V9 Bobber first ride impressions & questions

[faffi]

Are we talking about shock or fork springs?

Shocks. Fork OTOH is plenty stiff and oil is too thick for my taste, giving a harsher ride than needed.

[Zimmermichaels1ea]

What static sag do you have with the bike alone, as well as with you sitting normally? Because they feel stiff, I agree, but that due to them bottoming out. At least on mine. I am 190 lb net and carry 20 lb of riding gear. Same case with my son's V7 from 2010 - rear felt harsh, we upped the preload and it became much smoothere and comfortable. He is around my weight.

Well, I weigh 280 in all my riding gear.  I have the preload dialed all the way up, which seems to help a bit.
I'm really putting my hopes into better shocks and better tires.  Todd at GTM cycles recommends Dunlop Mutant radials, which I think I'll order this week.

[bad Chad]

I’m 240lb and found the stocks to be punishing over bumps, directing the energy through the chassis and into my spine!

I put on a set of Ikon shocks, off the shelf but made to run on the v9 and found the to be much much better.  No more grunting on bad roads.  I don’t know what sag I have set, they work fine for me out of the box so I haven’t felt the need to look into it.

[faffi]

I’m 240lb and found the stocks to be punishing over bumps, directing the energy through the chassis and into my spine!

As did I before I upped the preload - the shocks were bottoming constantly with stock preload. With you being 50 lb heavier, it must have been bone-jarring.

[Dirk_S]

It was noted earlier the counterintuitive notion that the V9 handles well despite having big bobber tires. Conversely, considering the V9 has a fairly steep rake at 26°, shorter trail than typical cruisers (117mm/4.61 in.), and the stock balloon tires have diameters that are at least as big if not a hair more than the V7’s stock tires, on top of the weight of the wheels, less gas up top, and lower seating of the V9 all bringing the weight of the bike closer to the ground, it makes sense why the V9 is perceived as cornering pretty well. Even the unsprung weight of the wheels coupled with the steering geometry of a standard feels to me like the bike’s front WANTS to move easily, as the farther the steering gets from the rider’s hands, the heavier the front gets, thus the front has a bias wanting to fall more into turns. That’s at least what I’m sensing with my position on the bike having changed to a sporty stance with clip-ons up front.

[Bulldog9]

Just catching up with this thread.

A couple of thoughts.
1. The OEM tires are notorious for bed manners and if they are older you may need to change them out.
2. Figure out the proper tire pressures and preload settings for your rear shocks. Have you set the sag properly? Setup makes a ton of difference and getting your bike sorted for you and your writing styles make a big difference.
3. As far as positioning the saddle. In my experience, moving back in a way from the handlebars and closer or more over the rear axle promotes and increases high speed weave. If that gets out of control, you can end up with the tank slapper and become history especially if you going too fast. Perhaps I haven't had enough coffee yet, but I seem to remember the best way to get rid of a tank slapper or that kind of weave is to lean forward and loosen your grip on the handlebars. So sitting farther back makes no sense to me.

Two main causes for the kind of weave you describe for me are too much weight in my saddlebags or top case, too little rear preload, and bad tires or tire  pressure.

[bad Chad]

Maybe that was part of my problem.

[Dirk_S]

Just catching up with this thread.

3. As far as positioning the saddle. In my experience, moving back in a way from the handlebars and closer or more over the rear axle promotes and increases high speed weave. If that gets out of control, you can end up with the tank slapper and become history especially if you going too fast. Perhaps I haven't had enough coffee yet, but I seem to remember the best way to get rid of a tank slapper or that kind of weave is to lean forward and loosen your grip on the handlebars. So sitting farther back makes no sense to me.

I agree with the seating… to a point. I’ve been playing with this, because my V7 III will do a bit of a lateral metronome swing since I began experiencing my front suspension issues with the enduro forks and 21” wheel. One thing I noticed about moving forward is that it forces your elbows up. Noticing that, and keeping in mind that veteran off-road riders always say “keep the elbows up”, I started experimenting—at high speed, if my V7 III begins to do the left-right rock, I lift my elbows, and the rocking usually subsides. Even without moving my weight forward, the rocking subsides. I’m not gripping the handlebar more; in fact, I make sure to keep the grip somewhat loose, but I’m changing the force direction that I put on the ends of the handlebar. I think when the elbows are down, our hands can often pull the ends of the handlebar without our noticing it. This extra pulling force on opposite ends can fairly easily get out of balance once we ride over a bump, uneven surface, etc., which can then lead to an escalating oscillation between the otherwise consistent pull or push on each end. Whereas keeping the elbows up, we’re getting rid of that tendency to hang weight on the ends. So, while I personally found some stabilization on my V9 at speed by moving my weight back to where it’s supposed to me, I did so making sure those elbows were up (and yes, I have also gotten rid of these lateral swings by moving myself forward as well, but noting the elbow placement).

Note that I have also been able to get rid of this pendulum rocking by simply avoiding a straight line and dipping to the left a little, then to the right. But clearly that’s not a permanent fix.

[Zimmermichaels1ea]

Okay, bumping an older thread to give a promised update on the V9 and my issue with it "wiggling" on the back tire a bit at speed.

Well, I purchased new Michelin Commander III Touring tires in the correct load range for the relatively light-weight V9 Bobber, and they have made a HUGE difference!!
The rear tire does not wiggle under me as I ride along smooth pavement (I had trouble detecting the wiggle on crappy road surfaces  ).
The Michelin's make the bike feel very planted on the road even at 80+ MPH on the Interstate.  They don't seem affected by grooved concrete, which is a great, and they corner like the bike is on rails.
So, I think I'm at least 75% there in sorting out handling on the V9.
I say that because riding on a really smooth, freshly paved asphalt road in my town, the ride was very "bouncy" (up and down) and I think that may be because I have the pre-load on the shocks cranked all the way down, probably way too much pre-load.
I guess if the "bouncy" ride continues even after experimenting with rear shock pre-load, the my next move is to purchase better rear shocks set for my weight with adjustable pre-load AND rebound.

That's my story so far!

[Zimmermichaels1ea]

FOUR THOUSAND MILES LATER

Just thought that in the interest of science, I would quickly post my experiences with the Bobber after 4 thousand miles of riding, some of which were on clear, sunny Wisconsin winter days -- so freaking cold!  Besides daily commuting and weekend rides, I took taken 4 longish moto camping trips, two last fall and two this spring.  So a good amount of rides given the weather up here.

I replaced the tires right away last September with Michelin Commander II tires.  They made a HUGE difference in handling, ride comfort and my confidence riding this bike.  The guys at the local bike shop helped me adjust the rear shocks and after the tires and shocks, the bike really handled well.  I took the bike to an advanced street rider course at the motorcycle/cart complex at Road America.   There I really got to throw the bike into the track's tight twists and turns and got to know its handling so much better in a safe environment.  I left that course feeling that the Bobber is a very capable bike, it does take more effort to tip into turns, but it feels very solid and stable in the corners.  It holds a line on the road very well, even in very windy conditions.  At 70+ MPH on the interstate it is fine, but passing semis can buffet the bike a bit.

Over the last eight months, I have begun to really prefer the Bobber to my '23 V7 Special.  I find it comfortable for daily rides and I can ususally sit in the saddle for about the same amount of time that I can sit on the V7 which is @ 2 hours before I need a break.  Fully loaded up with bags and gear, the Bobber is a bit cramped, the V7 feels a bit bigger.

Finally, the Bobber sounds way better than the V7. Its engine note is deep and it really rumbles at idle.  Its valves make much less noise than my V7 which still clicks and clacks loudly.  The V7 has over 7K miles and has had two dealer services, whereas the Bobber has only had it's first service.  Both bikes have identical exhausts one is chrome and the other is black, but they are the same, not like the later Bobbers that have cool looking exhausts.

Conclusion:  The V9 Bobber is a great looking and riding machine, at least in my opinion!

[faffi]

Interesting read, thanks for sharing. I find the stock seat on my V9 to be about as comfy as a church bench, meaning not at all.

How did you cope with the limited cornering clearance during the street course?

[Vagrant]

"V7 which still clicks and clacks loudly" I admit my hearing isn't perfect but I can't hear the valves on mu 15, 16, 17 v7's or any of my four v85's or my new 26 v7 sport. I'd check them myself if I were you.

[bad Chad]

The only reason your v7 valves are ticking louder can be your dealer has set the lash greater than it is set on the v9.    They both are specked the same.

[kingoffleece]

At 240 and 280 those riders are way outside the design parameters.  At a MINIMUM proper spring rates are required for anything even close to acceptable.

[Rons]

Well, I weigh 280 in all my riding gear.  I have the preload dialed all the way up, which seems to help a bit.
I'm really putting my hopes into better shocks and better tires.  Todd at GTM cycles recommends Dunlop Mutant radials, which I think I'll order this week.

Todd did my Griso 12004V suspension front and rear. Totally transformed the bike. I would do what he suggests and set the sag and fork height according to his recommendations.

[Zimmermichaels1ea]

My road course experience:
I must not be an aggressive enough rider  because I never scraped the pegs during the entire course, and the instructor told me that throughout the day he saw my lean angle increase dramatically.  It is for sure a pretty twisty track with all kinds of turns and elevation changes take a look at this link to see an old picture, they've added to the track since then:

 https://www.roadamerica.com/motorplex-track-days

Clicky clacky valves:
Thanks for the advice guys!  I think that I will have to pull the heads and check the valves myself.  What concerns me is that the same Guzzi dealer/shop, and I'm assuming the same mechanics, did the valves on both bikes. Maybe I'll record a video because it is very noticeable.  What is the recommended valve lash?  I've seen several different opinions on the forums.

Finally, the seat:
It is flat, not very plush, but so is my ass!    So for now, it will do!  For long rides I do pack a seat cushion I picked up off of Amazon.  I've only used it once, coming back from moto camping, @ a 300+ mile day and I was trying to get home and that seat began wearing on me.  The cushion helped get me through.  YMMV.

[Guzzidad]

   I bought my 2017 V9 Bobber about 8 months ago. It had 1900 miles on it. I've had enough Guzzi's to know how they're supposed to sound. I also thought there was excessive valve clatter. I checked clearance 3 times, always correct. I also thoroughly inspected for anything loose. Again, everything was perfect. And, the bike runs great. I came to the conclusion it must be cylinder fin ringing. I'm just going to keep riding it and if anything is really wrong it will surely expose itself. It's at 4,000 miles now.

[faffi]

Hm, my 2017 V9 is running very quietly, and I run the clearances at the upper tolerances. Of course, it is not hydraulic tappet silent, but with earplugs I cannot hear anything from the valves, and even without there are no untoward noises. Compared to my old Volvos with B18, B20 and B30 engines, my Guzzi is virtually silent.

[TN Mark]

I had this issue on my V9 Roamer with the stock tires, putting on a set of Dunlop Elite 4's cleared it up for me. I hated those stock tires, didn't like the handling, tire life, or smoothness.

Too few riders seem to understand how much tires affect handling. Thank you for the post what worked for you.

[Huzo]

Uncommanded incessant weaving can be a symptom of poorly greased/overly tight headstem races.

[Zimmermichaels1ea]

Update on the loud valve clicking on my V7 Special as opposed to the quiet valve train on my Bobber:

The valves really tick loudly at idle after the engine is good and warm,  so I rode the 2 hours down to the Guzzi dealer in Milwaukee on Saturday and had the mechanic give it a listen.
He said, as you all surmised, the valves need a bit of adjustment.  "Better too loose, than too tight" he said.  So they will adjust them for me next week.

Though the clicking is noticeable at idle, he said it's not too bad to ride home....just don't really push it hard.  I appreciate his optimisim! One look at me should have told him that I don't ride aggressively 

[Moparnut72]

If you ride it to the dealer it will have to sit for a few hours to cool off. The valves need to be adjusted cold. I screwed up on my free initial service and rode it for `2 hours to the dealership. The plus was that I was given a Zero as a loaner. I really liked it. At the time they were way too expensive and the range was quite limited. It would have made a great around town bike.
kk

[Zimmermichaels1ea]

Good tip!  For service, I usually bring my bikes in on my trailer hitch motorcycle carrier.  That darn thing has more than paid for itself.