How old is too old for tires?

[Stretch]

When one's pride as a cheapskate is in play, there are no tires that are too old.

That's funny, right there!   

                                        -Stretch

[MG_rider]

I have a set of tires from 1962 on one of my bikes. New tubes, a little shoe polish, and they're good to go. Learned from Burt Munro.

Back in early 80's I got hooked on club road racing.  One of the senior guys (actually, THE senior guy) told me how to make expensive road racing slicks remain useful.

He would store them under the house in doubled garbage bags, then spray them with carb cleaner to soften them up.  He had tires that were years old he kept this way and raced on them, partly because he was a cheap SOB and partly because certain styles and sizes were hard to get in later years.  I never tried this technique.

I remember going into the Metzler warehouse up by Everett, WA to pick up some race tires for 6 hour events.  Will never forget the smell of a warehouse full of outgassing race tires!  The vinyl esters in tires, plastics, car dashboards all outgas, relatively high vapor pressure stuff.  That white film on windshields is condensed vinyl esters from the car dashboard.

PS: I still have a Metzler 17" slick in the back here, date stamp "099" if anybody wants it. A little carb cleaner and viola, sticky front slick!

[Joliet Jim]

My best tire story was one that still had the wheel attached. Westbound on I94 in Indiana almost at the Illinois line and I see a truck tire bouncing in the eastbound lanes. I'm in the middle westbound lane with traffic on both sides in my 20' truck puling my 35' travel trailer. Sure enough the wheel bounces over the barrier and crosses the median and decides to come straight for us. As I'm bracing for what I expect to be a wheel through the windshield killing both of us, the wheel all of a sudden takes a super bowl bounce and not only clears the truck but also completely clears the camper and shocks the hell out of the person behind us who managed to miss the wheel. I really hate that expressway.

[egschade]

I have a set of tires from 1962 on one of my bikes. New tubes, a little shoe polish, and they're good to go. Learned from Burt Munro.



Acceptable risk to me on a low speed vintage bike that doesn't get ridden hard. That said, I've run ~30 year old tubed tires on other vintage bikes and rode them hard on those factory tires.
Wouldn't dream of it on a tubeless tire, I get uneasy about the slight cracks from UV exposure that I find on many tubeless tires within the first year. Luckily the tubeless bikes tend to rack up more highway miles so the tires don't last long enough to get too old.

But what about the TUBES in those old tubed tires? If there's air pressure in the tubes they're degrading from the inside out and we all know what happens when a tube lets go.

[wirespokes]

I asked a trucker about the recap issue and he said it was low tire pressure that caused them to come apart.

Tubes disintegrating? Funny - I've run old tubes even though the recommendation is to replace with the tire. If they're undamaged, I've got no qualms about reusing. I've been riding since 1966 and it's not been an issue. I wonder how many shops put talc on the tubes at a tire change? I'll bet it's one of those steps that gets left out along with cleaning the rim of all that black residue on the sealing surface.

[Ncdan]

We all have an experience that has instilled our bottom line as far as how much we are willing to push a worn or aged motorcycle tire. I’ll share the incident that drew my line.
During my time as a motor officer I had an incident involving a blowout on the rear of my 1982 CB900c that we were using at the time for police bikes.
They were dressed out with Vetter equipment and the only modification to the bikes was a fork brace to stabilize the front end a bit to accommodate the extra weight of the fairing.
I was running a call involving a vehicle accident with personal injury, which was always dispatched as a code one call, meaning get there ASAP.
I was responding on a 4 Lane Highway at a speed between 80 and 90 MPH, when the back tire suddenly blew out.
As soon as the tire let go, I came off the throttle and my speed begin slowing quickly.
Everything seemed fine until I got down to below 30 miles an hour and that’s when the thing come unglued. The back end was all over the place and it was a complete struggle until the bike finally came to a stop, with the tire off the rim.
I’m not sure how much of the outcome was due to my experience or just plain luck, but I suspect a little of both.
From that day forward to today, I am very self-conscious and picky about the tires on my motorcycles.

[Dr. Enzo Toma]

But what about the TUBES in those old tubed tires? If there's air pressure in the tubes they're degrading from the inside out and we all know what happens when a tube lets go.

As stated, they have relatively new tubes in them.

[SIR REAL ED]

Does anyone run Armor All in their tubeless tires, or in their tubes to make them last longer?

[egschade]

As stated, they have relatively new tubes in them.

Oops - missed that. Hope it works out for you.

[YellowDuck]

So far I think only two of the replies to this thread have been of the "You can't be too careful, how much is your life worth?" type.  That's impressive.

[Dirk_S]

So far I think only two of the replies to this thread have been of the "You can't be too careful, how much is your life worth?" type.  That's impressive.

Oh, come on—this is a Guzzi forum! Weighing wallet against risk just comes natural to Guzzi ownership….unlike the tire compound, which is ~60% synthetic.

[SIR REAL ED]

Nobody is replying to the Armor All question.

How about baby oil?

Inside and out?

[wirespokes]

Oh, come on—this is a Guzzi forum! Weighing wallet against risk just comes natural to Guzzi ownership….unlike the tire compound, which is ~60% synthetic.

This is a dangerous hobby? sport? obsession? we're involved in. There are some who worry, some who go with only the best or newest to mitigate risks, and others who trust to their karma, or luck... Then there are those who are so in tune with their bikes that they can perceive an impending problem soon enough to avert disaster.

You might call me cheap, but on the other hand, I don't have so much money I've got it to throw around. I'm careful with what I spend it on, and if something isn't a problem, why throw money at it? I'll run down to the wear bars if the tire still feels good, but not beyond that. I could get another thousand out of it, but why? Motorcycle tires aren't all that thick in the first place. It's deemed the wear bars are the point to toss it, no longer safe, so that's when I replace them. I get my use out of stuff. Is that being cheap?

I guess you could call Bert Munroe cheap. He cut corners every which way. Did you know that rather than buy expensive racing slicks he made his own? He figured that the only difference between racing slicks and street tires was the amount of tread on them. For high speed, the tread could fly off. So what did he do? He shaved off the tread on a street tire. And he did 200 mph on those tires!

I've had flats. I recall one time a rear lost air suddenly at about 40mph. Back end all over the lane, but didn't go down. I think it was one of those Mezeler Marathons - stiffer than hell, which probably helped not coming off the bead, but still no fun. Another time I was heading south to Los Angeles and north of the bay area the front went flat. My only flat front. Patched it and continued on to Santa Rosa where I was headed. A few days later heading into LA in rush hour traffic doing about 70 I felt the front going soft and not feeling right. Pulled over and half the air was gone. Patched it again - the previous patch hadn't stuck for some reason. After that, all good.

Now, If I regularly rode at triple digit speeds, or pushed them really hard, I'd possibly be more cautious about the tires. I get a little tense getting up to a hundred, not only about tires - a lot of things. 80 - no big deal.

[Bulldog9]

 


I with all this talk about safety, I'm'm just here waiting for someone to talk about how old a motorcycle helmet should be

[frozengoose]

I with all this talk about safety, I'm'm just here waiting for someone to talk about how old a motorcycle helmet should be

After 40 years, I finally replaced the old Bell Tour Star. Figured it'd had a good run, so bought a new one (Bell Qualifier). The thing of it is, if yah don't have an accident, the age of the helmet don't matter. It's the same with tires, if you don't drive like an idiot, and you're luck holds, 20 year old tires work fine. 🤪

[SIR REAL ED]

I with all this talk about safety, I'm'm just here waiting for someone to talk about how old a motorcycle helmet should be

Slow down Kemosabe.

First we need to discuss how to increase tire longevity by properly oiling one's tires.

What is the correct oil to use?  How often?  Outside only or both inside and outside?

I say olive oil for Pirelli tires at the end of each riding season!  Inside and out!

Change my mind!

[SIR REAL ED]

Bulldog9,

If you think about it (bourbon may help) shoes and tires have a lot in common.....

https://www.bikishoecare.com/blog/mink-oil-vs-neatsfoot-oil-vs-beeswax-leather-care-guide/

[Ncdan]

Talking about the train taking a dirt road🤔
IDK if it holds true but the paperwork that came with a new Bell helmet use to recommend replacing the helmet if it was dropped onto a hard service??

[MikeP996]

Yep, if you drop a helmet onto the concrete, instructions from at least some of the manufacturer used to say, "replace the helmet."  I don't know if it's still true - I've purchased several new helmets in the past few years but haven't read the instructions!

[Ncdan]

Yep, if you drop a helmet onto the concrete, instructions from at least some of the manufacturer used to say, "replace the helmet."  I don't know if it's still true - I've purchased several new helmets in the past few years but haven't read the instructions!

I don’t think I’ve ever owned a helmet that hasn’t fallen off of my motorcycle at least a dozen times😩

[MikeP996]

How do you expect the poor helmet manufacturers to make any money?   

Interestingly, Walmart sells full face helmets for less than 100 bucks.  They have to meet the same safety standards as a $700 Shorai/Arai/Schuberth, etc.  No, I'm not suggesting ditching the Shorai for a Walmart because I assume those big name brands (and others in the price range) far exceed those standards.  But you know what they say about assumptions. 

You could drop your Walmart helmet/replace it six times and still save money!!

[Dr. Enzo Toma]

How do you expect the poor helmet manufacturers to make any money?   

Interestingly, Walmart sells full face helmets for less than 100 bucks.  They have to meet the same safety standards as a $700 Shorai/Arai/Schuberth, etc.  No, I'm not suggesting ditching the Shorai for a Walmart because I assume those big name brands (and others in the price range) far exceed those standards.  But you know what they say about assumptions. 

You could drop your Walmart helmet/replace it six times and still save money!!

Yep. If you're in the market for a helmet and take the safety aspect of it seriously, it's worth taking a good look at those standards. DOT is a bare minimum and that's what the cheap helmets meet. Those mid range and premium helmets from Shoei/Arai/Schuberth tend to also carry ECE certification as the same helmet is sold with different marketing in Europe, and some are even Snell certified.

I sent a crashed helmet to Shoei a few years ago for them to do an impact inspection and check if the helmet had been compromised. It was an accident where I retained consciousness and had no recollection of hitting my head/helmet, but sure enough there was a scrape on the visor and EMS assured me that it's incredibly common for motorcyclists to hit their head/helmet in a crash and not have noticed it. No head injuries were found at the hospital. Anyway, Shoei assessed the helmet and gave me a report on it and shipped it back for free. Their assessment was that it was due for replacement, not from the crash's exterior impact or from the half dozen times I'd dropped the helmet which they noted tend to not compromise it, but from the inner liner, the impact absorbing styrofoam type material, being damaged in a spot from me putting my helmet over a mirror on bikes for a few years instead of setting it down flat or hanging it from a strap. So lesson learned there, propping a helmet up on a mirror can be more damaging than dropping it from seat height or rubbing it down the highway a bit.

[faffi]

Totally agree. If the shell got damaged enough to be a concern from dropping 3 feet to the ground on its own, how on earth could it be expected to withstand an impact at 50 mph while basically supporting your whole body weiight? It is the styrofoam inside that will deteriorate over time from sweat and repeatedly being taken on and off, so when a helmet that once fit snugle start to feel roomy, it is time to replace it. Or if the helmet hit something with your head in it.

But cheap helmets also pass the ECE tests, and can be as safe a costly helmet. What they can lack, is durability, and especially comfort.

[DoubleGuzzi]

.. being damaged in a spot from me putting my helmet over a mirror on bikes for a few years instead of setting it down flat or hanging it from a strap.

I remember from decades back, that in addition to the mirror thing, it was/is inadvisable to repeatedly hang a helmet from its strap. Don't recall the exact reasoning behind it but perhaps more to do with elongation/malforming of the strap, rather than anything structural.

For reference, both sides of The Pond and Downunder, as relevant everywhere:
https://sharp.dft.gov.uk/

[faffi]

I remember from decades back, that in addition to the mirror thing, it was/is inadvisable to repeatedly hang a helmet from its strap. Don't recall the exact reasoning behind it but perhaps more to do with elongation/malforming of the strap, rather than anything structural.

For reference, both sides of The Pond and Downunder, as relevant everywhere:
https://sharp.dft.gov.uk/

Never heard that, but it could be sensible. What I have heard many times, is not to hang the helmet on the mirror, because over time it can compress the inner lining. I still do it, though.

[frozengoose]

I don’t think I’ve ever owned a helmet that hasn’t fallen off of my motorcycle at least a dozen times😩

As luck would have it, I usually throw out or burn stuff like this, I found the brochure that came with the Bell helmet. While it doesn't say too much, other than lots of safety boilerplate, it does have some useful comments...

"Never drop or throw your helmet, as it may cause structural damage... sometimes invisible to the user."

"Do not park your helmet on mirrors or sissy bars... or carry it on the helmet lock while riding as damage to the helmet can occur."

"Bell recommends that helmets be replaced every 3-5 years."

If a helmets recommended lifespan is 3-5 years, you have to wonder how good the materials are or if they're just trying to cover their ass for liability ("sorry but your helmet is too old") and sell more helmets. Since I didn't have an accident with the Tourstar, I'll never know if it was still offering much protection after 40 years. But I did do a slide and roll with a 10 year old Bell open face helmet back in the early 70's and it worked fine. It left a couple of deep gouges in the back of the helmet where my head apparently bounced along the pavement, with no apparent damage to my cognitive abilities, tho my wife might question that!

[n3303j]

I got into the habit of putting my helmet on the ground next to the bike on the shady side. Can't fall off the ground and sun isn't good for fiberglass.

But since getting the Neotec 3 with the complete Sena setup I tend to keep the helmet in sight and at my side at all times. Maybe the floor at a restaurant, but next to my feet.

Meanwhile I spray my tires with 303 Aerospace Protectant spray. Keeps them shiny & black. Protects from UV. (Good enough for the space shuttle, good enough for me.)

[73 sport]

      Question for n3303j : How does 303 hold up in the rain?

[n3303j]

      Question for n3303j : How does 303 hold up in the rain?

It's not magic, but easy enough to reapply. Think of it as an improved version of Armorall. Good for plastics, fiberglass and rubber. It will delay ultraviolet damage. Lasts about 5 weeks.

[73 sport]

     Thanks. I'm looking for something that doesn't washoff in the rain.