The New Indian Chief Thunder Stroke 111 merged threadfest

[Aaron D.]

Nothing retro about a nice bike that serves the purpose you desire. Ageless, in fact.

[Orange Guzzi]

Nice try, but not impressed.  Looks like a parts bin bike.  More of the same. It probably is a nice bike, but looks cookie cutter too me.  Just my opinion. I'm sure there are buyer waiting to own one.  I would have been more impressed with a bike styled after something from the early 1900's and smaller displacement.   

[rocker59]

Nice try, but not impressed.  Looks like a parts bin bike. 

Which parts appear to be from a catalog or parts bin?

From what I've seen, there are lots of proprietary details on this bike.  (unlike the previous Indian attempt).

[oldbike54]

Still not an Indian .Sorry
Dusty

[oldbike54]

Boy , try to start a fight . ;D
Dusty

[Shorty]

One of the first test riders. He says he's from Ohio, but I detect a little Pittsburgh in his accent n'nat ;)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-tN6NrrEpk

Flashy Indian intro at Sturgis featuring Mike Wolfe, Don Emde, etc..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nicrmr_PXkA

[Shorty]

Still not an Indian .Sorry
Dusty

My Bonneville's not a "real" Triumph, either, but I ain't going back to the old ones... ;)

[Lannis]

Still not an Indian .Sorry
Dusty

Well, you know, from the standpoint of the Indian era (1901 - 1954) our Guzzis aren't real Guzzis either.

They've got two cylinders kind of poking up in the air, instead of one cylinder sticking forward and a big outside flywheel ...

And the company's been bought and sold and reorganized and fooled around with so many times, the oldest man in the world couldn't figure out what happened.   

But I'm OK with it!

Lannis

[formerlyRI_Steve]

"PolarIndian ,  PolIndarian "

Wouldn't that make it an Eskimo?

[mojohand]

... Oh well ?  ;) :BEER:

Albatross? :)

[handyandy]

Well we finally got a quick peek at the new Indians last night. Looks like they will have 3 models. They might give HD a pain in the wallet.

[Kev m]

http://wildguzzi.com/forum/index.php?topic=61876.0

 ;-T

[leafman60]

I bet we will see aftermarket fender options to replace those huge valanced fenders.

Back in the 50's, some Indian riders replaced them too.

[Kev m]

I bet we will see aftermarket fender options to replace those huge valanced fenders.

Back in the 50's, some Indian riders replaced them too.

Perhaps - but they exist now for a different reason (as an homage to the 50s) so I suspect most who buy this brand will want to keep them for that reason.

[leafman60]

I dunno about that.  Several members of the target demographic that I know have already made comments about the bike being a little too funky with those big fenders and that weird fairing.

Time will tell.  I hope they sell.

I have no interest.  They're ugly to me.  Sorry.

[Gary]

I love the fenders, always have. Reminds me of a Delage Coupe. I really like the new Chieftain. No way those fenders would be removed from my bike.

[sthomag]

Nobody's commented on the "cast aluminum frame". That is a truly different approach, reminding me of the pressed-steel frames used by small go-to-work bikes in the 50s and 60s: NSU Max, Honda Dream, etc. I wonder if they saved any weight using it.

On a different note, it should make the bike easier to clean: always a consideration with the chrome crowd.

[rocker59]

Nobody's commented on the "cast aluminum frame". That is a truly different approach, reminding me of the pressed-steel frames used by small go-to-work bikes in the 50s and 60s: NSU Max, Honda Dream, etc. I wonder if they saved any weight using it.

On a different note, it should make the bike easier to clean: always a consideration with the chrome crowd.

If I'm not mistaken, Victory is already using aluminum frames, so Polaris has a history with the technology.

[wheaties]

From the Cycle World article:

“I can really see the brand going anywhere and everywhere, and we want it to,” says Gray. “We don’t want the brand to pinned down into cruisers, baggers and touring like everyone probably expects. We want to go beyond that. That won’t be a quick process. It’s not going to happen next year, it’s going to happen over fives and tens of years.”

http://www.cycleworld.com/2013/08/03/2014-indian-chief-vintage-and-chieftain-bagger-first-ride-review-photos-specs/?src=SOC&dom=fb

Two things:

 1) The rake and trail are both less for the Chieftan over the other two.  That is really significant.  

 2) The editor talks about how great they sound, but do you think they'd offer a sound clip?  No.....

Regarding the fender debate.  My thought when I saw them was, if there was anything that gave the Indian it's signature look, it would be the fenders.  If I were designing the bike to relaunch the Indian line, I'd have taken steps to preserve that look.  Change can come later (or aftermarket).  For now, sell them on genuine Indian with all you've got.  

To me they give the bike a weighty appearance that is nearly too much.  Mind you, if someone gave me any of the three in any color tomorrow, I'd be quite happy to keep the bike.  But I wonder if it might be possible to modernize the design in a way that preserves the Indian essence, the design cues.   You can look at the design evolution of the Ford Mustang and still see that it's a Mustang (with some exceptions).  I'd like to see the same evolution on the Indian.

One other thing, what's the point of having spoked wheels if you can hardly see the spokes?  


(still waiting to hear the bike going down the road)
Matt

[tasbrus]

 I'd sure like to try one out and I just may take a test ride before summers end.

[Kev m]

1) The rake and trail are both less for the Chieftan over the other two.  That is really significant.  

That results in a shorter wheelbase as well.

The Chieftain also has an air ride suspension with more travel.

 ;-T

[rocker59]

Two things:

 1) The rake and trail are both less for the Chieftan over the other two.  That is really significant.  

 

They've taken a lesson from HD and used the "reverse triple trees" (as seen on the Electraglides for the past 30-years) for the Chieftan.  I believe this idea debuted on the Tour Glide.

[Kev m]

Thinking about it more - I originally said I'd like a Vintage with the bags and wheels from a Chieftain - but now I'm thinking I'd rather have a Chieftain with the windshield of the Vintage (but keep the LED driving lamps, assuming they're different from the lamps currently on the Vintage).  ;-T

Honestly, this is a real serious contender for me when I buy another big road going bike in a couple of years.

Cali 1400 (Custom with windshield and HB C-Bows)
Indian Chieftain/Vintage
Vic Cross Roads 8-Ball
RK

Honestly not sure what I'd buy if I had to tomorrow.

[JJ]

Thinking about it more - I originally said I'd like a Vintage with the bags and wheels from a Chieftain - but now I'm thinking I'd rather have a Chieftain with the windshield of the Vintage (but keep the LED driving lamps, assuming they're different from the lamps currently on the Vintage).  ;-T

Honestly, this is a real serious contender for me when I buy another big road going bike in a couple of years.

Cali 1400 (Custom with windshield and HB C-Bows)
Indian Chieftain/Vintage
Vic Cross Roads 8-Ball
RK

Honestly not sure what I'd buy if I had to tomorrow.

Agreed.  The Indian demo trailer is coming through the Phoenix area in October, and I signed up for a test ride. 8)  I would like to get another Big Twin touring bike someday, and all the one Kevm mentioned are good, each in their own right. 8)

Would like to see the new Cali 1400 in person also, someday.  The Victory's are a very good option if you don't want to go Milwaukee twin.  The Road King are tried and proven and GREAT open highway bikes. :)

[190 Octane]

There is one thing a find odd about the marketing strategy.  Does any one else think its ironic that the same company that makes Victory is marketing Indian as "Choice is coming to American motorcycles?"

[Kev m]

There is one thing a find odd about the marketing strategy.  Does any one else think its ironic that the same company that makes Victory is marketing Indian as "Choice is coming to American motorcycles?"

I guess it's just easier than saying "choice is coming for guys looking to buy traditionally styled American Motorcycles" and/or they're admitting that the target demographics for Indian is different than that for Victory.

[rocker59]

And better than "more choices are coming to..."

 :BEER:

The marketing is aimed directly at the HD demographic.  All of thier advertising is jabbing HD.

[Kev m]

MD first ride:

http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2013/08/2014-indian-chief-classic-vintage-and-chieftain-md-first-ride-part-1/

Polaris Industries has been frustrated, I am sure, with its efforts to grab market share from Harley-Davidson in the heavyweight cruiser category with its Victory brand.  Although, to be fair to Victory, it has reached the number 2 position behind Harley in worldwide market share for the category.  Nevertheless, for the American consumer in particular, branding is hugely important.  If  you don’t believe me, spend a few minutes doing a Google search of the “importance of branding”.  Indian is the brand to take it to Harley in a way Victory never could, and the reaction of the Harley faithful here in Sturgis (more about that later) is proof positive.

Oh, and about the bikes.  The new Chief models, including the Classic, Vintage and Chieftain, are extremely impressive on several levels.  Polaris tasked its designers and engineers with building the best bike platform in the category. 

<snip>

The largely aluminum, backbone frame feels stiffer than anything I can remember riding from the competition.  Indeed, the Victory platform comes closest, but the Indian frame feels more solid beneath me, leading to more precise handling and accurate suspension movement (without having to deal with random flexing and rebound from a less stout, steel chassis).

Though I have to say, sounds like some of that is from press release copy - and either the MD writer or Polaris's engineers didn't bother testing a Cali 1400...

[Andrew Thomas Evans]

There is one thing a find odd about the marketing strategy.  Does any one else think its ironic that the same company that makes Victory is marketing Indian as "Choice is coming to American motorcycles?"

Not really, since I personally don't think the market for those would want to buy a Harley (or something traditional) really bothers to look around to other brands - espically overseas - when they are looking. It's not good or bad, but they want a HD and they want that look, that badge, and to say they have one. I don't see them getting that same kind of enjoyment or pleasure from anything else, unless it's a custom chopper. Granted that isn't the whole of the cruser market, but I'll guess that it's a pretty good chunk.

What I've said before is it will be interesting to see what happens with the Victory line now that some of their models and ideas may crossover. The more HD looking bikes may transfer over to Indian (which would be neat) and would leave Victory with more room to design and grow their more core markets or work on more designs that would more fit the victory brand. It could also open them up to a more sport or racing bike as now they wouldn't have to worry about being a full line of crusers. It will also be interesting to see (in the years ahead, Polaris doesn't seem to be in a hurry) what they will do with Indian, leave it as more vintage throwback bikes with a lot of cues to the past, or expand it a bit. In any event I see both lines as complementing eachother and now they can grow in their own directions and focus on what they are good at rather than having to be a bunch of different things.

I also see the Indian name as one that could compete with HD. There are more than a few people who already know the brand, and with their marketing I'm sure recognition is going to pick up pretty quick - plus if it's a good bike all the press that it will get. Which is another thing I've said before - Polaris already has the designers on staff to create/build/test a new engine, it's not their first time around with a bike, and they do pretty good work. So as they have done, all they needed to do (still a big project) was on ond hand focus on marketing (since there was no doubt on the product) and on the other create a great product. Now maybe they hired on more resources for this, maybe they had to put on the back burner some Victory or regular projects, but it was well within the scope of the company to do this - and market this. They also have a dealer network to tap, so they aren't starting from scratch there like some companies are. So again, more money and focus can go into marketing and getting a good campange going that could chip away from the HD image and/or start the foundation with one of their own.

Which goes back to the name. Motorcycles are a lot about image, and an expression about who you are. A lot of people feel that in order to be riders (not good or bad just the way it is) you need to have a HD. It's American made, has (what they brand as) a rich history, and they have been successful in getting that brand out to everything (accessories, clothing, etc), so you buy into the whole lifestyle. I think if done right and taken slowly Indian has a chance (finally, after so many years) to start this on their own, build that lifestyle, and gain a following OR at least be accepted into the HD/American bike lifestyle - so either choice is fine, rather than just one choice.

Again, without that history I'm not sure a company just start up and get into that market. HD has it pretty much cornered and their customers are more interested in the looks, branding, and lifestyle, than anything else. Which is why other cruser brands/bikes haven't done well. It's not that they are bad machines, they just aren't HD, and they are too mass produced to be choppers.

IMO

[lucydad]

I enjoy the picker shows most of the time.  Anyway I checked on Texas Indian motorcycle dealers:  none.  The nearest is in Arkansas.
Contacting Polaris resulted in an email:  "we are working hard to deploy some Texas dealers, stay tuned".  Polaris has to build their dealer network and get enough bikes out there to satisfy curiosity.
They have definitely created a ripple in the Force though with some great advertising, etc.  I checked into PII stock and could find very little information, but it is way up.

Texas is a huge cruiser market, and Indian would do very, very well here in my opinion.  So, when a Houston dealer appears, it will be fun to go look at bikes, if they have any.