V85TT Neutral to 1st

[JHBettsSr]

My '25 V85TT has only 5,000mi. At stop lights it is often difficult to shift from neutral into 1st. I have the clutch adjusted at the 2mm spec. and also changed the gearbox fluid using Liqui Moly 75W-140 GL-5 full synthetic. Adjusting the clutch and the fluid change have not helped. Is this normal? Might it become smoother after more break-in miles? What's your experience? Thanks for any comments or suggestions.

[PeteS]

Try 1mm. It makes a difference.

Pete

[Vagrant]

My 25 is a bit wonky too. The clutch has no friction area. It catches all the way out at 2mm. It seems to not like n to 1 or 2 or 2 to n. ^000 miles on it. I think it just needs time. Mine is 98% highway miles.
My 26 v7 sport is fantastic and it's clutch feels different.

[YellowDuck]

Not sure how experienced you are, so please don't take this as condescending if it is obvious.

If it doesn't immediately engage 1st from N, let the clutch all the way out in N and pull it back in.  Then select 1st.

[Clifton]

Not sure how experienced you are, so please don't take this as condescending if it is obvious.

If it doesn't immediately engage 1st from N, let the clutch all the way out in N and pull it back in.  Then select 1st.

Other tricks on dry clutch motorcycles is to select 1st gear immediately after pulling in the clutch, before the gears completely stop rotating. Or if the gears are not aligned, while gently pressing to 1st let the clutch out a bit to rotate them.

[JHBettsSr]

Not sure how experienced you are, so please don't take this as condescending if it is obvious.

If it doesn't immediately engage 1st from N, let the clutch all the way out in N and pull it back in.  Then select 1st.

Thanks YellowDuck, not condescending at all. Your suggestion is a good one. I've noticed if it doesn't immediately engage 1st from N, I let the clutch back out in N, then shift to 1 AND pull in the clutch simultaneously, it usually hits 1 again. Sometimes I have to do this more than once. Do you know if more break-in miles will smooth this out? Or is it just inherent with this bike and I am the culprit who has to adjust long term? Thanks for your suggestion.     

[Cam3512]

Not an issue on my ‘20 V85.  Never has been.

[JHBettsSr]

Other tricks on dry clutch motorcycles is to select 1st gear immediately after pulling in the clutch, before the gears completely stop rotating. Or if the gears are not aligned, while gently pressing to 1st let the clutch out a bit to rotate them.

Thanks Clifton, I've tried "while gently pressing to 1st let the clutch out a bit to rotate them". Unfortunately, my V85TT will shift into 1st with the clutch still completely engaged. I've got the bruised calves to prove it :-). That's when I found that shifting into first while simultaneously pulling in the clutch helps get the gears rotating and allows shifting into 1st (usually). I'm wondering if this will smooth out over time or do I have to just get used to it? 

[Clifton]

...I'm wondering if this will smooth out over time or do I have to just get used to it?

I think you'll just have to get used to it (adjust). It's really the same on any vehicle with a dry clutch be it a car, tractor, etc. My Civic and Kawasaki Mule are the same, when the teeth are stopped opposite each other one needs rotated a smidge.

My problem is more with wet clutches that drag from the oil film, never stopping the gears therefore giving a lurch going into 1st. Some aren't too bad but the Stelvio I had was awful about that.

[azccj]

When you pull in the clutch lever and hold it in for a few seconds, is there a clunk when you shift it into 1ST?

[Moparnut72]

It has been quite common on my V7's when first started and cold. Just put a little pressure on the shifter and ease the clutch lever out and it will drop right into gear. The dogs and the slots need to line up. After the trans, er, gearbox warms up a bit not usually a problem as the gears are spinning more freely.
kk

[JHBettsSr]

When you pull in the clutch lever and hold it in for a few seconds, is there a clunk when you shift it into 1ST?

If I pull in the clutch lever and hold it for a few seconds, the shift lever often does not go down or engage 1st. But sometimes when the shift lever does go down and engage 1st it's just a soft click.

[PeteS]

I have a 2025 V85tt. I would say your problem is unusual. I had a brief problem with finding neutral from 1st or 2nd gear but that was resolved by limiting free play at the clutch lever to 1mm. Never a problem going from neutral to 1st.

Pete

[JHBettsSr]

I have a 2025 V85tt. I would say you problem is unusual. I had a brief problem with find neutral from 1st or 2nd gear but that was resolved by limiting free play at the clutch lever to 1mm. Never a problem going from neutral to 1st.

Pete

You're the second person to suggest setting the free play to 1mm. I'll give that a try and see what happens. Thanks Pete.

[Moparnut72]

Read post #10 again. I have had 4 Moto Guzzis, this worked on 3 of them the 4th was a wet clutch so it engaged instantly pretty hard with no drama. Put a little pressure on the lever and ease the clutch lever out It will drop right in.
kk

[Huzo]

Read post #10 again. I have had 4 Moto Guzzis, this worked on 3 of them the 4th was a wet clutch so it engaged instantly pretty hard with no drama. Put a little pressure on the lever and ease the clutch lever out It will drop right in.

+1

[QuickLime]

I had issues with getting to 1st on my V85 - turned out to be the shifter was misadjusted from the dealer. Worth checking on that as well - works great now. I thought maybe it was a weird Guzzi thing - nope.

[Huzo]

turned out to be the shifter was misadjusted from the dealer.

???..!

[JHBettsSr]

It has been quite common on my V7's when first started and cold. Just put a little pressure on the shifter and ease the clutch lever out and it will drop right into gear. The dogs and the slots need to line up. After the trans, er, gearbox warms up a bit not usually a problem as the gears are spinning more freely.
kk

Well that is a good idea. Unfortunately it doesn't help. After pulling in the clutch for a few seconds, I apply downward pressure on the shifter. If it doesn't go into 1st, I keep downward pressure on the shifter and begin slowly letting out the clutch. The clutch lever will release all the way out but still no engagement into 1st even though I'm holding firm pressure on the shifter. When this happens the only way I can get it into 1st is to let out the clutch, then shift into 1st while simultaneously pulling in the clutch. I sure appreciate your suggestion though. Thanks Moparnut72.

[Vagrant]

Will it go up into second then down to first?

[PeteS]

There is something wrong here. If it was working correctly no special technique is required. They actually shift better than most bikes, better than my EV for sure and just as well as my LeMans.

Pete

[Clifton]

There is something wrong here. If it was working correctly no special technique is required. They actually shift better than most bikes, better than my EV for sure and just as well as my LeMans.

Pete

I agree. Assuming the clutch is adjusted right pull the clutch and immediately lightly press down and it should shift easily into first. If not the bike needs to see the dealer.

But I've seen riders used to wet clutch motorcycles struggle shifting to neutral on a dry clutch motorcycle. On a ride some years ago a friend wanted to try my K100RS so we pulled over and switched bikes. I told him to lead and was watching him get ready when he looked down the shifter and started stomping on it! I knew what was happing so jumped off and ran over and sure as heck he yelled "it won't go into gear". We had a "discussion" on the differences on how dry and wet clutches function.

[JHBettsSr]

Will it go up into second then down to first?

Yes it will go into 2nd from N, but then when trying to shift to 1st from 2nd, going thru neutral, the problem often reoccurs.

[buck]

Yes it will go into 2nd from N, but then when trying to shift to 1st from 2nd, going thru neutral, the problem often reoccurs.

Doesn’t sound normal. My ‘22 has one of the nicest shifting transmissions out of many bikes I’ve owned. Take it to the dealer and demonstrate the issue to them.

[JHBettsSr]

I agree. Assuming the clutch is adjusted right pull the clutch and immediately lightly press down and it should shift easily into first. If not the bike needs to see the dealer.

But I've seen riders used to wet clutch motorcycles struggle shifting to neutral on a dry clutch motorcycle. On a ride some years ago a friend wanted to try my K100RS so we pulled over and switched bikes. I told him to lead and was watching him get ready when he looked down the shifter and started stomping on it! I knew what was happing so jumped off and ran over and sure as heck he yelled "it won't go into gear". We had a "discussion" on the differences on how dry and wet clutches function.

Thanks, I think you guys have confirmed that it's not just a "Guzzi issue". I've been riding bikes for about 60 years, was a Certified Automotive Master Technician for about 25 years, then retired as a mechanical engineer designing automotive engine parts. So I get the wet clutch/dry clutch gearbox operational differences. This V85TT is still under the factory warranty thru 2026. I'll take it to the dealer for a consult. It just hurts me to take it to the dealer, I really don't respect their service writer. Thanks for everyone's help.

[PeteS]

Thanks, I think you guys have confirmed that it's not just a "Guzzi issue". I've been riding bikes for about 60 years, was a Certified Automotive Master Technician for about 25 years, then retired as a mechanical engineer designing automotive engine parts. So I get the wet clutch/dry clutch gearbox operational differences. This V85TT is still under the factory warranty thru 2026. I'll take it to the dealer for a consult. It just hurts me to take it to the dealer, I really don't respect their service writer. Thanks for everyone's help.

I know the feeling. I opted to buy my bike from a dealer 350 miles from me, Jim Hamlin, rather than the one closest.
Maybe why mine shifts so easily. Good luck with yours.

Pete

[Moparnut72]

Sounds like my Mandello when it was new. It wouldn't go into neutral from 1st when stopped. I was going to take it back to the dealer. I was told over the phone "all Italian bikes do that." Anyway it just took some miles before it started shifting normally. I think it had something to do with the mechanism that prevents the gearbox from going into 2nd from first when stopped. I figure it must have been some kind of burr or machining abnormality.
kk

[JHBettsSr]

Well I awoke with a theory this morning that fixed my neutral to 1st shift problem. It turns out that the adjustable gearshift tie rod (#15) was too short from the factory. The gear change lever (#1) was hitting a hard stop (bottoming out) before the gearbox shift lever (#17) could rotate the shift drum all the way into 1st gear. I've lengthened the gearshift tie rod so that the gearbox shift lever completely rotates BEFORE the gear change lever can bottom out. All is well now, especially since I didn't have to take my Guzzi to the dealer for them to keep forever and mess up something else :-).

[PeteS]

Well I awoke with a theory this morning that fixed my neutral to 1st shift problem. It turns out that the adjustable gearshift tie rod (#15) was too short from the factory. The gear change lever (#1) was hitting a hard stop (bottoming out) before the gearbox shift lever (#17) could rotate the shift drum all the way into 1st gear. I've lengthened the gearshift tie rod so that the gearbox shift lever completely rotates BEFORE the gear change lever can bottom out. All is well now, especially since I didn't have to take my Guzzi to the dealer for them to keep forever and mess up something else :-).

Was it just a matter of removing a heim joint and backing off a few threads?

Pete

[Huzo]

Was it just a matter of removing a heim joint and backing off a few threads?

Pete

Aaahhhh……..