Author Topic: AZ Road Rage Incident (Read 14902 times)

Kev m · « **on:** July 15, 2015, 06:32:09 AM »

NWS language in video

I READ THIS, FIRST THING THIS MORNING... TOTALLY BORROWED FROM SOMEWHERE ELSE AND HAD TO SHARE....

Quote

Reports are coming out of Yuma, Arizona that a motorcycle rider may have cut off this motorist, who then worked up enough anger to attack the rider and his passenger at a stoplight. Violence escalated to the point where the biker put the road rager on the ground and hold him there, all of which was captured on his helmet cam.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZueHaDP4hU

I have to say it, the biker showed some decent restraint.

chuck peterson · « **Reply #1 on:** July 15, 2015, 07:37:31 AM »

link not working

jackson · « **Reply #2 on:** July 15, 2015, 07:44:47 AM »

Nope: Linky no worky

Kev m · « **Reply #3 on:** July 15, 2015, 07:51:12 AM »

Works for me now... how about you guys?

jackson · « **Reply #4 on:** July 15, 2015, 07:59:45 AM »

Now it's working.
Thanks

Lannis · « **Reply #5 on:** July 15, 2015, 07:59:57 AM »

Quote from: Kev m on July 15, 2015, 07:51:12 AM

Works for me now... how about you guys?

Yep, working.

The rider did the right thing. The car driver is claiming that he's attacking the rider because he "Broke the Law". Probably because he thought he was "lane splitting".

As soon as the car driver came up and punched the motorcyclist with no warning, his arse belonged to the motorcyclist. He went down pretty easily and was fairly incoherent, so I suspect he was probably drunk; the cops will figure that out.

I agree; great restraint on the part of the rider and passenger to not stomp his nose flat, and a good case for a camera on board .... !!

Lannis

blackcat · « **Reply #6 on:** July 15, 2015, 08:25:08 AM »

Quote from: Lannis on July 15, 2015, 07:59:57 AM

.... and a good case for a camera on board .... !!

Lannis

I have seen more rider's with a camera mounted to their helmets while (I assume) commuting.

charlie b · « **Reply #7 on:** July 15, 2015, 08:32:58 AM »

Pinpoint eyes. Due to sun or something else?

fotoguzzi · « **Reply #8 on:** July 15, 2015, 08:58:04 AM »

thaat was good, better start wearing my camera everywhere.

Lannis · « **Reply #9 on:** July 15, 2015, 09:18:56 AM »

Quote from: fotoguzzi on July 15, 2015, 08:58:04 AM

thaat was good, better start wearing my camera everywhere.

Might make the wearer behave better in situations like this where you might be tempted to take justice into your own hands once you're topsides on the bad guy ....

John A · « **Reply #10 on:** July 15, 2015, 09:45:56 AM »

That's what I was thinking, Lannis, I would have trouble with not getting real ignorant with the guy and giving him a life long disability and me problems I don't want.

charlie b · « **Reply #11 on:** July 15, 2015, 10:29:04 AM »

Just as an aside, here in Alb.

Guy had his bike stolen. He and friend got in truck. Found thief on bike. Thief would not pull over. Guy shot thief. Took bike and rode off.

Second part of story. Guy and friend end up in motel room with guns. Police called. SWAT standoff for a few hours (it was 200yd from where I work). Guy and friend finally give up.

Both now in jail.

No knowledge of history on this. Maybe gang related, maybe just rednecks with guns. Maybe they all knew each other.

Now, back to original situation, imagine what could have happened if there was no video of that, or, someone else had video but it was chopped just to show you shoving the other guy to the ground?

Just a bit of caution. If you take justice into your own hands you can end up on short end of stick.

LowRyter · « **Reply #12 on:** July 15, 2015, 11:54:42 AM »

In the comments it says the driver broke his ankle as he fell to the ground.

Cam3512 · « **Reply #13 on:** July 15, 2015, 12:48:34 PM »

That's an open/close case of assault on the rider and passenger of the bike. Video seals the deal. Rider did everything possible to de-escalate the situation. Notice car driver's change in tone after he found out he was on camera. IMO, guy on bike could have gotten in a couple good shots and STILL be alright legally.

Loftness · « **Reply #14 on:** July 15, 2015, 12:55:53 PM »

Obviously the rider knew the driver was pissed to begin with b/c he's looking back at him specifically before the guy gets out of his car. Who knows what actually happened before the incident.

He did show incredible restraint...if that was my wife that man had thrown a punch at, I'd have lost it.

tiger_one · « **Reply #15 on:** July 15, 2015, 01:02:17 PM »

^^^^ This. No business touching my wife, I would have leveled him!

Lannis · « **Reply #16 on:** July 15, 2015, 01:14:01 PM »

Quote from: tiger_one on July 15, 2015, 01:02:17 PM

^^^^ This. No business touching my wife, I would have leveled him!

The rider DID level him, had him under complete control, the guy probably peeing his drawers. I really hope I could do as well as that rider if my time came .... but I'm pretty sure I wouldn't. On the other hand, the puncher probably couldn't see straight enough to tell it was a woman he was punching.

Throwing a punch at a guy in a helmet and body armor doesn't imply clarity of thought, although I'm sure some would consider that idea judgmental ...

Lannis

Cam3512 · « **Reply #17 on:** July 15, 2015, 01:29:54 PM »

Never discount a head-but with your helmet on. Devastating.

Arizona Wayne · « **Reply #18 on:** July 15, 2015, 01:32:25 PM »

W/O that camera it's he said/she said. The car driver was an idiot no matter what, getting in a fight w/thongs on. He completely started the whole episode with fisticuffs. If the rider didn't split lanes to get in front of him, just saw a gap the driver left because his depth perception is off is no reason to get out of his car and start this incident. It's a good thing both riders had helmets and jackets on for protection. Whatever injury the driver got he deserved. Good thing there were witnesses.

Kev m · « **Reply #19 on:** July 15, 2015, 01:44:05 PM »

Quote from: Loftness on July 15, 2015, 12:55:53 PM

if that was my wife that man had thrown a punch at, I'd have lost it.

If that was my wife she would have leveled his @ss with a punch to the face and/or a kick to the groin before I could have gotten the sidestand down.

Lannis · « **Reply #20 on:** July 15, 2015, 01:51:46 PM »

Quote from: Kev m on July 15, 2015, 01:44:05 PM

If that was my wife she would have leveled his @ss with a punch to the face and/or a kick to the groin before I could have gotten the sidestand down.

That's a big advantage. It's a little-known fact that the law gives a woman a HUGE amount of latitude in a fight with a guy who is assaulting her.

In Virginia, for example, regardless of relative size and strength, the first guy to draw a gun in a fight is in serious trouble in court, and will have to have an extremely good story as to why he didn't use another weapon or why he didn't run if there was no other gun. CCW holders need to know that; it may not seem fair, but it's real.

However, the law assumes that a woman is automatically in fear of her life in an assault or struggle with a man due to differences in size and strength, and if she pulls a gun and shoots a guy who is assaulting her, it's as if the other guy had a gun too.

There were no guns here (thank goodness) but if the woman had gotten the guy down and beat him to a pulp, to make SURE he couldn't get up and hurt her, the law would likely have been on her side. Not so the male rider, and he acted accordingly.

A guy assaulted Fay in Atlanta in 1979 when she was on her Vespa, at the intersection of Ponce de Leon and Piedmont. A delivery truck driver, accused her of "cutting him off". I went looking for him the next day, but a good thing for both of us I didn't find him. Life would have been much different for that moment's satisfaction ...

Lannis

JeffOlson · « **Reply #21 on:** July 15, 2015, 01:51:58 PM »

Some people are such idiots. That motorcyclist did indeed show great restraint. I would not have been able to restrain myself and probably would have ended up in jail.

Speaking of which, I am off to court shortly to see if I can keep one of my idiot court-appointed clients out of jail for physically assaulting someone who verbally mocked him at a bus stop...

Kev m · « **Reply #22 on:** July 15, 2015, 01:56:04 PM »

Quote from: Cam3512 on July 15, 2015, 01:29:54 PM

Never discount a head-but with your helmet on. Devastating.

Funny, a couple of years ago there was a protracted discussion on the pros and cons of self-defense with a helmet on the Ducati Monster Forum.

It started when a board member/MMA practitioner insisted a helmet was nothing but a liability (because an MMA guy tends to train for close in, grappling, etc.).

My response was that if you let him get close enough to grab your helmet you already screwed up.

But it has got me thinking about it. I do think a FF helmet is a great protection against a punch, but it's also a liability if they do grab it. I'd actually prefer an 3/4 in that situation, most of the protection, all the visibility, and no chin-bar/grab handle.

It also occurs to me that my body armor would mostly be a liability, reducing the effectiveness of knees and elbows (since most of my armor is soft, not hard pucks which would potentially be an advantage).

Lannis · « **Reply #23 on:** July 15, 2015, 02:00:32 PM »

Quote from: Kev m on July 15, 2015, 01:56:04 PM

Funny, a couple of years ago there was a protracted discussion on the pros and cons of self-defense with a helmet on the Ducati Monster Forum.

It started when a board member/MMA practitioner insisted a helmet was nothing but a liability (because an MMA guy tends to train for close in, grappling, etc.).

My response was that if you let him get close enough to grab your helmet you already screwed up.

But it has got me thinking about it. I do think a FF helmet is a great protection against a punch, but it's also a liability if they do grab it. I'd actually prefer an 3/4 in that situation, most of the protection, all the visibility, and no chin-bar/grab handle.

It also occurs to me that my body armor would mostly be a liability, reducing the effectiveness of knees and elbows (since most of my armor is soft, not hard pucks which would potentially be an advantage.

That probably is very applicable for you or anyone with martial arts or hand-to-hand combat training.

But for the rest of us, who are not going to be throwing elbows at hard-to-find nerve centers to end the fight, but who have to depend on brute force and adrenalin to get close enough to hurt someone before they hit something vital, I would rather be in my armored leather jacket, boots, gloves, and helmet if someone is going to tackle me with intent to really hurt me ....

Lannis

JeffOlson · « **Reply #24 on:** July 15, 2015, 02:04:31 PM »

My new riding attire:

Kev m · « **Reply #25 on:** July 15, 2015, 02:05:34 PM »

Boots HELL YA! They would help!

And yeah, I mean, we can over analyze it to death.... too loose a jacket = too much to grab on, too tight a jacket/pants = reduced mobility... I dunno, I spend most of my time training in bare feet and what seems to be the equivalent of pajamas anyway.

Although living where we do now, with her new job and the 2 little ones, we've been finding it harder and harder to get to the dojo (45 minutes each way, only 2 nights a week at this school), so we're starting to train more and more in the backyard, sometimes we just do combinations before a run, other times it's the full boat. So I guess that's not a bad thing to train in other clothing and get used to other surfaces more.

Triple Jim · « **Reply #26 on:** July 15, 2015, 02:08:38 PM »

The car driver came across as pathetic to me, not some mean SOB. He was disoriented and staggering, and didn't seem to have his thoughts together. In my school days I was attacked by a fellow student on a couple different occasions... the usual school yard stuff. I did exactly what the motorcycle rider did, which was get him on the ground and hold him down until he either calmed down or a teacher broke it up. Controlling the situation and getting it stopped was my goal, not injuring the other guy. I'm pretty sure I'd do what the rider did if it happened to me, unless the other guy kept attacking.

Cam3512 · « **Reply #27 on:** July 15, 2015, 02:12:36 PM »

My first inclination would be to leave the helmet on (one advantage I mentioned above). Another is these type of encounters happen very fast. By the time you undo your chin strap, and use both hands to pull the helmet off, you're at a serious disadvantage.

Kev m · « **Reply #28 on:** July 15, 2015, 02:19:55 PM »

Quote from: Cam3512 on July 15, 2015, 02:12:36 PM

My first inclination would be to leave the helmet on (one advantage I mentioned above). Another is these type of encounters happen very fast. By the time you undo your chin strap, and use both hands to pull the helmet off, you're at a serious disadvantage.

Oh absolutely, if you had time to get your helmet off, you had time to just LEAVE and diffuse the situation that way.

I think I mentioned the downside of the helmet so that we don't feel like supermen just because it's there...

Bill Hagan · « **Reply #29 on:** July 15, 2015, 04:22:42 PM »

On the FF helmet as a liability or not issue only.

So ... there I wuz. At Riders Hill a few years ago.

To spare you all of the details of another of my longwinded tales -- tho true -- I happened to be up close and personal with a guy who needed some anger management class or had missed some med dose. No, not me.

Anyway, he had on all his ATTGAT including his FF helmet.

He was VERY mad. So mad that he spat at me.

Yeah, all over his chin piece complete with visible backsplash.

I started laughing. He sputtered something and left.

Bill

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Author Topic: AZ Road Rage Incident (Read 14902 times)

Bill Hagan