Author Topic: Safety from Ragers ?  (Read 21538 times)

Offline M0T0Geezer

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Safety from Ragers ?
« on: September 09, 2015, 04:19:49 PM »
 A new age has dawned where snipers may become  more and more more dangerous to motorcyclists. 

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Offline O

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2015, 04:29:13 PM »
Meh, I'm way more worried about those around me driving while texting/eating/generally being a dumbass.  They pose a much greater threat to riders every day, and in much larger numbers.
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Online rodekyll

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2015, 04:35:30 PM »
That's your NRA working to preserve your 2nd amendment rights.   :thumb:

Offline JeffOlson

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2015, 05:53:33 PM »
I, too, am much more worried about idiot cagers trying to kill me on my commute. I am willing to take my chances with terrorist snipers.

Still, it is a sad state of affairs. Now, where's my gun so I can return fire? Ah, here it is:

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Offline pyoungbl

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2015, 06:14:32 PM »
Humm, let's see here.  Revolver on the right side...looks really cool.  Now, to actually use said machine one must take the right hand off the throttle, grab the pistol, shoot, and still stay on the road.  I guess the shooter is counting on coasting while shooting.  Basically it's a dumb idea.
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Offline brlawson

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2015, 06:20:06 PM »
Humm, let's see here.  Revolver on the right side...looks really cool.  Now, to actually use said machine one must take the right hand off the throttle, grab the pistol, shoot, and still stay on the road.  I guess the shooter is counting on coasting while shooting.  Basically it's a dumb idea.

Just having it in plain site does wonders for most folk.
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Offline Johncolleary

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2015, 06:20:55 PM »
Throttle Lock!
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Offline Lannis

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2015, 06:21:06 PM »
Humm, let's see here.  Revolver on the right side...looks really cool.  Now, to actually use said machine one must take the right hand off the throttle, grab the pistol, shoot, and still stay on the road.  I guess the shooter is counting on coasting while shooting.  Basically it's a dumb idea.

Just for show anyhow.   He's supposed to be making it look like a cowboy holster and a cowboy saddle.   Might not even be a shootable gun, like the MG-42s you sometimes see on Urals looking to be like old Wehrmacht BMWs.

Urban legend would have it that Indian put the throttle on the left so that a motor cop could draw and shoot with his right hand while moving.   Yeah, now THERE's something that police departments would train their officers to do ..... !    :azn:

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Offline JeffOlson

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2015, 07:09:32 PM »
Right side, left side... How about standing up and down the middle?

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2015, 07:22:26 PM »
You'd have to be a pretty good shot to hit your mark with a pistol, while riding a motorcycle, looks like a lot of show.

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2015, 07:44:32 PM »
 
Meh, I'm way more worried about those around me driving while texting/eating/generally being a dumbass.  They pose a much greater threat to riders every day, and in much larger numbers.

 :1: Agreed.

Offline atavar

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2015, 08:03:47 PM »
Humm, let's see here.  Revolver on the right side...looks really cool.  Now, to actually use said machine one must take the right hand off the throttle, grab the pistol, shoot, and still stay on the road.  I guess the shooter is counting on coasting while shooting.  Basically it's a dumb idea.
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Offline atavar

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2015, 08:05:31 PM »
You'd have to be a pretty good shot to hit your mark with a pistol, while riding a motorcycle, looks like a lot of show.
Not so much as you think.  I sometimes practice shooting 5 gallon pails with my .45 while riding.  I hit quite a bit more than I miss.  It is like everything else, practice makes perfect.
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Offline Sasquatch Jim

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2015, 08:10:04 PM »
You'd have to be a pretty good shot to hit your mark with a pistol, while riding a motorcycle, looks like a lot of show.
 

 I was when I was younger.  I wore the pistol in a holster on the left side and  would go out in the desert and practice drawing and shooting while riding across open desert.  I got pretty good at it and all the jack rabbits in that territory hated me.
 I chased one zig zagging and shooting for about a half mile dodging about and occasionally shooting until he ran out into the
middle of a jeep trail and stopped facing me and gasping for breath.  I stopped about 8 feet away and pointed the pistol but did not shoot.  He just stared at me defiantly as if to say, "go ahead shoot, I've run far enough."  For that defiance I let him go.
 He had given me a good run.
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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2015, 08:47:50 PM »
Can you spell cruise control?

Anyone can spell cruise control. The question is -- can you install it?

Offline sib

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #15 on: September 09, 2015, 08:52:44 PM »
Just having it in plain site does wonders for most folk.
Maybe there's one on the left side, too.
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Offline Farmer Dan

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #16 on: September 10, 2015, 08:00:20 AM »
If I can hit a deer with a .30-30 while on horse back I should be able to hit a sniper with my revolver while riding my Eldorado.  It has throttle lock and my revolver has laser sights and I always carry.
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Offline atavar

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #17 on: September 10, 2015, 08:11:07 AM »
It is absolutely amazing how much more space you get on the highway if you have 1" of a black holster protruding from beneath your jacket.  Cars that never see you now see you from a block away.  It astounds me how drivers pick out that detail when they can miss a whole motorcycle.
If you don't believe this try it some time, ride with a pistol on your hip and see how drivers change.
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Offline blackcat

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #18 on: September 10, 2015, 09:36:40 AM »
Honestly, I'm more concerned about being taken out by deer, other motorists and the numerous truck re-treads scattered on the roadways. One of those giant rubber clam shell almost killed me on I-80 not too long ago. 
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Offline atavar

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #19 on: September 10, 2015, 10:54:14 AM »
Honestly, I'm more concerned about being taken out by deer, other motorists and the numerous truck re-treads scattered on the roadways. One of those giant rubber clam shell almost killed me on I-80 not too long ago.
I get flamed on this but I am going to say it again anyway, you can *greatly* reduce your risk from deer strikes by doing a little research on deer habits and psychology.  They have definite patterns and preferences to where they cross roads and if you pay extra attention in the higher risk localities you can avoid or be prepared for most if not all of the encounters.
I have been riding for 40+ years, almost all of that in areas with dense deer populations and have never touched a deer with a bike.  I have had a couple of close calls but being alert and prepared has allowed me to avoid them.
Deer are not magical or conniving creatures.  They hate getting run in to almost as much as you hate running in to them.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2015, 11:06:10 AM by atavar »
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Offline Sasquatch Jim

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #20 on: September 10, 2015, 10:59:34 AM »
 You have a picture of the giant rubber clamshell.   The ones I googled were for sale on Ebay.

 
« Last Edit: September 10, 2015, 11:01:52 AM by Sasquatch Jim »
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Offline Lannis

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #21 on: September 10, 2015, 11:48:55 AM »
I get flamed on this but I am going to say it again anyway, you can *greatly* reduce your risk from deer strikes by doing a little research on deer habits and psychology.  They have definite patterns and preferences to where they cross roads and if you pay extra attention in the higher risk localities you can avoid or be prepared for most if not all of the encounters.
I have been riding for 40+ years, almost all of that in areas with dense deer populations and have never touched a deer with a bike.  I have had a couple of close calls but being alert and prepared has allowed me to avoid them.
Deer are not magical or conniving creatures.  They hate getting run in to almost as much as you hate running in to them.

So, since you were expecting to get flamed anyway, here it is.

I honestly don't believe that you've been riding in "dense deer populations" all this time, and that you still believe that "being alert" will save you from a deer strike.   You don't know what "dense deer populations" are.

You've been rapping this B.S. for years on this list, to the degree that I was glad you went away for awhile.    Now you're back, saying all this same deer smack again.    People are liable to start believing it.

NEITHER YOU, NOR ANYONE ELSE, CAN AVOID A CANNON SHOT FROM A DEER RUNNING 30 MPH DIRECTLY OUT OF DENSE BRUSH INTO THE SIDE OF YOUR VEHICLE.   Certainly you can avoid running into a deer that is standing in the road, or that you can see running or walking toward a road.

But the careful people that are killed by deer do NOT run into the deer.   The deer runs into THEM, either from a quarter where they NEVER see it, or where they have a fraction of a second to see it.

I've had TWO vehicles, a Ford Aerostar van and a Buick LeSabre, totalled by deer that smashed into them from the side.   The Aerostar was running 10 MPH in my driveway and a deer hit it from the rear quarter.   Two weeks later, ANOTHER deer hit it from the side at night.   Our Buick was totalled by a buck running at top speed coming from the driver's side.   I slowed, took evasive action, almost had the car stopped, and the deer changed direction and hit the car on the driver's door hinge to the degree that the door wouldn't even open.

Your implication is that guys like Lawrence Grodsky, if they'd just been careful like you, could avoid deer.   NOBODY can avoid some deer, and it sounds arrogant and self-righteous to imply that you can.

People who really do live in deer country can compare notes and decide who's B.S.'ing.     

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Offline blackcat

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #22 on: September 10, 2015, 12:05:49 PM »
You have a picture of the giant rubber clamshell.   The ones I googled were for sale on Ebay.

 

More like this only in my case it was sitting vertically in the middle of the road. I held my breath running it over as there was no place to go given that particular scenario and hoped that my tires didn't blow out.



Deer, sorry but I'm with Lannis on this one and I'm quite familiar with were he lives as my sister in law has totaled at least two cars due to deer strikes along with other minor? hits.   I crashed once trying to avoid a deer and I was looking for it but it happened too fast. But, better them then the Moose crossing signs in upstate NY.
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Offline atavar

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #23 on: September 10, 2015, 01:07:43 PM »
So, since you were expecting to get flamed anyway, here it is.

I honestly don't believe that you've been riding in "dense deer populations" all this time, and that you still believe that "being alert" will save you from a deer strike.   You don't know what "dense deer populations" are.

You've been rapping this B.S. for years on this list, to the degree that I was glad you went away for awhile.    Now you're back, saying all this same deer smack again.    People are liable to start believing it.

NEITHER YOU, NOR ANYONE ELSE, CAN AVOID A CANNON SHOT FROM A DEER RUNNING 30 MPH DIRECTLY OUT OF DENSE BRUSH INTO THE SIDE OF YOUR VEHICLE.   Certainly you can avoid running into a deer that is standing in the road, or that you can see running or walking toward a road.

But the careful people that are killed by deer do NOT run into the deer.   The deer runs into THEM, either from a quarter where they NEVER see it, or where they have a fraction of a second to see it.

I've had TWO vehicles, a Ford Aerostar van and a Buick LeSabre, totalled by deer that smashed into them from the side.   The Aerostar was running 10 MPH in my driveway and a deer hit it from the rear quarter.   Two weeks later, ANOTHER deer hit it from the side at night.   Our Buick was totalled by a buck running at top speed coming from the driver's side.   I slowed, took evasive action, almost had the car stopped, and the deer changed direction and hit the car on the driver's door hinge to the degree that the door wouldn't even open.

Your implication is that guys like Lawrence Grodsky, if they'd just been careful like you, could avoid deer.   NOBODY can avoid some deer, and it sounds arrogant and self-righteous to imply that you can.

People who really do live in deer country can compare notes and decide who's B.S.'ing.     

Lannis

My riding time has been in North Dakota, South Dakota, Minnesota and Maine..  All prime dense deer populations.  I not only *can* avoid deer I *do* avoid deer, and so can others if they are just aware of their deer populations and the habits and psychology of deer.

It is you sir, who are doing a disservice by trying to get people to believe that deer are magical creatures you can not avoid so you might as well not try.  Talking people in to believing there is nothing they can do to help themselves is the surest way to get people hurt and you are doing others a great disservice by spreading that pap. 

To be safe you have to know and understand the risks you are going to encounter and develop the skills and strategies you need to avoid or manage them.  This includes deer and road hazards and other drivers.  If you are not willing to accept and deal with these risks then you are better off staying off the roads.  If you honestly believe there is nothing you can do about deer and other hazards then you need to get yourself a giant SUV and just plow on through. 

Please stop encouraging people to ride their motorcycles unprepared for the challenges they will face on the road. 

Man up.
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Online rodekyll

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #24 on: September 10, 2015, 01:32:04 PM »
The problem with studying up on deer psychology and habits is that it only works if the deer read the same book.  Unless you can assure me that all deer have library cards and use them, I'll continue to ride as though there's one lurking in every shadow and dip.

Offline charlie b

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #25 on: September 10, 2015, 01:35:53 PM »
Sorry, he's not saying to not be alert for them.  He is saying that sometimes, no matter how careful you are, you can get hit.  You can see the deer, slow down to a stop, and the darn buck will ram you anyway.  Happened to my wife driving through a residential area.

She saw the buck on the side of the road about 50yds ahead.  As she approached where he was (about 30ft off the side of the road) she slowed to about 10mph.  When the buck charged she stopped the car before he hit.  The passenger door was dented and window broken out.

Tell me please how she could have avoided that?  Maybe by not going to the store that day.  And, no not early morning or evening.  It was around 1pm in the afternoon.

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biking sailor

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #26 on: September 10, 2015, 01:36:12 PM »
In my neck of the woods, only way I can avoid deer would be to not ride in certain areas and definetly not at night, dawn, dusk, hunting season, during the rut...  And to ride only in open areas where you can see flat fields for at least a quarter mile in all directions, and if you see a deer, turn around and go in the opposite direction.

I once read that you can't know what a deer is going to do because they don't know what they are going to do.  Except of course be unpredictable.

My deer encounter 11 months ago had a buck jump over a guard rail from a ravine into my path giving me only a blink before impact.  Didn't have time to ask him to lie down on a couch and tell me how he felt about the situation.  I guess I could have avoided it by not being there on a bike, but I do like to ride anyway!   :evil:

Offline atavar

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #27 on: September 10, 2015, 01:37:27 PM »
The problem with studying up on deer psychology and habits is that it only works if the deer read the same book.  Unless you can assure me that all deer have library cards and use them, I'll continue to ride as though there's one lurking in every shadow and dip.

lol..  well of course you need to learn about the habitat in the area you are riding in..  and there is nothing wrong with constant vigilance and looking in every shadow and dip. I definitely do the same thing. On some level I think we are preaching the same thing from different directions.  Stay alert, be prepared, stay alive.
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Offline charlie b

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #28 on: September 10, 2015, 01:38:02 PM »
PS, me?  Never hit one.  In all the years of driving/riding around sunup and sun down, night driving, etc, etc  I have never hit one.  It is not because I am extra vigilent.  I have been lucky.
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Offline atavar

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Re: Safety from Ragers ?
« Reply #29 on: September 10, 2015, 01:39:09 PM »

I once read that you can't know what a deer is going to do because they don't know what they are going to do.  Except of course be unpredictable.

This is definitely one of the things to understand about deer.  When startled they bolt in some random direction.  That direction can even be directly toward what startled them.

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