration.  This is happening at low speeds and is not constant but intermittent. I am now a bit worried about taking it up to highway speed. There is no vibration from the left footpeg, whatever is happening is very isolated. The grinding sound has me especially worried.

I am not saying this has anything to do with the mineral oil flush, maybe its part of whatever was making my clutch slip? I did check and replace the gear oil in the front part of the drive; I had plenty, and it looked very clean.

Any thoughts?

Online Frenchfrog

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #1 on: October 03, 2022, 05:16:09 PM »
Not wishing to cause fear or distress ,but the way you describe it sounds like a universal joint or it's support bearing in the swinging arm.

Offline bigbikerrick

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #2 on: October 03, 2022, 05:19:50 PM »
with what symptoms you describe, I am suspecting the "U" joint. I have read of vibration in the right peg/floorboard could be indicative of a failing U joint, or bearing it rides on. To inspect that would require you to remove the swing arm. If its just the bearing, its inexpensive,and relatively easy to replace.
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Online Chuck in Indiana

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #3 on: October 03, 2022, 05:25:35 PM »
^^^^ What they said.
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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #3 on: October 03, 2022, 05:25:35 PM »

Offline mtiberio

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #4 on: October 03, 2022, 05:33:43 PM »
U-JOINT plus probably carrier bearing. Don't worry, I left Boston for Prince Edwards Island with my girl friend on the back back of my Eldo in 1980? and had a couple of momentary lockups, ignored. New to Guzzi, I didn't notice vibes. Was off road in Canada. Got home, swingarm off, u-joint fell out of chamber in 2 pieces...
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Offline Murray

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #5 on: October 03, 2022, 06:18:07 PM »
When asking a question bike year and model is always handy. :)

Offline yackee

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #6 on: October 03, 2022, 06:49:56 PM »
When asking a question bike year and model is always handy. :)

Sorry, indeed I forgot that. 1976 t3, I believe original u-joint, but if replaced, at 25k miles or so.  Has about 50k miles.

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2022, 06:56:00 PM »
Well the difinitive test is to ride along and when you detect the vibration, change gear. If the vibration stays the same, it’s from the gearbox output shaft or further back..(the shaft rpm stays the same if you have not altered speed, even though the revs have..).
If it does alter with rpm, then it’s the input shaft or forward.

Offline moto-uno

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #8 on: October 03, 2022, 07:29:59 PM »
 I'm with all the others, that through personal experience would be tempted to suggest you
get at that cardan joint (U-joint) asap . There is no roadside repair for that :( . Peter

Offline guzzisteve

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #9 on: October 03, 2022, 09:02:37 PM »
The next step is feeling it spinning through the peg.
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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #10 on: October 03, 2022, 09:20:22 PM »
Maybe check the swingarm pivot pins to make sure that they have not loosened up?  If the swingarm gets out of adjustment is it possible for something to make contact?  Better minds than mine can think this through. If it were a Commando I would say the layshaft bearing is going.
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Offline John A

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2022, 11:36:26 PM »
I had a ujoint carrier bearing come apart at around 60 mph on I 220 around Shreveport on a Cal2 in traffic.The back tire suddenly stopped. It then unlocked, repeating locking and unlocking as I slowed. Clutch didn’t make any difference of course. Destroyed swingarm. It was exciting. I wouldn’t ride yours over 20 until it’s fixed.
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Online Frenchfrog

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #12 on: October 04, 2022, 02:59:33 AM »
I'm with all the others, that through personal experience would be tempted to suggest you
get at that cardan joint (U-joint) asap . There is no roadside repair for that :( . Peter
I'll very much second that. I had a UJ go on me at a 80mph plus on the motorway years ago...and it was not giving any detectable signs of failure.It was my lucky day as I managed to coast the bike from the third fast lane to a lay by without locking the rear wheel and I didn't fill my pants either !!! Someone up there was looking after me.

Online chuck peterson

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #13 on: October 04, 2022, 05:40:40 AM »
Yup grinding noises are usually suspicious… :shocked:

On the centerstand in neutral just rotate the rear wheel slowly by hand…see if it hits a tight spot

New ujoint is a press fit into a new carrier bearing

Mufflers off
Remove lower shock mounts
Axle out
Remove rear wheel with rear drive attached holding the open end up so gear oil doesn’t coat the driveway
Remove swingarm pivot pins
Establish the bike is secure from rolling forward
Wrestle swingarm out
Ujoint falls to the floor in bits of shrapnel..

1/2 hr and about 5 tools to take it apart…
3 weeks and a couple hundred to go back together…

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #14 on: October 04, 2022, 08:30:48 AM »
These threads are the absolute best learning devices for the Moto Guzzi newbies like myself.

Mucho thanks to all who contributed.
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Offline yackee

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #15 on: October 04, 2022, 09:35:19 AM »
Thanks all for the advice. I will not ride the bike -- it sounds like a definite safety concern. My local "former Guzzi mechanic", a guy named Louis Bringer, seems to have disconnected his phone, so I will probably be attempting this repair myself. The parts don't look hard to get or *that* expensive. Since my T3's was built in '75, apparently it may have the earlier Ambo-style u-joint and carrier bearing (according to MG Cycle) so I will take it apart and see if I can tell the difference. I assume that my "clutch slipping" problem was actually related to the driveshaft bits eating themselves. I'll post pics when I get it apart.

Online Chuck in Indiana

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #16 on: October 04, 2022, 10:24:46 AM »
Thanks all for the advice. I will not ride the bike -- it sounds like a definite safety concern. My local "former Guzzi mechanic", a guy named Louis Bringer, seems to have disconnected his phone, so I will probably be attempting this repair myself. The parts don't look hard to get or *that* expensive. Since my T3's was built in '75, apparently it may have the earlier Ambo-style u-joint and carrier bearing (according to MG Cycle) so I will take it apart and see if I can tell the difference. I assume that my "clutch slipping" problem was actually related to the driveshaft bits eating themselves. I'll post pics when I get it apart.

No, a clutch slipping problem is normally the clutch slipping.  :smiley: This would be a *really* good time to get in there and fix stuff. I've said many times that if you *look* for problems on an old machine you will find them.
Quote
Destroyed swingarm. It was exciting.
No doubt had your undivided attention for a bit.. :smiley:
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Online Charles in Lake Charles

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #17 on: October 04, 2022, 10:58:30 AM »
850T models have the earlier u-joint. 850-t3 with disc brake in rear use latter u-joints.
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Offline yackee

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #18 on: October 04, 2022, 11:11:33 AM »
850T models have the earlier u-joint. 850-t3 with disc brake in rear use latter u-joints.

MG Cycle claims on its website that some early-build T3s (manufactured in 1975) came with the earlier carrier bearing an u-joint. I don't know if that's true or not.

Offline 80CX100

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #19 on: October 04, 2022, 12:31:44 PM »

I am not saying this has anything to do with the mineral oil flush, maybe its part of whatever was making my clutch slip?

Any thoughts?

      I'm only jumping in to possibly save someone mechanical grief in the future,

     The mineral flush just before the apparent demise of your U-Joint, may possibly be related.

      I researched extensively when I did the mineral flush, to cure the slipping clutch on my CalVin.

      One of the warnings I read, was that when you have the mineral spirits in the bell housing with the bike supported up on the center stand/stands and are putting the bike into gear and fanning the clutch to clean the plates; you have to be very careful that the swing arm is supported in some fashion or at least verified that it's not hanging down in a sharp, unusual downward angle.

      If you do that part of the flush, with the tranny engaged & driveshaft spinning and the swing arm is hanging down in a severe angle, the U Joint is turning at an angle it's not used to, with potential for failure.

      Great advice by others already on the U Joint job, the only caution I'd add is, be gentle with the fine machine threads in the swing arm at the pivot point, be very careful that you don't cross thread on reassembly; make sure you treat them with your favorite anti corrosion recipe. Iirc I used something by Loc-Tite

      fwiw good luck
« Last Edit: October 04, 2022, 12:33:23 PM by 80CX100 »
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Online Frenchfrog

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #20 on: October 04, 2022, 01:03:48 PM »
That's weird though...the shock absorbers don't need to be taken off to do a clutch flush so the swinging arm will still be held up.Can't conceive why you would do that to do this procedure but open to enlightement :grin:.

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #21 on: October 04, 2022, 01:14:59 PM »
These threads are the absolute best learning devices for the Moto Guzzi newbies like myself.

Mucho thanks to all who contributed.
I would not have made it through Guzzidiag without Gonzo, Paul Brooking and (of course Beetle’s tutelage).
Maybe I would have gotten there, but would not have had the guts to try… :bow: :thumb:

Offline 80CX100

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #22 on: October 04, 2022, 01:51:09 PM »
That's weird though...the shock absorbers don't need to be taken off to do a clutch flush so the swinging arm will still be held up.Can't conceive why you would do that to do this procedure but open to enlightement :grin:.

You don't take the shocks off to do the flush, or at least I didn't.

In theory, I suppose the shocks may hold the swing arm at a good angle, but I think by design they're intended to move down enough to compensate for holes or dips in the road,idk.

What I do know, is that every bike/shock/swing arm/U Joint is going to be it's own unique package, due to design/wear/corrosion/dirt/debris etc.

I didn't do anything special when I did my flush and I was lucky with no mechanical carnage, others apparently haven't been so lucky.

Something to bear in mind, nothing more.

fwiw ymmv
« Last Edit: October 04, 2022, 01:52:29 PM by 80CX100 »
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Offline yackee

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #23 on: October 05, 2022, 09:03:26 AM »
Maybe I did the flush wrong, but I didn't have the bike in gear. I had it up on the center stand, in neutral, and started the bike, revved it in neutral, and flashed the clutch open and closed a bunch of times. So the u-joint wasn't spinning.

Online Frenchfrog

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #24 on: October 05, 2022, 05:08:09 PM »
I really can't see how the flush would have anything to do with a UJ wear issue and this now seems to be what you have. I'd Definitely have a looksee before riding again.

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #25 on: October 05, 2022, 06:59:51 PM »
I would not have made it through Guzzidiag without Gonzo, Paul Brooking and (of course Beetle’s tutelage).
Maybe I would have gotten there, but would not have had the guts to try… :bow: :thumb:

Yeah it is cool to be able to read the threads and vicariously live some of the Moto Guzzi experiences without actually going thru them.  Very easy to see why people have a love/hate relationship for the bikes. 

The honest relating of the less than optimal Moto Guzzi quirks, can definitely lead one to think "Yeah, that's no big deal!  I wanted a bike with charm and personality and this is just part of the package!" 

Let's face it, whenever anything goes to Hell in a hand basket, at least you are going to get some good stories and common experiences out of the situation."
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Online Chuck in Indiana

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #26 on: October 06, 2022, 03:24:21 PM »
Maybe I did the flush wrong, but I didn't have the bike in gear. I had it up on the center stand, in neutral, and started the bike, revved it in neutral, and flashed the clutch open and closed a bunch of times. So the u-joint wasn't spinning.

You ought to be fine. Certainly made a fine mess, didn't it?  :smiley:
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Offline Gusable

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #27 on: October 06, 2022, 04:05:14 PM »
I did my clutch cleaning through the inspection window with brake cleaner.  In neutral. Bunch of gunk came out the bottom. Feels like it’s holding strong.  I’m not looking forward to changing that carrier bearing if/when I need to
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Online blackcat

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #28 on: October 06, 2022, 04:26:29 PM »
  I’m not looking forward to changing that carrier bearing if/when I need to

I recently bought this tool to press the u-joint into the carrier bearing.  That along with a HarborFreight press made it an easy job.

« Last Edit: October 06, 2022, 05:41:45 PM by blackcat »
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Offline yackee

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Re: new vibration through right footpeg
« Reply #29 on: October 06, 2022, 05:09:06 PM »
You ought to be fine. Certainly made a fine mess, didn't it?  :smiley:

Yeah it made a big mess! The mineral spirits got flown out of the inspection hole all over the driveway. My wife was like, "what's all that milk all over driveway?"

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