Norge SI symptoms

[brider]

2007 Norge, I read all about the SI symptoms & fixes here on this forum and performed one of the fixes (super-simple, can't remember exactly what it was).

HOWEVER, The bike has never really ZINGED! when I hit the starter, it has always kind of just lazily spun over, and this is with a fully-charged relatively new battery. Is this characteristic of the Norge? My only other frame of reference is my old Cal 2, which also has a SI bypass, but it FLIES when I hit the starter.

So a week ago, the Norge just went "click" when I hit the starter. Tried several times. Put it in gear & pushed it a bit to move the ring gear, turned it on & off, then ultimately it turned over & started. Yesterday the damn thing did it again, just a 'click' then a faint whiney sound like the fuel pump was cycling up to pressure, but I never could get past the 'click'. Charged the batt for a few hrs, it was already reading a good charge, but then tried to start it and it spun over and started no problem.

Does it sound like I didn't REALLY do the SI-fix correctly?

[guzzisteve]

A friend in Augusta w/8V Norge w/same fix  and same click.  His is for sale   Going back to FJ's

maybe a pinched wire somewhere   Make a hot button 

[Huzo]

Next time it does it, I’d jump the starter directly from the bike’s battery to the starter motor with a damn good lead and if it starts, then it’s in the starter circuit.
If it does not, I’d put the same good lead from the negative to the engine block and if it then if it starts, it’s the earth (ground).
Folks go to a LOT of trouble to clean the battery lead both ends, but the circuit is only as good as the ground cable.
The Norge is known for a breakdown in continuity at the engine end of the negative lead. Undo it from the fitting at the engine end and clean it properly.
Remember too, that the reduction between the pinion and ring gear has a bearing on how fast the engine spins, even if everything is optimum.

[pehayes]

Does this Norge have the dreaded 'autostart' feature.  Meaning that when  you press the starter button you can release your thumb and the bike continues to crank for several seconds on its own.  I suspect it does.  If so, that is the culprit.  In most other bikes, the starter button works directly on the starter circuitry and will almost always crank, even with a low battery.  In the 'autostart' models, the computer is involved and the computer decides whether or not to crank.  The computer does not tolerate any reduction in voltage and instantly cuts input to the starter circuit.  Most people have figured out a way to add a secondary bypass starter switch for use when the computer is screwing up.  It takes awhile to go through FOUR pages, but I recommend you read this thread thoroughly:
https://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=117948.0

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[Oca Grassa]

1st thing…what battery are you using?

2nd, are your terminals tight? At both ends? How clean are they?

3rd, that sounds like a faulty ground.

I recently found (not on my Norge) a battery terminal that was tight, but the cable was still loose. It too would randomly not start. Turned out, the one bolt was too long and bottomed out before the contact with the cable. I’m talking like sheet of paper thickness before contact. Took a while to find that.


When I did, the cable terminal was all arced up and needed a fair amount of dressing & clean up before it was ready for reassembly. Also added a washer under the bolt head to stop it bottoming out. All of that worked and no start issues since.

On my Norge, I added a heavy duty ground cable to a bolt on the engine block. Also bought a group 20 battery with some insane high cold cranking amperage…..enough for most cars even. Norge turns over with a quickness now and starts effortlessly.

I did also clean all the terminal ends and give them all a shot of corrosion X on reinstall, making certain all the bolts were tight.

[SemperVee]

 For what it is worth.  I worried about the same thing on my 07 Norge.  I installed a direct battery to starter hidden momentary button for emergencies.  No difference in start up... 

[brider]

  I installed a direct battery to starter hidden momentary button for emergencies.

I'll check all my grounds, but THIS sounds like a foolproof addition. I assume your switch is beefy enough to handle the current direct to the starter motor?

Yes, mine has that weird autostart feature. What was the logic behind it? I'll read the thread and see what it says, thanks.

[brider]

OK, finally read the 4-page thread and that is EXACTLY the discussion I was looking for. I realize now that the bypass (momentary) switch does not need to carry full starter-motor amperage, misinterpretation on my part.

Smarter minds than mine (Pat gets a big shout-out here for unassailable logic) have analyzed this problem to death, so I'm "going in" with a bypass switch.

Thanks all!

[brider]

UPDATE:

I bought a simple, weatherproof momentary switch:





And was thinking I'd run fused power to it from the batt + and then straight to the starter solenoid, but the starter rear-end is completely obscured by the decorative plastic cover (I really despise those things), and if it wasn't, it's obscured by the big silver sideplate that also requires the shifter to be removed to remove IT. So if I can get power to the starter solenoid via it's junction with the starter RELAY, which wire is that on the relay? Here is MY relay, with the yellow wire capped off and the SI fused jumper in it's place:





Any suggestions are welcome.

[Huzo]

I run mine full time without that poxy plastic cover. I considered taking the starter and related hardware off and doing them in silver like the GS series Beemers.
But I’ve left the stuff black and I now like it more.

[brider]

OK, I figured it out (I'm pretty sure...).

Someone previously posted the SI #1 fix in the diagram below, and I sketched in the SI #2 fix (that's what I call this OTHER problem that almost seems like the classic SI). Seems pretty darn simple, and I'm going to mount the switch on the throttle-side of the Norge dash:





I'm mounting to the throttle-side of the dash because I'm pretty sure you need to pull the clutch in to start.

Thanks everyone (especially for the link to the 4-page discussion), it helps to talk thru this.