New Moto Guzzi Door Mats Available Now
Anecdote inbound.When I was in my 20's and just starting out in life I had just started working for Chilton Book Co. I had a high mileage, beat-up Chevy Blazer (and a payment on it). I also had a 1.5 hour commute each way from just outside Lancaster County PA to the Radnor PA on the main line close to Philly. A bunch of my co-workers were all motorcycle obsessed. I learned to ride, bought a cheap bike, then quickly decided I wanted a nice bike.I bought my first new motor vehicle ever - a 1993 Harley 1200 Sporty. I couldn't afford IT AND my Blazer. So I sold the Blazer and decided I'd go bike only.Made it like 2-3 years. Got caught in a snow storm and it took me hours to ride home one day.Bought a cheap Yamaha 650 Special as my "winter beater bike" and rode that when there was too much ice on the roads.I had a snow mobile suit, tried every possible method to keep my face shields from fogging (and they all failed), bought Widder electric gloves, still froze at times.That last year I dropped the 650 like 3 separate times on black ice, one time just trying to get down my driveway.Said, screw it, life is too short for this crap. Ran out and bought a cheap used Geo Tracker... kept the Harley.... hell, bought another shortly thereafter. I have no need to try life without a car again.Anyway, as to your disdain for cars. Sure, riding changed my driving for the better. But let's be real, I'm not going to avoid something that makes my life better just because some idiots use it. If I really tried to avoid that I'd be left with nothing.
I went one year trying to ride only the bike. I still had a car, but my only car on the road at the time was my 70 Mustang drag car. SO I had a bike, and a car with no heat/defrost, no interror at all, steep gears, wide tires, with a manual valve body auto trans... all in upstate NY in the winter... It was fun at the time... and miserable also. One of those things that was cool to HAVE done... but not so much want to do it again. I really didnt mind the bike as long as it was over 30deg, and not glare ice on the roads. Thats no fun. Think I used the bike about 90% of the time.
You sir, are a MAN'S MAN!Or at least you used to be! Ah the day of bing young and dumb!!!
First world problems are tough!
POINT OF ORDER!I AM STILL dumb!101%
What happens is nothing until you want to sell the bike and a prospective buyer uses it as a bargaining point and you have to try and convince him of the facts, putting you on the defensive in negotiation. He leaves anyway, dissatisfied.So then you make an appointment and go to the dealer (nothing available on the weekend and you’ll have to drop the bike off, sorry) and the young and annoying ‘service advisor’ will be “unsure” about whether they can turn the light off without doing an evaluation of the bikes service history. But he’ll get back to you later to tell you that “good news”, Piaggio says it’s OK because you had the records (you did save the oil and parts receipts, right?) and he’ll also get you that extra ignition key you need because the first owner threw the previous spare away after trading in the bike on the spur of the moment. He’s ordered the key (more “good news” they’re still available for now, for $100 despite being made in India) and it’ll be here in a week.”Then we’ll have to get it cut at the locksmith ($100 labor) before coding it to the bike ($120 labor)”. And so on, the sum total of which is nothing to do with my attraction to motorcycles versus late model cars.I think Piaggio is tone deaf. Meanwhile the US Japanese motorcycle importers are generally smart enough to know that US buyers do not want or need chipped keys, they have secure garages not outside parking in Milano, and they want to be able to turn off their own service light because they do their own service and repairs in that garage/workshop too.
Water cooling is a very good point...I would have put my money on the V 85 simply because of size and power ....but the cooling factor would almost be crucial here in summer stuck in traffic in town.
Many motorcycles don't have the cooling capacity to sit in traffic. Many Owners manuals state not to let the bike idle for longer than X minutes. The forums I have frequented for various liquid cooled bikes have had real world complaints of overheating in traffic.
What motorcycles do you own?
Indeed, My Tuono couldn't sit for more than thirty seconds at a light without the coolant temp rocketing up to 225 F , Hopefully the v1000 will be more forgiving with its engine configuration and cooling fins ect. The older air cooled motors were just much better heat sinks with their heaver cast components compared to modern lightweight motors I think.
Practicality is a term that must be left in the car park at the dealer’s premises. You pay 30,000 Australian dollars over here, for a machine that can carry one person realistically and slurps 4.4 - 5.5 litres/100 km.Yesterday I took a trip in a Toyota Camry that was using 5.5 l/100 km in city driving…!I did some math once regarding my Norge..I get 20,000 km from a set of Michelins, that is a bit over $10 per tank of fuel, just for tyres..!So…If me and 3 mates want to go from Melbourne to Sydney that’s 1000 km. The Camry will use 50 litres of fuel at $2.00/litre so that gives $100 divided by 4, so that’s 25 bucks each.If we go on the bikes and they’re all Norges for instance, we will each use 2 complete tanks at 500 km per tank, so that will be $92 each plus $20 for tyres so we are each up for $112 to do the same trip.25 bucks versus 112…. No bike is practical unless you count parking costs.
well I’m definitely learning a few things. I really like both bikes. Currently leaning towards the v85. I’ve never had a problem commuting on my air cooled bikes. For the first time in 6 years of riding I have my own car to use but it sits in the garage. Gina have to test ride both probably. Will probably get more serious in a month or so depending on circumstances
Sorry If I missed this in the discussion - but were I YOU, I would take a look at the # of miles you put on in a year (or anticipate putting on) and compare it to the valve lash adjustment interval on the new V100.There's a exhausting pedantic discussion about it over at ADV rider. But the reader's digest version is that the cams have to come out to change shims and that MIGHT involve significant disassembly for access to pin the motor IF you're not taking shortcuts.That's a hard pass for me, though that is probably the vestigial tail of my preferences from the time long gone when I didn't own a car and rode 20-30k miles a year. These days I could get away with such a bike in the fleet because it is likely that I wouldn't have to do that adjustment more often than every 4-5 years (depending on what else is in the fleet and how far out that adjustment is).That's where my preferences for:* Air-cooled* Hydraulic lifters or simple/easy access locknut valve adjustments* Belt or Shaft drive* EFI first developed. It was after having dealt with the opposites of those things with ridiculous frequency that I found I no longer wanted to deal with those things.So FOR ME - the answer would be simple - a V85.... (or a Bobber - did I mention another leftover original survivor at a local dealer just sold once again freeing me from the fear of purchasing it).Ahhhhhhh, never did I think I would reach the point in life when I was actively trying NOT to buy a bike.It's a lot of work, a lot of work... Good luck failing at it, I'm a little jelly.
Huzo, I noticed you used what some may call a high end European motorcycle in your calculations. In some parts of the world they import bikes from Japan such as a Honda CT110. I am not sure if you have come across one. Apparently they are reasonably capable and can be used almost daily. It would be interesting to hear the cost calculations from someone who has actually ridden one of these some distance, like around a whole country, not just mailbox to mailbox. I mean a decent sized country to, not something like Austria like I heard some bloke once did.
GO GEO!!!I now bow out of this conversation ungracefully.......inditx
Sorry If I missed this in the discussion - but were I YOU, I would take a look at the # of miles you put on in a year (or anticipate putting on) and compare it to the valve lash adjustment interval on the new V100.There's a exhausting pedantic discussion about it over at ADV rider. But the reader's digest version is that the cams have to come out to change shims and that MIGHT involve significant disassembly for access to pin the motor IF you're not taking shortcuts.
It was a great little truck. TOTAL stripped model. No AC, no Power Windows, No Power Steering either if memory serves. NO 4WD... well, no 4WD for the first year or so, then I got bored and made it a 4WD! Then it was a little tank. Nothing could stop it... ...well, nothing but a blizzard one night that put a wall of snow on the road between farmers fields that was taller than the hood of the little beast. I slept in an Amish farmhouse that night... I just couldn't make it the final 5 miles to my home. A non-Amish farmer yanked it out of the snow onto the then freshly plowed road using his tractor the next morning. Still, a great little beast.But I think I like my Wrangler more.Nice Kev, great story.
The V100 valve adjustment interval is 15,000 miles.The V85 interval is 6,000 miles but it takes only half an hour so so at home, it’s not worth taking it to the dealer except for resetting the annoying light in the instrument panel.My current hope with my V85TT is that the dealer can at least reset the light without damaging the bike and I’m neither exaggerating nor paranoid. The same dealer did a 600 mile service before my ownership, which started at 1700 miles, but I got the receipt. When I did the 6000 mile service I found all four valves uniformly set to 0.2-mm (too much), the wrong transmission oil was used, and that a spark plug wire guide bracket screw had been removed from one valve cover and butchered when the hamfisted ‘mechanic’ attempted to reinstall it. Removal of that bracket is not necessary to remove the cover and Piaggio used a Torx head screw to make that clear. Eventually he left it unscrewed, sticking out of the stripped tapped hole at an angle. For this the dealer charged the previous owner $600, including a charge for twice as much engine oil as it holds.Now imagine a shop like that, one of the largest and most successful European bike dealers in the US mind you, doing the valve adjustment on your new V100. There are always a few exceptions but what I think what you’re dealing with at most motorcycle dealer service departments is near total incompetence and/or hurrying to save time that you’ll pay for anyway. Car dealers are the same but the manufacturers have removed most skilled periodic service from car designs.
Similar experience with dealer incompetence has led me to doing my own work. I had the dealer overfill my oil by 2 liters. Af1 is the only competent dealer experience I’ve had and they’re three hours away. I wonder how truly complicated an adjustment for the v100 would be?
Following up on my comments about chipped keys and dealer-only service light resets, I had my local and very well established Italian bike dealer address both today on my V85TT. The experience would apply to either bike equally and is something the buyer of either might bear in mind if the intent is practical use and long life.The dealer did manage to match the new coded and cut key to the bike and to turn off the service light quickly and without damaging the bike, and for that I was happy. I was in and out in 30 minutes on a Saturday, having needed to make an appointment to make that possible weeks in advance. The bill was $157, half an hour labor for each item, notwithstanding that the bike was only on the property for 30 minutes total. So a real labor rate of $314 an hour to address two items that I wish hadn’t been included in the design of the bike. I previously bought the OEM coded key (made by a Pakistani subcontractor to Piaggio, per the packaging) for something like $60 and had it cut by a locksmith for $5 or so. So the cost for a replacement key adds up to about $140 and if you do your own service (which on the V85TT is very easy and not too expensive) you might need to budget an additional $75 every 6,000 miles if you want the service light off. I think a wise owner who does their own work would leave the light on until ready to sell the bike, and then have it reset once. I did it this time only because the bike was in the shop for the spare key, and because I was curious about how much they would charge if left to their own devices and without me pushing back. Having the service icon will still bother me when it comes back on, hardly surprising since that’s the design intent but it doesn’t encourage me to pay tribute to do my own service, it makes me look for a way out.It was an interesting experiment but all of the above is contrary to what I love about motorcycles and with that in mind I’ll be going in a different direction down the road. Piaggio has just lost a customer in his peak earning years who has had at least one Guzzi in the stable continuously since 1987, currently three of them.
Most of the time I don’t get caught in traffic. However it is definitely a valid point. My commute is between 40-60 minutes. 60-70 miles an hour. I have just pulled over in the past in extreme situations and let the engine cool. Water cooled would be nice.
