First after dark ride for a new rider

[Triple Jim]

The world is homogenized.

[canuguzzi]

Rather than all the clean, bend and then check.

Remove bulb, check for current in the socket. Then you know one of two things:

Either there is current or not.

If not, correct that.

If yes, then check with known good bulb. No light, then mess with the bending and all of the rest.

[Mikkilicious]

What bulb No. is that?

Looks like 1577.

Pre ride check its working fine.
I almkat wish it was a full screw in. Instead of this half twist socket.

[Mikkilicious]

Well. Def the socket.
While I was screwing the cover back on it starts to flicker.
Took the cover off, and used my finger nail to push in the bulb. Comes back on and stays on.

Any advice on how to fix the socket for a newbie?

[Triple Jim]

Did you clean the socket's contacts?

[toaster404]

Clean, bend, dielectric lube to prevent repeat.  I use dental tool to reach in and bend contacts a little

[atavar]

Don't listen to the scairdey cats.  Riding at night and riding in the rain are both parts of what motorcycling is all about.  Enjoy all aspects of motorcycling, just remember to ride within the environmental limitations and your limitations. 
Make allowances for visibility, don't over drive your headlights.  When on a road with no traffic I some times practice hard stops by watching the road in my lights and making sure I can stop before the next piece of debris that comes in to view in the headlights.  If you can't do that you are riding too fast.  I will some times do the same thing when I see a deer in the ditch, just to make sure I can if I need to.  It is best to practice those skills *before* you need them.
When you ride in the rain be extra cautious in the first few minutes of rain, before all the oils are rinsed off the road.  You can be surprised how slick a freshly wetted road is.  Be especially careful to avoid the center of the lane in the rain.
The trick is to learn your personal limitations and stay inside them where you can ride safe, but ride!

[Muzz]

OK Muzz old man , but are they the plastic socket holders ? So far all of the advice has been to not ride at night , nothing on how to fix the tail light 

 Dusty

Don't know Dusty as I have never needed to look.....

To the OP, used to do almost all of my long "got to get there" trips at night.  Love riding at night.

[oldbike54]

Looks like 1577.

Pre ride check its working fine.
I almkat wish it was a full screw in. Instead of this half twist socket.

 OK Mikki , what in the world is an Almkat 

  Dusty

[Guzzistajohn]

Welcome to the forum. Riding after dark in the country 'round here is asking for problems. Critters everywhere. Bar closing time in the city, big dumb critters that run your arse over! BE CAREFUL!!

[Mikkilicious]

Don't listen to the scairdey cats.  nd stay inside them where you can ride safe, but ride!

I grew up on the back, so once I get my confidence up i won't be so afraid. Rain still makes me nervous. Baby steps.

Lol @Dusty it was a cell phone fail. Meant to be Almost***
I'm going to clean it all tomorrow and see if I can fix it.
Only had her two weeks and she's already so needy!!!

[Shorty]

Fully half of my riding is at night. I always do a brake light check. Extra lighting is your friend. You can get generic aux lights fairly cheap on ebay, and you need to be able to see not only the road, but what is just off the road as well. When I commute, I generally take the same roads back and forth, to keep current on the location of potholes, road trash, etc. As mentioned it is smart to use roads either very well lit, or prepare to slow way down so you can react in time. I run back roads and rarely go faster than 45 mph.  Extra care is needed on weekend nights;  every Friday night  is like Cinco De Mayo in Tulsa.    Even the old guys get a little antsy to get home, or they are on the phone or reaching for another Stones CD.  I really enjoy night riding, even though I have narrowly missed deer twice in about a year, and road kill or hazards almost weekly. I especially enjoy it when all the night blooming flowers are throwing their scents. It is fun, but you must be fully aware.

Make sure the bulb is the correct one for the socket. Good luck!

[donn]

Clean, bend, dielectric lube to prevent repeat.

I heard that dielectric grease is really an insulator, not a conductor and maybe not the best thing to use here.

But you can't believe everything you hear, so I looked on wikipedia (infallible) and it confirms,

dielectric grease is electrically insulating

... but also,

It can be applied to the actual contact as well, because the contact pressure is sufficient to penetrate the grease. Doing so on such high pressure contact surfaces between different metals has the advantage of sealing the contact area against electrolytes that might cause rapid galvanic corrosion.

Unfortunately the entry for petroleum jelly doesn't address its electrical properties, but from some other commentary I found online, I gather that as one might expect, it's also an insulator, and as far as I know they're equal on that score.  The impression I get is that dielectric grease might be a superior alternative, if only because of a higher melting temperature.

[donn]

Only had her two weeks and she's already so needy!!!

I'd bet on a couple more things breaking in the near future, but hopefully just minor things.  Hope it didn't sit around for really long intervals with gas in it, in its previous circumstances.

[Chuck in Indiana]

I heard that dielectric grease is really an insulator, not a conductor and maybe not the best thing to use here.

But you can't believe everything you hear, so I looked on wikipedia (infallible) and it confirms,
... but also,
Unfortunately the entry for petroleum jelly doesn't address its electrical properties, but from some other commentary I found online, I gather that as one might expect, it's also an insulator, and as far as I know they're equal on that score.  The impression I get is that dielectric grease might be a superior alternative, if only because of a higher melting temperature.

The problem with dielectric grease..Wayne used to have something on this in his tag line.. is the gasses IIRC can travel in the wiring and screw up electrical components. I know for sure that when the DPO of the Strada decided to put dielectric grease in all the electrical connectors, it didn't run for years until I bought it as a barn find, and (finally)cleaned it all out . It's the only Guzzi that has left me standing on the side of the road.. more than once. I use Vaseline on the advice of the electrical gurus here.

[Kiwi_Roy]

I have been waiting for someone with a Breva to step in and offer the solution, I can only guess what the lamp holder is like.

The lamp should be spring loaded by the contacts, pushing it into the socket it should take a few ounces of pressure it shouldn't feel loose at all.
One of the two contacts is the tail light, the other is the stop light, the base of the lamp with the bayonet fitting is the return to negative

You might be able to lift the reflector out, there will be two wires out the back (Tail and Stop) and another to the reflector or the reflector makes contact with the chassis somehow. You should be able to wobble the lamp around without it going out.

It could also be a faulty bulb, the filaments sometimes break and touch.

Do you know anyone else with a bike, any brand who can help you learn about electrics, it's really very easy.

Any other Guzzi owners in Kansas City, I'm sure they will be glad to help you with this.

Buy yourself a small multimeter ~$10 and learn how to measure for Voltage, Ohms etc Electricity is fun.

There's been some discussion about di-electric grease, I have no experience with the stuff but if people like Chuck and Wayne say it's no good that's good enough for me. No grease conducts electricity, it stops corrosion and lubricates. I have been using Petroleum Jelly aka Vaseline on electrical contacts and around batteries for over 50 years, I'm not about to change.

[atavar]

The theory behind the case for using dielectric grease is this:

The biggest problem with electrical connections is corrosion.  Corrosion happens because of oxidation.  If you can keep *all* oxygen from reaching the contact metal then there will be no corrosion and you will have an optimum electrical connection when two contacts make physical contact.
To achieve this what some people believe is that if you perfectly clean and dry the contacts, then polish the metal surfaces and cover them with a non-conducting waterproof coating that will displace at the slightest pressure you will be protecting the metal surfaces and allowing metal to metal contact.
The dielectric grease is designed to do just that, to block out moisture and oxygen and to squeege out of the way when contacts come together.

IMHO the dielectric grease works extremely well for large surface area contacts that have a strong mechanical connection.  This would be things like commercial knife switches or large circuit breakers or even heavy ring and spade connectors.  These types of connections have a tremendous spring pressure pushing the metal contacts against each other and squeeging the grease from the metal surfaces.  Small force connections like the light bulb we are talking about are more likely to have problems because there may not be enough force to completely squeege the grease from between the parts making contact.  Even a thin coating of grease between the metal contacts will cause problems.

The other problem with using dielectric grease is the requirement to *perfectly* clean and dry the parts before assembling and coating with grease.  If you leave the smallest bit of corrosion or moisture at the connection and then cover it with grease you have sealed the contaminants in an environment perfect for more corrosion to happen and you have ensured that the moisture will never evaporate.  If this happens you have actually made the problem worse instead of making it better. 

Again, IMHO, you are much better off cleaning and drying the connector and putting your efforts towards sealing the connector housing to keep out excessive moisture.  In the case of housings like the tail light in question it is actually better to have a drain hole at the bottom to let moisture out that to maintain a hermetic seal. 

Conductive greases are an entirely different discussion.  These are greases with powdered or sintered metal mixed in the grease to promote electrical connection.  While all of the corrosion caveats that apply to dielectric grease also apply to conductive grease there is also the added danger of short circuits introduced with conductive grease.  If you use a conductive grease you must make absolutely certain that there is no continuity created between connectors (for example the two contacts on a light bulb).  These conductive greases are meant for industrial applications like knife switches or large circuit breakers where the contacts are  inches or feet away from any other contacts or ground.  There must be no possibility that the grease from one contact can spread to create an electrical path from one contact to another or to power or ground.

This is just my opinion based on education (I used to be an engineer) and experience.  YMMV

[atavar]

I have been using Petroleum Jelly aka Vaseline on electrical contacts and around batteries for over 50 years, I'm not about to change.

Kiwi,
I hate to break it to you but Vaseline *is* a dielectric grease. Dielectric grease is simply a lubricating non-evaporating non-conducting moisture blocking compound with a relatively low surface tension.  That pretty well describes Vaseline.  While most dielectric greases are silicone based (better for high voltage applications and non-flammable) they can also be petroleum based.

[Kiwi_Roy]

Kiwi,
I hate to break it to you but Vaseline *is* a dielectric grease. Dielectric grease is simply a lubricating non-evaporating non-conducting moisture blocking compound with a relatively low surface tension.  That pretty well describes Vaseline.  While most dielectric greases are silicone based (better for high voltage applications and non-flammable) they can also be petroleum based.

I know that Vaseline is non conductive, but don't lump it in with the silicone based grease others love to hate. As I said, no grease conducts electricity at least none that I know of, Copper coat, Never Sieze, they don't conduct.
You mention conductive grease, with metal bits. it's not the grease conducting then, its the metal bits.

As an apprentice I was taught to use Petroleum Jelly aka Vaseline on the large copper to copper drum contacts of overhead cranes, here it was used to lubricate rather than protect against corrosion, if you didn't use it the contacts would wear away pretty quick.
It's also like magic around battery connections, as you say protecting the metal from Oxygen, apply Vaseline and you can forget about Lead Oxide creeping in to disconnect the battery.

I have been told that if you use Silicone based grease in the presence of arcing it turns to Silicone Carbide, very abrasive, I can't verify that.

It sounds as though you have some special experience with high Voltage switchgear, mine is just that of a simple sparkie.

Is any of this discussion helping the young lady with her tail-light problem?

[Mikkilicious]

I have been waiting for someone with a Breva to step in and offer the solution, I can only guess what the lamp holder is like.

The lamp should be spring loaded by the contacts, pushing it into the socket it should take a few ounces of pressure it shouldn't feel loose at all.
One of the two contacts is the tail light, the other is the stop light, the base of the lamp with the bayonet fitting is the return to negative

You might be able to lift the reflector out, there will be two wires out the back (Tail and Stop) and another to the reflector or the reflector makes contact with the chassis somehow. You should be able to wobble the lamp around without it going out.

It could also be a faulty bulb, the filaments sometimes break and touch.

Do you know anyone else with a bike, any brand who can help you learn about electrics, it's really very easy.

Any other Guzzi owners in Kansas City, I'm sure they will be glad to help you with this.

Buy yourself a small multimeter ~$10 and learn how to measure for Voltage, Ohms etc Electricity is fun.

There's been some discussion about di-electric grease, I have no experience with the stuff but if people like Chuck and Wayne say it's no good that's good enough for me. No grease conducts electricity, it stops corrosion and lubricates. I have been using Petroleum Jelly aka Vaseline on electrical contacts and around batteries for over 50 years, I'm not about to change.

My mechanic has a 70s (i think) California, he came over yesterday and put on new tires, took a look at the taillight and betting when the guy put a new light in he pushed too hard in to turn it, as all my mechanic had to do was reach in and pull the back connector out (was pushed in too flag). YAY so excited.

I'd bet on a couple more things breaking in the near future, but hopefully just minor things.  Hope it didn't sit around for really long intervals with gas in it, in its previous circumstances.

you were right, damn you. but so far minor things. ordering a new oil pan plug, it was lose so going to replace that and the gasket just to be safe. Looked like the other owners never changed the gear oil either. it was gross.

Few minor things that my mechanic friend was not happy about, but no one ever keeps their vehicles up to the standards that an old school mechanic would. shes still running very well and that makes me happy.

[Hymes Inc.]

shes still running very well and that makes me happy.

This is all that matters in the end.

[Dilliw]

My mechanic has a 70s (i think) California, he came over yesterday and put on new tires, took a look at the taillight and betting when the guy put a new light in he pushed too hard in to turn it, as all my mechanic had to do was reach in and pull the back connector out (was pushed in too flag). YAY so excited.

Great.    I would still consider using a proper 5/21, a 2397 or an LED instead of an 1157.  Someone above posted it was a difference in contacts and I've heard others say it was the higher wattage on low beam.  Either way I know people have had problems with those in  the plastic sockets.

[Zoom Zoom]

As George mentioned on the last post, IIRC, Guzzi calls for a 2057 rather than an 1157. (Someone please correct me if I got that bulb number wrong.) Anyway, it does not get as hot as the 1157 because it is a little lower wattage on the tail light side. Not getting as hot translates to less heat on the plastic socket. I have used those on my EV for some time and don't seem to have the trouble I did some time ago when I used the 1157's. The heat generated from those would cause me to need to work on the socket and contacts from time to time. THAT got old in a hurry.

Also, as mentioned previously, the Super Bright LEDS are a nice alternative.

John Henry

[Charles in Lake Charles]

Check http://www.defender.com/product3.jsp?path=-1|65136|2312566|2312567&id=2106919

[Triple Jim]

Glad to see that Defender is still around.  As late at the '90s, when everyone else was taking credit cards by phone, Defender required mailing a check to them.  Now they actually have a web site!

[malik]

You can also replace the reflector with one of those with an LED inside, and wired up to the brake light. Available cheaply on the net. Extra insurance.

When you start doing your long distance touring, you might consider getting some driving lights. Although you might not intend to ride at night, I get caught out often enough & find the extra light very very useful. I'm now using Denali D2 LEDs wired into high beam, & they're magnificent, but the cheaper halogens work well too & anything is better than just the headlight. It does give a lot more confidence for night riding.

Mal