'26 Special Suspension - Fixed

[Moparnut72]

My bike just turned 2k today. I figured by now it would start loosing up a bit. The roads in northern Cali aren't that great but the ride on my bike is really stiff, more than my V100 was. I started doing some checking on different things. First of all I am pretty light, 160 lbs soaking wet. I swear if someone threw some change on the road I could count it. So while going down the road I put my fingers on the joint between the fork tube and the slider. Virtually no movement. When I got home to open the gate I checked for sag when I got off and on and there was none. So were the forks over filled, spring too stiff or did they put 80W/140 in them. Another thought this is the first time I have ever ridden on Michelin tires, due to their history of longevity are they that stiff. I realize that modern tires run more air pressure than tires from the 60's and 70's did. It is making me wish for the suspensions I had on my old Airheads. I am not a canyon carver anymore as I am elderly so I am not looking for major handling but I would like a smoother ride. Any thoughts before I tear into things and I do not as in will not spend big bucks on  high zoot aftermarket parts. I can't justify $1,000 on suspension parts for a $10k bike. I know I am whining but I want to do a bit of moto camping this summer but I don't want to get personal with every imperfection in the road. My V7lll rode better than this. I also wonder if MG is compensating for heavy Americans. I apologize for the rambling.
kk

[YellowDuck]

There's quite a bit you can do without spending much.

Do a proper rider weight sag measurement.  If it's less than 30% of total travel then you might want to consider lighter springs.  One problem is that no one seems to know what the stock spring rate is.  I tried to measure the ones on my 2023 V7 stone and got 6 N/mm, but who knows if I measured right.  Race tech on their site list the stock rate at 8 N/mm, which honestly seems more likely to me.

If you have any sag at all (there really should be some, even at your weight!), you can do a stiction test.  While you are on the bike, have someone lift up the front end a bit, then let it settle slowly back down.  Measure sag.  Then have them push down on the front end, and let it rise slowly.  Measure sag again.  If the difference between the two measurements is more than about 10 mm your forks are sticky, which might just be tight seals still needing to break in, but could also be bent fork tubes.

Another thing that can increase fork stiction is the front end being twisted in the triple clamps.  You can see this pretty easily just by sighting the forks from the side.  The two tubes should be perfectly parallel. 

Too-heavy oil won't have any effect on average sag, it will just affect how long it takes to achieve it when you add or remove weight.  It can contribute to apparent stiction, which is why sag is best measured as the average of the stuck-up and stuck-down measurements described above.  (on a bike with externally adjustable damping, you wind the damping adjusters all the way out before doing the stiction test or a sag measurement).

[Vagrant]

I don't remember if you got the sport or special. My sport with the supposedly adjustable front upside down forks is too stiff also. I think they pulled it off a Aprilia and just stuck it on the Goose. I looked in the book and the recommended setting is full soft. Or in other words it really isn't adjustable. I'm 180 + 20 pounds for gear and would love to be able to back it off four turns. Also if they had put in some rebound adjustment it would have helped. I'm at 1700 miles and the first 1000 was on horrible Az roads so it should be about as good as it will get.
I've never had any experience with these forks. How hard is it to change out springs?

[YellowDuck]

I don't remember if you got the sport or special. My sport with the supposedly adjustable front upside down forks is too stiff also. I think they pulled it off a Aprilia and just stuck it on the Goose. I looked in the book and the recommended setting is full soft. Or in other words it really isn't adjustable. I'm 180 + 20 pounds for gear and would love to be able to back it off four turns. Also if they had put in some rebound adjustment it would have helped. I'm at 1700 miles and the first 1000 was on horrible Az roads so it should be about as good as it will get.
I've never had any experience with these forks. How hard is it to change out springs?

There's really no such thing as hard or soft when it comes to preload adjustment, which is all the Sport has.  Adding preload helps to keep from bottoming out the forks, but not by making them stiffer, just by raising the starting point where the fork is in its travel when the spring is compressed enough to support the weight of bike + rider.  Think of it as adding positive (compression) travel at the expense of negative (extension) travel.  In any situation where you are neither bottoming out nor topping out the forks, adjusting preload will barely affect suspension feel at all, except for the small difference in front ride height.

[Michael_A]

Before you do any mods it would be good to make sure the stock suspension is not binding or otherwise having a problem. You noted little to no movement going down the road. I'd check the axle/pinch-bolt setup and the fork brace over the fender, and make sure those aren't out of alignment and causing binding. The front end of the V7's is fairly supple, and a tad firm but not bad. I'm at 240lbs and am impressed with the ride quality/handling balance. Perhaps there could be an assembly problem binding up the forks? I've seen it on other bikes in the past....

[Moparnut72]

There's quite a bit you can do without spending much.

Do a proper rider weight sag measurement.  If it's less than 30% of total travel then you might want to consider lighter springs.  One problem is that no one seems to know what the stock spring rate is.  I tried to measure the ones on my 2023 V7 stone and got 6 N/mm, but who knows if I measured right.  Race tech on their site list the stock rate at 8 N/mm, which honestly seems more likely to me.

If you have any sag at all (there really should be some, even at your weight!), you can do a stiction test.  While you are on the bike, have someone lift up the front end a bit, then let it settle slowly back down.  Measure sag.  Then have them push down on the front end, and let it rise slowly.  Measure sag again.  If the difference between the two measurements is more than about 10 mm your forks are sticky, which might just be tight seals still needing to break in, but could also be bent fork tubes.

Another thing that can increase fork stiction is the front end being twisted in the triple clamps.  You can see this pretty easily just by sighting the forks from the side.  The two tubes should be perfectly parallel. 

Too-heavy oil won't have any effect on average sag, it will just affect how long it takes to achieve it when you add or remove weight.  It can contribute to apparent stiction, which is why sag is best measured as the average of the stuck-up and stuck-down measurements described above.  (on a bike with externally adjustable damping, you wind the damping adjusters all the way out before doing the stiction test or a sag measurement).

I was thinking more about this last night in bed going to sleep when I do my best thinking.    So lighter springs came to mind as well as fork alignment. I get maybe .5 mm sag when I get on the bike. It hardly moves at all. I have 2,000 miles on the bike so I figure the seals should have worn in by now. I can push down on the bars with almost no movement at all. Locking the front brake and forcing the bike back and forth I can get movement but it takes quite a bit of force. When I had my V7lll it would drop 3 or 4 mm when taken off the side stand stand and a bit more when I got on. First thing I am going to do this morning is realign the forks. If that doesn't help on to further investigation. Thanks for your insight, your thoughts mirrored mine. I went for a ride yesterday afternoon on a rough country road. This is totally unacceptable even had me thinking BMW. Horrors! I'll now read the rest of the comments.
kk

[mechanicsavant]

imho , If the OEM tires are bias ply (as both my small blocks were), radial ply tires will feel like you’ve roller skated onto a cork floor ! No more counting the Pennie’s & grains of sand ! Once again just my humble opinion!

[Moparnut72]

Thought about that too. Like I said I have never had a set of Michelin tires before. My tire of choice has always been Avons, I have always found them to ride quite smoothly.
kk

[Moparnut72]

I went to the shop and jacked her up and loosened up all the pinch bolts and moved everything around until I was satisfied everything was straight and free. Let it down and now it is doing what it is supposed to do. I don't suppose they take a lot of time on the assembly line. Slide everything in and tighten it all up. I haven't test ridden it yet but I am confident it will be a whole lot better. It actually settles a little bit coming off the side stand and more when I get on. I am by myself so I can't measure anything. No zip ties, I messed up a seal on my V7lll doing that which resulted in a big cluster with the speed sensor. Thanks all.
kk

[Moparnut72]

Before you do any mods it would be good to make sure the stock suspension is not binding or otherwise having a problem. You noted little to no movement going down the road. I'd check the axle/pinch-bolt setup and the fork brace over the fender, and make sure those aren't out of alignment and causing binding. The front end of the V7's is fairly supple, and a tad firm but not bad. I'm at 240lbs and am impressed with the ride quality/handling balance. Perhaps there could be an assembly problem binding up the forks? I've seen it on other bikes in the past....

I think this is what was causing the binding.
kk

[Moparnut72]

Just got back from a test ride. All good. Even turns are much better, I can now even feel the damping. So I treated her to a bath, she doesn't get them often enough. She is a work horse, all kinds of chores, grocery getter, mail retriever etc. Thanks everyone.
kk

[YellowDuck]

Just got back from a test ride. All good. Even turns are much better, I can now even feel the damping. So I treated her to a bath, she doesn't get them often enough. She is a work horse, all kinds of chores, grocery getter, mail retriever etc. Thanks everyone.
kk

Wonderful!  So glad you got it sorted.  That's really disappointing that a new bike would be delivered to the owner with that type of issue.

[Michael_A]

Hate to say it, but I have seen it before when I was working at a BMW Motorcycle dealership in the 80's. Yeah, sometimes the factory missis something, or it gets tightened out of sequence. Maybe once or twice a year we would catch one with a sticky front end. The mechanics were very thorough in their pre-delivery inspections, and could tell pushing the bike out of the crate and onto a lift that the front end felt "off". They would loosen, bounce, re-tighten, etc. and that was all it took. Maybe a 10 minute job, but it kept from having a customer come back. Glad it was a simple fix and kudo's to the OP for taking it on - something that the dealership should otherwise address under warranty.

[Vagrant]

Exactly what steps did you do.

[Michael_A]

Didn't know if you were asking the OP or me.... but this is what we did at the shop back in the day...

1.Glass plate or machined flat plate on upper fork tubes to verify alignment as mounted in triple trees.
    1.1  If not flat against forks adjust triple trees/clamps.
2. Loosen axle and pinch bolts. (Usually this was it... pinch bolts tightened before axle nut. Lower fork leg(s) would "pop" into place.)
3. Loosen fork brace.
4. "Bounce" front end and note any difference. Usually the front axle takes a minute "set" or may need to be drawn fully home and seated.
5. Torque axle FIRST.
6. Torque pinch bolts SECOND.
7. Torque fork brace LAST while assistant pushes front end down or bounces front end. Note any binding.

If that doesn't do it, suspect bent fork tubes (never saw that on a new bike, but some poorly crash repaired ones).

[Moparnut72]

That's funny, I did it in reverse order. One difference is that I lifted the bike. Turns out that something is different as my lift and my special spacer for my V7lll doesn't work. It interferes with the exhaust system. So I lifted the front end by the center of the handle bars. I undid all the pinch bolts where I found that the fork brace has quite a bit of play at the attachment points. I centered that as best I could tightened it first and then went on to all the others.
kk

[Vagrant]

Thanks everybody especially Michael. I never would have thought of having to re-adjust the front end on a new bike. Now there were no earth shattering snap crackle and pops but My forks now work! I now have 1 3/4" sag in the front with 0 preload on the adjusters. They claim there is 5.43" travel. In the rear I have 1 1/4" on the lowest setting of preload out of 3.86 travel. The bike now rides smooth and comfortably.
I have the forks now raised to the lowest ring groove cut into the forks. I had gone an extra 1/8" but I like this better.

[Michael_A]

How are you adjusting front end preload? I have a 26 V7 Special and there are no adjustments. I'd like to crank in a bit more because, errr... I'm fat. Did you put adjuster caps on or have a Sport?

[Kev m]

How are you adjusting front end preload? I have a 26 V7 Special and there are no adjustments. I'd like to crank in a bit more because, errr... I'm fat. Did you put adjuster caps on or have a Sport?

He has a Sport.

[Vagrant]

There were some cheap Chinese ones discussed here in the past.

[DoubleGuzzi]

There were some cheap Chinese ones discussed here in the past.

Yup!

[Vagrant]

How are you adjusting front end preload? I have a 26 V7 Special and there are no adjustments. I'd like to crank in a bit more because, errr... I'm fat. Did you put adjuster caps on or have a Sport?

How much sag ate you at now? You might be able to make a spacer for the fork to raise the sag.

[kingoffleece]

That won't fix an incorrect spring weight.

[Michael_A]

I'm just enjoying riding the heck out of this thing, and now it's past break in I can push a bit harder. Going to leave things alone for a while suspension wise until I form a clearer opinion on what, if anything, it may need. It's pretty darn good right out of the box!
On most Japanese bikes I almost always have to add about 1/2 inch of front preload. My Bonneville T100 was about spot on. And all my airhead BMW's needed major respringing. My new V7 COULD, MAYBE, use around 1/4 inch more preload.... but maybe not... we'll see!