Guzzi reliability

[spgott]

I am a new Guzzi owner - bought a 2007 California Vintage in January after coveting this model for several years.  I think this is the most beautiful bike on the road, not to mention the only one of its kind I've seen around here.  It is fun to ride, handles well and I get tons of looks and compliments on it...definitely more than I ever did on my previous bikes.  My problem is with its reliability.  When researching Guzzis, I heard differing stories...that they are problematic and need a lot of maintenance as well as that they are simple and reliable.  My experience so far has been closer to the former and it concerns me.

I picked up the bike in Janurary at six years old and with only 6000 miles on it.  It obviously did a lot of sitting idle so some issues could have sprung from that.  In the last 8 months I've had two flat tires (admittedly not the bikes fault), replaced the final drive gasket, replaced three valve cover gaskets (left on twice), had the rear brakes flushed, replaced the rear master cylinder and brake lines.  I am now waiting for a rear brake light switch.  These are all pretty minor but they keep cropping up and due to Piaggio's horrible customer service, my bike sits in at the dealer for weeks waiting for parts to arrive.  Two weeks ago, after having my bike out for a month, waiting for the rear brake parts to arrive from Italy, I finally picked it up and rode down to central Florida where I ended up duck walking across a busy intersection because a nut dropped off of my shift lever, stranding me in neutral...or one of the many false neutrals I've found in my gearbox.  Again, I know these are minor issues but they are relentless.  I am not a wrenched nor a tinkerer...I don't have the talent nor temperament for it.  I sold my car after buying my first bike and ride as my sole form of transportation.  I rode 85000 miles on my Honda without any problems save a few light bulbs needing replaced.  Am I making a mistake counting on a Guzzi in this manner or am I having a tough break-in period?  A few people have told me that if I want to own a Guzzi, I have to be prepared to tinker with it a lot.  Is this generally accepted?

I love this bike.  I still do double takes when I pass by it at work and the sound it makes when accelerating is amazing.  Am I asking to much from it.  Lately I've likened owning this bike to dating a supermodel.  Its beautiful and great to be seen with but its also high maintenance and subject to periodic break-downs.

Does anyone have any advice to give.  This bike is breaking my heart.

[fotoguzzi]

You do have to tinker some, if you owned 2 bikes, one could be a Honda !

[Triple Jim]

I'll be watching this thread, since I just got an '89 Mille GT.  I've had my '72 Kawasaki H2 since 1978, and have heard about how unreliable it is,  how the Kaw triples require constant attention, aren't good for long trips, etc..  After putting about 40,000 miles on it, I can say it has been very reliable, and has required little attention, other than standard maintenance like a new top end every 10k miles, which is frighteningly easy on that engine.  I'm guessing that if you have the ability to do routine maintenance and repairs yourself, and have the eye to spot small problems before they become big ones, your Guzzi will be very reliable.  On the other hand, if you rely on the dealer to replace things like a brake light switch, I could imagine it getting frustrating and expensive.

[Travlr]

> I rode 85000 miles on my Honda without any problems save a few light bulbs needing replaced.
> Am I making a mistake counting on a Guzzi in this manner or am I having a tough break-in period?

IMHO, yes you are making a mistake if you expect a Guzzi (or most any bike) to be as reliable as a Honda.

Having said that I would not trade any of my Guzzi's for a Honda.  But you may feel differently.

T

[rodekyll]

In my opinion you can't have a m/c as your only transportation and not be willing to work on it.  If a leaky valve cover gasket ruins your day, you don't care to replace it yourself, and you've got nothing good to say about the service and supply line, then you'd be happier with a jimmy van.  Everything breaks.  You want something that can be fixed at the next intersection, by someone else, while you wait, and cheaply.  That does not describe a Guzzi.

[oldbike54]

Well , Guzzis can be frustrating , but are the easiest modern bike to work on . Plus , the incredibly helpful support group , best in the world . Any questions you have will elicit an outpouring of support and answers , we have some of the most informed and savvy pros in the MC world right here on WG , you guys know who you are . Not to mention a large network of sharp amateurs , and others who are willing to learn as we go . Parts can be a problem , and finding a good dealer is tricky , but they are out there . You say you are not mechanical , I say anyone can learn basic skills that will see them through . Good luck , and some patience will get you there .
Dusty

[OLD-WAN]

Motorcycles are machines and require maintenance, some more than others.  Dealers are places to spend money and some are more costly than others, and the same with brands.  You should learn to do your own work.  I've had many brands over the years and I think it more the specific MACHINE than the brand.  I've put 50K plus one several different Japanese brands and the same for BMW's but also had a few machines that didn't make 20K...it all depends...just like cars/trucks and washing machines.

Roadkyll and Dusty said it all.

[Red Dog]

Hang in there if you want a bike that puts a smile on your face for many years to come and every time you ride.  Guzzi's have a long break in point, I have a 2011 Black Eagle with 16,000 miles on it and the first 8,000 miles I hated that bike & I have been riding Guzzi since 1971!  Now you would have to come up with a sizeable amount of cash to get that bike away from me.

I love buying Guzzi's that have about 10,000 miles on them because the first owner has done the hard part of breaking them in!  If you get rid of it now you've done the next owner a big favor because you paid for all the little buggy things that happens in the first 8,000 miles.  The next guy will ride it for ever with only basic maintenance.

If this bike makes you smile hold on to it for another couple thousand miles before deciding to dump it.

[rocker59]

In my opinion you can't have a m/c as your only transportation and not be willing to work on it.  If a leaky valve cover gasket ruins your day, you don't care to replace it yourself, and you've got nothing good to say about the service and supply line, then you'd be happier with a jimmy van.  Everything breaks.  You want something that can be fixed at the next intersection, by someone else, while you wait, and cheaply.  That does not describe a Guzzi.

 :+1

[Andrew Thomas Evans]

Anything will have issues and you never know when something will just fail. If the dealer is good, then ask them to go though and double check most common things to fail, or at least to make sure most everything is tight. There is no reason why this bike coudn't be dependable with little maintance, other than it's been sitting for a while and things are getting old (rubber, seals, gaskets), and somethings just get loose and fall off.

I don't really buy that this brand takes more tinkering (other than we have a website full of what seem to be professional tinkerers) just that with used or old bikes there are issues that will need to be sorted out. Once that happens you should be set.

[rocker59]

  I say anyone can learn basic skills that will see them through . 

Dusty

Only if a person is willing.  Things like valve cover gaskets can be mail ordered from a stocking dealer and a stock can be kept on hand at home.  A few socket head bolts and a couple minutes to replace one, if needed.  Definitely not a dealer-required issue.

[rocker59]

I don't really buy that this brand takes more tinkering ( we have a website full of what seem to be professional tinkerers) 

We do have that!  A search for "TPS settings" will show you that!  I guess that one of these years I'll have to reset the TPS on my 46,000+ mile LeMans that's never had it done.  Or, replace some of my years-old pan and valve cover gaskets that never seem to wear out, just for principle, of course.  :BEER:

[Scott of the Sahara]

So the bike is almost 7 years old with low miles.
Brakes happen to any vehicle, although usually not that soon, but every vehicle will need attention to the brakes.
Bolts coming loose. Again this happens with motorcycles that vibrate. It is not a big deal.
I love wrenching on my Guzzi. I gave up all wrenching on my cars in about 1990. I got tired of dealing with oil and dealing with big complicated problems and decided to give up.
Motorcycles give me a chance to do minor things and feel good about wrenching.
Loctite is your friend.
Any bike will have problems, and yours are not that major. Give yourself some time with the Guzzi and you will not regret owning it.

[spgott]

Thanks everyone.  I'm not incapable of doing some work on the bike and small problems don't ruin my day.  Small problems every few days starts to ruin my outlook though.  Poor eyesight as a child and young adult prevented any inclination to work on engines, small parts, etc and now that I've had at least one eye fixed, an artificial lens does not allow much close-up focusing.  I'm never going to be a mechanic in any capacity and have never developed the interest.  I don't want a project bike, I just want to ride.  Hopefully this is just a lengthy break in period.  My dealership works with me a lot even though I did not buy the bike there...bought my two Hondas and my girlfriends Triumph there and they treat us well.  

I've been exclusively a rider quite successfully since 2007 on my Hondas.  Perhaps I'll add a second bike to the barn just to make sure I always have one going.  Most riders have their bike and another vehicle...mine will just be another bike.

[youcanrunnaked]

Motorcycles vibrate, and their mechanical parts are exposed to the elements, so fasteners loosen and things can fall off.  A shift lever coming loose is a common problem on ALL bikes.  The solution is to do a pre-ride inspection before every ride, and a more thorough inspection anywhere from once a week to once a month, depending on how often you ride.  For a motorcycle that is primary or sole means of transportation, some time each weekend should be spent going over the bike and adjusting the controls, tightening bolts, airing the tires, etc.

[Andrew Thomas Evans]

We do have that!  A search for "TPS settings" will show you that!  I guess that one of these years I'll have to reset the TPS on my 46,000+ mile LeMans that's never had it done.  Or, replace some of my years-old pan and valve cover gaskets that never seem to wear out, just for principle, of course.  :BEER:

:BEER:


I'd think that once setup, a newer Guzzi should be pretty much turnkey other than checking for things that are getting loose - which would happen on any bike anyway.

If a dealer is close no harm done in having them go though things when they do a oil change, or bring it in once every few years for checking out.

[oldbike54]

Only if a person is willing. 

So true . Maybe the reason why so many of us enjoy bikes we can work on is age related . Most of us started when bikes were a bit more maintenance intensive , so we developed the skills necessary for that reality . Part of the motorcycling experience for many of us is the learning process , and having the confidence in our own ability to fix what may break .
Dusty

[spgott]

In my opinion you can't have a m/c as your only transportation and not be willing to work on it.  If a leaky valve cover gasket ruins your day, you don't care to replace it yourself, and you've got nothing good to say about the service and supply line, then you'd be happier with a jimmy van.  Everything breaks.  You want something that can be fixed at the next intersection, by someone else, while you wait, and cheaply.  That does not describe a Guzzi.

Roadkyll - I am not expecting things to be repaired at the next intersection and my day is not ruined by a leaky valve cover gasket.  My day is ruined when it is the forth thing that has gone wrong in a month with my bike and I think I'm justified in being frustrated by it.  

[oldbike54]

SPG , what is your location ? I'll bet we can find a well schooled Guzzi fanatic close to you .
Dusty

[Triple Jim]

...an artificial lens does not allow much close-up focusing.

At 55, the lenses in my eyes don't do much focusing, so I use clip-on lenses on my glasses, available from sporting goods stores, or eBay, and other similar sources.  I use the "bifocal" type, that lets you look over the top, through, or flip up out of the way.

This is the type, but they can usually be found a lot cheaper on eBay, for example.  I use 2.00 or 2.50 diopter lenses, but stronger ones are available.  Most of the sales sites mistakenly call that 2X or 2.5X magnification.

http://www.debspecs.com/Bifocal-Clip-On-Flip-Up-Readers100-to-500-P2312.aspx?gclid=CMnf1a-Iv7kCFRKg4AodpV4AwA

[cwiseman]

As far as the valve cover gaskets leaking, buy some rubber gaskets from www.realgaskets.com
you can reuse them each time & they do not leak.

My calvin is about to roll over 30,000 & still in love with it.

[Aaron D.]

I think the bike having sat so much is key. Once you get through the poop (I've never had a valve cover gasket go bad..) it should be turnkey.

I disagree that you cannot commute with a bike as your only vehicle without tinkering-it will just be a lot harder and more expensive if you take the bike in to the dealer for every little thing, and there is no guarantee it will be done right.

[rodekyll]

Roadkyll - I am not expecting things to be repaired at the next intersection and my day is not ruined by a leaky valve cover gasket.  My day is ruined when it is the forth thing that has gone wrong in a month with my bike and I think I'm justified in being frustrated by it.  

I am not saying that your frustration isn't justified, just that it kicks in at a lower level than you'll be able to tolerate if you want it both ways.  There are things I own that I won't work on, too.  But I don't depend on them as my main tool for anything.  Anything I rely on I am self-reliant on.  If I can't fix it myself, I can't depend on it, and my lifestyle demands dependability. 

[LowRyter]

I buy all my gaskets, plugs and filters mail order (Harper's).  Delivered to my door.  

I've had a few of those pesky valve cover gaskets leak on me too (especially on the Sport) but usually I can make it between valve adjustments.   I also keep a couple of spares (including pan).

I make a practice of cleaning my bikes every time after I ride with a spray cleaner and do a "once over" visual inspection.  

[oldbike54]

Hey Rodekyll , it all depends on how dependable the dependability is depending on dependable dependability to dependably function dependably . OK I lost that somewhere .
Dusty

[treebone]

how does the saying go...I feel your pain??
I bought a 09 CalVin with 4000 miles on her, and went through a laundry list of problems. a blown rocker cover gasket on the trip home, later the cam position sensor went out (180.00 part that you could fit in a shot glass) but only diagnosed by a Guzzi Wizard in Albuquerque. Then a leaking final drive turned out to be a shot ring and pinon gear that the PO had changed to 7/33 gears of unknown asian origin, luckily replaced
by another Guzzi Wizard in NY.  
On a long trip out west, she was running kind of crappy for a few hundred miles, but I had developed a habit of checking fasteners for looseness every couple of days, and it turned out the hose clamps on the fuel injectors had worked loose and only required tightening.
Now at 14000 miles, it has been a while since any problems and my confidence is slowly returning. I do not do any major work on her outside of tires and fluids. I think one of the keys is (as mentioned) is to do a basic inspection and snugging up of all fasteners every couple hundred miles and especially before and during a trip.
This does not require much mechanical skill, other than not over tightening things. Tools required are as basic as a set of metric allen wrenches, less than 20 bucks, a small assortment of metric box/open end wrenches, 8mm to 14mm does most everything, a good crescent wrench, as well as a quality phillips
and standard slot screwdrivers. A small lipstick tube of blue loctite jell will last you a lifetime, and become
less necessary as you gradually apply it to any fasteners that continue to loosen up.
This is not major stuff that requires a lot of smarts. It will often as not alert you to the fact that something is wrong. way ahead of being fat, dumb and happy only to discover the problem when you are least able
to do something about it.
As you go through this inspection and snugging process, the familiarity you will gain will help bond you with the bike, and certainly does not harm your self esteem. After a bit, you will begin to understand the lanquage she speaks, and realize you care about this machine in a way that you never did with the Honda.

[CalVin2007]

Thanks everyone.  I'm not incapable of doing some work on the bike and small problems don't ruin my day.  Small problems every few days starts to ruin my outlook though.  Poor eyesight as a child and young adult prevented any inclination to work on engines, small parts, etc and now that I've had at least one eye fixed, an artificial lens does not allow much close-up focusing.  I'm never going to be a mechanic in any capacity and have never developed the interest.  I don't want a project bike, I just want to ride.  Hopefully this is just a lengthy break in period.  My dealership works with me a lot even though I did not buy the bike there...bought my two Hondas and my girlfriends Triumph there and they treat us well.  

I've been exclusively a rider quite successfully since 2007 on my Hondas.  Perhaps I'll add a second bike to the barn just to make sure I always have one going.  Most riders have their bike and another vehicle...mine will just be another bike.

      I think that adding a second bike is a good plan. Guzzis do, in my opinion require more rider participation in maintenance and small repairs than do Honda and Yamaha (two brands I've owned many of). My own 2007 CalVin has had a few niggling glitches...some the same as yours....but I am a mechanic by trade and can readily deal with them. I can understand that level of involvement not being everyone's idea of a good time. This week my bike lost a saddlebag bracket/fender bolt and spacer. My fault for not checking and loctiting the nut...but it's something that probably would not happen on a Honda. I fixed it quickly but then I have tools and access to lots of bolts and hardware. I've found the shift linkage nuts loose as well...loctite fixed them before they fell off. I say keep that supermodel in the garage but add a "girl next door" you can depend on when the model has a headache. I still can't walk away from my CalVin without turning to look back at it as I go..... ;)

   Terry

[DaddyRabbit]

Sold mine with abt 20k on the clock. She was my 2nd Guzzi, and both made me work for love for the first 5-6k miles, although your issues far outweighed mine.  After that, the CalVin was a great soulful machine. I started motorcycling (the second time) on a Honda Valkyrie with absolutely zero issues.  Fantastic motorcycle until I crashed it. I'm on my 4th Guzzi since the Valkyrie died and I've loved motorcycling in a way the Valk never produced.

So, work on it and enjoy the special relationship a Guzzi gives, or don't. Nobody here is more right than what you need for yourself to enjoy riding. For me...it's worth it.

DR

[Wayne Orwig]

These are all pretty minor but they keep cropping up and due to Piaggio's horrible customer service, my bike sits in at the dealer for weeks waiting for parts to arrive.  

The problems all sound familiar to me. It is because your dealer only wants to get parts from Piaggio. If you have anybody touch the bike, make sure that they contact you about the parts. You can get them from MG Cycle, Moto International, Harpers and many other sources in just a couple of days. Yet I have met many places that are OK with letting a bike sit and take up shop space waiting on parts that Piaggio has on order from Italy. And the dealer uses that "it is Piaggio's fault".

[Lannis]

I am a new Guzzi owner - bought a 2007 California Vintage in January after coveting this model for several years.  I think this is the most beautiful bike on the road, not to mention the only one of its kind I've seen around here.  It is fun to ride, handles well and I get tons of looks and compliments on it...definitely more than I ever did on my previous bikes.  My problem is with its reliability.  When researching Guzzis, I heard differing stories...that they are problematic and need a lot of maintenance as well as that they are simple and reliable.  My experience so far has been closer to the former and it concerns me.

I picked up the bike in Janurary at six years old and with only 6000 miles on it.  It obviously did a lot of sitting idle so some issues could have sprung from that.  In the last 8 months I've had two flat tires (admittedly not the bikes fault), replaced the final drive gasket, replaced three valve cover gaskets (left on twice), had the rear brakes flushed, replaced the rear master cylinder and brake lines.  I am now waiting for a rear brake light switch.  These are all pretty minor but they keep cropping up and due to Piaggio's horrible customer service, my bike sits in at the dealer for weeks waiting for parts to arrive. 

I just realized that I've topped 100,000 miles on Guzzis (5 of them) in the last few years.   One was 35 years old, one 30 years old, one 20 years old one 10 years old, and one new one.

I'm not an ace mechanic by any means.   But none of my bikes have ever sat in a dealer's shop waiting for anything.   Sometimes they sit in MY shop for a bit waiting for me to get my lazy arse in gear or to get home from a job far away .... but they're not waiting on parts or a mechanic.   Valve and final drive gaskets, brake light switches, flushing brake lines, and stuff like that is really easy to do on a Guzzi.

None of those bikes have ever had anything break that needed a dealer ....

Lannis